STEAM ROOM FOR ANGER

Lita57

• runor, it's not fair, but looking at your history, she probably treated you like you were from another planet because you're only Stage II and "You should just get over it by now. We cut it out of you and then burned it out. After all, you're not Stage IV, like so many other poor, unfortuate women, with brain mets, organ mets, bone mets and lung mets.Now THEY have something to be emotionally/psychologically upset over! They will never be cured! No amount of rads will ever completely burn it out of them. They will die in 'x' number of months or maybe a year or two or three, depending on how chemo-resistant their tumors are, and how fast they continue to metastasize. But you've got plenty of time left, and we're keeping tabs on it, so stop whining! Or do you want this to become some sort of self-fulfilling prophesy with your constant worrying?"
• 
  
• That's how some of these people are. Unless they've experienced cancer themselves, they absolutely have no idea. You will always have the Sword of Damocles hanging over your head, even if it NEVER comes back. It hasn't even been a full year since Tx ended for you yet, either. Once you have cancer, no matter the stage, it changes you forever. The painful, mental fallout never ends for some patients, even when they're NED.

Micmel

Runor~ waving hello my sweet friend. Did you tell that dumb ass cow that your friend had her boob replaced because of that not to worry about thing called cancer no matter what Effin stage you're at? Did you tell that cow monger analpore that a BCO possey was waiting out back to trip her and push her face into the mud and then say ohhhh did you fall into the mud? Are you ever going to get that out of your favorite blouse ever? Will you ever look at that puddle or mud or CANCER patients ever the same? Stupid ignoramous. Love you friend ~M~

70charger

yup same thing only I was on ph with NP, she said "Oh sounds like you need some counselling" ( I was just having a bad day). Other people are allowed to have a bad day, yet immediately we are seen as needing counselling. Medical community needs counselling on what it is we actually go thru mentally & emotionally.

Lets ALL become butchers & have a big steak tonight.

Hugs Runor ((((((((())))))))))))

mistyeyes

My oncologist has a lab in office. They did the blood test and you got the results to see if you can get your chemo that day. I would hate to have to make all of those special trips.

Runor - I so, so, so agree with you. The mental thing is one of the hardest to go through. Living your life if every twitch, itch, pain is cancer is total HELL! I don't think they understand the fear of having this again. I did all of the fight you told me to do, and now I'm on my own! I told my doctor, during a frantic moment, that I did not want a reoccurrence and I did not want to hear about a five year survival thing - 5 yrs is not enough . I was a survivor in my 90's and died of something different. I said we were a team and I am almost done with my part except exercise and diet it was time for his part.

He put me on a new medicine that was approved last summer. Nerlynx, for HER2+ . I need to be careful with my mouth. This stuff is whipping my butt.

marijen

runor, maybe next time you could bring her some educational material, ask her to read it, and call you if she's got any questions.

runor

Thank you everyone! I get up every day mad at myself that I have this shadow. I get up trying to rationalize it away. Everything that Lita said, I say to myself every damn day. But that office woman .... wow, just wow. I feel it is her JOB AND RESPONSIBILITY to understand the situation I'm in. And the horrible thing is ... honesty moment ... that before I was diagnosed I was probably just as dismissive and ignorant as she was! It is hard, impossible really, to explain to most people the feeling of having a huge, cosmic hand reach down, grab you by the head and yank you out of the life you used to have and toss you into a life that LOOKS the same but is NOT the same. I remember at first feeling like everyone was an alien, or I was, I could not identify with anyone. I did not feel part of the human race anymore. I felt ... gone. I know. It's weird. I think what was gone was my picture of myself and how I felt in the world. THat perception was and remains, gone. Blown away in an instant in a doctor's office.

So what we end up doing is rebuilding our perception of ourselves and how life is going to look and feel. We mortar it together, one heavy brick at a time. We have never had to do this before, but things are busted up and we have to fix them and it's heavy friggin work and you pinch your finger between bricks or drop them on your toes and then some chippy dipshit comes along to ask if perhaps you are doing this work because you are crazy and need to talk to someone. I am not crazy! She is BLIND to not see the destruction that I am trying to repair!

