Presidential debates on ABC right now-both parties

Can't remember the last time I agreed with a Republican on anything, but it was bound to happen sooner or later. McCain's speech today on home foreclosures makes some sense.  Far too many people purchased homes they couldn't afford, at mortgage rates they couldn't afford. There has to be some responsibility assumed by those who borrow money as well as those who lend money. Obama and Clinton are doing far too much pandering. Here's what McCain had to say:

Drawing a sharp distinction with the Democratic presidential candidates, Senator John McCain, warned on Tuesday against hasty government action to solve the mortgage crisis, saying “it is not the duty of government to bail out and reward those who act irresponsibly, whether they are big banks or small borrowers.”

In an address focusing on domestic issues following his stops in the Middle East, Mr. McCain, the presumptive Republican nominee, did not propose any government bailout.

“Government assistance to the banking system should be based solely on preventing systemic risk that would endanger the entire financial system and the economy,” said Mr. McCain, spoke before a business group in Santa Ana, Calif.

His comments came a day after Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton called for aggressive federal intervention to help troubled homeowners, including directing $30 billion to states to help homeowners at risk of foreclosure. Mrs. Clinton’s Democratic opponent, Senator Barack Obama, has similarly called for active federal intervention, including a $10 billion relief package to prevent foreclosures.

As the mortgage crisis has rippled through the economy, it has thrust itself to the forefront of the presidential race. But Mr. McCain’s remarks Tuesday represented a stark tonal shift from the increasing calls for helping homeowners, as he faulted not only borrowers who engaged in risky lending, but suggested that some homeowners engaged in dangerous financial practices.

“Some Americans bought homes they couldn’t afford, betting that rising prices would make it easier to refinance later at more affordable rates,” he said. Of the nation’s 80 million homeowners, he said, “only 55 million have a mortgage at all, and 51 million are doing what is necessary — working a second job, skipping a vacation, and managing their budgets to make their payments on time. That leaves us with a puzzling situation: how could 4 million mortgages cause this much trouble for us all?”

Mr. McCain split the blame between the rising housing bubble and the use of confusing and complex financial arrangements, which he said were badly understood even by financial managers. He said initial losses, coupled with the lack of transparency, has caused a “crisis of confidence in the markets.”

“Capital markets work best when there is both accountability and transparency,” he said. “In the case of our current crisis, both were lacking.”

Any government assistance must be accompanied by reforms to ensure the problems are not repeated, Mr. McCain said. He said homeowners and lenders must be clear from the outset about the terms and obligations of any mortgage.

“We must have greater transparency in the lending process so that every borrower knows exactly what he is agreeing to and where every lender is required to meet the highest standards of ethical behavior,” he said.

Mr. McCain did not rule out a bailout, instead saying any such aid should be temporary and “no assistance should be given to speculators.”

“Any assistance for borrowers should be focused solely on homeowners, not people who bought houses for speculative purposes, to rent or as second homes,” he said.

Mr. McCain did not provide specifics about any immediate plans to deal with the crisis, saying he was “prepared to examine new proposals and evaluate them based on these principals.”

He also called for a meeting of the nation’s top mortgage lenders, asking them to pledge support for customers and homeowners.

“Working together, they should pledge to provide maximum support and help to their cash-strapped but credit worthy customers,” he said. “They should pledge to do everything possible to keep families in their homes and businesses growing.”

McCain:  "Working together, they should pledge to provide maximum support and help to their cash-strapped but credit worthy customers," he said. "They should pledge to do everything possible to keep families in their homes and businesses growing."

///

People who are trying to save their home don't have a prayer of being credit worthy too.  Something has to give.  If they've been trying to keep up with doubled mortgage payments, something tells me they need to get packing if they've been eating off of credit cards lately.

