INSOMNIACS place to talk in the wee hours

sas-schatzi

Well, the latest Trump controversy. The media reports an incomplete statement. The world goes nuts. Meanwhile the Congress is voting on a similar bill. But whoa Nelly. They don't have too. Seems there was a law passed in the time of John Adams that did the very same thing. Was used during the time by JA during the French Revolution to limit French immigration. Then by Jefferson against the British in the war of 1812.

What pisses me off is the media. The talking heads and the journalists. The don't report the news, the edit it. They're is bias. Creates an uproar.

I found a tutorial about bias evaluation when I did a thread on the science forum. I'm going to link it. Because my life has been about science. I read a study not just for the information, but I look at it for bias. I am dismayed at the bias I read in science articles.

The bias in news articles is off the charts. One of the big issues that is being debated all over in the news right now is whether the right to buy a gun should be denied to someone on the "Terrorist watch list". This discussion and the action by Congress and the statement by the President is a major issue way bigger than Trumps words. We have to think about rights. Do we believe in and uphold the rights granted to us by the Bill of Rights and the Constitution.

California had some of the strictest gun control laws in the USA. Yet the Farooks subverted the laws. As a result do we allow our rights to be taken away because they were criminals?

With the 'No fly list'. It has to do with the 5th Amendment to the Constitution. Due Process. A person can not be denied their rights under the Constitution without being convicted of a crime. Can I be placed on the list and not be charged with a crime? The Government is doing it.

The watch list doesn't mean someone has been adjudicated of a crime. i.e. a court has found them guilty. Names on that list may be there because of clerical error. I will add a link to Wiki that has a section on people that were placed there erroneously.

Just because someone thinks I'm guilty of something, doesn't make me guilty. We are ruled by law. If we allow our rights to be taken from us one by one we will enter into a time that society and community will go back so far in time we will not recognize it.

All the elements of " !984" Written by George Orwell are in place except for the monitoring in our homes. Well not quite true. Our government has that ability with satellites to see into our homes. Into our bedrooms. Nothing is sacred. Nothing.

Everything that Aldous Huxley wrote about in Brave New World and the Revisited has come true. Between Orwell and Huxley's predictions, we are sunk unless we act to support our Rights.

You may believe that this is not the place for this discussion. But where better than our home.

sas-schatzi

Wiki link to description of the ' No fly list"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Fly_List

I'm betting I'm on the list. I was so adamant about my rights after 9/11. I wasn't a terrorist. Don't treat me like one. Plus they're were hygiene problems. The unclean hands searching my luggage. Then the gloved hands that were not changed between bags. Then the taking off of shoes and walking on unclean surfaces. Several times I asked for supervisors in the early days and asked to be taken to a place that a letter could be written. May seem arrogant that I could make change nationally. But that can happen.

I won't even talk about the Bic lighter unless someone asks.................

The bias post is down one or two posts

Cubbie2015

Mags, sounds like the overall news was good, I'd they can just figure our something that will work better for your back. Ouch.

Sas, your poor brother. He didn't understand what was going on! That would be scary to a little kid.

I don't know why anybody pays any attention to Trump, he's a grandstanding nitwit. Terrorists don't scare me, I've got cancer. Bring it!

sas-schatzi

Aug 23, 2015 01:15PM , edited Aug 23, 2015 01:37PM by sas-schatzi

In many posts here and elsewhere, I have referred to bias. Bias is the bane of research. When a study is completed and it is submitted to a journal for consideration of publication, the journal assigns (asks) professionals i.e peers in the field to review the study. The choice of the reviewer is made by level of expertise regarding that subject. The belief being that if they're is an error the knowledgeable reviewer will recognize it. The reviewer task is to look at all sections of the study for accuracy. Generally, several or more reviewers are assigned to evaluate a study. This reflects back to what I said earlier re: the internet and the explosion of information. The controls of publishing studies only after serious peer review have been weakened. Plus, people that wish to skip scientific review have learned how to do this, and publish on the internet. Making their subjects appear to fit the rules of scientific review.

I'm happier now. I presented this better than I did before. The original thought for this post, was to find a working definition of bias that we could use. In this case, I love the internet LOL. I located a tutorial about bias that is mostly user friendly. Takes about 20 minutes to get through. Not that I expect any of us to become perfect about detecting bias, but I do believe we will be more questioning of what we are reading. It will, also, help when comparing several studies at one time.

