Rant away about COVID, the vaccine, etc.

trinigirl50

Illmae, of course we have the truth. It is obvious that the vaccine has cut down hospitalizations (of the vaccinated). We've had enough data posted here on this thread to support that vaccines work, why would you think there was no biased data out there?

I do Covid Tracking in a small county here in US so I have real experience of the numbers. An example of the Public Health Data:. 80 people tested positive on 8/26, 75 unvaccinated, 3 vaccinated with Moderna, 2 with Pfizer. Currently 20 in hospital. 1 60 year old male died. All in hospital are unvaccinated.

Where would be the bias in that data?

I agree we won't know everything about Covid or all Covid vaccine side effects for awhile but I would think that is a fairly normal reality.

I also agree that the debate has become hopelessly and stupidly politicized. And that deeply saddens me. However, facts are still facts.

Rumor you are one of the most articulate and interesting of the conspiracy theorists on this thread. I often read your posts because they are so relatable and funny. But thank Goodness you live nowhere near my husband (who has never asked anyone for anything in his entire life, including the hereditary illness that makes him high risk for Covid). I imagine that you might find it difficult to look him in the eye and ask him to stop asking for special privileges because his right to live was an impingement on your right to ummm, not put a cloth over the lower half of your face while in his presence.

I believe that the masking, social distancing was meant to be temporary while they worked out an answer. They got an answer - vaccine. And then because of misinformation, people refused to get the vaccine, so now we are back to square one. Entirely preventable.

My mother in law died alone due to Covid, my friend Lennox died due to Covid. They might be dispensible to most but they weren't to me. Neither of them were the type to think that they should be granted special privileges, both of them were hoping to be vaccinated but weren't allowed at time of their diagnosis, both of them were exposed (having masked and social distanced religiously for nearly a year) due to others not thinking Covid was a big deal. Since when has compassion for others become whingey emotional blackmail? This is in your face reality for many. Go spend an hour or so in a Covid ER unit if you need more proof.

wrenn

Because of her articulate, funny, interesting posts I have been proud to live near Runor.

Until today.

Beesie

trinigirl, I am so sorry for the loss of your mother-in-law and your friend. I may not have known them but I know that they were not dispensible. I can't imagine anyone thinking that they were.

Mavericksmom

Aram: Great point, thank you!

illimae, I have my pop-corn!

Melbo, I couldn't have said it better.

Beesie, thanks for your contribution, I thought the same and yes, I am one that up until now has remained quiet but have been reading.

My feeling, if you can get a vaccine and chose not too, you fit perfectly into my husband's motto of "if you are going to be stupid, you better be tough!" I might add to please not take up hospital space because NOW you understand how deadly this disease and YOU are having difficulty breathing!

I am SICK of non-maskers inside schools with "all in", masking isn't a big deal, I do it ALL school day long, I even eat with my mask on! Not a huge problem. As per my thread on Covid and schools, we need our kids all back to school with in person learning, and we can have that, if we are as safe as possible.

I am SICK of the selfishness and if I hurt feelings by saying that, oh well! Most topics I feel two sides, but as far as Covid is, I can't handle the ignorant! and foolishness!

My concern is for kids, so I won't say more on here other than those of you who don't vaccinate and can or don't wear a mask (unless you live in a remote community with no Covid), you are putting kids in danger!

Think about these things: If a child gets Covid, only one parent can stay in the hospital with the child, so pity the poor siblings and if there is a spouse, the one who can't be with their child! If an adult or child gets Covid and is hospitalized you will get a huge medical bill, so good luck with that! It doesn't matter if the person dies, you will be hit with grief and a huge bill that can come a year later! Who wants that? There are children in schools and others who CAN NOT mask or be vaccinated! What you do matters to them!

I am not trying to be mean or put anyone down, but I do speak my mind when it comes to Covid! I wish everyone well!

illimae

Trini, sorry, it didn’t type exactly what I meant about data, it’s more about reporting. I believe information is often modified to fit an agenda. I find your tracking info credible, I have no reason to think otherwise but I have worked in state government long enough to know that some data is gathered, interpreted and reported by people who can be incompetent at best and corrupt at worst. If Covid hadn’t been so completely swept up in politics, I’d likely be less skeptical of what I hear from media, not random youtubers but mainstream as well. The pandemic is so involved with power and money now that I am just not confident in what we are told and why.

Anyway, ultimately, the CDC does not recommend the vaccine for me, maybe something better suited will come along, maybe not, either way my guard is still way up, my mask is on and vaccinated individuals need not fear me.

