Early Stage Natural Girls!

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  • purple32
    purple32 Member Posts: 3,188
    edited May 2012

    ( you said )  " I have been in a nearly suicidal funk. It has really been bad. It's a good thing that I am going away for a week next ..."

    YES, feed the ducks, soak in nature, relax, do all that is possible to ' forget' about cancer '  . Breathe!   I have  a  feeling this is truly the BEST medicine.

    When you return, if you are still feeling very down, pls call your dr.

    Best Wishes.

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  • luv_gardening
    luv_gardening Member Posts: 1,393
    edited May 2012

    Hymalaya, it's not the lymphedema you need to worry about if you leave cancerous nodes behind.  It would go to stage IV and then you'd be needing very strong painkillers at the very least.  Your age makes a huge difference too.  If you're under 40 it could be very aggressive, and if you're over 70 then you can skip big treatments after surgery.

    I hope you get a caring surgeon who will explain it to you in your own language so you understand the risks.

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    My sister was about 40 and died soon after cancer surgery , even folowing doc 100 % for surgery plan, chemo, rads, etc

    my mother-in-law was over 70 when she was with breast cancer operated and got the same story as my sister.

    Even folowing doc plans and modicaments, they needed to live on painkillers  before death.

    So---anyway everybody takes painkillers before death(ok, almost everybody)

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  • Kaara
    Kaara Member Posts: 3,647
    edited May 2012

    himalaya:  Joy is right...your age has a lot to do with the aggressiveness of the bc.  It tends to be much more agressive in pre menopausal women, and the tx must reflect that.  You need to know everything about the type of bc you have so that you can make informed decisions on tx.  Ask your doctors for any and all reports, and for a complete explanation of receptor status, stage, grade, etc.

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  • NattyOnFrostyLake
    NattyOnFrostyLake Member Posts: 377
    edited May 2012

    Joy,

    Every study since 1960 has shown that lymph node removal shows provides no survival benefit. When the recent study authors speculate that the chemo wiped out and residual node cancer, they indicate they are just guessing. But the prior research shows even when women had radical surgery alone no survival benefit accrued.

    Lymph node surgery is a prognostic, staging tool. It does nothing therapeutic. That is well documented.

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  • luv_gardening
    luv_gardening Member Posts: 1,393
    edited May 2012

    Patty, you may be right.  There's not enough information to know. I ask myself, what happens to the cancer that spread to the nodes if left there?  I can't imagine it just dies.  So surely it must grow and spread?

    What about extra capsular extensions which have worse outcomes?  Would that be the result of the nodes not being removed?  Or the primary tumour being left too long?  These are rhetorical questions that need proper studies.

    People must do what they think is right but need enough information to make the decision.  I just couldn't take that risk of leaving cancer in my own body.  Chemo is a different story and I'm on the fence there.

    I'm reading "The Emperor of all Maladies" and it's certainly interesting, but we have a long way to go yet.  I'm hopeful that something will work in the next decade so we won't have to make these lousy decisions.

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  • candygurl
    candygurl Member Posts: 130
    edited May 2012

    Dunesleeper, I'm really sorry you're feeling crappy.  Spending time with nature is fuel for the soul. I hope it  helps.  There are natural antidepressants that you may want to look into like St. Johns Worth, Kava Kava etc.   And exercise and psychotherapy have been proven to be very effective anti- depressants.  Together, they put the drugs doctors prescribe to shame. or.americanmentalhealth.com/index.tpl?page=12013858151685145

    Himalaya, you should google "Preventing Surgery-Induced Cancer Metastasis-Life Extension".  The article offers some rather interesting information.

    ETA  A good site to check out too is www.breastcancerchoices.org --A Nonprofit Organization Scrutinizing Breast Cancer Procedures and Treatment.

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    I remember that in my childhood old ladies were talking that  cancer should not be touched by surgerist knive, otherwise it gets angry and spreads all over body....so people were afried to go for surgery if they got cancer...nowadays  i think  its a very first think what people do---cut out  problematic place...any problematic place...with very advanced  tools and under control of very advanced machines...

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    I wonder what about  fine and big needle biopsy, that is also touching cancerous lump---is that cause for mets?.I heard that mammogramm is also a cause for cancer and metastasis.

