Bible Study for the Biblically Challenged Anyone?

moodyk13

Hi Laura! Glad you popped over and very glad your following along.  Please feel free to contribute anytime, as we are all students of God's word. 

moodyk13

To me, understanding the events that took place in Genesis lays the foundation for the rest of the scripture.  If you know the history, it makes it easier to comprehend the rest of the bible.  In addition, Genesis lays out how the Israelites came to be and how they came into bondage in Egypt, and how all this was necessary to lead up to the birth and life and crucifixion of Jesus Christ.  I beleive that God knew He would need to "prove" to the Israelites over and over His Divine Power, or no one would ever believe that Mary could concieve a baby and still be a virgin, and certainly wouldn't believe that Christ was dead for three days and came back to life.

However, by studying the Old Testament-particularly Genesis, it makes the New Testament more of a "WOW He thought enough of me to do all this" rather than "How could He do all this, He never did anything miraculous before..."

So today I am going to back track just a little bit to Genesis 17 and lay the foundation of why Sarah had to have a baby, why Isaac was born, and why Ishmael and Hagar had to be "out of the picture".

Genesis 17:  Because Abraham was blameless before God, God promised to make him the father of all nations.  Sarah was his wife, so God also promised that Sarah would be the mother of all nations.  This is why God "opened her womb" and she conceived Isaac.  See Ishmael was not the son of Abraham's wife, he was the son of the "surrogate" Hagar.  Hagar can't be the mother of the nations, she is not the wife of Abraham.

When God made this covenant with Abraham He instructed Abraham in circumcision as a sign of the covenant.  The scripture tells us in Genesis 17: 24 & 25 that Abraham was obedient and circumcised himself and Ishmael.  The scripture also tells us that Ishmael was 13 years old at this time.

When Sarah had Abraham send Hagar and Ishmael away he would have been around 15 - 17 years old I gather.  Ishmael was 13 and it was a year later before Isaac was born, so that would make him 14ish, and I am not sure how old children were when they were weaned back then, so I am guessing between 1 & 3 yrs so Ishmael would been a teenager, and old enough to know better than to make fun of his "toddler" brother.

I believe, even though it broke Abraham's heart to send his first born away at such a tender age, he knew deep down how influential siblings were to each other.  If Ishmael had a bad attitude, then it could so easily rub off on Isaac.  Abraham valued his covenant with God, and his faith in God, more than his desire to allow Ishmael to stay there and "wreak havoc" on his family.  This is proven again when he obeyed God and took Isaac to sacrifice him. 

Man, what if we kicked our kids out of the house today every time they made fun of a sibling.............

marshakb

I have always been fascinated with the story of Hagar and Ishmael.  Abraham, of course, knew Ishmael would be jealous of the "legitimate" child, Isaac.  Proof of his unfailing commitment to God is his willingness to send one child away and offer up, in sacrifice, another.  And let's not forget that jealousy still exists to this day with God's chosen people. 

I've been a little puzzled by the promise to Abraham to be the father of all nations if Ishmael was promised when he was banished to be the father of a great nation.

We're truly blessed to not have to make these kind of ultimate sacrifices, when Jesus died on the cross so that our sins will be forgiven.

Thanks for the welcome Moody. 

marshakb

OH BTW Moody did you do this?

" I am gonna work on one that goes from Ishmael to Muhammed (Islam founder)"

If so what page is it on?  I'd really like to see this lineage

moodyk13

marshakb, first let me say, thanks for adding to discussion as your insight is very welcome! 

I would like to add to your comment "Ishmael was promised when he was banished to be the father of a great nation."    If we go back a little bit, to the time Hagar was still pregnant, we can see that God let her know up front that Ishmael would be "a wild man; his hand shall be against every man and every man's hand against him."  (Gen 16:12) This conversation took place before the covenant with Abraham.  So when God promised to make him a great nation, He didn't mean it was a good thing LOL  .   Basically a reminder of what God ahd already told Hagar while she was still pregnant.  God never forgets His words and promises.

And yes I said I would post the lineage of Ishmael, but now I am not sure I can provide something that is concrete. I can't remember which theology site I saw it on, and when I google it, seems that only Islam's proclaim to be descendants if Ishmael, and we know how much we can believe them...........

Anyway, I will keep searching and if I find it, I will post it. 

karen4u

Just wanted to drop in and tell you how much I enjoy reading your posts.  You certainly have the gift of teaching, which is not mine.  But allow me to use mine and encourage you to continue allowing our Blessed Lord and Savior to use you.  You handled the start of this thread with such meekness, I admire you for that.  God Bless You !!! 

moodyk13

Wow karen4u what a humbling thing to say.  You have blessed my heart so much!  God just used you to remind me how important it is I continue to stay faithful in serving Him with this thread!  Thank you so much!

