I need a mentor

Hi ladies: I'm too pooped right now to do the research, but there's something in the back of my mind about different meanings for sin (the bad stuff people do, day by day) and evil, a transcendent force that drives people to sin. I think Ephesians chapter 6 goes with this ('wrestling, not against flesh and blood but against principalities ... spiritual wickedness in high places") .. and there is something in the Old Testament, maybe in the Prophets where God is quoted as asking somebody, in the wording of the King James Version, "Do I not create good and do I not create evil?" (This is a tough one for some believers, as stated elsewhere on the thread we can't compute evil with the goodness of God, but my question is this: If God is Creator of all and evil exists, then who else could have created it?)  Sin seems like what happens in interpersonal relationships and it affects OUR relationships with God, but evil is not about us, it's about Satan trying to get back at God (how silly!) by attacking humans and trying to trash the good things and good world that God has given us, starting with Paradise, aka the Garden of Eden in Genesis. Bottom line in trying to apply this to our cancer assault. we may not have been able to stop IT, but as clearly evident in this powerful faith community we "definitely" are not allowing IT to stop US! This is my contribution to the mix -- these discussions are great!  As you can see from the jumbled thinking, I need to go take a nap ... it's been a wonderful day and my fatigue is well worth it, but that's a happy story for another day.  Let each one of us "keep the faith," as we see it personally, let's continue to share and grow together.  Good night and sweet dreams, Granny.

Are y'all ready for this? I was on a thread and stopped to fuss with our cat for scratching the wrong thing. As I shut the door, I had a thought about a "Gethsemane experience." And as I sat back down, the phrase, "Gethsemane syndrome" came to mind as another way for me to find meaning in my latest spiritual struggles. Had a great night's sleep, have a long list of errands for today, feel up to it, and I'm "outta here." (Think Jackie Gleason used to say that). I'm laughing as I sign off, without offering any additional information on this tidbit. It may be more excitement for "the mix" (see yesterday's post).  I know I'm feeling better -- my children and I have noticed recently that my long-silent sense of goofy humor is waking up. You ladies have a lot to do with this. You've made me laugh when I've logged in, while sucking emotionally on a negative lollipop flavored with lemon joice and vinegar (tee-hee!). Have a nice day, family, may the Good Lord  bless you real good (don't remember who used to say that)... bye-eee, Love, Granny.

Hugs Granny--you made me chuckle--I can feel your happiness!

Jackie Geason said, "And away we go!"

Did Fonzie say, "I'm outta here" ??? 

I think Red Skelton said, "God Bless" Did he ever say, " REAL good!?"

Let's all watch Nick at Nite & figure this out! LOLOL 

Held, I was on my  way to sending you a message when I read your post. I am so very sorry for the communication gap -- with you not knowing what was happening -- but at the time there was nothing I could do about it. I got broadsided with a major post-op crisis ... details are too raw right now. But I followed the "crisis code" according to James 5:13-16: Is any one of you in trouble? He (she) should pray. Is anyone happy? Let him sing songs of praise. Is any one of you sick? He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well, the Lord will raise him up.  If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man (woman) is powerful and effective (NIV). One of my pastor-friends came over, we talked, laughed, and then had "church." She followed the pattern above, we sang hymns, she served me communion, and then we prayed for each other. We certainly know that healing and cure are not always the same thing. Medics are still working on cures for the body, but when spirit and mind are healed, as is the case with us, we become "more than conquerors" over the assaults on the body. My beloved sister, Held, there's much more to share, but Granny is back -- in more ways than one. All of you laid the groundwork for me to survive the spiritual assault that I felt coming when I started an unusual Advent consecration. My prayer-warrior sister gripped my hands firmly in prayer and guided me out of the darkness of depression, into the field of bright flowers that I downloaded, prophetically, just before the steamroller hit. I went into a very deep sleep and woke up thinking of you and the fact that I needed to contact you. My sisters -- brother Norm -- I praise and thank God for mighty deliverance ... with love, Granny.

