Cancer Envy?

vbishop

Hey Jay -

We can change the meaning of the term "flash mob".  LOL!

Are you happy today?  Just got my dose of happy!

Jayaytea

in little bit earlier post TB90, you mentioned that you...   

   "must be the odd man here as I hate when people treat my cancer diagnosis as so serious. I love it when they place a very positive spin on things. I feel blessed to have DCIS compared to other dx, but am highly aware of how fast that can change. But our dx alone does NOT explain what we have been through. I had to have a mx and am now having radiation and am DCIS. There are twists and turns to everyone's experience and numbers alone do not address that." 

I'm hoping to get there.  It's like a double edged sword - I feel guilt for the self-pity, but I want people to understand that there are many steps to this treatment, and each one is agonizing. Why do I care?  Don't know, I guess that's my make up. 

Really, I'm not so pathetic that I want people to ask me everyday, in fact, those in my family who do ask regularly are getting on my nerves, LOL!

When women have prophylactic MXs, like Angelina Jolie, who drew a lot of attention to the issue, I don't know that many people appreciate how difficult losing breasts is.  Physically, emotionally, then add the battle against  cancer to that...

So maybe, when the pink washing comes up this October, there should be more of a campaign educating people as to how multifaceted this diagnosis is.  How even early DX still can mean MX, rad, chemo, and 5 years of hormonal unbalance.  Maybe then, people will know to ask, "How are you coping?" Or "are your treatments going alright?"

Sigh...I just need to work these emotions out.  Maybe it's the f...ing Arimidex !

Jayaytea

vbishop,

You are so much fun 👍

Keep up your great posts!

ziggypop

I doubt that anybody in this world understands or really fully appreciates what other people go through - the parent who loses a child - do we think their pain ends after an 'appropriate' mourning period? The person who suffered child abuse - do we really consider what that means for them on a day to day basis - every time we see them? When somebody has a knee that goes bad and has to give up multiple activities that she loved not to mention chronic pain and physical therapy? What about the people with chron's and the diabetics, and the people with pancreatic cancer and prostate cancer and liver cancer and lung cancer, what about the people with MS or cerebral palsy or on and on and on. What about the kids in HS who 'just' had horrific acne - the kind that clearly hurts and makes a high school kid un-datable. I'm guessing that somewhere along the line we have all said things, done things in an unthinking way that ended up hurting people (or at least not helping them). We're human. 

I don't know that anybody gets the full measure of empathy or compassion that they deserve - at least not from everybody, we a luck if we get it from just a few people - even one.  

Maybe we should think of how great it is to live in a time when we can connect with people who have a pretty good understanding of what many of the things we go through are like. I know that I'm happy to be able to post here & have been blessed with support and comfort from women of all different stages. It makes it all a little easier.  

Anonymous

Well said ziggy.

Jayaytea

thanks, ziggypop. As usual, wise, helpful words.  

We ARE lucky to have this technology to connect with others.

I've often remarked that we rarely know what others are dealing with in their lives.  Thank you for helping me gain perspective.  I sense that it comes from a place of kindness and earnesty.

J

tangandchris

Love you Ziggy!!

I've been following this thread for a couple of days...very interesting topic.

I remember when I told a good friend about my dx, she said "oh but early detection is the key right?" As if to say that I had detected it early so I would be fine. I don't even know what early detection means, I felt the lump and had mammo a few days later. They detected it and turns out I still had S3 cancer.

Everything is relative to each person's experiences. I've had another friend tell me she didn't want to talk to me about her problems because of everything I was going thru. That made me feel like I was some sort of untouchable being that shouldn't be bothered with petty problems like home forclosure or a friend's marriage issues. I didn't like that, even though I understood her intent was good...but her problems were still her problems and she needed to talk.

I hate to think anyone here at BCO has been made to feel minimized by their dx. When I first started posting here and browsing I never even clicked on the S4 link, it terrified me. Now I read some of those threads and I am amazed at what they are dealing with. It puts things in perspective for sure for me.

My step-mother's sister just recently found out she has DCIS. I won't lie, I've wished I had that dx rather than mine. But, I also know that she is scared and needs support too.

