I say yes, you say no, OR People are Strange

Bren-2007

I can't believe after a day like today that posts are being deleted.

I don't know what was posted that was deleted .. but I'm terribly disappointed in the "reporters."  Trying to ruin another great thread.

Jerks.

iodine

the tragic incident occured at a Safeway.  I sorta doubt that political motives are expressed a lot at Safeway, but I could be wrong.  As you said NUT did this, crazy people out there.  Be careful.

AnnNYC

I thought the rule here was no deleting, no tattling -- on fellow BCO members, that is.

I hardly think it's "tattling" for Konakat to have posted that graphic from Sarah Palin's PAC, showing crosshairs on Rep. Gabrielle Gifford's district.

So, is it "hate speech" to try to hold a politician accountable for hate speech?

crazy4carrots

Dotti -- As I understand it, Rep Giffords was holding an outdoor meeting with her constituents.

iodine

I just saw that it Was a political event.  Poor people.  Now the nuts don't want to let us have the freedom to congregate.

AnneW

Let's stop the speculating right now, and send good vibes/prayers/whatever out to the Congreswoman and ehr family, as well as all the others injured, killed, or witnesses.

I'm angry, sad, and just plain pissed that this happens in our country.

Anne

AnnNYC

The event at the Safeway was called "Congress on Your Corner," and Congresswoman Giffords had been holding these events frequently since she was first elected in 2007.

http://www.richardhowe.com/2011/01/08/az-congresswoman-gabrielle-giffords-shot-at-congress-on-your-corner-event/

"And in August 2009, when there were demonstrations against the health care measure across the nation, a protester who showed up to meet Ms. Giffords at a supermarket event similar to Saturday's was removed by the police when the pistol he had holstered under his armpit fell and bounced on the floor."
[from: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/us/politics/09giffords.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1] 

.

konakat

Palin supporter Elisabeth Hasselbeck is shocked by that ad.  She really didn't say anything much different from what I posted.  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/26/elizabeth-hasselbeck-sara_n_514561.html

floralgal

Delete

pip57

I am sure there will be all kinds of 'spin' on this event from all sides. All will claim it was a senseless tragedy and they will distance themselves in any way necessary.  It doesn't change the outcome and the fact that the shooter was a 'nut'.

Beesie

According to those who've spoken at the press conferences, 11 people were taken to hospital; of those, 1 died - a 9 year old girl.  5 are in critical condition and the other 5 do not have life threatening injuries.  The congresswoman was shot in the head but is now out of surgery and doing as well as can be expected.  She was conscious and responsive prior to going into surgery, so that's a good sign.  

What's not clear is if any people were taken to other hospitals and how many died on the scene. I have heard confirmed reports that a federal judge was among those who were shot and that he has died.  So the fact that only one person has passed away in hospital does not mean that only one person has been killed in today's events.  That's the info as of now.

Just horrific, all of it.  Whether this was politically based or just a wacko is what we don't know yet so let's not speculate on that. 

AnneW

Ah, a nut with a GUN. Now there's a subject that can stir up some emotion...

Anne

konakat

Considering it happened at a political event and a congressperson was shot, it'd hard not to speculate that it's politically motivated.  I find it hard to believe it was a random wacko job.

bluedahlia

Unfrigginbelievable.  The mindset in the US is very dangerous.  And I can't believe some idiots deleted KK's post.  To you I give the Italian salute.

Anonymous

I am certain that the congresswoman (and every other member of congress) has made many votes during her time in office that have angered any number of people.  It is far too soon to jump to any conclusions about the shooter's motives, and frankly, who cares what that nut job thinks?  Anyone who uses such violence doesn't deserve to be given a forum to express their opinions.

ANYONE who shoots into a crowd of people, especially one that includes children, is a deranged nut and a criminal regardless of their political leanings. 

Bren-2007

The suspect is Jared Lee Loughner, white, age 22. 

Alpal

PatMom - I agree completely with what you said. I also think that it is completely irresponsible for any politician to spout rhetoric which encourages nut jobs to violence. Whether this nut job was encouraged by that type of rhetoric remains to be seen.

pip57

 This is from the shooter's you tube posting.  “In conclusion, reading the second United States Constitution, I can’t trust the current government because of the ratifications: the government is implying mind control and brainwash on the people by controlling grammar,” he writes in one video posting. “No! I won’t pay debt with a currency that’s not backed by gold and silver! No! I won’t trust in God!”Here is a link to Loughner’s YouTube site.Clearly a lot of psychological issues involved. 

pip57

I just watched a couple of his you tube videos.  There are no words to describe them.  He really was working on a completely different realm than reality.  Very politically versed and opinionated.  But very delusional.  

floralgal

Delete

Medigal

Did anyone but me notice some of the books this deranged piece of non-humanity was reading?  He says the government is "implying mind control etc." but he was brainwashing himself  by some of the books he was reading.  That video shows a very sick person and today he got to act out his insane fantasies.  I think his actions are going to change the way all politicians interact with their constituents.  This is not terrorist action from afar. We are fighting so called "terrorists" in a far off land and the worse of them are living amongst us!  What a sad day for America!

Floragal:  We are dealing with a "sick" mine here!  What is the government supposed to do?  Give sanity tests to all people living here?  Anything can set people like that off and if you had been next to him in a supermarket you would probably never have recognized him as the killer he is.

floralgal

Delete

Beesie

Elizabeth, I agree with you that given where the shooting took place, there's little doubt that politics had something to do with it. But what we don't know is whether this nut had a particular issue with this Congresswoman, or with this government, or with the Dems in general or maybe just with all politicians and government in general.  And that's why I think it's too early to speculate and that's why I said that we don't know that it's politically motivated.  A lot of these wackos are just anti-government, regardless of who the politician is, regardless of who is currently in charge in the government and regardless of the policies that any particular party or government supports. 

Anonymous

No "reason" exists for someone to commit such violence.  To imply otherwise is to justify even in some small way the criminal's actions, and in the process encourage the next deranged nut job. 

I don't care to live in a place that bans books or thoughts or ideas, even if I don't agree with them.  It is not the thought that is the crime, it is the criminal action taken in response to that thought, and that crime should be punished to the fullest extent of the law. 

What the government can do is hold him fully responsible for his actions, and not minimize them by finding that he has mental health issues and it is therefore someone else's responsibility to keep him from harming other people.

floralgal

Delete

suemed8749

It's a sad day to be an Arizonan. How ironic that Rep. Giffords read the 1st Amendment on the House floor yesterday and today was shot exercising her right to assemble.

I agree with almost everything PatMom said; however, I DO care about the motivation of the shooter. I believe that heated rhetoric and use of violent symbolism by political leaders can influence unstable individuals to make that symbolism a reality. I am NOT blaming anybody but Jared Lee Loughner for today's tragedy, but I also believe that all of us need to weigh freedom with responsibility. That is especially true of those in the media spotlight who, like it or not, have the ability to sway impressionable individuals.

My DD served as a Page in the AZ Senate when Rep. Giffords was a state senator and says Ms. Giffords was always very thoughtful and friendly. What a tragedy - a nine-year-old, a judge, and at least 4 other innocent lives taken. No matter what the motivation - a tragedy.

Bren-2007

Sue .. you expressed my thoughts much better than I could.  Thank you.

Bren

bluedahlia

Too many nutjobs on TV and Radio too.

rosemary-b

What do we expect when national figures say to put people in the crosshairs? It is sadder than sad.

Edited for stupid typo.

suemed8749

Thank-you, Bren.