Alternative Treatment
Comments
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Hi Zuvart, I really appreciate your posts - you mention Tucker, I really miss the gal
she's so upbeat, wonder what she's up to and hope she comes back to us
There are studies about surgery, anesthetics, chemo, rads, Tamox causing cancer - Are there studies that determine those to be the cause of recurrence and/or death ? How many die from treatment ?
Or do I really want to know ???
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Maud, thanks. I have no idea how many people die directly from treatments. That would be an interesting to know. I miss Tucker too. I hope nothing is wrong and she's just on vacation.
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zuvart: I trust you were speaking metaphorically when you wrote about people flushing their sleeping meds down the toilet. I worry about all that sleeping aquatic life.
Seriously, if they are too dangerous for us and our kids, they are too dangerous for disposal at home. Should go to toxic waste centres or back to the pharmacies which will then take them to the toxic waste centres. Kay
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Attribution of Deaths Following Cancer Treatment
"Welch and Black (4) raise the concern that cancer death rates are systematically underestimated, in that many patients who die as a result of cancer treatment do not have cancer recorded as the underlying cause of death.
The authors assembled data on the reported cause of death for all patients in the Surveillance, Epidemiology, and End Results (SEER)1 program from 1994 through 1998 who died within 1 month of cancer-directed surgery for one of 19 common solid tumors. They found that for 41% of these deaths, the cause was not attributed to cancer. The authors speculate that cancer treatment is the probable underlying cause for essentially all of these deaths and, as a result, the cancer mortality rate is underestimated by 0.9%.
Welch and Black (4) also suggest that many deaths subsequent to 1 month after cancer-directed surgery may be similarly miscoded, leading to further underestimation.
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The earlier article on taxane was dated 2007. Here's a new article today about taxanes often being ineffective. It also mentions stronger tumours being more responsive to chemo.
If 50 to 70% will relapse after having taxane, it makes me wonder how many would have relapsed anyway without any chemo. Considering how toxic it is I wonder how many people suffer for a dubious benefit?
Breast cancer therapy effectiveness under microscope
In regard to unreported cancer deaths, that's why it's important to look at overall survival which includes death by any cause as it includes death by cancer, treatments or unrelated causes.
Edited to add, there's a study in the research forum today on freezing tumours.
In percutaneous cryoablation, tiny probes insert pressurized argon gas into tumors and kill them by turning them into balls of ice.
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From livestrong.com/article/70454
A secondary tumor is the formation of a new and unrelated cancer as a result of the treatment of another cancer. The secondary cancer usually arises months, or even years after the initial treatment chemotherapy and radiation are known carcinogens meaning they can cause cancer.
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I know for a fact that my friend with lung cancer died from overtreatment with chemo. It was horrible and did not help her one bit. I did research on her type of lung cancer, and it said that it did not respond to chemo. The only thing she should have been given were pallative treatments of radiation for the pain when the cancer progressed to her shoulder and then bones, which she did receive.
The chemo made her so ill that she couldn't eat and she died from malnutrition. Her body just shut down. This happened less than two months before I was dx, so it was fresh on my mind. I was determined that I would not suffer her fate if at all possible.
I received the results of my Thermography today and it was all clear. I received a T1 rating in both breasts with a TL in the left, meaning I'd had a lumpectomy. It's the best you can receive..yea!
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Kaara, thanks for reporting your themography results.......congratulations!
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Selena thanks for the info on Paxil and Celexa. I will get with my primary and see if she will do that. This Paxil has really got to go!
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Good luck! It was a good decision for me... let's hope it works for you too!
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I'm back. great work time but grusome report on my trouble, if I get to it. ty joy for your input: you still there??
we have like 99% of the same genes as other mammals so I'd think trouble in rats would mean trouble in us. more trouble in rats if they eat rat chow than if they eat a healthy diet, of course.
I've been wondering if the vinblastasine chemos zap the hair the same as the others. joy??, my hair is still so healthy even though mostly whits, but I do take good care of it.........
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a feiend posted a quote from charles darwin of fb: the survivors are not the most strong, or the most intelligent, they're the ones most easily adapted to change
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abigail48: Very true that quote, and it applies to all thing in life, be it health, career, or just everyday living!