And, welcome!  I hope you will join in the discussion, as I believe everyone has something to share that will teach others..

May God Bless you and anyone reading here!

Rosemary44

Let me ask this one question.  Now I know God is a male,  anyway in that wrestling match, when you first read about it, like I did, what was your first thought? 

I'll tell you mine, What?  Are they 12?  Jacob wouldn't give in, God broke his hip, as a one up.  Jacob couldn't resist making a comment afterwards.  Ha, I won kind of thing.  Typical men stuff.  And we wonder where they get it from. 

LuAnnH

I hate when you all jump ahead of me and give away what is happening  LOL  I am just getting to the struggle in the bush and now I'll have a heads ups  LOL  Oh well, given my rotten day maybe it iwll make my reading more exciting.

moodyk13

Actually Rosemary, the bible tells us that God has both characteristics of male and female, in addition of course to Him being a Spiritual being which would have no human characteristics, but anyway here is the verse:

Genesis 1:27  "So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them."

And verse 26 prefaces this by saying:  "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion" Notice the use of plural terms used to describe God with "us" and "our" and then the plural terms used to describe "man"  with "them".   It can be a bit confusing if you try to nick-pick apart, but if you just read it and not try to find some underlying message, it is pretty easy to understand.

God dislocated Jacobs hip He didn't break it.  And as we said earlier, this wasnt about God, as God doesnt need to wrestle, He can just "zap" , it was God's way of having Jacob recognize his role in this world.  This is eveident when he acknowledges that he wrestled with God and lived to tell about it.  Jacob knew it wasnt about getting one over on God because that is impossible, it was about recognizing that God had big plans for him, and he is capable of rising from adversity to do God's will!  AWESOME!

marshakb

On the subject of Jacob, he was known to be determined, willing to work long and hard for what he wanted and was considered a good businessman.  His biggest weakness seems to be when he was faced with conflict he relied on his own resources rather than going to God for help.  He also tended to accumulate wealth for its own sake.  (WOW, now that sure is something we see in todays times too)  What he learned in life is that this security DOES NOT lie in this accumulation of "things" and that all human intentions/actions whether for good or evil, are woven by God into his ongoing plan.

Gen 28:15 "What's more, I will be with you, and I will protect you wherever you go.  I will someday bring you safely back to this land.  I will be with you constantly until I have finished giving you everything I have promised".

In a summation on Jacob from Life Application Study Bible:  Jacob means 'he grasps the heel" or figurativley "he deceives".  He grabbed Esau's heel at birth and  by the time he fled from home, he had grabbed his brothers birthright and blessing. 

God didn't give up on him!  He became a person who presented his plans to God and waited for His approval before taking any action.  Spiritual growth, available to all of us!!

moodyk13

AMEN Marsha it is amazing sometimes that the only thing that has changed since the dawn of man is technology, but our characteristics and behaviors remain the same!!

LuAnnH

If you all didn't see it anywhere else my son is in the AIR!!!!!!  He is leaving the war!!!!!!  SAFELY!!!!!!  I am packing frantically to leave for texas tomorrow and upon my return will be facing SRS and surgery for my pain pump.  I am taking my bible with me and will do my best to keep up with you all.  I hate falling behind because it ruins my excitement!!!!  I love you all and will try to keep up and will be returning from texas Jan 30th.  Love you guys, I'll be back as soon as I can but my sons loving arms are waiting for me!!!!!  Can you tell I'm a tad bit excited!

moodyk13

LUANNH THAT IS SO AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!  I AM SOOOOO HAPPY FOR YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!  PRAISE GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

sue_blue

LuAnn, enjoy your time with your son. You both deserve it. I wish you safety and joy as you travel and reunite. Many blessings. It's so awesome that you are excited about not missing out on anything here either. Enjoy!

Rosemary44

LuAnn,

Great news, we all are enjoying your excitement. 

Rosemary44

Moody,

We can also see that Jacob was hanging back, he sent everyone on to meet his brother, everyone but himself.  He was a bit fearful of what was in store for him.  I think the wrestling match was a confidence builder also.  We all wrestle with problems and we could use some confidence to just put it in God's hands.  Well, that's how I interpret the passage.

moodyk13

OOo Rosemary I forgot about that!  Makes sense and I wonder if Jacob could sense something was up and that is why he got everyone out of there.  He didnt have any verbal warning..... 

