I say yes, you say no, OR People are Strange

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  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013
  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013
  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013
  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013

    Another viewpoint of the above.

  • YramAL
    YramAL Member Posts: 1,651
    edited September 2013

    Wow. Who knew that thanking the mods for posting factual information on another thread would get me on reporting posts and sending PM restriction? My post was removed as well.

    It's getting ridiculous around here. Maybe the mods should remove their post as well since it could be seen as controversial. Scientific facts are controversial in the conservative world, you know.

    Mary

  • alexandria58
    alexandria58 Member Posts: 1,588
    edited September 2013

    What's the old saying?  My mind's made up, don't confuse me with facts.

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013

    Mary, I noticed that you ( there were some recent others as well ) had a post removed.  There is only one thread in all of BC. Org that I have bothered to block the individuals.  I have left the thread itself open......so I know when anything is posted and who posted. 

    It was my understanding recently that no cross posting of any kind would be allowed.  As I only went over there once or at most maybe twice, I didn't think much about it.   I now wonder ( because if so I surely missed it ) if there was a post explaining this to one and all. 

    If indeed a post is a thank you it would seem odd to lump it in the category of 'restrictions/sanctions.  I can see the removal of a post --- especially if there is a new ruling being put in place.  Guess I'm just hoping that it was totally clear that even a thank you was out of the question.  If not, then it would be a kindness to perhaps remove the restrictions.  I hope that will be considered.

    Jackie

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013

    Obviously the word compassion has been removed a long time from the dictionarys these people use:

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013
  • RetiredLibby
    RetiredLibby Member Posts: 1,992
    edited September 2013

    Hm. I was looking on this website for a link to healthcare.gov or a section on the Affordable Care Act, and there isn't one. There is a thread in the Insurance forum about it - members discussing the costs on the exchanges and how glad they are to have the option - but nothing on this site that I could find (maybe I am missing it?) that tells women who come here how to look up information to get insured. We are ALL uninsurable under the former rules since we are survivors. I would think that it would be important to help women who come here find information on how to get insured now that it is possible.



    Hm.

  • Enjoyful
    Enjoyful Member Posts: 3,591
    edited September 2013

    Good point, Libby.  Maybe a "Resources" section with pertinent and helpful information?  Links to information about the ACA, Medicare (since a significant number of us are approaching disability), the state exchanges...?

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013
  • Enjoyful
    Enjoyful Member Posts: 3,591
    edited September 2013

    On another note, I'm currently reading "A People's History of the United States."



    Boy, do people suck. They never teach this stuff in high school.

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013

    Was reading last night and then again this morning about how Harry Reid will be "the culprit" who shuts down the government.  Well, well, well.  It certainly would appear that way perhaps if you haven't kept up with politics and most importantly the QUITE heavy-handed obstructionist style the GOP has been handing out now for the last five years or so. 

     The way I see it anyone who has the capacity to think logically will find that it just isn't so and could not be.  Mr. Reid is not my favorite but the only thing getting him from Point A to B this time is the cowardly, and highly tyrannical actions put forth by the GOP to cripple the government.  Willfully and maliciously and whether it is believable or not, things done with such bad intent hurting so many is not going to bode well for those involved.  Karma.....it may take its time, or not, but it will show up. 

    Jackie

  • crazy4carrots
    crazy4carrots Member Posts: 5,324
    edited September 2013

    FYI:  This morning NPR's "On Point" programme right now is discussing the ins and outs of the ACA, with callers phoning in with their questions.  Very informative.

  • pupmom
    pupmom Member Posts: 5,068
    edited September 2013

    E, I read that book a few years ago. What an eye opener! Should be required high school reading.

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013

    Here is someone who obviously knows something about KARMA  !!!!!!!

  • ananda8
    ananda8 Member Posts: 2,755
    edited September 2013

    The sign up procedures and insurance prices vary State by State.  Here is a news clip about Arkansas exchanges that gives the basics.

    http://www.arkansasmatters.com/story/affordable-health-care-prices-roll-out-in-arkansas/d/story/vj-W0j3nGUq_i4bEGJcfbg

    If someone wants information they need to Google "afforable care act and their State name".