BIG hugs Granny!

As the Goldsmith works the metal in a flame he NEVER looks away for an instant---know that you are locked in our care as we lift your name in prayer.

Be well & stay strong 

Held. Faith -- whole family:: I'm so happy, I would do a "holy dance" if I didn't know that I need to take a chill pill a while longer! Held, you and others can continue to back me up in prayer.  I mentioned spiritual attack. Remember the story of Jesus, tempted in the desert by Satan?  He left Jesus "for a season," until he could think of another way to keep Jesus from completing the Father's plan. But each encounter strengthens for the next battle. Aha! I mentioned something, on the post written when I was on my way up the wall, about a "Gethsemane syndrome." You can pray for a better understanding of how Gethsemane speaks about God's will for my future. including important decisions about treatment plans. Thanks, everyone: enjoy the rest of your day.  Love, Granny.

I believe that church and religion can absolutely be seperate from God.  There are a few chruch's in my area that "preach" if you are "good" you can go to Heaven.  There is no accountability, no sustained relationship with God either through prayer or His word.

Also there are "churchs" and "religions" that are not of God at all- Scientology or any other belief that there is no God or after-life or perhaps they worship "many" gods, man made "gods"

As far as deciding if one religion is better or more true than any other:  Hmmmm, this is how I respond:

If I spend my life believing in the One True God and His Son Jesus Christ;  If I spend my life believing as God's Word promises that "whoever believes in Me will have eternal life" ; If I spend my life worshiping and loving and doing as God calls me to do and have a true relationship with Him and believe all that the bible says in both the old and new testaments; If I do ALL this and I die and find out it was all a lie, well, I lose NOTHING!  There is no penalty according to "other" religions.

BUT, if I live my life believing in reincarnation, or there is no life after death, or there is no God or no Jesus and I die and find out I was wrong.............well, I LOSE EVERYTHING.  I wont be given a "second chance" to believe something after I have died that I refused to believe when I was alive.

So, I'll take my chances on believing in Jesus Christ, and every single thing in the Bible, and rest in His grace and mercy and take my chances on Jesus!

So I guess I would say that the best/truest "religion" or "church" or "belief" is not defined by man at all- it is Jesus Christ-God in the flesh.  Believe in Jesus and everything else will take care of itself.

Well according to the bible- yep.  If they knew about Jesus, had ever heard His name or had the opportunity to learn about Him and turned it down, then yes they are "doomed" to hell.  God's word is VERY clear on this.  Otherwise there would be no reason for any of us to believe.  We could just be nice and helpful and go to heaven. 

 If that was all there was to it, then Jesus' suffering on the Cross was useless.

My sisters: "Speaking the truth in love," I am beginning to feel a familiar uneasiness -- a tension that sometimes creeps into ecumenical (interfaith) sharing like ours. Strong convictions as expressed by Moody and Saint are important for maintaining the integrity of their individual belief systems. Personally, I am a firm believer in Jesus Christ, trained as a minister of His Gospel in the world as well as the Church. I was taught that whether in the Church or in the world -- when discussing religion it is important for each person to know for sure where they stand, and then bring those beliefs to the dialogue as a central point of reference. My prayer for each one of us is deeper understanding and spiritual growth, flowing from the Highest Source of Wisdom that each one of us believes in, or is searching for. . Whatever we discuss, and however strongly we feel about our personal beliefs, let's remember the open, universal spirit of our thread. Re the two points of view shared by Moody and Saint, even in the context of  Jewish/Christian belief in one God, there are many names for God. Add those names to the belief systems of many cultures, and in most cases, the bottom line seems to be that they are grounded on common belief in Higher or Transcendent Power(s) above all human understanding and control.  I think there is something in the Book of Romans concerning the issue discussed by Moody and Saint. Will get back with the reference if no one else finds it. Carry on, ladies, I'm learning and growing a lot.  Love, Granny. .

