How has the Pandemic affected you as a cancer patient/survivor

ChiSandy

It's a rural thing--on both sides of the border "rugged individualism" runs rampant, especially in mountain/prairie states & provinces. I will give the example of my own state, IL It's a "tale of two states." Here in Chicago & its "collar" suburbs, first-shot rates exceed 72%, with full vaccination at or above 2/3. Many city & suburban hospitals' ICUs are half-to-2/3-full, with half the ICU beds currently occupied by heart, stroke & trauma patients. (A couple of ghetto-barrio hospitals are at or nearly at capacity, however: Mt. Sinai, which serves a primarily Latinx area, is currently at 104% capacity; UIC Hospital in the Medical District--where my husband did his residency & fellowship and I am treated for ocular melanoma, is at 98%--but because it's a university research hospital and trauma center it treats more complex critical care and post-op patients and has only slightly more COVID than other critical ICU patients--especially overflow gunshot patients from Cool County Hospital).

But downstate--especially far-southern--IL might as well be the Deep South, not Midwest. It's solid red Trump country (except for African-American E. St. Louis). The 22 southernmost counties have exactly ZERO ICU beds available--and only 17% of its residents have gotten even one shot. The statewide indoor-mask mandate is flouted down there, as were capacity limits for restaurants, bars and churches since the pandemic began.

I never said, BTW, that there are any countries that "don't deserve" vaccines. Stop reading stuff into my posts that simply ISN'T there and was never even implied.

As to Astra-Zeneca, the US has yet to approve it. The only Americans who got that vaccine were those enrolled in university-based trials which have since concluded (I know because I was disqualified due to my melanoma). NO boosters given to nor destined for the elderly & immunocompromised are Astra-Zeneca or any other viral-vector vaccine--only Moderna & Pfizer. If the US is hoarding Astra Zeneca, it's emphatically NOT the fault of those seeking boosters!!!! Blame those controlling the AstraZeneca supply, as well as the COVIDiots causing mRNA and J&J vaccine doses to spoil and be discarded.

Back at the dawn of mRNA vaccines in the US--even here in the Chicago area--getting a vaccine (even first shot) was like the Hunger Games. The politically-connected (especially GOP) and hospital administrators were hogging the doses when those in hard-hit minority 'hoods (even those where those corrupt hospitals were located) couldn't get them. My husband's hospitals at first wouldn't vaccinate anyone not working directly in COVID ICUs (whereas the ones in wealthy Streeterville were vaccinating families & friends of the top brass and even retired docs). It took nearly a month before one relented and agreed to vaccinate active medical staff. As for me, I had to wait till my age group and underlying-risk-status class became eligible--and I had to register with several agencies, hospital systems and pharmacy chains before I could finally score an appt. Appts. opened at midnight and were gone 10 min. later. This went on for several weeks. I had to keep refreshing Walgreen's site and clicking on an ever-widening radius of available sites until I grabbed one in a suburb 20 miles away. (My housekeeper, who lives within a mile of one of the aforementioned minority-community corrupt hospitals, had to travel 35 miles nearly to Will County). When the time came and I got my shot (in a blinding snowstorm), they refused to schedule my second one--they told me to go home and go back online. By the grace of God I was able that week to schedule my followup...at the same suburb, and again in a snowstorm. Two months later there was finally enough to go around--but by then the QANuts and COVIDiots had begun to do their social media dirty work.

Beesie

ChiSandy,

I'm not sure if you are referring to my comments, but since I'm the one who's mentioned AstraZeneca more than anyone else, let me clarify that my comments about the U.S. hoarding AZ supply, even though the AZ vaccine has never been approved in the U.S. but has been approved in Canada, Mexico and most of the world, was specific to the period when everyone was scrambling for 1st and 2nd doses, back in the March - June time frame.