One of the things I do, is read the objective(opening paragraph) and the conclusion of a study, or the abstract first. This allows me to focus on the key points within the study that the authors used to come to their conclusion. I find that it helps me detect bias within the study orbetween study results that don't jive with the conclusion. Hope this helps

http://familymed.uthscsa.edu/facultydevelopment/elearning/biasinresearch.htm

sas-schatzi

Cubbie opposite on Trump. You didn't read anything I wrote about today's thing or bias. If the media only reports part of a statement he can be shown as something less than right. The media is biased. When we have the ability to hear the full statements regarding what the canditates really say versus how the media states it-------the difference is enlightening. Reporting is reporting, not editing. Bias in reporting is dangerous.

Cubbie2015

Ah, I'm just being flip Sas. Can't take Trump seriously, though. My experience with the media is that it's almost impossible to figure out what really did happen, no matter whose side you're on.

Loveroflife

Ms. Sas, thanks for the update on Patty. Now, you have me curious about the glass angel candle holder. We have bias in news reporting In America?? It all comes down to motives and who owns the media. Loved 1984 and Brave New World....need to go back and read them again. It is a scary time for America. I honestly don't care for Trump, but I have to admit I admire his boldness and fearlessness of being politically incorrect.

sas-schatzi

Cubbie, We are in a troubled time. Grant that. I read several hours a day. I listened to conservative talk radio a few hours a day. I apply what I know. I'm concerned that the public is misled about Trump b/c they misrepresent what he says and facts. Scares me. Scares me b/c we are too politically correct. Scares me that to take a stance on anything anymore that if someone or group decides they are offended, demands are made for resignations. Polarization of subjects is the norm, or seems so. I took time to read about Washington, Jefferson, Adams, and Franklin when Steve was in school. Because they were all of the same time period it was interesting to see how their lives intertwined. In each biography, they're was the the discussion of the news reporting. Would like to say that it has changed. It hasn't.

My observation is that statements are made true or not, that if someone is a liberal or a conservative they believe the presentation of the information that fits within their belief system. If facts are presented that shows that their understanding is wrong, they dismiss them as false. That's scary.

For example, Hilliary has broken Federal law on the email scenario. It's easy. The statuatory and regulatory laws aren't ambiguous. All Government employees shall use the government server. She didn't. Yet our government i.e.DOJ and FBI, aren't pursuing a usual course of a criminal investigation. Bias.

The worst case scenario is akin to Watergate. The agencies responsible for pursuing the investigation delay their conclusions until later in the election process or worst case scenario they decide after Hiliary is president that they are going to indict. Chit we have a crisis as I said akin to Watergate. Nixon would have been indicted and convicted on criminal charges. Ford understood what it meant to the country. He knew that by pardoning Nixon it was the best thing for the country. Worst thing for Ford.. If Hillary wins the election and indicted who saves the country? The response is they are all corrupt, doesn't fly. The law prevails. If our rule of law doesn't prevail. Then our system fails. Were f**ked.

Why then should any law be followed?

Loveroflife

Sorry for the funky format. Screen froze up on me while typing.

Mag, ouchie!! Hope your pain will be under control soon.

Goats, sorry about your friend/disciple. Love older people as they have much wisdom and different perspectives to share. We used to host dinner for the Gideons and their wives once every few months many years ago. I loved to sit there and listen to these sweet ladies who were mostly in their 80's.

Loveroflife

Rose, thinking of you and as usual, interceding for you. Hug

sas-schatzi

Loverly, it wasn't just an extra piece of glass. I still miss her. That's why I have her in the topic box in W&F's, I still can look at her. She's special. Texturally, she is unique. You can feel each glass bubble attached to the next glass bubble. Her skirt is perfect. How she was created is the mystery for me. Blown or molded. I'm very happy that she may be part of the Indiana Mayflower pattern. But it's not really proven till an exact match is made. When I thought I had her traced back to China that was fun. But with this new finding I'm lending toward Indiana glass.

Are you being facetious about bias in reporting in USA? Yes, owners do set the tone by who they hire and setting the work environment.. I have wished often lately for a news organization that does an unbiased presentation of events. Haven't found one yet. Basically, I think they are all sloppy. Any suggestions?