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited September 2013

    Enjoyful.  Happy reading.  Howard Zinn was my professor when I was in college, low those many years ago.  Great book.

    Mary - still say what the moderators have suggested is the BEST WAY TO DEAL WITH EVERYTHING ON THIS SITE:

    Don't Like, Don't Read.   Or as my many politically active friends say;" Never try to teach a frog to sing."  MUCH more important things to do. 

    Bren - my heart is with the woman who wrote the post, and while 18% ( think it's closer to 20%) may not seem enough porportionally, it was, don't know what it is now, but was $70,000,000. a year 70 million dollars a year is a great deal of valuable money going into scientific research.  So while I wish Komen gave a higher percentage of it's money - I respect the VALUE of what they do give annually.

    Check out Jon Faveau on today's Daily Beast.  Great article,  Don't want to post the whole piece here, but it's good.  

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited September 2013

    Don't know who the commentator is on FAUX news, I don't watch or read it - but as a resident of the Great Blue State of MA, represented in the US Senate by Eliabeth Warren, somone might want to remind the commentator that the words "under god" were added to the Pledge suring the Eisenhower administration, when everyone led by McCarthy were klooking for "Kommunists" under the bed skirts.  Ah, the "good ole days" so many want to return to, and yes, there is a Bill in Blue Ma - and it's lookin' good for passage....

    Also Martha Coakley is running for Gov. of MA.   Happy Dance.  Sending sunny, gorgeous leaf colored good wishes to all who read this threadSmile

  • IllinoisLady
    IllinoisLady Member Posts: 29,082
    edited September 2013
  • RetiredLibby
    RetiredLibby Member Posts: 1,992
    edited September 2013

    E, I LOVE Howard Zinn. They don't teach that stuff anymore and so many people to whom they DID teach it have forgotten those important lessons.



    L

  • RetiredLibby
    RetiredLibby Member Posts: 1,992
    edited September 2013

    Actually, people should go to www.healthcare.gov to find out about the Affordable Care Act and insurance. There will be links to state exchanges, etc. I think that is important information that should be highlighted on this site.

  • QuinnCat
    QuinnCat Member Posts: 3,456
    edited September 2013

    The world continues on despite what the minority of the majority is up to.  Though, will internet enrollment into the healthcare exchanges not happen tomorrow should the government be shutdown by the GOP?  I have several friends who will be shopping tomorrow - one who doesn't currently have health insurance and needs an operation, desperately.  One who is on Oregon's state plan that is now going to be handled by the state exchanges and one who thinks she will get a better deal than what she currently has from her professional group.  Customers are waiting!!

    Great article RL.  Ditto on what Alexandria said.  Facts are confusing for those that are entrenched in their make believe world.  

    Sunny wonders why we would ever read....  I must have eternal curiousity why some groups of people can so misinterpret reality to fit their biases.   They're not always stupid people, either.  There are, albeit a handful, of scientists who believe in most science, but reject carbon dating in order to hold on to their Creationist theories.  Granted, in this country, we get more the type of those on Medicaid who use the word "socialism" as a perjorative.  Along with this stupidity, realize that if you question or direct someone like this to the fact that disputes their ideas, you will likely be slandered over any chance for a cogent reply.  That's all they have, afterall.

    Like Congress, whose wacko members would not exist without gerrymandering; these irrational folks I describe would not exist without the brainwashing of Fox News / Rush Limbaugh and the repeal of the Fairness Doctrine.  A lot of insidious damage has happened for many decades due to these two things, in my opinion.

    When I was young, we had the John Birch Society.  Was it RL's article that stated they were the equivalent of the modern day Tea Party?  It was so fringe, that the biggest exposure they got, in their day, was holding their little newspaper and a donation cup outside of the downtown department store. (My mother always commented on them to me - the good Canadian she was.)   Radical Conservatism has grown dangerously in our lifetimes - TransVaginal Probes, Dana Perino saying you can flee the country if you don't accept Christianity.  Really, are these things coming from network news and our politicians - quite startling, really.