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Hi Abigail ! glad to see you back with us
Please, tell us about your trouble
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don want to. but will. sunday night vv bad. wind coming up & rain storm a few days later. worst discomfort since wind thunder storm last spring. reached for my ng apricot kernal cream, didn't work very fast, I sleep with a hand towel, have for many years since this started, years before it became apparent, scrubbed it hard. then gor out my ice pack & applied it for a few minutes until it hurt from freezing. then got out my great organic pure apricot kernal oil & applied that. then could get back to sleep, & 3 days of no discomfort!!, I don't look at it much anymore & don't bath much either anymore, but I had to change my shirt this morniong, & I looked at it in the utilities room which has a bright light, & apparently it had bled & then scabbed over. looked terrible. I put on the good aprico kernal oil again. & I guess I'll do the castor oil pack sooner than I planned. It's beans so I think it's no good for our trouble, but should be good for it currently..............
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Hi Abigail, I hope you enjoyed your time at the studio. I'm afraid I know little about chemotherapy other than the ones they wanted me to use. The one you mentioned sounds like one they use for stage IV. I had 2 of the 3 rounds of FEC (5-fluoruorocil, epirubicin, cyclophosphamide.. spelling?..) before dropping out. I refused the Docetaxel as I doubt it helps with my type of slow growing BC according to my research. But you needn't even think about chemo as you may not need it.
It you have broken skin then you may get an infection soon. That's what happened to the woman in the thread I sent you a link to. I think this would mean they can't operate for fear of spreading the infection. That's why it's better for us to get the surgery as soon as we find a lump, before complications set in. I feel so sad for your situation and I really hope with all my heart that it's some other health problem, not cancer. Please keep the area as clean as you can and cover it with something sterile. Ask at your pharmacy for dressing for an open wound and change it every day.
Other than that, I guess the pain will eventually cause you to see a Dr or emergency help so there's no point in me pressing the point. Please take care and know we are all here for you.
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hi joy. It' doesn't look like it will get infected. & I've felt very good since this happened. I plan to not rub it as I did though. early on, in march last year the whole breast got dark so I stopped rubbing it as I'd done for years? & cleared up the rough part. then I started agian recently. not a good idea apparently.
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"RAINFOREST PLANT LIQUEFIES CANCER WITH NO SIDE EFFECTS
CANCER patients are offering themselves as human guinea pigs as researchers investigate a possible cure for cancer that was found in north Queensland rainforests.
Scientists have identified a compound in the fruit of the native blushwood shrub that appears to "liquefy and destroy cancer with no side-effects", according to latest research.
Found deep in the remnants of a 130 million-year-old rainforest, the fruit extract may yet hold the secret antidote to Australia's No.1 killer disease.
Victoria Gordon, of EcoBiotics, an Atherton Tableland-based company, said they hoped to go to human clinical trials later this year.
Dr Gordon said a single dose injection of the extract, known as EBC-46, had been effective in 50 critically ill dogs and about a dozen cats and horses.
"This is proving to be something exceptional," she said."The tumour literally liquefies.
"There is a rapid knock-down of the tumour, it disintegrates within 24 hours and we have a rapid healing response.
"The biggest tumour we treated was the size of a Coke can in a dog, and that animal is fully healed and healthy."
Dr Gordon said it had worked on skin cancers, such as carcinomas and melanomas, and bone cancer, and was a possible treatment for breast, colon and prostate cancer."
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Click on the media section, then "Sunday Night, Seven Network" and "Sunrise, Seven Network" to see longer segments.
There have been many discussions about this. It's probably only available for pets in clinical trials in Australia at the moment. And it only works on accessible, local tumours, though I'm not sure how they treat bone. The trees are only found in small areas and the fruit is only available for a short period on the ground. If I lived in the right area I'd be trying to plant some, but that's about 10 hours drive away.
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what's the name of the plant, joy?
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another quote posted by the same friend on fb: the one who follows the crowd will usually get no farther than the crowd; the one who walks alone is likely to find himself in places no one has ever been. - albert einstein
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Abigail, it's a compound in the fruit of the native blushwood shrub (only to be found in Australia) and looks like this:
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it does sound really great doesn't it. nhow is it taken? liquify the bad & piss it out!!!!!!!!!
