Non-Mainstream Therapies: Are You Curious? Skeptical? Grateful?

The case histories reported in medical journals from way back do show oophorectomies alone causing tumor regression. Stephanie's case could have been attributable to ovarian suppression alone or to synergies between OS and Zometa or OS, Zometa and cannabis oil, or OS and CO, or Zometa and CO, alone or together. Without a controlled study using her genes, we'll never know.

In my case I definitely responded to Taxotere, Adriamycin and Cytoxan combined with Zometa, steroids, antihistamines, colony growth stimulating factors, anti-inflammatories and antibiotics. NED after 5 cycles and chemopausal. That was in 2007 with an initial diagnosis of stage 4. The docs pushed chemo on me and I can't really complain. It worked for me. It doesn't for everybody. Stephanie's regimen may not work for everyone as well. I wish we could find out already why certain things work for some people. The cure is different for each cancer.  

Heidihill, true. Some things work for some, not others. I"m glad your choices worked out for you and that you took the path that you did because it worked. I just wish there were many more like you. Do you take alternatives too?

There are other women, including women with stage iv breast cancer who have had similar results as Stefanie with the cannabis oil, combined with other alternatives, who have not had any conventional treatments whatsoever. Still there are those who have not responded to cannabis, and there are some instance of those whom have had progression while taking it too. So, to be clear on where I am coming from, I don't think it is for everyone, only those who have regression and continue to remain in remission while taking it. My main point really was for us to try and support each other and whatever is working for each individual person.

I rooted around a good bit on google before I chose to have an ooph. I had read articles comparing it to chemo for sustained remission, but I had not seen reports of complete remission of solid metastatic tumors, especially 8 or 9 of them, with ooph alone.

So if the 8 or 9 tumors were in the liver, lungs, and spine, clavicle, do you think that zometa and ovary suppression alone could cause complete regression/remission?

Thanks Melissa.I was really just wondering about ovary suppression (zoladex) or ooph, and it healing widespread disease, not ogliomets.

Okay awesome, so there are others here who had zolodex or ooph alone, or combined with zometa, for their tx of widespread mets, that have achieved remission. That is pretty remarkable. Really makes a case for individualized care. Glad I got an ooph. Didn't even need that AI anyway.

Leggo, I think several others have weighed in on the question. "Remission" is, as far as I know, synonymous with "regression." Whether you call it remission or regression, it means that the disease retreats, sometimes even to the point of being undetectable (NED). So, based on what I read in connection with this discussion, yes, ooph and/or hormonal treatment can effect regression/remission in ER+ breast cancer, even when there is metastatic disease and metastatic disease beyond oligomets. The thing is that although this is well established, studies also show that if you add chemo to the bag, then the survival is further improved. But I do increasingly see docs starting with the hormone-deprivation (by ooph, pill or both) and holding off on the chemo. They are also beginning to use hormone-deprivation as neo-adjuvant treatment in stage 3, instead of using neo-adjuvant chemo. I think there are some studies running on that.

gemini, that's what I wanted to add. An ooph or ovarian suppression may not be enough. An AI in some form or a SERM in some form has to be considered. I've been on either AIs or Tamoxifen. And yes, it does help to not have much body fat like Stefanie. Through plenty of exercise and a mostly plant-based diet I've been able to lose my chemo pounds and maintain a healthy weight.

Vitamin D is also an important tool. I get megadoses at my onc's office during check-ups. My onc also gives me melatonin (which is not available here) to help me sleep. 

Light, because your odds increase if you add the AI. But as I remember your stats, your risk of recurrence would have been low either way (could be wrong, my memory is known to fail ).

I just had this discussion with a friend who is being treated for stage 1 node-negative BC. In her case the "value added" of an AI is minimal to non-existent, and I urged her to ask a LOT of questions and get a 2nd opinion if necessary.

In my case I had the ooph so I could go on an AI instead of tamox, because AIs have been shown to be more effective than tamox for lobular BC. I haven't looked at the numbers in a while, but I think my odds of either recurrence or death within 5 years of DX were around 50% without adjuvant treatment. 50/50 odds over 5 years are not great odds, so if the AI reduces that 50% risk to 30% or even 35% (it is in that neighborhood), you bet I am taking the AI. I am also thin (BMI around 19).

I don't believe that bs about odds. I know a truck load of women who have had chemo, AIs for many years, and it didn't decrease their odds of recurrence.

Standard of care, is more negligent than I thought if they don't announce to all of their patients, and shout out from the rooftops that an ooph or ovary suppression alone can cause remissiion of widespread liver involved metastasis....for years!

I don't think I'm on the same page when it comes to this topic. To begin with, I have a different definition of the terms. In addition, I can't find a single case of hormone positive bc being treated with an ooph alone or widespread mets (I guess the term is relative), being treated with hormonal therapy only. I suppose we're all just going to believe what we want to believe. I believe hormonal treatment and/or chemotherapy is not going to save me. I believe that there are plenty of women, like Stefanie, who have found a better way to fight this disgusting disease. Each of us have to do what we think is best with the information we have. When you're very sick, you just know what works and what makes you sicker. I think it takes a certain kind of person to think and spew arrogance and hate like ORAC. I can't take people like that seriously and I certainly feel sorry for his patients (if he has any). He clearly is apathetic to the suffering associated with end stage cancer. He hasn't walked a mile in anyone's shoes. If at some point he gets very sick, I think his days of knowing it all will likely come to a quick end....they usually do. Unfortunately, if and when that time comes, nobody will give a shit, likely not even his colleagues. He'll just disappear.

Amen sister!

If someone develops into stage IV cancer after taking chemo and AIs for many years, then I really don't see evidence that it did much for them....for way too many. This, side by side with evidence that chemo allows stem cells to proliferate the cancer due to the proteins in the blood emitted by the cells following; This, side by side with the evidence that there is fraud in medicine, namely cancer medicine, and there has been for decades; This side by side with the fact that cancer drugs don't hold up to their "science"; This side by side with the fact that medicine adheres to paradigms and practices that don't work in many areas, are all evidence to me that we need to open our eyes, not rattle off industry made statistics that still leave 40,000 women a year dead from this disease.