MIDDLE-AGED WOMEN 40-60ish

elimar86861

Why soccer over football?  At least part of my reason is I like my beefcake on the leaner side.  While there might be a nice QB or running back every now and then in football, with soccer there are 22 fit & trim men on the field every time.  That maximizes my hottie viewing.  The more you watch a sport, the more you can see the nuance of play, and I think most games are exciting.  For those who think the only exciting part of a sport is the scoring, soccer is not for you.  Soccer is somewhat more like hockey as far as the scoring goes (only without the bulky clothing to hamper the visible hotness.)

Eph,  Thanks for the tip sheet.  Can't tell the (hottie) players without a program.  Already know those little Spain boys (winners of Cup four years ago, plus Torres is in on the roster again, oogle below,) but like I said, there is a whole new crop of hotties.

Momine,  You shock me.  Greece qualified for Cup and your whole country is going to be watching them (and going crazy.)  Everyone but you.  I was there in 1986, so I know the level of frenzy the Greek fans can muster.  (That was a general election year and pound for pound, I have to say the election brought out even more frenzy than the soccer.  Hehehe!  You know what I mean.  Birthplace of Democracy.)

Footballnut

I love football!  Since my chemo is scheduled to end in mid august I should be good to go for the nfl season!  As for hotties, we have our crew!  My fave quarterback may not be one of them but I do love him dearly for his accomplishments and character!  For those of you football fans I hope that you like the pic because when I saw it I thought "damn I wish I wrote that!"

Footballnut

here's a few of my faves - drew BREES, Colin kapernick and a young PEYTON with abs...... Followed by my nhl goalie henrik lundqvist. Best dressed in the nhl!  The pics posted a bit out of order but you'll get the idea!!  Lol

Momine

Homemom, I have absolutely no idea what that meant.  All I can discern is that they run around with a ball and crash into each other for no apparent good reason.

Elimar, it was even worse in 2004, when the Greeks won some big soccer tournament. I tried to watch the final game, I really did, but I get so bored that it makes me cranky. So I lasted about 10 minutes, my longest stretch yet. People have explained it to me, and I sort of get the point of it, in theory. Then I try to watch again, and 3 minutes into it, my eyes glaze over. The thing with not knowing whose goal is which gets me every time. Also, they only try to score something like every half hour, and in between you are left with the endless running up and down thing.

What is the "cup" that they qualified for? The thing in Brazil?

elimar86861

F-nut, I am only sorry you missed my (accurate!) Super Bowl 2012 prediction, based on the hottness of the QBs (Brady & E. Manning.)  It was hilarious, if I do say so myself.  You could probably search it out in the posts if you are inclined.

elimar86861

Yes, Momine, that thing in Brazil.  (elimar throws up her hands!)

Footballnut

elimar too funny!  I never could like those two but must admit that I do like the PEYTON / Eli commercials!  They're a hoot!!

barbe1958

Where I live is around a golf course and resort Inn. We have two legal sized rinks for hockey (indoors) and two regulation soccer fields. The Spain Olympic soccer team practices here every summer for some strange reason, along with other teams. Yawn......

Tomboy

F-nut. that tatooed man would be fine living in my neighborhood, so we could visit. And that other man wears his suit very well. I am a sort of basketball fan, by proxy, my man loves his lakers even when they are awful. But besides running and swimming, tennis and climbing trees, basketball was one sport i was pretty good at in high school, so i enjoyed it more than most team sports (we had to have phys-ed). too funny though, after i got lymphedema, i began to notice that i was admiring their well-shaped arms, more than anything, and forgetting to watch the game. One thing i like about basketball, is, when someone is so great, that they can change direction while they are up in the air. I have done that exactly once in my life, in my 30's, crossing a busy down hill street, in San francisco's china town. and the coolest thing was, it felt great, and when i had done my errand, and came back to where i started, there had been witnesses. i had been there with a gang of 8 friends,mostly guys, who were fellow artists/musicians, and had gone their to pick up some equipment. and they had watched me, and i saw a new respect in their eyes for me, cause they were ALL basketball nuts. i am probably the only one who remembers that moment now, but the feeling of joy coursing through my bod, as i did it, was amazing. i am so happy i threw myself around so much, in my idle youth. Am i gonna be one of those old granpa type people boring people to death w/stories?