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  • candygurl
    candygurl Member Posts: 130
    edited June 2012

    2009 Breast cancer awareness month: needle biopsies could spread cancer

    "Regardless of which procedure is utilized, some researchers feel that the procedure puts women at a greater risk for spreading the cancer if it turns out that cancer is present. A study at the John Wayne Cancer Institute issued a report in 2004 that suggested that needle biopsies can spread cancer from an isolated tumor to a nearby lymph node by 50 percent. The team of scientist studied 633 women who had breast cancer. Half of them were diagnosed with cancer through a needle biopsy, and the other half had undergone a lumpectomy. The researchers found that the women who had undergone a needle biopsy were 50 percent more likely to have cancer in their sentinel nodes than women who had undergone a lumpectomy. Researchers think that the cancer was spread because the needle disrupted the isolated tumor and caused cancerous cells from the tumor to travel to the nearby lymph nodes.

    www.examiner.com/./2009-breast-cancer-awareness-month-needle-...

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    "Are Needle Biopsies Safe?                                                                                                                              

     By Dr. Ralph Moss
    from CancerDecisions.com

    Breast Cancer Cutaneous Metastasis at Core Needle Biopsy Site www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov › ... › Ann Dermatol › v.22(2); May 2010

    .

    (Edited by Mods to fix funky formatting only)

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  • candygurl
    candygurl Member Posts: 130
    edited May 2012

    Himalaya,

    I hope you understood the article I posted. The supplements below suppress VEGF and thus may help protect against angiogenesis.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Cancer Surgery Special Report

    Note: these products are to be used for cancer surgery recovery and preparation and not to prevent, cure or treat cancer.

    Begin taking the following supplements at least 5 days prior to surgery, discontinue taking the supplements the day of the surgery, and resume taking the supplements one day after surgery (unless directed otherwise by your physician).

    It is suggested to take these supplements for approximately one month after surgery.

    • Glutamine: 3000 mg per day away from food
    • IP6 (inositol hexaphosphate): 1-3 grams per day
    • AHCC (active hexose correlated compound): 3000 mg per day
    • Lactoferrin: 300-900 mg per day
    • PSK (protein bound polysaccharide K (Coriolus): 3000 mg per day
    • Cimetidine: 800 mg before bedtime
    • Modified Citrus Pectin: 14-30 grams per day away from food
    • Soy isoflavones (genistein): 100-200 mg per day with food
    • Silibinin (component of milk thistle): 500-600 mg per day
    • Chrysin: 1000 mg per day
    • Green Tea: 650-1000 mg of EGCG per day
    • Curcumin: BCM-95® extract: 400 mg per day with food OR 2500 mg per day of a regular curcumin supplement

    Please Note: Different curcumin formulations will differ in their absorption and bioavailability. These differences in absorption can affect the suggested doses. For example, one type of curcumin - called BCM-95 - has studies documenting that 400 mg of BCM-95 curcumin compound can provide curcumin blood levels equal to ingesting 2,500-2,800 mg of regular curcumin supplements.

    • Resveratrol: 20-25 mg before surgery; increase to 100-250 mg 2 weeks after surgery
    • Quercetin: 500-1000 mg per day

    Due to blood-thinning effects, avoid the following supplements for 2 weeks prior to surgery and begin taking 2 weeks after surgery:

    Prescription Drugs:

    Pharmaceuticals prescribed prior to surgery depend on the status of the individual cancer patient. Patients with low white blood count are typically treated with granulocyte colony-stimulating growth (GCF) factors such as Neupogen® (300-480 micrograms per day) or Neulasta® (6 mg) which lasts 3 weeks. Other pharmaceutical compounds which have shown benefits for cancer patients undergoing surgery are interferon alpha and Interleukin 2.

    • Neupogen®: 300-480 micrograms per day OR Neulasta®: 6 mg, which lasts 3 weeks
    • Interferon alpha: 0.5 to 3 million IU
    • Interleukin 2: 1 to 6 million IU

      

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    Oh thank you so much....See if we think logicaly that is so possible that cancer spreds because needle goes in and out, distroing the bllood cells and getting into blood...if i new that before...

    Ok what is that is.

    I will do my best to cope with that.

    I can show that report to my new surgeon but it seems they are like robots so programmed and only what is in the programm.

    They dont want to listen other opinions and i think its not good for  authorities if somebody does different, then there is a risk to loose a job, you know.

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    I have apointment with him tomorrow morning.

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    About blood thining we were talking with anestesiologist and she said that  in holland they dont care about blood thickness.

    In other  countries they check that before every surgery and if people have too thin blood , they have treatment and then  when blood is good enough, they perform the surgery.