Rosemary44

Moody,

Put it into your own perspective.  What do you want it to mean for you?  No, I don't think he knew the fight was coming.  For me he was pretty darn fearful and acted accordingly.  He stayed put. God took care of that quick enough.  God didn't push him out, He just gave him a confidence building lesson instead. 

marshakb

Agreed, Rosemary, when Joseph invited him to come to Egypt it is pretty clear he didn't want to make a move without God's approval.  However, God also gave him the  confidence of being able to TRUST that He would guide him.

I think in alot of situations in our lives we have the thought of "I can handle this on my own'.  Gods lesson is that we don't have to, so why not just turn it over to him in the first place?

moodyk13

I believe the US Airways plane crash/landing was a total God thing.  I dont know if the pilot is a christian or not, I bet he believes in God though.  But think about this: there is a plane in the air and has no power, pilot has to go through a mental check list of choices in a minute or less of time. 

He makes his choice and then puts it into action.  Think about the fact there was no wind, no rain, no ice or snow.  No boats, small planes, helicopters, ferries, nothing in his way on the very very busy Hudson river.  When both engines blew, he no longer had "power steering" as electical components would have gone out with the engines.  So he manually steers the plane PERFECTLY onto the water, once landed, the flight attendant couldnt get the back emergency exit to open.  If she had been able to open it, the plane would have sunk in a matter of minutes. All are saved and standing on the wings of this huge airliner, being pulled out of the ice cold water.

There is so much God all in this it makes my head swim!  One thing I cant help but think of is this:

I see the plane as the USA, we are in the water and sinking, but we aren't sunk yet.  If people will just trust God and climb onto the wings, there is rescue from death.  For all who walk out on those wings, there is a life boat called Christ, ready to pull us up into safety.

Just amazing to me.  God guided that plane and placed it perfectly in the water, and the media calls it "luck".  It was totally by the grace of God those people survived.  God has big plans for someone who was on that plane, maybe the pilot, maybe more than one person.  But God gets the glory here on this thread.  He used the pilot to do his work and I praise God for that!

Rosemary44

The miracle on the Hudson.  I don't know if God has intentions for anyone that survived as much as giving us all a reminder of His existence.  I hate to see idolizing going on of mere mortals as we're all watching.  I think we all need to be put in a time out to think about things. 

moodyk13

LOL Rosemary, I do wish someone would put me in a time out!  I would even like to be grounded! 

moodyk13

STUDY #2:  Abraham & Isaac Cont.

The next time Isaac is discussed in the Bible is Genesis 22.  This is the ever so famous story of Abraham following God's instruction to sacrifice Isaac, and the undisputable faith Abraham had, that pleasing God was more important than his son's life, or perhaps Abraham just had unshakeable faith that God would never take back His promise to make Abraham a great nation through Isaac specifically.

Let's look back real quick to chapter 15:

Genesis  15:2-4 "But Abram said, ‘Lord God, what will You give me seeing I go childless, and the heir of my house is Eliezer of Damascus?'  Then Abram said. ‘Look, You have given me no offspring; indeed one born in my house is my heir!' And behold, the word of the Lord came to him saying, ‘This one shall not be your heir, but one who will come from your body shall be your heir.'"

Eliezer was one of Abram's servants.  Probably the head servant and in those days the custom was for a man who was childless would "adopt" someone, many times their head servant to be their heir.  Then if a natural child came later, the child would take the place of the servant as heir.

So Abram knows that Eliezer is not meant to carry on God's promise of being a great nation.

Look forward to Genesis 17 where God is talking to Abraham about Sarah:

Genesis 17: 16 "And I will bless her and also give you a son by her; then I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of peoples shall be from her."

Then lastly, God tells Abraham specifically that He will establish His covenant with Isaac and not Ishmael:

Genesis 17: 21 "But My covenant I will establish with Isaac, whom Sarah shall bear to you at this set time next year."

Back to chapter 22, I believe Abraham was willing to go through each step of a sacrifice even if it meant sticking the knife through Isaac, as he knew how big God was, and knew Isaac would not die before God had fulfilled His promise.

moodyk13

I am going to put something in the middle of our discussion here that I believe the Lord has called me to do.  I have been feeling that I am suppose to do this for quite some time, perhaps waiting on the "right" moment.  I believe the moment is right, because God won't let me rest till I do.

Let's look at The Trinity:  God the Father, God the Son, & God the Holy Spirit.  Because the Bible doesn't use the word "Trinity" when describing or referring to God, so many people don't believe that it exists.  I have always understood that God is three entities in One being, I have never even thought to doubt it.  But if someone asked me to show them this in the scripture I would be stuck.   Well God has opened my eyes to biblical scripture that does in fact, descriptive, and faith that He is three persons wrapped up into One.