Granny- I am wondering who or what Gethsemane is?  I am not that well aquainted indepth with my bible to recognize this right off.

In questioning the seperate church and God- I was looking at it in a way for me to worship God, to have relationship with God and NOT be a part of an organized religion/church.  And if I have this relationship yet question the bible (or parts of the bible) and Jesus's role does that make me a heath, pagan, no good, non believer, or just not christian? and if so, according to whom?

EWB I know you directed this to Granny, but I just love talking about Jesus so much, I want to share my thoughts with you too.

Gethsemane- is a yard at the foot of Mount Olives.  It got its name because gethsemane is also an oil-press and the name of an olive.  The PLACE Gethsemane was also the place where Jesus took His disciples to pray and consequently was arrested there.  You can find this story in Mark 14: 32-48, Luke 22:39-44, and John 18:1-11.

You asked "And if I have this relationship yet question the bible (or parts of the bible) and Jesus's role does that make me a heath, pagan, no good, non believer, or just not christian? and if so, according to whom? "

Here is MY response (again my opinion) :

I beleive you should question the Bible.  It is why God gave us His word.  For us to question, research, discuss, differ, all of these things will bring you closer to God--at least they have brought me closer.  For me, if I don't look for answers I wont have a clear understanding.  I truly believe this is how God draws us to Him, not away from Him.

How can you truly understand Jesus is the Son of God without learning His word and part of learning is asking questions.  Then it is up to each individual to develop their own relationship with our Father in heaven  It doesnt make you a heathen, it makes you a submissive child of God.  He is doing something spectacular in your life- I beleive that with all my heart.

As far as church goes.....(again- my thoughts and opinion)  if you are attending a church and your are NOT growing in your relationship with God, then perhaps, that church is not for you.  You need to develop a relationship with God and wherever that happens is not important, what is important is that it happens.

Now, God does want you to have a relationship with other believers and this is done most effectively in a church- again-it must be one that motivates YOU to walk closer to Him.  And you know me enough by now to say "here is what the scripture says":

Acts 2:44-47 "Now all who believed were together, and had all things in common;
45 And sold their possessions and goods, and divided them among all, as anyone had need.
46 So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart,
47 Praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved."

MATTHEW 18:20 "For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them."

The first lesson I learned regarding ecumenism is that we need to agree to respect & tolerance in discussion. I  absolutely think that is crucial & assure you that that is where I am coming from. I hope that allays any uneasiness.

Granny--thank you! You have said much more eloquently EXACTLY my feelings.....there are truly some things that can be dangerous to discuss past the point where our views diverge. Like politics: those who disagree will surely debate!!! I LOVE debate. I believe that that is where we learn & grow --by listening to others.  I do not intend to offend, but once we cross the line it is inevitable...each to her own (keeping in mind that a healthy debate is NOT fighting, but discussing & should be as unemotional as possible--very difficult when the subject is so emotional) 

EWB-I believe that growing spiritually is a difficult journey. I have worked with many newbies to spirituality & we always tell them, "you can read & learn about God/Jesus & have the info in your head, but moving it from head to heart is the biggest jump"  That said I think the biggest message Jesus gave us is one of community. It may be a solitary journey intially, but once we believe it is a natural progression to "take it to the streets."  It is also a huge part of growing in faith when others can support & help along the way (much as this site is to bc sisters a church is to faith) I agree with Moody that WHICH church may be a task to discover!

Moody-no offense intended! I would like to hear YOUR words on the subject as opposed to quotes from Scripture if that is possible. I am one of those ppl who rarely reads the footnotes & want to know what you think rather than a "respected professional" as it were! LOL--Hugs 

Let he debate continue!! LOL--be well & stay strong  

About to board my plane..... will ask for clarification as we wing thru the heavens.............

hugs all around.