Getting sleepy. May try sleeping. Hugs

Chevyboy

Morning gals! Okay, yes Loverly..... We have a lot of "Little Clinic's" here in Denver... You can get sports physicals, etc.... and this is where I got my flu shot, AND my pneumonia shot... Same as with super Walmart here... If you ask their "consultant" for their opinion, on which otc would work best for a certain problem, they will come out, and explain what certain drugs are used for....

We also have those "Urgent Care" offices set up in a lot of mini-shopping centers. I think after "Mr.G" (Hah, that's cute!) explained to her where it hurt, and etc. she thought he should get it checked out, but that maybe it wasn't arthritis, and if the Aleve or Tylenol didn't help, he could try Motrin. And since he won't go get it checked out, unless it was falling off, we welcomed any opinion handy.... Ha!

Now it's up to him.... I can't "fix" him.... and I know all about drinking, no matter how much, and medicating yourself... but this has been going on for maybe 60 years.... Same with my Dad... HE was taking 1000 mg of Ibuprofen for his Arthritis, along with his bourbon & beer.... Passed away when he was 82, after he just gave up, and missing my Mom, and it broke his heart........

Wouldn't it be nice if we could tell someone "drinking and smoking might kill you eventually some day" and they would actually listen and do it?

I quit smoking when I was 24.... but I knew it was really hurting me.....

And in my opinion, I think Trump is just play bat-crazy! I used to like this guy, but he has gotten too big for his britches, and thinks he can fix this country in one fell-swoop! I don't like any of the other candidates either! Each party is bought by big donations....and since I know nothing else about politics, I had better stop while I'm ahead.... Ha!

Jazzygirl

Sassy- my current sources for information are NPR, PBS, and the local newspaper. I feel NPR and PBS give a bit more factual account of events, plus both cover things going on in the world whether they are huge things like what happened in Paris or not. When the Paris terrorism event happened, I watched BBC as I knew I might get more info than the over dramatization that goes with US media. There is little journalism on the US news, mostly like a reality to show me. Everything is sensationalized for ratings.

Local news paper has an interesting section in it called Around the World and talks about climate, environmental, and geologic news from around the world. It is one of my favorite sections of the newspaper! Yes, I am old school, I still read the newspaper!

I too am a scientist by education and need facts vs. someone's opinion on a situation. It is very hard to get facts anymore through the mainstream media.

Jazzygirl

Also, thinking of Rose, Patty and Blondie this morning. Sending love and hugs across the miles.

Spookiesmom

Since Chevy opened the can, I'll throw my 2 cents in. Trump is a lunatic. He should be locked up,mouth taped shut. He's managed to piss off so many. Who does he WANT in this country. Just rich angry old white men?

The rest aren't much better. The ignorance on both sides is astounding.

Chevyboy

Haaaaaaaaaaah! You GO Spookie! No, Sass brought it up, and I couldn't leave it alone.... People like him just scare me.... I know all about freedom of speech, but this guy SHOULD have his mouth taped shut. No, there is not one candidate out there so far, that could lead this country. I am neither party..... they are all nuts....... sorry..... I don't mean to offend anyone, but that's just how I see it.

Jazzygirl

Chevy- I don't like Trump either. I think he is becoming very dangerous to this country with what he is doing and saying. Somebody needs to put a muzzle on that boy!

sas-schatzi

What is the exact statement made by Trump?

Holeinone

CHEVY, LOVE LOVE LOVE your image of politicians. We all know that there are good, honest men & women serving our country. Money & power trumps common sense in many people. It's disappointing that we have little enthusiasm for our politicians & upcoming election. I agree with you & Spookie, Trump is a embarrassment. Why & how he is doing well in the polls, I have no clue. If he should win the Republican nomination, Idaho will support him. We are a Republician state. They even voted in a felon, because he was on the Republican ticket.

I spent 2 nights up in the mountains. Went with 2 friends to celebrate a birthday.

Jazzygirl

Hol- how pretty is that?

Voting in a felon, wow, that speaks volumes.....

Holeinone

Jazzy, it was magical. It snowed about 8 inches, the lodge has lights on all the trees, spruce & pine.

