fasting

Anonymous

Steroids will raise your blood sugar. Glad all went well!

dmjmom

Thanks Serenity, I'm sure you are right. It just surprises me, blood glucose was 134 this morning! My MO said I can possibly skip the steroids next round. I broke my fast this afternoon with 3 pecans, an ounce of cheese and a bowl of nice bone broth. So far so good. My Neulasta pod thing infused my medication and I just took my last dose of steroids.

Carmstr835, how are you doing?

Anonymous

I continued the steroids at the hospital before each chemo, but I didn't take any at home. I had no problems going without the meds at home.

Glad you're doing so well!

toughcookie_21

I realize this is an old thread but I'm hoping that some of you are still active. I am very seriously considering fasting before and after chemo. I have been fasting about 12-15 hours daily and eating a ketogenic diet for the past year with great results in terms of mental clarity, energy and weight loss. I lost 25 pounds, lowered my blood pressure from a consistent 160/90 to 120/70, lowered my cholesterol and improved my overall health to the point that I was able to run a half marathon in April just before finding out I had breast cancer.

The problem I'm having is the lack of support from the medical community for this kind of diet. I've yet to meet a doctor or nurse who supports low-carb or intermittent fasting. For those of you who are fasting, did your oncologist support this? Do you think it's safe to proceed without telling them? I'm not getting a whole lot of support for cold capping, icing my hands and feet, or even continuing with my current diet, let alone fasting for 48 hours per week. It seems that everyone I've met with wants me to suffer through the worst side effects of chemo and not prevent them through any type of intervention.

Anonymous

Great job on the weight loss and half marathon!

I mentioned fasting before chemo to my MO once. He didn't mind. I told no one else at the hospital. Please keep track of your weight. You don't want to lose too much. A little padding is good.

My MO did suggest that I ice my hands and feet. I had a little neuropathy in my feet for about 2 months. Vitamin B12 and an antihistamine fixed that. I would ice again. Cold capping has a low success rate with the chemo I had, so I didn't try.

The side effects of chemo can be terrible. I believe fasting helped prevent GI problems for me. It's also easy to stop fasting if you find it isn't working.

Good luck!

IntegraGirl

I just finished 6 months (8 rounds) of chemo and fasted 48 hours before treatment and 24 hours following every time. I told my MO what I was doing and referred him to the Valter Longo studies. He was sceptical but didn't object. A few of the chemo nurses had heard about it and were quite supportive although one battle axe started to argue with me and insist that I needed to eat a big breakfast the day of treatment so I had to tell her to get out of my space. Anyway, my SEs were pretty nominal beyond losing my hair and fatigue. My blood counts were normal throughout and I didn't have the Neulesta shots once. I broke my fasts with two Egg McMuffins and a large cappuccino every time and those were the best damn McMuffins in the history of the world . I have lost 15 pounds during chemo although that may be attributable to diet changes as much as anything else

dmjmom

Hi toughcookie! I've been eating keto with intermittent fasting for six months with the supervision and instruction of my cardiologist. He is such a big believer that he has monthly seminars explaining the diet for his patients at no charge. I've lost 50 pounds in those six months and my blood work has improved in all tested areas.

I am fasting three days before, day of, and 24 hours after chemo ends. I have my second round next week. My oncologist knows about my fasting,says it's fine, because I have extra weight and the lab work they do before chemo will let her know if my body is handling it well. She is not a believer though, lol.

I have lost a lot of my hair, and did get a UTI, which was expected because I have a colonizing bacteria that causes one whenever it gets a chance. I had some side effects from the prechemo steroids and the Neulasta pod shot, but I won't have to have either of those medications for my next chemo round. I had no GI problems or mouth sores or any other side effects from my first round besides hair loss and the UTI. My blood work right before chemo and a week after was very good.

I didn't mention that I was fasting to the infusion nurses.

It sure sounds like keto is working for you. There are doctors out there that believe in the keto way to eat. I hope you find one!

bareclaws

I'm finished with chemo, but still getting Herceptin and starting radiation this week. I am doing IF, 18/6 and find it's not hard. As in, I can continue this indefinitely. I got serious about it toward the end of chemo and my last two treatments were the easiest. Now I'm slowly losing the weight I gained on chemo and am about seven pounds away from where I started. Blood numbers are kind of all over the place. Glucose is good, but red and white blood cell counts are still slowly going down. The nurse practitioner told me yesterday that it can take weeks or even months for that to stabilize. I haven't talk to my MO about fasting but feel that she would be supportive. Many people at my center do cold capping and just about everyone on taxanes ices hands and feet. Oh, I also am running (really run/walk) five days a week. I don't know if I'll ever run another marathon, but half marathons for sure

Outfield

Fasters, how do you deal with the hunger? Since that study about the 13 hour overnight fast came out, I've tried, but I get such a gnawing in my belly that I can't sleep. Seems like it should e so simple to do, but for me it's not turning out to be that way.