So Anne I guess that means that you will vote for Obama if he is your party's nominee and if he should win the Presidency then that will pretty much be the end of Hillary ever becoming President.........after all it really is about having a Democrat in the White House......right?  Shokk

I just heard that when they took a look at Obama's tax return, they saw he and his wife are not too generous. Last year they donated 1-2% of their money to charity. Hmm

I was just listening to Hillary's plan to help the mortgage crises for the individual homeowner.  There are many reasons why we should be keeping them in place, and her plan is have FHA take over their mortgages and set a decent interest rate.  There was more to her plan and it made sense.  Keep the homeowners in their houses if possible.  Plus getting advice from a committee to make sure all bases are covered wouldn't hurt either.  Don't put a band-aid on the problem, fix it.

Amy posts and on one of these political threads I said I would no longer engage her on this topic. But again I lied.  I should have been a politician.

Shirley,  you really don't get slavery do you? I can't believe how gratiousously you throw around that term. No matter how awful your childhood was, you were not brought over to this country in shackles, denied the ability to learn to read or become educated, given up for rape to your white slave masters,  etc. etc. etc. I'm truly sorry if you had a bad childhood and I admire you for overcoming that, but to  suggest that you were your mother's slave is a slap in the face people who were slaves.

Amy, have you ever met a slave? 

And yes, Amy, I certainly do GET slavery.

I believe when I told my little slave story I admitted it didn't compare to real slavery.  Therefore, don't get so offended when I tell a little story.

The whole idea of my story is we have to move on.  Listening to "ministers" spewing hate is not going to bring this country together.  And, as I stated, there will ALWAYS be racism against all colors.  We need to teach our children in our homes how to treat other people.  And, not all parents are willing to do that because there is racism in this country.  It has improved, but IMO it will never ever be totally abolished. 

We live in in an imperfect world.  I hate to burst your bubble, but it will NEVER be perfect.

Shirley

Inna,

Do you have any idea of the expenses the Obama's may have been experiencing during this time? Does it even matter to you? If so, I'm curious as to why? Have you checked on the charitable givings of The Current Occupant of the White House and his Shadow/Mentor Cheney? And how about Senator McCain?

Cherryl

Inna--you posted earlier to the thread at large that Obama gave 1-2% this year to charity; when I looked at his return, available to all for viewing, it was 10%+; now you return to his taxes in 2003. Why not go back to 1983?  I can't speak for anyone else, but for me accepting any numbers that you post is a bit like a fish riding a bike (to take a line from you).  Not going to happen.  

But because I'm a stickler for detail, I checked the site you gave, only to find that you selected the tax year with one of  the lowest numbers (he gave even more last year than this). 

I don't usually talk about Cheney, but just this once.  Of the 94 million  dollars in assets reputed to be owned by the Cheney's, the bulk of it (all of it actually) came from Halliburton stock options (which he sold and invested in a blind trust when he was sworn into office); and most of Halliburton's profits arise from government contracts, and a good many of those contracts are in countries invaded by the U.S. while the Bushes were in office. I won't insult the intelligence of the women on this board by pointing out what this means.  I'm sure they can figure that out for themselves.  There used to be a word for it, used frequently during WWII, but it seems to have disappeared from the lexicon.   

I will also mention that Obama's money, aside from what he earns from his day job, has come from royalities on his books. Writing books is very hard work and Obama deserves whatever money he earns.  He has a rare gift for language, as those few of you who read his speech already know.   

Below is an excerpt from an article in "The Nation" on Cheney's wealth:

For the Texas-based Halliburton, there initially was some concern. Only two years ago, with the company's stock floundering, the board of directors chastised Cheney for the company's poor performance. But then came the presidential election, and those same directors must have figured they had died and gone to heaven after Cheney got the Veep nod. That's when the board of directors turned around and rewarded him with an incredibly lucrative severance package providing the bulk of his reported $36 million income in 2000.

Can you blame them? Most of Cheney's working hours last year were devoted to seizing the White House for the most avidly pro-Big Oil presidency in US history, and servicing Big Oil is what Halliburton Co. is all about. That and construction projects around the world that an anti-environmental Administration now seems all too eager to facilitate.