I know that AZ remains unapproved in the U.S.. and is not being given out to anyone, and specifically is not being given out to the elderly and immunocompromised who are seeking boosters. I think boosters for this group is important and should be prioritized. In both the U.S. and Canada, those boosters are only Moderna or Pfizer. My 97 year old mother who has Alzheimers and lives in a LTC residence got her Moderna booster a couple of weeks ago.

At no point have I blamed any vaccine recipients or those seeking vaccines/boosters for the vaccine distribution mess. The issue that I described lies with the U.S. government, which mandated that orders placed by the U.S. government be filled first, before orders from any other countries, for any vaccines manufactured at any U.S. facility. So while the government did not stop these companies from shipping vaccines to other countries, by flooding these companies with orders, they in effect did the same thing because all those U.S. orders had to be filled first. Now, to be fair, all countries had placed their orders on spec, months before any of the vaccines were approved - so no one knew which vaccines would make it to market and which vaccines they would receive. This is why so many orders were placed; all countries were hedging their bets by ordering more than they needed from many different companies. This is why the U.S. had placed orders on AstraZeneca - they placed those orders before they knew that they would have sufficient supply of Moderna and Pfizer and before they knew that they wouldn't even be approving AZ. What is astonishing however is that during the March-June time period, when other countries were scrambling to get any vaccines they could, Biden (or his representatives) didn't cancel those AZ orders, or put a delayed shipment date on those orders, or exempt AZ from the mandate that U.S. orders had to be filled first - and Biden obviously knew what was happening since he eventually "loaned" some of those about-to-expire vaccines to Canada and Mexico. That was irresponsible and on a global basis, probably cost lives. If AZ could have ramped up production in the U.S. and shipped to anywhere in the world, more people would have been vaccinated sooner.

The fact that things have settled out and that the U.S. (and Canada) now have enough supply to donate lots of vaccines and lots of money to COVAX does not change what happened earlier in the year, when it was 'everyone for themselves' and 'survival of the fittest' (or more accurately, the biggest and most powerful). As moth said earlier, hopefully everyone has learned from what happened.

Chowdog

https://twitter.com/boulware_dr/status/1438915110978863105?s=21

meanwhile fda booster meeting seems to be a $hit show now.

wrenn

"It's a rural thing--on both sides of the border "rugged individualism" runs rampant, especially in mountain/prairie states & provinces." I'm always flummoxed by non Canadians thinking they understand how Canada works. Explains why many have always thought of us as "country bumpkins".

We not so dumb what we look.

Anonymous

ChiSandy -

1) No one in this thread has blamed individuals for getting boosters. The elderly and immunocompromised benefit from them.

2) True, you didn't use the phrase "don't deserve". Your post seemed to say that vaccines shouldn't be sent to developing countries because they would be mishandled or used by corrupt officials. The phrase I used was a benign reading.

Latte123

I often wonder about the lens through which we view Covid. For me, I am very frustrated and angry at the limitations to my already shortened life (stage four) because of lower than ideal vaccination rates. However, I am retired and I am fortunate I don't have to work to pay bills. I have truly been privileged to not have to go to work everyday over the past 18 months. Some women with my diagnosis have to work to pay the bills and often to maintain their health insurance to pay for their breast cancer treatment. Some women do qualify for Medicare through social security disability, but it takes 5-6 months of being unemployed before you get your first disability check and some women do not have the savings to support themselves that long and can't consider disability because of that. They keep working. If one is able to retire on social security disability, there is still a two year wait to qualify for Medicare. All of this means that some women with breast cancer (especially younger women I think) really have no choices. They face many hardships as providers for their family, caregivers for young children and more while dealing with side effects and pain management. This is heartbreaking. We desperately need systemic change in the U.S. to address these issues.

wrenn

Latte it is the same here except for our medical always being paid. I too feel very lucky to be retired. I have not lost money during the pandemic and can basically stay home and order anything i need or do curbside pickups. I can't imagine the stress of having to work or care/worry about children and getting medical tests. We too have to wait for long term disability to kick in. The isolation is getting to me though.