  • gardengumby
    gardengumby Member Posts: 7,305
    edited September 2013

    I agree.  The women here should know how to get insurance coverage under the law.  And, again, this is a LAW, not a bill. 

    Most people, I have found, have no idea how the ACA works.  It isn't, for example, one size fits all.  You can choose which plan you want to have, based on how high a deductible you feel best fits your life and lifestyle.  The amount of subsidy you get is based on a constant, however.  You cannot get a bigger subsidy if you choose the platinum level coverage.  The subsidies are all based on Silver level so there is consistency. 

    Here in Washington seven companies have joined the exchanges offering 35 different plans.  All of them are less expensive than comparable plans cost pre-ACA.  The people who tout that the exchanges are more expensive are not comparing apples to apples.  They are comparing shoddy plans that cover basically nothing to platinum plans that cover pretty much everything and have low deductibles.  In other words, they are, as usual, lying in their teeth.

  • RetiredLibby
    RetiredLibby Member Posts: 1,992
    edited September 2013

    GG, what disturbs me so deeply about the lies about the ACA is the fact that the lies will harm people.  The lies will end up killing people, and that is not overstating the case.  If someone lies about the ACA and someone else believes them and doesn't take advantage of the health insurance (the gateway to health care) offered by the ACA and that person dies from a treatable medical conditions for which s/he didn't receive treatment because of lack of health insurance, the liar is a contributor to that person's death.  Hm.  How will that go over for the liar in any alleged afterlife?  The regressives, after all, are great believers in personal responsibility and taking responsibility the consequences of one's actions.  How will you feel if someone dies because of your lies?  (Clearly it doesn't bother some of them - Bush & Cheney at the top of the list, who are responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands if not millions through their demonstrable, easily proven lies.)

    Here is Krugman's column today.  It actually ties in with the theme of personal responsibility and taking responsibility for the consequences of one's actions.  If their actions destroy the world economy, do you think they will own up to it?  I'm betting not.

    The New York Times

    Rebels Without a Clue

    By  PAUL KRUGMAN

    Published: September 29, 2013

    This may be the way the world ends — not with a bang but with a temper tantrum.

    O.K., a temporary government shutdown — which became almost inevitable after Sunday’s House vote to provide government funding only on unacceptable conditions — wouldn’t be the end of the world. But a U.S. government default, which will happen unless Congress raises the debt ceiling soon, might cause financial catastrophe. Unfortunately, many Republicans either don’t understand this or don’t care.       


    Let’s talk first about the economics.       

    After the government shutdowns of 1995 and 1996 many observers concluded that such events, while clearly bad, aren’t catastrophes: essential services continue, and the result is a major nuisance but no lasting harm. That’s still partly true, but it’s important to note that the Clinton-era shutdowns took place against the background of a booming economy. Today we have a weak economy, with falling government spending one main cause of that weakness. A shutdown would amount to a further economic hit, which could become a big deal if the shutdown went on for a long time.       

    Still, a government shutdown looks benign compared with the possibility that Congress might refuse to raise the debt ceiling.       

    First of all, hitting the ceiling would force a huge, immediate spending cut, almost surely pushing America back into recession. Beyond that, failure to raise the ceiling would mean missed payments on existing U.S. government debt. And that might have terrifying consequences.       

    Why? Financial markets have long treated U.S. bonds as the ultimate safe asset; the assumption that America will always honor its debts is the bedrock on which the world financial system rests. In particular, Treasury bills — short-term U.S. bonds — are what investors demand when they want absolutely solid collateral against loans. Treasury bills are so essential for this role that in times of severe stress they sometimes pay slightly negative interest rates — that is, they’re treated as being better than cash.       

    Now suppose it became clear that U.S. bonds weren’t safe, that America couldn’t be counted on to honor its debts after all. Suddenly, the whole system would be disrupted. Maybe, if we were lucky, financial institutions would quickly cobble together alternative arrangements. But it looks quite possible that default would create a huge financial crisis, dwarfing the crisis set off by the failure of Lehman Brothers five years ago.    (emphasis mine - just what everyone else is saying.  If the U.S. cannot be trusted to honor its debts because its political system has been sabotaged and broken by a group of lunatics who aren't even the party in power -- who are subverting the nation's constitution and electoral system, then investors will find someplace else to put their money.)   