Tomboy

i forgot to say, Pao Gasol. He is pretty easy on the eyes.

elimar86861

I also like Fomula One (daredevil hotties,) polo (rich horseback hotties,) and some tennis (hotties with one big arm, like a fiddler crab.)

Also, my Canadian Middies, I love curling.  (Not particularly hot, but I just love seeing man doing a chore-type activity, sweeping with a broom.)

p.s.  kathec, I am checking out the NBA Finals right now too.  Basketball is another sport that makes a person super-fit, equally on both sides, which I like.  Although I do like a tall guy, some of the NBA dudes are just abberations of giantism.  Oh wait, that is another thing I like.

p.p.s.  I am not crazy about the tattoos so many of the athletes have.  It was not so common a few years ago in soccer, but they have kind of followed the trend now. 

Momine

Eli, ok, thanks. I knew the Brazil thing was a big deal, because they covered it for a full freakin' half hour on BBC, when I was on the treadmill in the gym and hoping for some news or something. I didn't know that the Greeks were part of it though. I don't know anyone IRL who follows sports, or if I do, those people go about it very quietly.

elimar86861

The Google search homepage is observing World Cup today. Yesterday, in Brazil they had a HUGE opening ceremony, like how they now do the Olympics.  Major pageantry.  I think part of it was about creation and had people that were walking trees, another part was JLo in a barely there outfit.  Trees were cool.

It's the most watched sporting in the world.  But it ain't curling.

Footballnut

never got into basketball. The last time I watched was when what's his name played for the boston celtics!!  OMG!  Is this chemo brain????

Kathec love ur story! I have one of those involving music. I remember it like yesterday. Growing up in Montreal I used to go to a bar called fortification - long gone. I used to bring my angus young schoolboy suit and the Dj would give me notice before playing ac/dc so that I could change

One time he played shot down in flames and I had a crowd of people around me banging their heads while I "did my" angus in the middle

There is a part in the song where Bon the singer says "angus shoot me". They all pointed at me and said it

I knew then that I would never forget that moment. Seems like yesterday!!!!

Debster

Elimar, Yes I am ER positive grade 2 stage 1. My nodes were clear but I show cancer cells in my vascular system going into my nodes so both my radiation doctor and my onc. doctor feel it is better for me to do chemo because it is very easy to miss and it only takes a very small bit to get through.... They are not sure it hasn't already got past my breast. So I chose to agree with them for the treatment so I can do all I can to help myself.

Hugs and love to you

barbe1958

I can handle watching golf if I'm doing something else with my hands, like a craft. But I can't really sit and watch too many TV shows with any kind of attention. I will watch Survivor or Big Brother or something and tolerate it only because we have a PVR and I can blow through the commercials.

elimar86861

Debster,  It is kind of a moot point now, because you have almost come to the end of the chemo, but since others read thru' this thread I've just got to say it:  How much benefit were you supposed to get from the chemo?  You see, chemo works great on aggressive, fast growing cancers; but ER+ are generally slow growing cancers that are not particularly responsive to chemo (and on which the anti-hormonal drugs work much better than chemo does.)  To give a woman chemo just because she has lymphovascular invasion (LVI) does not take into account what kind of cancer she has.  To give a woman chemo based on lymphvascular invasion alone can amount to being over-treated.  For this reason, a test called the OncotypeDx was developed, which helped to determine how much benefit a person with a small, ER+ cancer would receive.  

In the best case scenario, your Grade 2 cancer DID have a fast growth rate, which could be affected by the chemo.  Hopefully, this was taken into account by your doctors.  In the worst case scenario, they gave you chemo based on the LVI alone, and it may not even be very effective, but kicked your butt just the same.  The good news is that with ER+ you will also be getting Tamoxifen or an AI before too long, both of which are particularly good at fighting hormone-driven cancers.

I can imagine you reading this and thinking, "What in the heck does elimar know?  She is not a doctor."   Please, take the time to do your own investigations into your treatment.  I think you will come to understand what I am saying here.  I  really hoped the chemo did help you.  

What is next for you?  Radiation?