IntegraGirl

I find fear to be tremendously motivating. My fear of side effects outweighed my hunger . I also drank loads of green tea and water and ate celery sticks if I got desperate:).

Anonymous

Eating more protein will help. Your body is used to a schedule. You can increase the duration of your overnight fast an hour at a time to ease yourself into it. If I've had dinner, I'm not hungry until mid morning.

bareclaws

I stop eating about 6 pm and don't eat again until noon, EXCEPT for under 50 calories of some fruit early in the morning to get the nasty overnighttaste out of my mouth. And black coffee all morning. No hunger at night but I'm certainly ready to eat by midday. Being busy, exercising, and chores keep me busy enough in the morning to keep me away from food. The feeling of hunger is not unpleasant. When I feel "fed" all of the time, it means I'm gaining weight.

carmstr835

I am doing fasting 5 days before and 24 hours after . My MO does not know, this will be my 5th chemo on Thursday. The side effects aren't bad except mg 3rd infusion. Not exactly sure why, I know they switched my chemo from TC to TCHP and that was the first infusion of TCHP. The next one was fine zero side effects except I was neutropenic. They discontinued the neulesta for that treatments but I am sure i will be getting it each time now. I am on a very low carb diet when not fasting. I lose about 15 lbs each week I fast but gain back 12. I do exercise the first 3 days after my chemo. That helps to sweat out the chemo and I feel great. I think the first 2 days are the hardest. I stay busy so I don't think about my hunger

TwoHobbies

Outfield, I personally think the more your body "practices" at the fasting, the easier it gets. First time I tried fasting before chemo, I only made it until about 2 pm. Second time I got through longer, and each time it got slightly easier. Both IF and longer fasting has gotten easier for me. The stomach churning and nausea will go away after a few minutes, but of course it makes it hard to sleep. When I have to stop fasting is when I get seriously shaky. If you are trying intermittent fasting, maybe eat later so you can sleep and then skip breakfast.

I actually never told my MO or the nurses that I was fasting before and after chemo. In the instructions, it said "NO FASTING" in caps, so I just didn't mention it. At that point, I had recurred, so by gosh, I was adding whatever I damn wanted to.

rdeesides

Can someone explain the fasting to me? Are you literally eating nothing or severely restricting calories? Obviously water/tea is ok? I don't want to gain weight or have SE if I can avoid it and I think fasting will not be too hard for me.

bareclaws

There are several ways to approach fasting. I'm doing intermittent daily fasting (IDF). Basically confining eating to a "window" of several hours a day. I'm doing 18/6, skipping breakfast and not eating after dinner. It's not hard at all! I run in the morning and don't like to have food sloshing around in my stomach when I do that, anyway. Once I got serious about this routine, there were only two chemo sessions left and they were the easiest to tolerate. I'm still doing Herceptin and have started radiation. I didn't ask anyone's permission to do this. The weight that I gained in the early months of chemo, surgery, etc, is coming off and that feels wonderful, too.

toughcookie_21

I agree that "practicing" helps your body ease into fasting. I never thought I would be able to fast consistently for 13 hours a day, but now find it easy to do especially when I'm busy. It took me a few weeks to get to the point where I was ok not eating past 8 pm and then not having anything but water or black coffee in the morning until 9 or 10. It was easier when I was working. since I've been home after my surgery, I've had a harder time stretching that 12 hour period of not eating.

I usually try to eat lots of protein before any type of longer fast and have my last meal at lunchtime or late afternoon and then nothing the next day but black coffee, water and herbal or green tea. I also occasionally will have a teaspoon of coconut oil if I'm having a really hard time with hunger. I haven't fasted for longer than 36 hours yet, but I'm going to practice this week or next before my first chemo.

dmjmom

Hi rdeesides! When I fast before chemo, I do allow myself black coffee and plain tea in addition to lots of water. My cardiologist suggested having a bit of Himalayan pink sea salt if I start to feel bad. For the chemo fasts I haven't felt the need to have any salt, but I did have some when I did a seven day fast in May (water only that time, no coffee or tea). I'm about 48 hours into my second chemo fast, my next round of TC chemo is on Wednesday. I lost 10.5 pounds during my last chemo fast, and kept nearly all of it off. I'm sure there are people who should not fast, and I have no medical training, so this is just my personal experience. I find the fasting to be very easy because I believe in the science behind it and I believe that I need to get all of this extra weight off if I am going to have any chance of preventing a recurrence of my BC.

toughcookie_21

Hi all, I am scheduled to begin chemo next Friday and I plan to fast 48 hours before and 24 hours after. I have been prescribed dexamethasone and zofran to take the day before. I don't do well with medication on an empty stomach. For example, I am on an antibiotic right now that doesn't stay down unless I eat something with it. I've been experimenting and I'm able to keep it down with a small dish of gelatine or a cup of bone broth, but this will break my fast if I have to eat something with the Pre chemo meds. Has anyone had experience with this?