    No sane political system would run this kind of risk. But we don’t have a sane political system; we have a system in which a substantial number of Republicans believe that they can force President Obama to cancel health reform by threatening a government shutdown, a debt default, or both, and in which Republican leaders who know better are afraid to level with the party’s delusional wing. For they are delusional, about both the economics and the politics.       

    On the economics: Republican radicals generally reject the scientific consensus on climate change; many of them reject the theory of evolution, too. So why expect them to believe expert warnings about the dangers of default? Sure enough, they don’t: the G.O.P. caucus contains a significant number of “default deniers,” who simply dismiss warnings about the dangers of failing to honor our debts.       

    Meanwhile, on the politics, reasonable people know that Mr. Obama can’t and won’t let himself be blackmailed in this way, and not just because health reform is his key policy legacy. After all, once he starts making concessions to people who threaten to blow up the world economy unless they get what they want, he might as well tear up the Constitution. But Republican radicals — and even some leaders — still insist that Mr. Obama will cave in to their demands.       

    So how does this end? The votes to fund the government and raise the debt ceiling are there, and always have been: every Democrat in the House would vote for the necessary measures, and so would enough Republicans. The problem is that G.O.P. leaders, fearing the wrath of the radicals, haven’t been willing to allow such votes. What would change their minds?       

    Ironically, considering who got us into our economic mess, the most plausible answer is that Wall Street will come to the rescue — that the big money will tell Republican leaders that they have to put an end to the nonsense.       

    But what if even the plutocrats lack the power to rein in the radicals? In that case, Mr. Obama will either let default happen or find some way of defying the blackmailers, trading a financial crisis for a constitutional crisis.       

    This all sounds crazy, because it is. But the craziness, ultimately, resides not in the situation but in the minds of our politicians and the people who vote for them. Default is not in our stars, but in ourselves.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/30/opinion/krugman-rebels-without-a-clue.html?hp

    ----------------------------------------------------end

    They are indeed subverting the Constitution and attempting to destroy the integrity of our electoral system.  Elections work because we have made a bargain to accept the results.  We don't go around overthrowing our leaders because we don't like them.  Except these seditionists are attempting to do just that.  This is short of armed insurrection, but only just. 

    Republicans LOST the presidential election.  They LOST seats in the Senate.  They only held on to control of the House because they gerrymandered districts (i.e. cheated).  They are attempting voter suppression and cooking the voter rolls to maintain their hold on power.  The MAJORITY of the people in this country have rejected their ideas, their policies and their plans over and over again, yet they refuse to abide by the results of the elecitons.  We really should all fear for the future of the Republic -- I know I keep saying it, but I cannot emphasize it enough.

    L


  • gardengumby
    gardengumby Member Posts: 7,305
    edited September 2013

    Libby - keep saying it. You really cannot say it enough.

  • RetiredLibby
    RetiredLibby Member Posts: 1,992
    edited September 2013

    And sequestration is still with us, you know.  We are suffering a death by a thousand cuts, and nobody is noticing except the people who are doing the work.  The regressives really are hell-bent on destroying this country if they can't run it.

    The Washington Post

    Wonkblog:  The FBI can’t investigate terrorists and fraudsters due to budget cuts

    By Neil Irwin, Published: September 30 at 10:45 am

    We now look to be hurtling toward a shutdown of the U.S. government. While you can't completely rule out a last-ditch deal, the real questions now revolve around "How long will it last?" and "Will the resolution also raise the debt ceiling?" and "How vicious will the circular firing squad and bigger recriminations be among House and Senate Republicans be after a deal is struck?"

    But while the drama plays out on Capitol Hill, a separate report over the weekend shows what is really at stake. As our colleague Sari Horwitz reports, the new FBI director, James Comey, had an unpleasant surprise as he traveled the country to meet with agents.

    In the first week of his new job as FBI director, James B. Comey had already heard about how training had stopped for recruits at Quantico and that the bureau wasn’t planning on bringing in any new agents next year, all because of budget cuts.