I am going to post in 3 consecutive posts so that it is easier for everyone to read, then I hope you will take your own time, to look up every piece of scripture and perhaps mark some of these in your bible.  The last post will be a "quick reference" chart that I put together in a .gif format.  I keep one in my bible.  If you would like to have on to print, and can'y get it to print from here, please PM me with your email, and I will send it to you directly.

Now here is my "Preface" for the next the posts on the Trinity.

Genesis 18:1 - 3  "And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;  And he lifted up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them , he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,  And said, My Lord, if now I have found favor in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant:"

Notice the three words I have put in bold.  In the beginning of Genesis, God lets us know that He is more than one when He said "let US make man in OUR on image" .  Now here in chapter 18 is our first "glimpse" of the Lord God being Three in One Lord God.

  

moodyk13

                                        THE TRINITY PART ONE  

The Trinity

The Trinity is a "Hot Topic" among Christians and among those who try to "discredit" christianity by denying the Triune God.

One thing we can all agree on is that the Trinity is known as "God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit."  I tell my kids to think of it like I am Karen the wife, Karen the mother, Karen the daughter.  I am still the same person, but each "role" has different responsibilities.  Each One in the Trinity has different roles.

Secondly, anything that God has not completely revealed to us through His word is where your faith must prevail.  Hab 2:4 "...but the just shall live by his faith." 

God makes it clear that He keeps some things secret:  Deut 29:29 "The secret things belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law."

God the Father:  This one is easy, He made the universe, it is all His, He made man in His image, His word calls for the father to be the head of the house hold, so God is our Father.  The prophets refer to "God the Father" many times in the scripture.

God the Son:  Oh this is the most difficult one.  For every verse that identifies Jesus as God in the flesh, there are verses that shows Jesus in a role as inferior to God.  The question I hear the most, and one I asked myself, is "If Jesus is God, why does He pray to Himself?"  And the answer that was given to me and satisfied ME was that Jesus prayed to set the example for what God's word tells us to do....pray!  We are to go the The Father for wisdom, strength, courage, guidance, fear, everything.  Just as I set the example with my children with say exercising.  If I tell them they should exercise and they see me exercise, I ask them to exercise with me, they are more likely to exercise.

God the Holy Spirit:  This one is pretty easy too and the bible is full of references to the Spirit of God or the Holy Ghost.  This is the entity that cannot be seen or heard but certainly felt.

moodyk13

                                    THE TRINITY PART TWO  

Gen 1:26 "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness..." 

The plural use "us" and "our" show already that God in more than one entity.  Not more than one God, just more than one "part" of Him.                 

John 1:1-3  "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.  He  was in the beginning with God.  All things were made by Him; and without Him was not any thing made that was made.

John 1:14-15 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.  John bare witness of Him, and cried, saying, This was He of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for He was before me.

John 14:7 - 11 "If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also: and from now on you know Him, and have seen Him.   Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficient for us."   Jesus said to him, "Have I been  with you so long, and yet you have not known me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say,' Show us the Father'? Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me, does the works.  Believe Me that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me: or else believe Me for the sake of the works' themselves."

Tim 3:16 "God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory."

1John 5:7 "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are One."

Gen 1:2 "...And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."
Acts 5:3 "But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost...."
Matthew 28:19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost"

moodyk13

                                 TRINITY QUICK REFERENC CHART

moodyk13

bump

marshakb

Genesis 22

Can you imagine how Abraham must have felt on that 3 day trek to Mt Moriah to make the ultimate sacrifice of his long awaited for son?  (THREE days to think about what you are about to do.  THREE days to change your mind!!)  To place the chopped wood on his sons shoulders and lead him off as Isaac asked "where is the lamb for the sacrifice?"   And what must have been going thru Isaac's mind as his father tied him up and laid him upon the alter?  How fitting for Abraham to name the place "The Lord Will Provide" after God stopped him and he saw a Ram caught by the horns in nearby bushes to take Isaac's place. 

God does test our faith often.  I do, at times, feel I am being tested with my BC dx.  When I was recently dx'd with mets I struggled, thinking, "Well crap, I thought I already PASSED this test"  LOL 

How many times have we heard the words "The Lord Will Provide"?  Moody, your thread gave me the opportunity to know where the history of those words come from.  Thank you for that.  If Abraham had the faith to know God would provide during his test, I can trust in that also.