We swam in the 100 degree pool & soaked in the hot tub. My DD has a part-time seasonal job with the co., so I was able to get a fabulous room at a very reduced price.

Spookiesmom

Sas not doing Eukanuba.

Not just one statement, many.

Loveroflife

Hi1, could you hook us up? Passed through Idaho this summer on our way to Yellowstone....beautiful.

All the candidates say what their target audiences want to hear, including Trump. I do admire his gut though, but am scare if he becomes president because of his unfiltered speeches among other things. Word choices are very important when you deal with allies and enemies. You don't want to cause a WWIII. I originally like Ben Carson because of his calm and collective nature until more of his character was revealed.

Love the sign Ms. Chevy.

Ms. Sas, NO, she is no ordinary glass!! I think of you every time I look at her

magdalene51

Sassy, you will have fun with this page. The last time my MRI images were looked at, my ortho doc told me it was inoperable. But PCP and I were talking yesterday about hearing about all kinds of new technology in treating spinal problems, so I started looking today.

Innovations in spinal treatments

I was wondering why, when I saw the neurologist, he didn't order any scans, and it was because he expected them to already be done, but he didn't get the report before my visit. Still wondering why it was only lumbar they scanned. The 2008 scan showed a lesion on the cervical spine. Has that progressed? I'm due to see neuro again December 30.

Could we just leave the politics for elsewhere before we ruin this thread? As hard as it is to believe, we have differing opinions on what this country needs. My $.0

magdalene51

I think we should

Loveroflife

Yes Mag, I agree.

Ms. Sas, I am just as frustrated as you are with the problems we have with the media and this beautiful country. I used to listen to Mike Nation ( yes, the right wing wacko) because he somehow has the bits and pieces that mainstream media leave out. After a while, it was hard to listen to him because I could sense the hatred and yes, the bias also. I like listening to NPR and the BBC for world news to compare the info..

Jazzy, forgot to say love the pic of the red/orange sky. Amazing how the particles in the atmosphere combined with wavelength of light give us that beautiful color

Jazzygirl

Mags- I was hesitant to say anything about politics, only about media coverage, because my parents told me never to talk about politics or religion and have found that to be good advice throughout the years. I am back to sharing pretty photos, funny photos, or good stories as I have them.

Today I am going to share about Xmas wreaths. I bought a small wreath a couple weeks ago via a charity here one of my friends is active with, and put it on the door with a big red bow. Today, a huge LL Bean wreath came from a family member so I thought "what to do, what to do?" I have more wreaths than places to hang them! So here is my solution, the big LL Bean wreath on the front door and smaller one on the nearby gate! These are the only Xmas decorations I put outside.

sas-schatzi

I have no problems with opinions that are concluded based on fact. The biggest danger to our Republic is the discourse of the people can't occur because it is being intentionally misrepresented by the press. That is routinely happening on a daily basis in all areas of our life. The positive is those papers that routinely do this more than others are going under. i.e the Huffington Post

Jazzy and Loverly, I like NPR, but they don't address the daily problems as much as I would like. Their investigative programs that look at subjects in a complete presentations can't be beat.

Loverly, your sweet about the little angel.

Mags reading the link now. Any chance your Neurologist could be switched?

kathindc

I prefer to listen to PBS, BBC and NHK World News out of Japan to get good media coverage of what is going on in the world. They are straight forward and no chit chat between newscasters . News from the local stations here in DC drive me crazy. So much useless banter. A story will be reported at 4:00 to be continued at 5:00 to be continued at 6:00 with very little added. And then we have the newscasters who are melodramatic. I remember my son commenting on how we are perceived by the news on BBC and Japanese newscasts. He's right, what an eye opener.

sas-schatzi

jazzy love the doors

Mags. Nice synopsis. Now to find a doc. ...To the left of the article was a list of ortho related articles. This link is to a list of 6 docs that are google the most frequently b/c of the articles they've written. Not suggesting them. But couldn't hurt to see where they are located.

http://www.beckersspine.com/spine/item/25892-6-spi...

The Spine-health.com mentioned in the doc discussion. I used that site some time ago when doing research for Stephen. I suggested he put it in as the go to resource when working on a case.

http://www.spine-health.com/

Off for oil change