I was at first diagnosed as stage 1 grade 1 but was upgraded to stage 2 grade 2. This is not the upgrade most people want. ANd now, hoping to hear the all clear, I hear that there is still a thing, not an alarming thing, not a thing anyone wants to biopsy, but a thing that they are watching. Because it kind of shouldn't be there and is not surgical scarring because it showed up BEFORE any surgery was ever done so... do I need to talk to someone? I don't know what the hell I need to do other than smile, nod, say I'm fine and pretend like everything is normal so I don't upset people who really can't handle my truth. I'm disoriented and scared. Who the hell can counsel that out of me?

marijen

I guess this would be the wrong time to post “cancer is a gift”...🤐

NoteRed

Good evening to all... Now that I m thinking of it the last 3-4 years I ve been hiding a lot of anger daily... Iwas trying not to answer to insults bout my quality of work etc.

Even now that I am in this situation my superior has an attitude like I wanted all these. To get cancer- I want and must take days off but I am afraid there will be an opportunity for them to show me the exit when I come back...on the other hand I m thinking that maybe is for the best to go from that sick en

Artista964

Maybe that lady sees people who are doing well. Most of us tend to respond with ok when asked how we are so maybe she was taken aback. I don't bother telling anyone but my docs how I'm really feeling. Now if the doc doesn't get it then time for a change. Just trying to give another perspective. I don't expect anyone who hasn't been through it to understand and not be insensitive except for my actual tx team. Back when I was badly infected and the threat of my implant was real the nice office manager/ma was saying you'll be ok. I don't know that, not even doc does but she's never been in it. So i let it go. I've learned from my family no point in trying to get them to get something (my anxiety at that time) when their solution was always think positive. I'm on meds so it's under control and they think i can now stop the meds since its been years. So i dont bother. How am i doing? Fine. And they don't know of my cancer stuff except my bro who is a true support. Seek support from those who benefit you and ignore everyone else except your docs which you can always change.

I used to be badly bullied as a kid. I was suicidal. Parents didn't get it and said i did something. Bullying was ignored unlike today. With counseling as a young adult i made it a goal to overcome. No one was going to intentionally cause me grief. If they don't get it i either let it go because someone like that means beans to me or i walk. I dont see some members of my own family and it's over 4 years now. They are nice but their flaws in understanding mental issues is too much for me so Im gone.

My point is, and it's for your own mental health, is to let things go. If you can't then change it. It's not easy. But forget others and work on yourself for the sake of yourself.

If you're looking for therapy i recommend cognitive behavioral therapy. The premise is everything starts with a thought. Thought leads to feelings. Feelings lead to behavior. Change the thought and lift your mood. I learned this in a psych ward 7 years ago. I changed what i could, let things go and work on my thoughts. Mine in runors situ is what i wrote, which starts with a maybe.

It sucks what we go through and to put what strangers say in top in any context of importance is a stress we don't need. I don't have time for insensitive people. I have enough aggravation with my list of ses from my stage 3 high risk to progress stuff.

Vent here but i hope you are working on yourself for your sake. Thats not negating feelings but you can make yourself sick like i did from anger.

Wish all the best.

NoteRed

Rosabella thank you very much for your words. I also had my difficulties as a child since my mother died when I was 2...so I have a constant feeling of loss. And I always trying to protect the "helpless "... and you know its an endless fight..

I ll take your advice for the counseling i feel i need it..

Egads007

Runor,

After reading what you wrote, feeling the EXACT same way, feeling just as viciously angry at the unfairness of it all and continually thinking it’ll switch back to the way it ‘was before ‘ I’m left with little or no advice on how to deal. Will we ever come to terms and accept the ‘new normal’. Maybe, if we’re lucky. I can’t tell you what to do, nor how to feel. For me it’s akin to alcohol recovery, they say one day at a time. That’s all I can do at this point in my life. Today you are angry...really angry so roll with it. Fuck the Mary Poppins and yell to the treetops. it IS unfair and it DOES fell like hell worrying over whether a pimple or ingrown hair is cancerous. There are no words for the heinous hell we all suffer! So why try to figure it out when we are in the moment. Roll with it. Tomorrow might be better, might not be but I hope so. Getting angry at it is a way of facing it in my books. I think you’re more angry at ‘it’ than the nurse, she was simply the vehicle that brought you to this today. So rant away, your raw honest anger is understandable and appreciated by all here. Just do me one favour if you can, don’t EVER let this bastard named cancer steal your amazing sense of humour...it’s taken enough of you already. Great big hug!