I think given that pandemics are new to most in government I think ours was handled fairly well since they had to scramble to please everyone with so little information. I am impressed by how smoothly it is going really but still a nightmare for so many.

illimae

Latte, I totally agree about the struggles, especially by the younger women. I was 41 when diagnosed and had I not had a government career with a medical retirement option and short/long term disability programs, I’d likely be dead by now. The disability paid me while I waited for SSDI to kick in and continues to until death, I also have insurance as a retiree. If I had been in industries like retail or restaurant service, I’d be screwed by the lack of benefits and need to continue working.

LillyIsHere

Makes me sad how this virus was thrown on us not only to kill but to create hate, fear, depression rates are over the roof and I won't let this happened to me. I am fully vaccinated but I don't judge my friends who aren't for different reasons. I also don't judge my co-workers and friends who are fully vaccinated and got very sick from covid. This vaccine is far from perfect and that's why I keep the mask on all the time when I'm around people.

In a personal matter, covid lockdown started 2 weeks after my 3rd surgery (I had 3 major surgeries in less than 4 months). I was exhausted and I was going to work between surgeries so the work would be done by me and not passed to my co-workers. I didn't know at that time what a big mistake it was until covid hit and we stayed home. Then I realized how much I was doing. What I did at beginning of covid lockdown is I slept a lot, 8-9 hr/day, I eat well, I took care of myself and my family, I spent time with my young kids I never had time before. So, looking at the silver lining, in my case it wasn't all bad.

AliceBastable

ChiSandy, the town I grew up in in SW Illinois in Madison County is pretty blue. And driving through EXTREMELY rural Calhoun County last fall we saw a lot of Biden signs and very few Trump ones. Other places we've driven through on our frequent central-to-southern Illinois day trips have been a mix. Maybe actually visit those areas instead of throwing shade based on urban elitism?

Chowdog

fda just voted against the booster. 16 out 19 members voted no booster for those >16. The question voted on was if Pfizer had enough safety and efficacy data to justify booster for those > 16.

Not surprised. The whole us pandemic response seems to be "playing catching up" and "not collecting ng data". Probably why we will never get out of this.

cm2020

Chowdog, I want to vomit. So the only choice my family has is to go into a Walgreens (that doesn't have our records) and tell them we haven't been vaccinated and ask for our first dose? Making sure that we get the same vaccine as we had previously? Unethical, probably. But damn, we are all high risk for various reasons and I am terrified for our health and safety. My daughter is 17.

What are you guys doing?

Chowdog

cm2020, looks like they r discussing for another vote for those > 60. It sounded like they r more concerned about the risk of myocarditis for 16 to 18 year old. I would recommend discussing it with your doctor about risk and benefit of a booster.

Edited to add: they continue the discussion. some members support > 50, some support healthcare workers, and those with other underlying conditions (not included as the 3rd dose for immunocompromised).

this is the FDA vaccine advisory committee. they have input on FDA decision, but ultimately FDA will make a decision not the committee. CDC will have its meeting next week, then back to FDA for another meeting. So, it's not over yet.

cm2020

Chowdog....Neither my husband nor I are 60. So even if they choose to approve it for that age group it won't help us. I haven't read anything yet, so thank you for telling me their concerns for the 16-18 year old group. I have a physical next week and will talk to my dr. Last week I asked my MO and I don't fall into the immunocompromised group (even with several auto-immune disorders). My daughter has a physical in 2 1/2 weeks and I will have her discuss it with her dr.

I can't even think straight about this anymore. I am (like all of us) so tired of this and exhausted from constant worrying. Idaho rationing care (I am not in Idaho) and now this just feels like those of us that are truly trying are constantly getting smacked down. Right or wrong, it is how I feel. I am just sick at all of it.

Anonymous

cm2020 - This was a vote on whether to give a booster to the general population 16+. If you're immunocompromised, then you should be able to get a booster. I'm not elderly or considered immunocompromised. I had Moderna with 15 weeks in between. I'm in no rush to get a booster and would prefer to wait until the half dose is available.