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  • DianaNM
    DianaNM Member Posts: 281
    edited May 2012

    I asked my doctor about the needle "seeding", and he said this doesn't happen. When my MRI came in, it showed a dot of cancer located to the outside of my tumor, where the needle track would be. Maybe I planted a "seed" of doubt by pointing that out. But I doubt it. I had a mastectomy, so hope that will take care of it.

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  • NattyOnFrostyLake
    NattyOnFrostyLake Member Posts: 377
    edited May 2012

    Absolutely, needle biopsy cancer cell-seeding occurs in some people. They have studied this in breast cancer and certain other cancers. You have too look up the studies.

    You can't believe your doctor because he or she isn't aware of the studies. It's not their job to be aware. It's their job to follow the current guidelines.

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  • DianaNM
    DianaNM Member Posts: 281
    edited May 2012

    So, if something shows up in my left breast in the future, I should requst a lumpectomy rather than a needle biopsy? Is that possible?

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  • NattyOnFrostyLake
    NattyOnFrostyLake Member Posts: 377
    edited May 2012

    You can request an "excisional biopsy." Lots of BCO women have had that. It's a tiny lumpectomy where they don't cut into the tumor.

    Some people who have had needle biopsies go back and have the needle track removed. But then, in some cases the doctor sticks the needle or core biopsy shaft in at several angles--I don't think several track lines could be removed. Maybe. Worth investigating.

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  • purple32
    purple32 Member Posts: 3,188
    edited May 2012

    RE:  Melatonin

     http://www.denvernaturopathic.com/news/MelatoninandBreastCancer.html

    Does anyone use this and if so , what dosage ?
    Many thanks.

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  • LAstar
    LAstar Member Posts: 1,574
    edited May 2012

    I see a naturopathic oncologist, and she recommends melatonin based on stage: http://komenoregon.org/files/Cancer_Education/Tina_Kaczor.pdf

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    Patty, PRECISE!

    All what i hear from my doctors in Holland---they all follow the gidelines and dont wanna even think or talk about other things.

    Like my surgeon said---im here  for cuting you lump not for talking arround!

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    Im using ayurvedic CRUEL capsules.

    Somebody else does that?

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  • Kaara
    Kaara Member Posts: 3,647
    edited May 2012

    Reading some of these posts make me realize how fortunate I was to have a BS that was compassionate and took the time to expain every little detail about my disease and tx.  He even gave me his cell phone number to call if I had any further questions.  He never talked down to me when I had my own ideas about how I should be tx.  We didn't always agree, but we were able to reach a suitable compromise in every instance.  He is the best!

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  • himalaya
    himalaya Member Posts: 149
    edited May 2012

    IM happy about you!

    I gues i see one female BS in Amsterdam AVL clinic.

    I was there for second opinion and she is very differentas those 2 BS here in my city.

    Yes, by the way, i met today  my second BS, he was the same as the first...the same talking and very worried, grumpy.

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  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited June 2012

    Himalaya, we have not seen you in a while, how are you ?  Have there been any developments ?

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  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited June 2012

    MODERATORS HELP !!! I LOST MY PICTURE TO KAARA AND KAARA HAS BECOME HIMALAYA AND HIMALAYA KAARA  !!  lol lol

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  • luv_gardening
    luv_gardening Member Posts: 1,393
    edited June 2012
    Here, you can have my purple flower Maud.  It all went wrong when Himalaya's pic snuggled up with Zuvart above where the page widens.  Unless yours is different.  Cool
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  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited June 2012

    Joy, I had a purple flower before and changed my pic, you would not want to be mistaken for me now would you ?  Lol

    Now, can I have my red dress back Laughing 

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  • luv_gardening
    luv_gardening Member Posts: 1,393
    edited June 2012

    I love you all!  Tongue out

    Darn, we're all "normal" again.  I was enjoying the musical chairs.

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  • purple32
    purple32 Member Posts: 3,188
    edited June 2012

    Hi all

    I am hoping someone here can help me.  I am looking for alternatives to tamox., and at this point, I am most interested in trying grapeseed extract. Specifically, I see in some of the clinical trials or articles referencing BC, they mention IH636 as a 'unique" GSE.  The only trademarked product I have read about online that mentions IH636 is ACTIVIN.


    However, I am not at all sure if IH636 is found in all GSE or even what it is !

    Can anyone point me in the right direction on this, specifially with the reference to IH636?
    IF it is indeed a GSE that was claimed to be one the best and suitable for clinicial trials, I am interested.,

    Thanks for any replies.

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