Piggy99

Illimae, polysorbate/PEG allergies are just about the strongest contraindication for the current Covid vaccines, and have the highest correlation to severe anaphylactic shock after Covid vaccination. You made the right call not getting the vaccine, and I don't think anybody here would question your decision or your right to be exempt from any vaccination passports or requirements. I would argue that the existence of people who cannot have the vaccine is even more reason for those of us who can to roll up those sleeves and don on those masks.

December11

As a vaccinated person, I don't fear the unvaccinated. It should be the other way around. They should fear me. I trust the vaccine I got. I trust if I get the COVID, the vaccine will keep me out of the hospital and off the ventilator. And if I got the COVID, I might be one of those people who didn't know I had it and passed it on to the unvaccinated who could end up in the ICU, on the ventilator, or worse.

MountainMia

On Thursday August 26, 2021, there were 2,266 covid-19 related deaths reported in the US.

An average 747 carries 366 passengers. Edited to add, there are about 1.73 million passengers flying each day in the US.

An equivalent of more than 6 jumbo jets' worth of people died on Thursday from covid-19.

If there were 6 major plane crashes in the US EVERY STINKING DAY, you can bet the same people who are whining and bitching about government control about covid would be DEMANDING that the government do something to stop all the plane crashes. And you can be damn sure that those same people would protect themselves and their families by NOT FLYING, even though only 0.1% of passengers die in those hypothetical plane crashes.

trinigirl50

thanks for clarification illimae. I do find it sad that people are unsure who to trust nowadays.

Stay safe up your beautiful mountain.

Anonymous

Question - is a belief that "most people are not getting vaccinated in the USA" a conspiracy theory too?

After it's been shown that 85% of adultsactually do have at least one shot already and are perfectly willing to become fully vaccinated?

What percentage of the population must be vaccinated for herd immunity and/or for everyone to feel safe?

Teedoff

While we catch a breath I’d like to recommend the newest book by Canadian author Louise Penney, The Madness of Crowds. It’s a mystery novel wrapped in a serious look at how public opinion can be influenced during a crisis. It says a lot about Covid and how we treat our fellow human beings. It was written before Delta but after vaccines became available and people were beginning to feel freedom to interact with loved ones A very thoughtful look at people’s reactions to the pandemic even though it is fiction.

Chowdog

Olma, as of this morning, based on CDC data, only 74% of the U.S adults have received 1 dose. The U.S has a large population of kids, therefore only 61.6% of total population have received 1 dose.

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinat...

With regarding to herd immunity, pre delta, it was estimated that 70% of population need to vaccinated to reach herd immunity. however, with Delta, now it is estimated ~90% of population need to be vaccinated.

wrenn

thank you Teedoff for book recommendation. just downloaded. Sounds good.

blue22

KBL I think you mentioned earlier you were having trouble sleeping. Is it possible that deep down you are trying to convince yourself not getting the vaccine is the right choice for you, and you created this thread hoping to support that decision, but instead the majority of posters are arguing for vaccination and thus the thread failed in its intended purpose?

It would be a nice fantasy to think you can just make that decision and move on, but the reality is the pandemic is still here, and it is not going away any time soon. If you choose not to get the vaccine, unless you stay home and isolate yourself, and everyone you come into contact with is also equally careful, you run the risk of getting Covid, getting sick, and possibly dying from Covid. I think you know this, and that is why you are having a hard time sleeping.

Anonymous

thanks for the response Chowdog. Even at 74%, the statement that “most people are not getting vaccinated" is false. The vaccination of children and teens only began recently, isn't that right.? So a low rate.of vaccination among under 18s to date, doesn't indicate non-compliance.

exbrnxgrl

olma,

Remember too, that the areas where vaccination rates are low are not equally spread out across the country. That aggregate figure, whether it is 74% or not doesn't speak to distribution.So to really see where low vaccination and infection, hospitalization, and deaths are it's more specific and interesting IMO, to look at state and county data.

Trinigirl,

I'm so sorry for your losses. May the memory of your loved ones be a comfort and a blessing.

Chowdog

Olma, it depends on the state, county and zip code in terms of vaccine compliance. On the CDC site or your local covid dashboard, you can play around and see how your county is doing. My county is highly vaccinated but there are plenty of pockets (zip codes/communities) with low vaccination rate.

More importantly, with Delta, we really need more people to get fully vaccinated rather than counting on just 1 dose to become more protected from Delta. back in April, NYT reported 5 million people skipped the 2nd dose. I really hope these people get their 2nd dose unless of course they couldn't due to allergic reaction. I think the herd immunity % is for people to become fully vaccinated.