Quite an impressive record for an executive who was just learning the business. They knew the guy would be good; after all, as a congressman he had one of most pro-industry voting records. And it was Defense Secretary Cheney who had made the decision to privatize logistical support facilities for the military, which gave Halliburton's subsidiary, Brown & Root, huge construction contracts for the US military at bases throughout the world.

Of course, as the former Defense secretary who'd saved Kuwait, where Halliburton has huge contracts, Cheney was already known to be an effective player. But how could Halliburton have known Cheney would be this good? Not only did he help elect another Texas oil guy as President, but if you look at the short record of the Bush-Cheney Administration, when it comes to opening the environment for energy exploration, even that most pristine area in Alaska, these guys know no limits.

Indeed, they must be guffawing down in Texas to have two good old boys running the White House without a scintilla of shame. It's been oil money well spent.

Anne,

I was about to ask Inna the same thing. I gave less to charities in 2003   than I did in 2006 an '07. Why? I earn more each year so I give more each year.

Shokk, thanks for posting the Cheney and Bush stats. I'm not really interested in them per se, more curious why Inna is focusing so much on  the Obama's.

Have a good evening everyone.

Cherryl

Inna--Generous!  Dick Cheney has assets of more than 90 million dollars, acquired as I stated earlier. Ugh! Most of that money is in a blind trust, and some is interest-deferred, so he is not paying taxes on it.  George Bush's assets are estimated at over 10 million, but may be considerably higher. 

The sum of 7,000,000+ donated by Cheney in his eight years as vice president includes the large sum he was pressured into donating to charity in 2000 from future Halliburton stock options.  In 2000, after selling and donating options, he still had an income of some 20,000,000. He was forced to donate some of those future options to avoid the appearance of manipulating Halliburton stock, thus the seemingly large charitable donation. This year, assuming the figures posted are true, he gave slightly more than 100,000 (compared to Obama's $60,000) on an income of more than $1,600,000 and with assets of 90+ million.  As with Bush, his expenses are considerably lower than Obama's.  Also, the Obama's until recently were paying off their school loans--they neither of them come from rich families.  And since they both worked, they also had child care expenses.

Bush gave $18,000 more than Obama, yet his living expenses are considerably less--no $60,000 interest payment on his house, for example--and his assets are much greater.  Obama's assets, aside from his ability to write, is a heavily mortgaged house.  

And whatever sums any of them gave to charity, their charitable giving has nothing whatsoever to do with the security of this country. 

As you pointed out, they are all forced to publish their tax returns and no doubt they all feel pushed to give more money to charity than they would if they were private citizens.  However, Obama was not running for president in 2005, and his charitable giving was extensive. He had a very large royalty payment in that year. 

Cheney is a skinflint, but I'm hardly surprised. 

I believe when I told my little slave story I admitted it didn't compare to real slavery.  Therefore, don't get so offended when I tell a little story.

In another context your story might not have been inappropriate-- in this context it shows that you don't understand the ramifications of slavery that are still being felt in this country. I am not personally offended, just astounded at your gall. Yes, we have to move on, but not by making jokes about slavery and pretending it didn't happen. Part of your moving on is understanding that there is a context in which some people are still hurting from the trauma of their ancestors and extending that christian hand you purport to have to see where they are coming from. People won't move on if you continue to deny the context that shaped their beliefs.

I'm not sure what percentage a person gave to charity is important in the race of the white house. Certain people seem to be looking for reasons to pick at Obama. I would like to challenge the democrats on this thread to focus on the commonalities between Obama and Hillary and the need not to have a Bush 3rd term with McCain rather than the bitter back biting that's been going on in this thread.

Amy--since it irritates you so much when I say anything positive about your candidate, I will try in the future not to!  Promise!  As my husband always says, never get between a dog and his bone.

Anne,

Halliburton info is on the mark.  You did your homework well.

I think I remember to hear that Halliburton moved to Dubai to save on expenses. Incredible....

found it....http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/03/12/business/main2558620.shtml 

And let's see "The Nation" the oldest published far left newspaper published since 1865......also calls itself "the flagship of the left".......so we all know that it is fair and balanced in describing Dick Cheney......give me a break......Shokk