Tomboy

elimar. ok, now you have really got me thinking that perhaps i was over treated. i think i had only two nodes positve before treatment, but the lady who biopsied them, i could actually feel her kind of stirring them, with the needle in my skin, to find another, i think shes the one who messed them up. because on imaging a whole month prior to surgery, only two looked enlarged, or involved. and then i tested equivocal for her2 by IHC and FSH, but they wanted to give me herceptin anyway. i was so naive then,, and had only found this sight the night before chemo was supposed to start. anyway, the original tumor in my breast was small and not agressive, but apparently by the time it went to my nodes, they said it went nuts there and became a whole different animal altogether, and those two reasons, they dont give herceptin alone, and the LVI meant that it could have gotten into your bloodstream, was why they gave me chemo. and when later i found out about the oncotype test, he said that was only for earlier stages. but i thought it ws to find out which chemo would be effective for each individual, or if it even was gonna be effective. now i am even wondering if they moved up my grade, because they even seemed baffled by whether i was luminal a or b. woman who stirred up my nodes, her pathologist said i was luminal b. my tx place  refused to tell me whether i was or not.

elimar86861

kathec, Your BC is unlike Debster.  Big tumor, lots of nodes involved, LVI, Grade 3 (even if questionable) and HER2+ (even if just weakly,) so I wouldn't second guess that if I got chemo for that Dx.  Chemo really is still a given in your case, therefore Oncotype test does not apply.

I'm just saying if someone has a early stage, low grade, ER+ tumor, even with a couple nodes involved or LVI, it seems that some doctors just go with the anti-hormonal systemic treatment these days.  That the anti-hormonals are more tailored for that type of slow growth.  The Oncotype test is often a deciding factor for that.  

Hope I did not add to confusion.  Where's Barbe?  She is good at saying a lot of the same things I do, only in different words.  She knows what I am talking about too.

And, Debster, it takes quite a bit of reading, here and elsewhere, before you discover some of this kind of cancer info.  In our haste to "get the cancer out" we really don't have all the information up front.  It would be kind of impossible, unless we were oncology nurses or something.  If I could go back and do it all again, I know I'd have done things differently now that I've learned a thing or two.  Not that I want to do this again.  Ever!

3rdtimenow

Hi Elimar, the first time I was diagnosed I was 49,  3 years ago at 59, I had my second bout and had  a bilateral mastectomy, now at 62, I have it again in the same breast as last time. I have been dealing with this all through my middle age. The first time I was still working, went to work every day all through chemo and radiation, I think I did really well physically  and emotionally as well. The second time I just needed surgery and local radiation, so it wasn't so bad. So far this time, I have had surgery, but I don't know yet what treatments I will need. I am  finding it much harder to deal with emotionally this time, as I never in a million years expected to be back in this boat again I also think it was easier when I was working,  having to be someplace everyday kept my mind occupied and I had very good support from my coworkers, I am finding it a little lonely this time. Best of luck to all of you.

Tomboy

Elimar, you did fine. You explained it great. you did not add to the confusion, it is just sometime's i am a little dumb. today was a dumb day for me, and i hope i did not add to the confusion either. btw, were you at the meet-up w/ hbcheryl and slowdeep and badger etc?  i was gonna go, had a temporary pitbull pup, and couldnt go, but i guess some of em went to hollywood blvd,and that is like 10 minutes from my house. okay, i am in pain, dumb, live too close to hollywood. please kill me now!!!

3rdtimenow.... i am speechless, and so so sorry to hear that about you.. but now you can make some friends here, and learn lots, and seriously, it gave me something to do,to come here and get to know some outstanding women, when i wasnt interested in anything, really. BCO did save my sanity, and did make me understand things, and simply made me feel not so alone. welcome..

elimar86861

3rdtime,  That is awfulness to the third power!  Totally not fair!  Let me get this straight:  First time, one breast...lumpectomy+; second time, new primary in other breast...BMx+; and now a recurrence from the second BC?  So, nothing ever came back from the first surgery and treatment then?  All you can do to not feel like a three time loser is to take care of business and become a three time cancer butt-kicker.  You will find many threads on BCO with women who understand, so you definitely are not alone.  We are all here.

I forgot to say WELCOME!

elimar86861

kathec,  Don't worry, you get a pass due to chemo-brain and L.A. smog-brain.  No I was not on Hollywood Blvd., but that Badger sure gets around!