Edit to add, as a country, we are only 52.3% fully vaccinated.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/25/business/covid-...

KBL

Oh, blue, I'll come in briefly. Nope, not even close, but nice try. I've had trouble sleeping long before COVID. I don't know, maybe it's because I'm on medication for Stage IV that keeps me awake. Maybe it's because I have constant hot flashes day and night. Maybe it's because I get up to pee multiple times a night and just can't fall back to sleep easily.

I didn't create this thread because I needed support, I created it because it was consuming another thread and no one else wanted to start this one to give people in the other thread the opportunity to rant about cancer. I knew the majority were for the vaccine. You can go to Page 290 in STEAM ROOM to see a response I wrote.

I do not lose sleep for my decision. Please try to be respectful. I do not want people to try to diagnose my reasons for not sleeping.

AlwaysMeC

Olma, I believe the percentage depends on the R0 value. Reports say that Delta has an R naught of around 5-8, comparable to Polio. Herd immunity for polio is 80 percent. If it's as contagious as measles it would be around 95 percent. I don't think we can get to herd immunity because children aren't vaccinated. So, at this point I think everyone is just operating on mitigation. The story was different when it was the first variant that had a R0 of around 2-3. And with all the unvaccinated catching it, who knows what kind of variants will come of it in the future- may be less contagious, may be more contagious.

Anonymous

caryn, chowdog, alwaysme, thank you for the added info. Yes agreed,the most relevant concern for individuals is the rate in their own locale.

Saw this today, seems positive. Even when antibodies from the vaccine begin to wane, our immune systems have a backup plan -

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-28/antibodies-waning-the-immune-system-has-a-backup-plan-for-that?utm_campaign=news&utm_medium=bd&utm_source=applenews

“Researchers at the university's Perelman School of Medicine tracked 61 people for six months after immunization with mRNA vaccines. The team noted that antibodies gradually ebbed, but that the shots generated durable immune memory to SARS-CoV-2 in the form of B and T cells that increased over time to help ward off serious illness.“

The Twitter thread from the researcher is good, too. Note, I think it’s a preprint, not yet peer reviewed.

Elderberry

Teedoff: Another novel by L Penney. She is a terrific writer. Must go get it!!!

KBL; Have you tried CBD oil or melatonin for sleep? They are safer then the diazepam related drugs. Insomnia is a bitch. I have periods where I lay awake thinking at least I don't have to get up and go to work with barely a few hours sleep. I am retired. I can always nap. No idea why some nights are like that. It is not my tortured psyche. I am just awake and my brain tries to fill in the empty spaces with playing stupid songs in my head. I am so glad to be vaccinated. I am so glad my husband has been. I just wish I could travel, see more friends and live whatever time I have left to its fullest.

I have posted this before but I am old enough to remember when the polio vaccine came out. My mother could hardly wait for me to get my vaccine. We had kids in school with canes and braces or had siblings in hospital in iron lungs. I had measles, mumps, chicken pox. Kids had encephalitis, deafness, blindness from measles. I just covered in bright red dots all over. Oatmeal baths and calamine lotion for chicken pox. I survived but a shot would have made for a much happier time. Now shingles is a potential for me and my cohorts who had chicken pox. At least there is a vaccine for shingles.

I am pro pro pro vaccines but I can't/won't argue with anti-vaxxers and the hesitant will have their arguments as to why they want to wait for five years first. For what? When all is revealed that there are no long term side effects, the current vaccine will have been re-tweaked several times (just like the yearly flu) and then what? You won't take the newest version in 2026?

KBL

Elderberry, yes, I have tried CBD with CBN. It does work on and off. I tried melatonin one time and had the craziest dreams ever. That was enough for me. I have not and probably won’t ever do any prescription sleep meds. I think my reason for not being upset about not sleeping is I no longer work as well. I can’t imagine how people who work function with insomnia. I try so hard not to look at the clock because if it’s between 1 and 3, forget it. I fall asleep great. It’s the staying there that’s the issue. Stupid bladder

exbrnxgrl

Elderberry,

I was born the year after the polio vaccine came out but like you , had measles, chicken pox, German measles but never mumps. I had no lingering effects from any of them but do remember being miserable, I confess to enjoying the way I looked when adorned with pink calamine lotion dots. My older dd briefly considered not vaccinating my oldest grandchild. I am glad she she realized that it is important.

Teedoff

Elderberry: Everyone is back in Three Pines, but oh this turns dark. But again, beautifully written. All 400 pages! Makes you think!. Sorry I gave Penny an extra e.