Chowdog

cm2020, i edited the above reply to you with some additional color. the committee is also discussing people with underlying condition (those are not considered severe immunocompromised). and then CDC will meet next week to discuss, then back to FDA for more discussion. so it's not over yet.

cm2020

SerenityStat.....I am not immunocompromised. I plan to talk to my immunologist to get her thoughts (don't see her till November) and am going to ask my primary about doing titers (they are able to do that, right?) to make sure my vaccines fully "took" (can't think of the correct term right now) because I was on prednisone...about 10mg at the time I got both vaccines. My Pfizer doses were at the recommended 3 weeks apart. Same with my daughter. We don't reach 8 months until early December.

cm2020

Chowdog...Thank you for the update. I am glad it isn't over yet. I know I should probably go read it for myself but I started crying just seeing the headline and reading your first post about it so trying to read and process it isn't going to happen.

Chowdog

Like I said earlier, the meeting was a $hitshow. the whole process is. how did they not to be prepared with more voting options, instead of just lumping everybody into 1 big group? Also, Niki Manaj's tweet made into public comments.

cm2020

Chowdog....*facepalm*. Good.Damn.Grief! This is what happens when the inmates run the asylum.

Anonymous

cm2020 - This doesn't show a need for another shot for under 60 yet. We should wait for more studies.

Chowdog

cm2020, They just voted 18 to 0 Yes for enough data for EUA: 1) those >65 year and 2) those at high risk for severe covid, edited to add this means either with underlying conditions or with high job exposure like healthcare workers. (maybe you fall into this category)

SerenitySTAT, the sad reality is CDC has failed to collect data. it stopped collecting breakthrough infection data unless you are hospitalized or died. we have 2 million americans who have taken the booster, yet I don't see anybody collecting safety and efficacy data from these people unless you are enrolled into one of the clinical studies.

Anonymous

Chowdog - I've noticed that some states don't provide much data.

Chowdog

SerenitySTAT , I think it's well documented that U.S as a country has some serious data collection problem. from cdc to local level.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/08/18/c...

even our covid dashboard is all over the place without any consistency. like my county today had to go back adjusted # of people fully vaccinated coz some boosters were counted as first dose.

cm2020

Chowdog...That is wonderful! I believe all of my underlying conditions do make me a severe covid risk. I will discuss it with my primary next week, but feel hopeful that I will be able to, without it being unethical, get a 3rd dose. Given the myocarditis concern, I will have a discussion with my daughter's dr at her physical about whether she can safely get a 3rd dose even though she is also at high risk of severe covid.

Latte123

I agree, in general the US does have some significant problems with data collection on public health issues. Public health has been poorly funded for many years (forever?) and there is also a lack of coordination across cities, counties, states and institutions. It would be a big move forward in terms of addressing health challenges (not only Covid, but also breast cancer, maternal mortality, etc.) to improve and expand data collection practices.

On the topic of the FDA and the third booster, I honestly think that it is hard for the experts to make these decisions because so little time has elapsed since the vaccine was first deployed in the US. It is hard to assess "risk" with a short time line. This is why they often refer to preliminary Israeli research findings, which are helpful but not definitive. I am actually glad there are different opinions in the FDA panel. I don't want them to make these decisions without considering various points of view and giving the issue as much thought as possible.

Latte123

Illimae, I am happy you were able to retire and have health insurance. Nonetheless, a stage four diagnosis at 41 is tough and I am sorry you experienced that. Younger people are less likely to have had time to build their savings accounts and the necessary years accumulated in jobs that contribute to social security.It puts them in a terrible place when health emergencies occur.

ChiSandy

The FDA panel did endorse Pfizer boosters for all those >65, provable immune system status notwithstanding. My only regret is that I received a full dose of Moderna--the mfr. now recommends half-doses as boosters. (Not because my side effects would likely have been milder, but because half my booster could have been given to another senior or immunocompromised person).

cm, you received radiation only 3 months ago--it's still "cooking" from the inside out. That, plus the recent hi-dose prednisone you took, likely puts you into the immunocompromised group. You won't know till you ask--which is what I did. My melanoma MO (not my ocular onc, who got his own two shots only because he was mandated to) said I was still fully-protected, but my bc MO and PCP both said to "go for it." And I also asked at Walgreen's "consultation" window.