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Geeze, I don't know what they're waiting for !!!! I'm sure eating the fruit helps tremendously, why can't we find it North America ????
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who knows what the "side effects" are. dogs cant tell us, well anyway, when justeen got her surgery she told me she was vv pissed off at the sore arm she woke up with.
& as usual it would probably grow back, more fruit juice shot?? but the best would be for kary mellis to get off his pot smoking ass & find a way to zap the offending dns
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This is not an edible plant and may work by simply corroding the tissue. It sounds like their publicity was designed to get shareholders money. I found this letter on a pet forum:
A new cancer treatment in animals (EBC-46) derived from a North QLD rain forest tree was originally promoted in tv programs in Oct 2009 and then again in June 2010 (although no scientific data has been released during that time)
No data regarding this compound has be published in the scientific literature at any time. THe information that the company Ecobiotics (via their subsidiary Qbiotis) has posted on their website claims of efficacy in treating cancers in mice, horses, dogs and cats with only minimal discomfort. The mechanism of action of cancer killing is not clear, but is postulated that direct injection into the tumour may stimulate neutriphils to eradicate cancer. The anecdotal descriptions we have heard from veterinarians that have used EBC-46 vary and include necrosis of the tumor creating and open wound sometimes accompanied by significant pain, and often followed by regrowth of the tumour from the periphery, this implies corrosive activity rather than a specific anticancer mechanism.
although Ecobiotics claims cancer cures in patients with otherwise unmanageable cancer, there is little long-term follow up, little clear information regarding the pets disease status or previous treatments tried, and toxicity has not apparently been assessed in any cohesive manner. the Qbiotics website states there has been a "lack of significant effects or adverse events". However we know of at least one dog with a live tumour that was treated in November 2009 with EBC-46 (under direction from Ecobiotics). although the amount of the drug was less than the recommended dose, the patient died during the injection and could not be revived. This event has not been reported by Ecobiotics in their most recent media release or through their website, although they now list liver cancers as one of the sites to avoid treatment. This case and several other patients we know of with marked toxicity that was reported to Qbiotics, casts not doubt as to the completeness of the company's reporting. The CEO of Ecobiotics was contacted to see if we could help with a properly desigtned clinical trial but this offer was refused.
Whenever a "cure for cancer" arises it raises flags. We feel it is appropriate for veterinarians as highly trained professionals whose first concern is the well-being of our patients and all animals with cancer, to be wary when a research group wants to treat patients without a significant body of toxicity data, and chooses to announce trial "results" in the lay press rather than through the scientific literature. Marketing directly through the lay media is of concern, as we feel it takes advantage of worried pet owners fears and hopes. in addition, there appears to be an effort to avoid the same level of scrutiny just because the patients are animals and not humans. This is doing injustice to the veterinary profession as well as to the pets we care for. Finally there is an implication that current "traditional" cancer treatment is ineffective and associated with unacceptable side effects. Veterinary oncology is currently practices with the highest regard for quality of life, surgery, chemotherapy, and radiotherapy are all tailored to ensure these treatments are effective and yet provided with minimal side effects in the vast majority of patients. the animals treated with EBC-46 have, according to the Qbiotics website and media releases, been pets that have "untreatable diseases". Some of the patients we know of (including those shown on the website) certainly had the potential to respond to, and in some cases had the potential for cure with, established therapies such as surgery, radiation therapy or chemotherapy.
PLant derived materials do have potential for cancer treatment; in fact some of the most effective and well-established chemotherapy drugs used in veterinary (as well as human) oncology are derived from plants. However, enormous amounts of careful research and evaluation needs to be done before efficacy can be established. Since the USA National Cancer Institute initiated a screening program for plant-derived antitumour agents in the 1960's, more than 100,000 compounds have been screened but only seven plant derived anticancer drugs have received Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approval for clinical application.
A critical part of the necessary evaluation of a new drug is a carefully designed clinical trial. A rigorous clinical trial is the only way to provide the evidence of safety and efficacy which is required by regulatory authorities for the approval of drugs, and should withstand the process of peer-reviewed for publication in veterinary and medical journals. Treating individual cases without the framework of an appropriate study design can contribute useful early information but it constitutes a pilot study, not a clinical trial. For example, the American Cancer Society evaluates cancer treatment methods by asking three questions:
1) Has the treatment been objectively demonstrated in the peer-reviewed scientific literature to be effective?