    But Comey was stunned when he began visiting FBI field offices this month and heard directly from his special agents. New intelligence investigations were not being opened. Criminal cases were being closed. Informants couldn’t be paid. And there was not enough funding for agents to put gas in their cars.

    “My reaction to that . . . ” Comey said about the gas. “I don’t even want to tell you what my reaction to that was.”

    The reason for the hard times at the FBI is the federal budget cuts that began with the 2011 debt ceiling deal, including the across-the-board cuts known as sequestration.

    Remember the sequester? When it went into effect March 1, it appeared to be something of a bust in terms of the damage it caused, at least in terms of how that damage has played out in the public debate. The White House had been claiming that the cuts would be devastating. Then they went into effect, and, well, not much of anything happened.

    As it turns out, slashing discretionary spending 5.6 percent doesn't cause massive, immediate, camera-ready dislocations in how government works. When such effects did arise -- namely in the form of long delays at airports -- Congress tweaked the law to fix it. While economists attribute sluggish economic growth this year in significant part to the sequester cuts, that impact has hardly occupied the public's attention.

    The new report from the FBI Agents Association is a reminder of the smaller, less visible effects that the cuts have had across the country. Any large organization can endure budget cuts like that in the short run. People work a little harder, less urgent projects are shifted to the back burner, empty positions go unfilled, and so on. But the longer the scrimping goes on, the less those tricks can fill the gap. After seven months of sequestration cuts, here are some of the things the FBI is having to scrimp on, according to anonymous comments by agents:

    Restrictions in surveillance technology means the necessary facilities used for terrorist  communications won't be monitored.

    No gas means cases don't get worked – period. Nothing is close to anything on the reservation. Witnesses and victims don't have phones. We have to drive to them. They are too poor to drive to us. … Fewer guys - fewer cases get worked. That is the cruel truth. Real people won't get justice. The face of the sequester is a molested Navajo kid or a beaten Apache woman, neither of whom will see justice.

    We have approximately 10 very important [counter-intelligence] cases that we would open … but we can’t open them because we don’t have the [Special Agents] to work the investigations and the other agents on the squad already have full case loads.

    The hiring freeze has prohibited our team from adding new agents to combat the significant surge in investment fraud and mortgage loan modification fraud. Resources are stretched and not able to completely address the financial losses experienced in our area of responsibility . . . just this past week, four known fraudsters were advertising in the classifieds for employees to expand their current fraudulent schemes, however, with our lack of resources and now the additional cuts and furloughs, we are not able to address the progressing schemes.

    I … investigate street gangs. Recently … we have been facing funding shortages on the criminal side for the last couple of years. There are certain gangsters I can’t go after with a Confidential Human Source (CHS) or any other way as ‘drug buy’ money is not sufficient.

    Here's what these stories of the on-the-ground impact of sequestration on the FBI has to do with a likely government shutdown.

    The effects of government on our lives are, much of the time, invisible. Things work in the background, making our lives better in ways that we don't even notice. Government-funded weather satellites provide the raw information that allows your local forecaster to tell you whether it will rain today. NIH researchers are developing insights that might cure cancer a generation from now. And the FBI is constantly building cases that put bad guys behind bars and lead would-be bad guys to think twice before bilking the elderly in a mortgage scam or running a street gang. (emphasis mine)

    That's not to say there is no waste in government. Of course there is, as there is in any large organization. There are plenty of agencies whose missions seem outdated or unnecessary in the modern age.

    But simply slashing funding for all agencies across the board, or shutting down nearly the whole  government, doesn't do anything to make government more efficient or shutter unneeded agencies. The U.S. economy and society will keep on chugging with the government shutdown and spending levels will be sharply below their levels of a year ago. But in the process, some really important, if not so visible, work will be going undone, and over time the country will be worse off.