Lolotte19

my rant totally outside of current talk. But i need to.

Feeling like shit after round 3 AC. No nausea or vomitting but unable to concentrate, stay on same position, sit walk lie down nothing works. I am really fed up. Have an appointmemt Friday with onco to see my numbers if I stoo treatment now and go straight for surgery and obviously no radiatiin. My tumir has shrunk with AC already and surgeon things lumpectomy instead of mastectomy. So what the heck. I'll take the risk and do just surgery.

I hate how i am feeling right now. Sleep deprived lost of appetite inability to concentrate and more. Just ranting and this morning was hitting my had on my sofa like a mad woman in distress. I hate this disease and i hate it happened to me because i am not a fighter.

Voila my rant.

DancingElizabeth

Lolotte19 - I'm sorry your're feeling so awful. :-(

BUT - that is GREAT that your tumor SHRUNK with A/C!!!! And, lumpectomy instead of mastectomy!!!! :-) I know the chemo feels like hell - but - just imagine it whacking the shit out of your cancer!!!

Runor - Exactly!!!!! I told my DH - to just "imagine" for even one second - how it feels to be at high risk for metastatic cancer - the rest of your life. It literally is a living nightmare. He wouldn't even try to imagine. Oh well.

Everyone Else - thanks for the kind words and replies!!! It really helps to come to a board - where everybody "gets it".

So - I got my results back and MO said they are "great!!". She said she usually has her patients do an annual bone scan. But, based on my labs, she doesn't feel it's worth it - so no bone scan!!! Whew!!!!! And, I've graduated to 6 months (instead of coming every 3 months). I feel lucky - but - still scared - like - how could *I* be so lucky? Is this really true - I don't know why my brain can't accept that I'm Ok. Its just slowly sinking in....

runor

DancingEliz, I get the feeling of relief and yet being guarded at the same time. We have all learned there are bears in the woods, having all been bitten when we were doing nothing but minding our own business.

Egads, I don't know that I'm angry over the unfairness of it all. Life is not fair and something was going to get me eventually. I just hoped eventually would raise its head 25 years or more from now. So, I have never really felt 'why me'. But I am truly pissed off that you can be working in the medical field, in a designated cancer clinic and be so utterly out of touch with the experiences of your patients. She wasn't just some random nurse. She had a clip board, asked me questions and handled her response with an absolute lack of professionalism. I expect, and bloody well should get BETTER service from the people in the industry. She dropped the ball BADLY.

The end result is what I think more and more of us slowly learn; Keep it to yourself. Having a shitty day? Keep it to yourself. So tired you can't move? Keep it to yourself. Arm swelled and hurting and having pains in your boob and armpit? Keep it to yourself. Feel repulsed when you look at what's left of your boob? Keep it to yourself. Do you look at your husband and have thoughts of him sitting on the sofa watching tv with another woman 10 years from now and you long gone? Keep it to yourself. While no one can take this off my shoulders or fix it for me, having someone look at me like I was a freak was extremely not helpful. I didn't ask the woman to help me, fix me, or counsel me. She asked how I was doing and I told her. She SHOULD have said, "This is a terrible jolt and no one is prepared to deal with it. Healing mentally can take longer than healing physically. You are not alone because this is what I hear from so many cancer patients. We offer some services if you ever need someone to talk to and you can pick up a list of names at the desk if you want. But be assured that you are perfectly normal in feeling all of this and finding it a struggle." THAT would have been helpful.

wrenn

Runor, when I was younger I'd have left that office in tears. Now when I walk out they are in tears.

Meow13

A friend(facebook) just posted a joke, if they were a plastic surgeon they would 100% put a squeaky toy in every breast implant. I should post on the stupid comments.