Got my polio shot in school. We marched across the auditorium stage to line up. Our parents were happy for sure. The pictures of kids in Iron Lungs were so heart breaking. Had red measles, German measles, mumps, and chicken pox. Thankful for shingles vaccine and pneumovax in my old age. I believe in the prevent defense when available.

Olma: Wish I made enough B cells and T cells! My immune system is shot. That's why I made a Hail Mary pass for the booster and fingers crossed it helps. As you can see, on my balance scale of risk I choose vaccines

exbrnxgrl

KBL,

I think I mentioned this before but my older dd had weird dreams with melatonin too. She didn’t take it for quite a few years but recently gave it another try and didn’t have those dreams. In my dispensary, they sell a product called Lights Out. It’s a high THC and melatonin tincture. It works for me!

KBL

exbrnxgirl, I will see if my dispensary has something like that. I’m not sure I want to try the melatonin again. Thank you for the name.

Anonymous

Yes I had all the childhood diseases (except polio) too, before the vaccines for them were developed. My sister and brother were in time for the rubella vax but had to suffer with measles, mumps and chicken pox.

I did get the polio vax of course and the smallpox vax - it was still given routinely by some pediatricians in the early 60s. I remember a big scab that finally fell off and then a scar that looked like a big acne pit. My scar did eventually disappear.

I never bothered with flu shots, though. I still have only had it once and that was given to me at the cancer center. My onc wasn’t too happy with my lax attitude about it - but before having cancer, my reasoning was this -

I work from home

I don’t ride public transportation

I’m normally not in crowded spaces

This shot is much less than 100% effective at preventing all strains of flu

I’m pretty healthy (true back then) and rarely even get a cold,haven’t had a bacterial or viral respiratory infection in yrs.

Not worth my time and not worth risk of getting sick from the vaccine, even if mild symptoms for onlyone day.

I’m not opposed to getting it now, circumstances have radically changed. But in four years, I’ve only had it once.

kathindc

I remember taking the polio vaccine as a child. A friend of my mother, who was just a few years older than me had polio as a child. Years later she developed post polio syndrome which greatly impacted her life. I see something like that happening with patients who have/had severe cases of covid. Look at the long haulers who are having difficulty now. One of my DDs had covid last year. We think of covid as being upper respiratory. It isn't. She had severe gastrointestinal symptoms that lasted over two months. Luckily, she didn't have to be hospitalized but did end up having to have IV fluids twice because of dehydration. This was the symptoms seen by her doctor who has a large patient population in her part of the city. She jumped when the city opened vaccination appointments to her age group for preregistration. I have been fully vaccinated since the end of February. Knowing what my DD went through and having several comorbidities and thinking how those could lower my chances for survival and my research I did not hesitate in signing up for the shot

The delta variant is hitting young children muchharder than the previous ones.

KBL, I do think you need to do your own research from reputable medical journals. Even National Geographic has made covid articles accessible to non subscribers. You have been given excellent information from others, maybe it’s time for you to do your own research from reputable sources. And yes I have done my own since early on in the pandemic as stated above. It left no doubt that getting the vaccine was the right thing to do.

Trishyla

My sister and I both had measles in our eyes. I still vividly remember, nearly nearly sixty years later, having to wear sunglasses every waking moment for about three months. My poor mother was terrified that one of us would end up blind.

I also had mumps and chickenpox and rubella. Quite honestly, looking back I realize how lucky we were to have survived childhood. If we were kids now my mother would have marched us to the head of the line the moment we were eligible. As I would have if my children were still young. To do otherwise would have felt like child neglect.

Anonymous

Jo-5 - The ones here for vaccinations aren't wrong, but it doesn't matter. Look up any reputable hospital and visit their COVID page. Those hospitals recommend vaccinations.

New Zealand has reported its first death from the vaccine. It was from myocarditis. Scary, huh? You know how people (wrongly) minimize COVID deaths by claiming comorbidities? The person who died had other unspecified health issues.

Let's do math. Not really. I'll do it. I'm getting the numbers from the article below.

NZ deaths from vaccine: 1 / 3 million = 0.00003333333%

NZ deaths from COVID: 26 / 3465 = 0.75000000000%

=> Much less likely to die from the vaccine than COVID! It's 1 in 3 million vs 1 in 133. Huge difference. See it?

NZ has a low case rate, but it was 0. They're locking down and will likely be at 0 again with more vaccinations. Then they'll gloat by having Crowded House perform again.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-58380867?xtor=...