Had Walgreen's not been willing to believe I'm 70 and had recent radiation (still "percolating," acc. to my ocular onc) for a tumor that can't be excised, I would absolutely not have gone to a different pharmacy and lied that I was seeking a first shot. They do check the central IDPH database and can call your bluff. However, I would not be averse to dragging a known COVIDiot in there and offering to hold them down till they got their first jab. (Not talking about those extremely few--which includes our Illimae--who have a legit medical reason for being unable to get vaccinated; there is no legit "religious" exemption because AFAIK only Christian Scientists are not allowed to be vaccinated; even Jehovah's Witnesses forbid only receiving blood products).

When I mentioned the conundrum of involuntarily unvaccinated Third World residents and the extreme difficulty--if not impossibility--of getting first doses past corrupt dictatorial leaders and into people's arms, what I meant was the current situation, which would likely cause those donated doses to spoil before they could be administered. The WHO and vax-making (relatively) wealthy nations need to get together and figure out a way to collect, transport, distribute and administer those vaccines rather than let them continue to spoil. (I agree it's high time to turn loose and donate our AstraZeneca supply before it's too late). Doctors Without Borders are helping, but there aren't enough of them--and they lack legal authority to get past the brick wall of corruption, despotism, and tribalism. (Moreover, every medical and paramedical person sent abroad for that purpose is one who can't vaccinate people or staff COVID units & ICUs in North America--S. America, even Brazil now, seems to be getting a handle on COVID).

Alice, I've traveled extensively in SW IL, most often Randolph County, where my recording engineer works and farms his land. He & his wife (Evangelicals who "walk the walk") are nearly the only white liberals in Sparta, much less their church. That is a part of the state that ever since Costello retired, has overwhelmingly returned crazy Tea Partier-turned-Trumper Mike Bost to Congress every two years since 2010. Granted, I haven't been back since the pandemic started--but even in 2016, I don't recall seeing a single Clinton sign on my entire drive down I-55 and then country roads from Chicago to Sparta (except the outskirts of Springfield). Of course, there are majority-white NW & SW Side Chicago neighborhoods & close-in suburbs full of bigoted COVIDiots (it's how a self-declared Nazi won the GOP primary for Bill Lipinski's seat in 2018--giving Blue Dog Dem. Lipinski one final term). The latter areas are where 2 of my husband's 3 hospitals and his office are (the third hospital is in a hard-hit neighborhood of color and his union health clinic borders another).

Wrenn, I exclude cities and college towns on both sides of the border from my assessment of prevailing political sentiments in mountain & prairie states & provinces.

Just learned that Cuba--which makes its own vaccines--is now vaccinating toddlers as young as age 2. Despite its poverty, it is way ahead of any other N. American nation (perhaps any other country, period) when it comes to cutting edge cancer immunotherapies (note--not the "B-17' or laetrile snake oil being sold by clinics in Mexican border towns).

Chowdog

Our governor's 2 kids just tested positive

https://www.politico.com/states/california/story/2...

Anonymous

Chowdog - Sorry to hear that. I hope his kids recover quickly.

ChiSandy -

Conundrum? That's no excuse. Have you heard there's a pandemic going around? Good thing smarter and more persistent people are on it.

The Alberta healthcare system is failing because of their leadership. Years of cuts to healthcare reduced hospital capacity. Their cases were under control at the beginning of the summer before the leadership declared the pandemic over, lifted any restrictions, and didn't push vaccinations. They ignored rising cases. They ignored warnings from the hospital system. They have a higher vaccination rate than the US, but they don't have the hospital capacity to handle the cases without implementing other public health measures. Less healthcare capacity requires stricter public measures. They're applying them now.