We are all human here....we all have cancer...we need to cut each other some slack. ((hugs))

16Christine

vbishop,

Thank you for the happy song! Love it! Makes me get up and dance. I'm listening to 24hoursofhappy.com now.

vbishop

Maybe we should think of how great it is to live in a time when we can connect with people who have a pretty good understanding of what many of the things we go through are like. I know that I'm happy to be able to post here & have been blessed with support and comfort from women of all different stages. It makes it all a little easier.

Well said Ziggy.  Thanks for the reminder of how blessed we are to have this place, and these people, that know what we're going through without us having to utter a word.  And to have support and understanding from everyone here if we choose to rant, rave, or curse to the high heavens.

We are all human here....we all have cancer...we need to cut each other some slack. ((hugs))

TangandChris - this one sentence says it all.  Thanks for your comments.

I'm listening to 24hoursofhappy.com now.

16Christine - I am pleased that you're getting your happy on!  So how is 24-hours of happy?  I think I may have created a "happy" monster

Jay - did you get your happy on yet?

percy4

Wow.  I'm usually in the DCIS section, as I'm DCISMI (DCIS with microinvasion), but took a look here.  Funny that there is no microinvasion section on bc.org, only one for micros who are HER2 pos.  I'd like to talk to others with my diagnosis, as even the tiniest invasive cancer that was there has a possiblity of having gone into the vascular system before it was removed.  Small chance, but possible.  I feel I don't belong entirely in the just DCIS world, nor entirely in the bigger-than-micro Stage 1 world.  I would really like a DCISMI section.  I do, personally, feel extremely lucky to not be a stage 4, or any stage higher than I am (1a micro).  I, personally, don't feel in the same world as a Stage 4, as my treatments and my prognosis are so different.  I will say, however, that when I learned it wasn't just DCIS, which can never invade, but microinvasive cancer, which can upstage over time, I did join a world where I will never again be carefree in this area.  I imagine that, for awhile, every headache or bone-ache or liver-ache will frighten me.  And, unlike other cancers, where in 5 years it looks like you may be home free, with bc it seems the recurrence chance goes up over time.  I question every decision I make about treatment, agonize over tests, was in tears waiting for the pre-rads mammo results (and I'm a pretty steady girl), and am having more trouble now about how to prioritize things in my life.  Things are different, now.  So, no, I'm not like a Stage 4 lady.  I've seen enough of the poor, very ill-looking women with no hair in the RO's waiting room to know that.  But I am afraid (and I hope I'll be able to put this away in one box, and just live life) that someday, near or far from now, I could become more than a Stage 1.  And it is strange to live with that fear, and, I agree, have everyone around me feel/act like it's all gone for sure, no problem.  Which it probably, hopefully is.  But I'll never know for sure, ever again.  Things are different, now.

LizzieK

From my viewpoint the fact that I am Stage I is a blessing: less surgery (lumpectomy), less treatment (one week partial breast radiation and no chemotherapy) and a very high cure rate.  I say this from the perspective of having had Stage IV throat cancer three years ago where my chances of survival were low and the treatment horrendous (concurrent high dose radiation and chemotherapy, severe burns on my neck, feeding tube, disabled for months, etc.).  If the throat cancer comes back I lose my larynx and the ability to talk and swallow if I want a shot at survival. Luckily it looks like I am cured (throat cancer usually recurs in the first 2 years).

Yes I felt my heart sink when I found out I had cancer again and sweated like all of us do with the biopsy results, typing and staging.  Those with Stage II, III and IV suffer a lot more than we do. They live with the higher probability of recurrence or worse.  I for one don't mind so much when someone doesn't think my cancer is that serious.  I am thankful that if I had to get another cancer I got a Stage I breast cancer. 

percy4

Yes. Lizzie.  I have to agree. While it's sometimes a pain in the butt for people to minimize what I've been going through, it IS also a comfort that they are able to do so.  There is no comparison between me and a Stage 4 lady.  I'm just scared because I know that, in the fluke situation, I could become one, someday.  So I have to take Life a bit differently.  Haven't even put into place how, just yet.  I've braced myself for the idea that I could lose a breast in future, having done rads to that breast, now.  I don't plan on it, but I have to accept that it could happen, and I just don't feel like I can count on being "done".  That said, and as awful as that is, it is NOTHING like a Stage 4 lady.  I went to the store to get the the protective creams for the breast during rads, and the girl working there started to cry because her Mom had died from BC recently.  Put things in perspective.  I can't have it be my kids with the tears rolling down their cheeks.  Still; my concern about an amputation of a body part in fututre is valid, too.  In THAT, the fear of the future, we are all the same.  But we are NOT the same as the women who will probably not live long. xx

percy4

I also have to say that I don't know how theStage 4 ladies with small kids do it.  The only thing that makes me feel somewhat OK is that I have, for now, a good prognosis, but mainly that my kids are grown.  If I was a Stage 4 lady with little kids, I'd be a curled-up blob on the couch.  I so admire the strength and courage and humour of the Stage 4 ladies I see here, and I cannot even imagine being them, God bless them, all.