Debster

Elimar, I did a lot of research and sole searching about my treatment and talked to a lot of people and made my decision based on the tests and information I got my hands on and believe me information I got. Me and my husband both agreed with the doctors that it would benefit me based on the information we have the family history I have and the fight I wanted to give myself. I took all my test results examined each based on its own merit then listened to different opinions and then went with my gut so I guess I am as sure as any of us can be that the decision I made about my treatment was made right. I have to say I would do it again if need be even as tough as it has been. I pray to God I don't have to ever  worry about it again but I wanted to give myself the best chance I thought I had to see that it doesn't get any further even if just a tiny chance. That is still a chance. My doctors based the decision on me,my tests results and my family and their professional opinion.

I appreciate you throwing it out there but I can assure you this decision was not made lightly but it was the best one for me. Hugs and love to all....

elimar86861

Deb,  Did you have the OncotypeDx test done then?  It sound like the chemo was really rough on you, so I do hope it achieved its aim to prevent recurrence.  Yes, that is what it is all about.  Is radiation next?

p.s.  Really not trying to give you the third degree interrogation.  I am just not as trusting of doctors and always wonder how they arrive at their decisions.  I wonder this of my own doctors all the time.  So, it is not you, believe me.

3rdtimenow

Thank you for the warm welcome, Kathec and Elimar, you're right, I had a lumpectomy, chemo and radiation the first time and that breast is still fine. The other 2 were in the other breast, but not a recurrence, this is a new primary cancer, all 3 different. I had a lumpectomy the 2nd time with local radiation and 1 year later, another scare, another biopsy that turned out to be benign, but I decided to have the mastectomy to avoid this happening again, 2 years later here I go again, so much for that. Stephanie

barbe1958

The Oncotype test is for early stage ER+ breast cancer. It determines if chemo will be effective. The fact that 3rd time has just stated that she recurred, indicates that the chemo probably wasn't effective the first time. But, the Oncotype test is also assuming you take Tamoxifen or another AI for at least 5 years. 

It used to be assumed that grade had something to do with the Oncotype result, but numbers since the testing began have shown that they are all over the place. Someone with grade 1 might score 23 while someone who is grade 2 might only be 6. Normally grade 3 will get chemo, no questions asked.

Because I didn't get chemo on diagnosis, my first line of defence IF I recur will be Tamoxifen! That is how effective Tamoxifen is. I'd rather have skipped the chemo that even my surgeon said "Save the big guns for next time." and have Tamoxifen up my sleeve than have blown the opportunity to ever use those stronger chemos again if I recur. There tends to be a pretty strong 30% recurrence across the board, so if I only reduce my risk by 10% with chemo, that is only 3%!!! Or, say your onc told you that you had a 20% chance of recurrence and chemo would give you a 10% reduction - again, that is only 2%!! A lot of chemo is thrown at women for th wrong reason but thankfully, on the 5 1/2 years I've been on this forum I have seen huge changes.

Also, ER+ TENDS to be a slow growing breast cancer. I saw my onc every year until year 4 and now I see her every 6 months. Some women are getting dismissed at 5 years and that's when my risk begins!!!! We HAVE to be our own advocates and ask all the tough questions. The only "good" thing is that if an ER+ cancer occurs, it does tend to be slow growing and can be caught again.

3rdtimenow

Hi Barbie, Just to clarify things, I did not have a recurrence the second and third were new primary cancers, all completely different types. I had chemo the first time and went 11 years before a new cancer in the other breast and I took tamoxifn for 5 years. I don't yet know about the ER status, but the other 2 were ER+ I will ask my doc about oncotype test.  Happy to have found you ladies. Stephanie

3rdtimenow

Hi Barbie, Just to clarify things, I did not have a recurrence the second and third were new primary cancers, all completely different types. I had chemo the first time and went 11 years before a new cancer in the other breast and I took tamoxifn for 5 years. Stephanie

elimar86861

Yes, Barbe, did you see my call for assistance?  But it was not pertaining to 3rdtime.  I was hoping you could further explain where I was coming from regarding what I wrote to Debster.  To me, hers seems like a small, hormone receptive cancer, but they are all gung-ho about chemo for her.  I don't get it.  I guess there is some factor which I have not heard her mention that points to going with the chemo.