    If you don't believe a pointy-headed journalist, just ask your friendly neighborhood FBI agent.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/09/30/the-fbi-cant-investigate-terrorists-and-fraudsters-due-to-budget-cuts/?tid=sm_fb

  • QuinnCat
    QuinnCat Member Posts: 3,456
    edited September 2013

    RL - my question is, would John Boehner put country ahead of his House leadership?  If he ignored the Hastert rule, we could get both a clean CR and a raise in the debt ceiling.  If he lets the government shutdown, the financial world might start thinking he would do the same for the debt ceiling (though I know from watching MTP, that some wacko conservative reps will not hold the debt ceiling hostage, though some will).

  • RetiredLibby
    RetiredLibby Member Posts: 1,992
    edited September 2013

    Kam, I fear that he wants to hold on to his speakership so desperately that he will crash the country to keep it.  I don't think that a one of them has any honor or will put the country first.

    Here is something else that I don't know if people saw.  I did, but I live here.  Anyone with a second X chromosome who votes for a Republican really should avail themselves of the mental health provisions contained in the Affordable Care Act, because they really want to kill women.  There really is a war on women:

    Politico.com

    The House's war on women

    By CECILE RICHARDS | 9/30/13 9:27 AM EDT


    The full picture of what the House of Representatives did late Saturday night  is just coming into view, and it’s startling. The House voted to keep the  government functioning as long as the Affordable Care Act is delayed for a year  — and they also voted to let any employer or insurance company deny a broad  range of preventive health care to women based on a personal “moral”  objection. (Emphasis mine.)

    Think about what that means. If a retail chain is bought by someone who  doesn’t believe women should have access to immunizations or screening for the  human papillomavirus, then potentially lifesaving treatment that is proven to  help prevent cervical cancer would not be part of the insurance coverage for any  women at that company. If a woman works at a bank owned by a man who opposes  contraception, her birth-control prescription would no longer be covered by her  health-insurance plan. Same thing for breastfeeding support, domestic violence  counseling, HIV testing and other preventive care.

    And to be completely clear: The bill that the House Republican  leadership pushed through in the middle of the night Saturday would only subject  women’s preventive health protections to this kind of interference. Other types  of health care — not to mention prostate-exam screenings and other important  men’s health protections — would not be weakened. (emphasis mine - think about what that means.  They specifically targeted WOMEN'S HEALTHCARE.)

    Incredibly, a narrow group of Republican leaders in the House is pushing to  shut down the entire federal government over women’s access to birth control,  cancer screenings and other basic health care.

    It’s all too familiar. Backed into a political corner, House Republicans go  after women’s access to health care. We’ve seen it over and over again for the  last few years. It’s like they can’t help themselves. A small group of mostly  male politicians are seemingly obsessed with these issues, and can’t seem to  stay out of women’s personal medical care.

    It hasn’t worked before, and it won’t work this time.

    Women have already begun to feel the impact of the Affordable Care Act’s  preventive benefit. Millions of women are getting birth-control pills, IUDs and  implants without a copay, and millions more women will get this benefit over the  next several months. For the first time, birth control is being treated like  what it is — basic, preventive health care — and women will not just let that be  taken away.

    Already, more than 27 million women across the country have been able to  receive breast exams, annual well-woman checkups, domestic violence support and  other preventive health care without a copayment, and an estimated 47 million will benefit when the law takes full effect.

    Public opinion about the Affordable Care Act broadly is still mixed, as  people figure out what it will mean for them and sort through the political  misinformation. But public support for what the law will actually do is  extremely strong. That’s particularly true of the women’s preventive health  benefits and protections, which enjoy strong support from the vast majority of  Americans — and yet remain the focus of House Republicans’ bizarre fixation.

    Somehow, far-right members of the House are celebrating. Rep. John Abney  Culberson rejoiced, “It’s wonderful!” Rep. Tim Huelskamp said, “America’s been a  little astonished” by what House Republicans did.

    As more people see what happened, and see that they’re actually pushing  toward shutting down the government in order to deny health care to millions of  Americans and singling out women’s health in particular, they will be more than  astonished. They will be outraged. And they will, once again, demand that  Congress focus on real problems facing the country instead of pushing an extreme  agenda against women’s health.

    Cecile Richards is president of Planned Parenthood Federation of  America.


    Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/the-houses-war-on-women-97554.html#ixzz2gOWZP66d

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