2) Has the treatment shown potential for benefit that clearly exceeds the potential for harm?
3) Have objective studies been correctly conducted under appropriate peer review to answer these questions?Our concern regarding EBC-46 is shared by the Cancer Council of Australia. In June 2010, this group sounded a note of caution on the media releases, saying the company had not yet published its research.
"We have yet to see the results of this research published in a significant journal, where they would be subject ti independent scientific scrutiny, which is useful determining the rigour of the research,"chief executive Ian Olver said in a statement. "...it is far too early to be able to class this as a breakthrough."EBC-46 has not undergone the testing and scrutiny for saftey and efficacy that is required to enter clinical veterinary practice. Until such time as controlled clinical trials can be performed that ensure that pets are not likely to be harmed by this treatment, we cannot endorse this product. The undersigned veterinarians have had extensive experience in designing and performing clinical trials, both in Australia and overseas, and we strongly urge our fellow veterinarians to wait for complete evaluation of any compound before recommending it for their patients.
Signed Anthony Moore : BV SC, MV Sc: (Oncology) Adjunct Professor, University of Sydney, Director Veterinary Oncology Consultants
Angela Frimberger V MD (Oncology) Adjunct Senior Lecturer, University of Sydney, Director Veterinary Oncology Consultants.
Rodney Straw BV Sc - Specialist small animal surgeon (oncology), Director of Brisbane Veterinary Specialist Centre, Executive Director of The Australian Animal Cancer Foundation.
Peter Bennett BV Sc (Oncology and Internal Medicine) - Specialist in Veterinary Oncology and Small Animal Internal Medicine - Director Melbourne Veterinary Cancer Care, Senior Fellow Univeristy of Melbourne Adjunct Senior Lecturer Massey University.
Valerie Poirier DV M, (Oncology and Radiation Oncology) Specialist in Veterinary Oncology
Peter Best BV Sc - Specialist in Veterinary Anaesthesia
After a lengthy discussion at our vet practice, until more work is done on this we are not recommending it to anyone... not one of our staff would even contemplate using this in our own animals, let alone recommending it to the general public.
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rigorous clinical trials can also be fudged by companies wanting money in the same way. justeen got a good year following her surgery, then the cancer came back in her face 2 or so years later. probably should have left it alone as long as it didn't fill with blood. unsightly as it was, she had insisted on falling in love with a dalmation/bordercollie cross & having more pups while it was very big. the pups were born with some kind of lung amalomies, 3 died, perhaps more as she'd leave for awhile after each was born, one, "precious" was precious but couldn't eat solid food, it was something like...........can't recall the name of the trouble, the 5th dog was huge. looked like a black lab, with no lab in him. great dog but only lived 6 years. he got breast cancer too, It regrew after surgery & he didn't survive a second sergery. perhaps the vet didn't want to see him again.
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I won't give up HOPE
All-Natural "Killer" Targets Cancer
There's good news on the cancer front. An all-natural flower extract kills cancer cells without harmful side effects.
The news comes from Professor Laurence Patterson. He's the director of the UK Institute for Cancer Therapeutics (ICT). He also leads cancer research for the University of Bradford in England.
"Many agents used in the treatment of cancer are poisons," he says. "Chemotherapy can be the death of a patient."
But this new flower extract treatment is different. It targets cancer cells while leaving healthy cells unharmed. And it works for many types of cancer.
"It's a new treatment that could be effective against pretty much all types of tumor," he says. "And it will not cause damage to normal tissue."
Other cancer experts are supporting his findings, which are published in the journal Cancer Research.
"This new approach targets tumor blood vessels that cancers need for growth," says Dr. Paul Workman, who leads the cancer research department for the University of London.
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Maud: It will be interesting to see if it ever sees the light of day once the pharmaceutical industry gets involved. I'm always hopeful.
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Kaara: if BigPharma stands in the way of saving our lives, they are killers.
I'm hopeful because this is in Europe...wonder if pharma is Big over there
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