SheliaMarie

Runor, I’m proud of you for sticking around. Even though I was crazy scared, I left the boards after my original active treatment ended. I think for me it was easier to pretend I wasn’t as worried when I didn’t talk to other cancer survivors. Even as a stage IV now, I still consider myself a survivor, btw

Your humor is one of the things I look forward to as I’m reading the boards. And your raw truth is totally relatable.

I think I must’ve missed something though. I guess I thought you were “in the clear”, so what is it that they are“watching”? That in and of itself would cause panic in anyone.

runor

Swess, way back in the beginning a big, hairy looking object like a spider web (radial scar) showed up in my boob. They went in and did lumpectomy and got clean margins.

I found a new lump in my good boob, had mamm, new lump was a cyst. But the bad boob, well it looks like whatever that big hairy thing was, that was supposedly removed, IS STILL THERE. So they cut out something, and yet the original finding of architectural distortion remains. It has been explained to me that this could be post surgical scarring, or this could be typical changes after radiation. But this hairy looking thing was there BEFORE biopsy, surgery and radiation and it is still there! So what is it? What is it doing? Did I have more than one blob of cancer and we missed one?

Last mamm (on the 20th of March /18) says it has not changed or grown. Well that's a bonus. BUT THERE IS STILL SOMETHING THERE! It was not cut out, it was not radiated into dust. No one is saying it's cancer. Nor are they saying it's not. They're saying we will look again in 6 months and see if it changes. And this makes me feel anxious and like taking risky street drugs might be an appropriate reaction. And then I get lady with clipboard telling me, in essence, that I might need help getting over this. Well, it ain't exactly over, is it? It seems to be just hovering, not good, not bad, not overly concerning but a little concerning .... I give up. I am going to spend the next 6 months pretending I'm fine. It's what I do everyday anyway.

Artista964

Good luck, notered. Cbt therapy helps with dealing with other aspects of life too where you can't change what is or what has happened. Wishing you peace.

Artista964

good luck notered. Cbt therapy helps to deal with other aspects of life too in dealing with things or people you can't change. These should statements while may be true cause even more distress, which could put someone like me back in the psych ward, 5150. I have a long list of shoulds I've given up on for my own mental health sake.

SheliaMarie

Just remember, runor, you never have to pretend here. I’d be worried as well.

Juniper81

I am angry, mad, closed off. So many different emotions each day since finding out your having a BMX. Today my papers came in from both surgeons telling me what I need to do for surgery. All the times of things happening and my husband have me this look like it sucks but you got to do it and I lost it. Closed the papers didn't want to talk about it. No one understands but you ladies. I want to run, I want to ignore it all. I keep trying to stay positive. I do for so many except my husband and closest friend. But I am a mess. Each day is a day closer to surgery, 3 weeks. And within that I have other doctor visits and tests for other things. .. I am just frozen in place. Thanks for letting me get that out.

DancingElizabeth

Juniper - ((((Hugs)))). The beginning of all of this mess - is enormously overwhelming... A lot to do while a lot to process - at the same time. I remember wishing that time would stand still and I wanted to hide in my bed and just stay there until I felt safe. But, had to keep going. I made lots of lists of things I needed to do - and just kept moving forward. But, it took everything in me - to keep moving forward. My sister was a lot more supportive than my DH. He actually wasn't that supportive... You will get through this!!

Runor: EXACTLY!!!! Thank-you for putting it all words...It feels good to read your posts!!

M0mmyof3

I've had several people (some in my own family) tell me I needed counseling to deal with having had cancer. I feel like telling them to F' Off! because where was this phony concern when I first started dealing with cancer! One woman that my hubby works with even went so far as to say the only reason I went through reconstruction was for him! My hubby shut her down with, “No, she didn't do it for me. She did it for herself and her own reasons, including the fact that it would have been harder to deal with having to look at herself in the mirror and seeing her body has physically changed and it wouldn’t be the same ever again if she didn’t do it.”

Some people just don’t get it or would know how to deal with it if it happened to them.

Artista964

to be clear, if the aim is at me with my therapy info, thats not saying there's something wrong with you. Cancer sucks. People suck. It's meant to help you work through the anger, depression, anxiety. We can't change people and many situations we are in, but there is help when you've had enough of being in the shitty state you're in. Make the changes you can. I cut off most of my fam after i came out of the psych ward when they acted like it was nothing and threw away the material to educate them. Best decision ever.