wyo

I saw this on a friend's facebook and thought it summed up a lot of what Ziggy and others are saying here- we just don't know what goes on in people's lives

percy4

Yes; kindness is the only real thing we can give to each other.  No matter our "religious" ideas, and even if we don't have religious ideas, I do think that human kindness has a life of it's own.

vbishop

Percy4 -

Your first post here really hit home.  I have been lurking on other threads way too much and it scares the crud out of me.  Although I am a stage 1 and my chance for recurrence is only 7%, I still freak out every time something is different.  I had  lump that turned out to be fluid encapsulated in scar tissue which I finally asked my surgeon to aspirate.  I just got back from seeing my primary doc because I lost my voice over the weekend.  Typically, I wouldn't give it a second thought...I never get sick, I just get cancer.  But now, I worry every time something is different.  Sigh....I hope I get to the point someday where I'm not waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Jayaytea

Percy4, 

I agree with

vbishop.

Your post made several concise points and mirrored some of my fears.  I feel like I've found my "home" with you ladies on here. So many of your comments seem to validate my experiences. 

wyo -

That is a great poster, I plan to repost it. "Everyone you meet is fighting a battle you know nothing about. . ..." Women have been so strong that it's no wonder others downplay the fallout of this cancer. We do a great job putting on that brave face so no one does. So we can't exactly be surprised when they don't get it.

Lately, I'm trying to remember that when people make remarks, they aren't trying to diminish my (my what? ....my illness, my condition, my situation, my CANCER? - okay) my cancer, they are trying to be positive.  I have come to realize that, when It comes to my family and friends saying nothing, assuming that I'm "back to normal," I think they are just afraid of breaking the mood - of making me sad.

I had a screening mammogram, that spotted a suspicious mass.  I had a follow up 3 months later that led to a biopsy, that led to a mastectomy.  I had an immediate tissue expander, followed by Arimidex, followed 4 months later by an exchange for an implant, followed by depression, followed by antidepressants, followed by more revisions, as in fat grafting. When I mention that I have to have another surgery, and the reaction is, "oh, more reconstruction?", it makes me feel like I WANT to have more surgery, like it's cosmetic augmentation, heck, the literature they give out at the hospital for after care even says, "BREAST AUGMENTATION SURGERY"!  Ha!  

I've just returned to -20C (-4F) after 10 days in mexico. (A mixed blessing as the winter break was wonderful, but I had a daily dose of reality as I braved the sight of my new "me" in the mirror as I braved wearing a bathing suit in public.)  I swam laps in the pool everyday and next month I'm joining a TaiChi fitness class offered by a Lymphedema therapist.  I'm smiling more, but I still get sad.  Not many people see that sadness, I've done a great job of presenting a positive image of a strong bc survivor. So why would anyone think I'm struggling. That any women are?  

Ladies, please keep chatting.  J

vbishop

Awww J -

So sorry to hear you're having to go through additional surgery.  Also that depression is kickin' your butt sometimes.  You don't always have to be brave and it's okay to have a pity party sometimes (just don't LIVE in pity party land).  

You are also doing wonderful things for YOU!  The swimming, the TaiChi class.  Way to Go!  Remember to find your happy place when things get tough!  You know where it is.....

Hugs!

Jayaytea

thanks vbishop. You are always so sincere and so positive.  I love your attititide. 

I'm doing good.

J

Moonflwr912

j, I am glad you are doing better. Just keep going. To quote Churchill, "When you're going through hell, KEEP GOING!!!"

You don't have to do it prettily! Just get through the day. We've all fallen in that pot at some point. But BCO really helps me claw my way out. 

Much love. 

Jayaytea

Moonflwr912

Thank you for your kind response.  I am touched, and feel so supported on here.