DancingElizabeth

My feeling is - what can therapy really *change*? I've tried it - at the suggestion of others. It's done nothing for me. The fact that I had BC - will always be a fact. Therapy doesn't change that.

The *only* thing that actually does help me - is going to the gym. Not sitting in front of someone - having to answer questions. The gym doesn't ask questions. Working-out makes me feel free...and makes me feel safe. I don't know how else to explain it...but for me - therapy doesn't work and an hour in an exercise class or on the stationary bike is much more effective and cheaper!!!

Lita57

I went to more than one support group during my first year: one for St 4 women only and one monthly 4 Christians with Cancer.

I stopped going to the weekly ALL cancer group at kaiser b'cuz I wasn't getting that much out of that one. The Christian group no longer exists because the leader just passed away a couple months ago from pancreatic cancer and no one else has stepped forward to lead it.

The St 4 group is across the Bay, and I can't go to that one anymore because i can't drive, per dr's orders, all because of my 20+ brain mets. I've had some mild bleeding from time to time, and dr is afraid I could have a major bleed on the road and kill someone.

I may ask my palliative care doc for a referral as things continue to get worse for me. Counseling is NOT shameful. Get some if you need it. I miss the support groups as sometimes you need the face to face interaction.

L

Artista964

what type of therapy is key otherwise ya it's just talk. Look up cbt. That requires action on your part. It doesnt negate your feelings like you may think. Your feelings are valid. It helps you think differently to help you cope. I had this in the psych ward as a mandatory thing to attend. I was this is foo foo for awhile because i didn't give it a decent chance. My father recently had a stroke that left his left side compromised. He's doing pt but it doesn't seem to be working as well as we hope. He was playing tennis last year at 78, pillar of health with pefect labs, bp, cholesterol, etc. So it was a shock to his docs. He's a big stresser so we figure that the cause.

Im working on his mind using cbt but being respectful that his feelings are real. We are slowly working to this may be as good as it gets. It pained me to tell him you are at more risk for more strokes once you had one but he has to know so he can work on his anger and depression and anxiety. Its slooooooooow but baby steps are happening. Its a mindful daily thing to do. Cbt doesn't end. It needs to be used daily to achieve peace with things/people you cant change. Let go of the shoulds in others. Shoulds are for you for you have control of your mind.

My parents didn't do anything about my mental issues from childhood that escalated to 40 years latet being 5150 to the psych ward suicidal and all, but im there for them in their 70s dealing with their mortality, body breaking down, and fear even though im dealing with shitty ses and stage 3 bc stuff that's more than enough for me who is alone.

Bro and bff know. Bro just gives support and prayers. Bff sometimes is surprised or says things that i could get in a twist over making my headaches worsr but i know she loves me and has done a lot for me in the past esp when i had my mental rock bottom breakdown. I could say she has no experience with cancer, but shes watched her father die from it at 21 and her sis in 2015. Everyone is different in how they process it. I've learned the long hard way that I'm it in taking care of me. I don't expect others to get anything. And i feel at peace which is the best case scenario for things or people behaving badly.

Eta, not all therapists are good or kind. Like docs youneed to shop around. Make sure their credentials says cbt in it.

DancingElizabeth

I agree - therapy is great for some or probably most people.

I've been to about 7 different therapists and not once had it made me feel any better! In fact, I would feel much more depressed after spending an hour hashing over everything that is wrong in my life (a lot of it I can't change - so - talking about it makes me feel even worse).

I think I'm not a good candidate for therapy...:-(

Beatmon

I think you should report the clipboard Queen to the Practice manager. She is the person that needs counseling on how to speak appropriately with patients with breast cancer, or any cancer!

Some one on my friend list posted that squeaky toy in reconstructed breasts! I have a pretty dark humor, but saw absolutely NO humor in that. It takes a year out of your life and pain to do it. I suggested maybe he could try them in his balls if he had testicular or or any other male cancer. I saw it posted during whenall of the Me, too was going strong. Who touches our breast to make them squeak! Really went all over me.