J

ziggypop

Jayaytea- 

I don't know whether people are trying to be positive, or if they don't get it. I'd kind of like sometimes to tell that that you just can't stop in the middle of reconstruction surgery - it just doesn't work that way. But, I know that I, me, I feel better, if I an let it roll off my back. And I'm learning that I can (sometimes more well than others), and part of the reason that I can is because I do have this outlet. The other thing I try to keep telling myself is that most people have had or will have something happen in their life that I won't understand. 

You sound like you have a really great attitude, braving wearing a swimming suit in public is a big deal. I have a feeling that you are one of those people who after a few years are going to be able to look back and think, "Wow, I did a really good job coping with that, and I can actually see looking back that it made me a much stronger person." Just seems that way to me. 

Jayaytea

Ziggypop,

Thank you so much for taking the time to address my posts. Wow. You really are thoughtful. I don't feel supported by anyone here in person, so I'm so glad I have women like you.

Your comments and those of others have helped me put things in perspective and realize that only those who've been through this understand how hard it is, how frightening, and how emotional. 

Losing a breast was horrible, but I feel as though I'm now free of BC. I have the hope the Arimidex assures that. The reconstruction phase is longer and harder than I was prepared for, but I'm getting through it. 

 I think I have it hard, but I'm well aware that many have a much more difficult stage of cancer to fight. 

To women with a bigger battle, please know that I hope that you are well supported,  hard as it is, we all should accept and stick to every treatment offered for the best possible outcome. 

None of us expected to be a part of this community, but thank goodness we have each other. 

J

luckypenny

I sure wish I was the subject of someone's caNcer envy- sounds like a problem that I wouldn't mind coping with .  Alas , not in my future as a stage 3a node positive gal. 

Jayaytea

luckypenny, 

I know that so many - too many women suffer through such harsh treatments over and above the mutilation of surgery.

I hope you are well supported by others in your life as you deal with
your breast cancer. None of us wants to be here, but I am so thankful I
have found a group of women who understand what I'm going through. We all must navigate our way through this disease.

I don't know what you've had to endure, but please accept my well wishes.

J

wenweb

I just found this thread and think it's great!!  I have not read through it's entirety, but would like to say that I had survivors guilt in the beginning. So many times as we make our way through life, comparisons are made in order to minimize an experience that we perceive as being bad.  Sometimes we do it to ourselves such as "I could be worse off, look at so and so".  Other times it's a consoling friend trying to make us feel better by saying the same thing.  As one poster stated, "the worst thing that has happened to you, is the worst thing that has happened to you"  This statement has huge power.  If we allow it to prevent us from minimizing a traumatic life experience, we can fully experience (it) and help ourselves to heal, and help others along the way.  Blessings to all.

wenweb

Hello again, I think I responded too soon with what I thought was the main topic of this thread.  After having  reading the entire thing, it seems that my simple comment regarding the main topic didn't take into account what has really been going on.  It's sad, ( but true) that there is often conflict when one misinterprets another in a most innocent and unintended way.  It seems that one person was very sincere with her intention and the other didn't want to buy it.  It also seems that this happens all too often.  Our differences is what make us all unique, and what makes the world go round.  It's human to find it difficult to embrace our own faults and easy to see them in others...

exbrnxgrl

wenweb,

No need to worry about what has gone on on this thread, as the dust up I was involved in is over. It actually has become a good chuckle for me and those who know me, at this point. If bc has taught me anything, it's to laugh at life as much as possible. "Laughter is the best medicine" has turned out to be more than a cliche.

Caryn

PS: I agree with "the worst thing that has happened to you, is the worst thing that has happened to you" as long as we're not talking about a chipped manicure (joke, not meant to seriously put down manicure aficionados)

Jayaytea

hi wenweb

I think your first response was bang on. As I interpreted the intent of this thread, it was meant to help us sort out our feelings, some of which are guilt.  

At my second visit with my oncol I felt tremendous guilt sitting in a waiting room with so many terribly sick people.  Do I have cancer? Yes.  Did I need to be there? Yes.  But I felt like an intruder and I felt guilty for not being sicker.  I was just diagnosed with depression at that appointment, such a frustrating SE in all this.  

I have gleaned some very helpful insights through this thread.  I think a person reads through different threads and has to just take what is relative to themselves.  Here, I found a lot that was relative, and felt very supported by those who took the time to comment on the main issue.

Caryn, I like your sense of humor.  I've seen your comments on other threads and appreciate your input.

J

Loral