Anonymous

toughcookie - How little gelatin do you need? A tablespoon has less than 30 cals. Have you tried gelatin powder in coffee? It's a thing. Keep it under 50, and you won't break your fast. You could try collagen hydrolysate that won't gel.

Good luck with your chemo. I found I didn't need the at-home meds, but I don't usually have problems taking meds.

Chiarara

just wondered if anyone who has tried fasting over a longer timeframewould like to chime in, either as an approach to manage chemo SE or to trying to reduce progression or recurrence? What did you find good about it, was it not helpful, or just neutral?

Thanks!

Anonymous

I did fasting during chemo and am doing modified fasting (13-15 hours a day, daily) now. If you search my user name and use the key word "fasting", you'll find several posts where I describe what I did. I believe it did relieve side effects from chemo, I hope it helped the chemo work more efficiently, and I also think the daily fast is keeping my weight down and my BMI in the 19-20 % range, even after nearly 5 years of tamoxifen/AIs, which would (in theory) further protect me from recurrence.

Claire in AZ

TwoHobbies

Chiarara, I did fasting during chemo, but I wasn't sure I was doing a long enough time period. Its hard to tell if it helped with side effects. For sure I was not side effect free. I had bad fatigue and really didn't feel great during chemo. I mainly did it because I had a local recurrence and I felt it was my last chance to be curable. I try to do fasting a couple of times a year in hopes of killing any stray cancer cells and regenerating my immune system. In fact, I started a fast last night, because I just realized I hadn't done one since mid-March.

carmstr835

Chiarara, I have been fasting for 7 days every 3 weeks and when not fasting am on a low carb diet. I start my fast 5 full days before chemo, the day of chemo, and until 24 hours after my chemo (targeted therapy, now).. I have my infusion every 3 weeks on a tuesday, so my last day to eat is wednesday night, the week before. I drink water and black coffee only. I eat again the following Wednesday evening. My 1st fast was in the 1st week of June and each one gets easier to do. So I have been doing this for about 6 months now. I really have no issues fasting at all. I do try to exercise though to keep my body from depleting my muscle. I did tell my oncologist finally last month and he is OK with this as long as I get enough calories in a 30 day period. He said there is some positive clinical data suggesting this is good for us cancer patients to prevent recurrence. I hope so because I am leaning against taking the hormone therapy my BMI is about 22-23. 6 months before my cancer diagnosis I was considered obese and been on low carb diet for about 1 1/2 years. I did have a few bites of bread sage dressing made with bread this year for the first time in 2 years, but no increase in weight this time and I am due to begin another 7-day fast this Thursday. I plan to continue fasting every 3 weeks indefinitely even after my targeted therapy is completed.

Chiarara

Thanks for replies. I have started the 13 hour overnight fast, pushing breakfast later. This has worked very well for me, which was a real surprise, as I am one of those people who always seemed to need to eat every 3 hours. Well, just as others have commented, breakfast seems to kick that pattern off. So I am very pleased that I am not getting the dips in energy I used to experience. I think I’ll try dropping breakfast altogether a few days a week and see how that goes. My body can be pretty sensitive to stress, so I’m building up slowly.
I do not need to lose weight, but am interested in positive effects on blood sugar regulation, hormones and there seems to be some evidence fasting is good for the gut microbiome as well.

WC3

I know it's an old post but here is my experience with this.

Day 1: Morning fasting blood sugar. 88mg/dl. I ate an egg white and a half a bagel for breakfast. My 2 hour post prandial blood sugar was 92. I had broth for dinner.

Day 2: Morning fasting blood sugar was 69. I just had some dill pickles with no sweetener for brunch. By evening I had moderate amounts of ketones in my urine, indicating a shift from glucose metabolism to fat metabolism. I felt a little weak but not particularly hungry but my blood sugar around bed time was 51, which in my opinion, for me, was too low to go to sleep at because of the risk of hypoglycemic crisis, so I had some matzo ball soup with a small matzo ball, a small piece of chicken, vegetables, and 1/4 a bagel. My post prandial blood sugar rose to 78 and I went to sleep.

Day 3: Morning fasting blood sugar was 69. I had to take the dexamethasone so I took it with an egg white. Post prandial blood sugar was 74. I had a pickle for a snack at some point. Again with no sweeteners. Early evening blood sugar was 88 from the dexamethasone and I still had some ketones in my urine. I had the 2nd dose of dexamethasone with another egg white. My blood sugar then rose to 92 from the dexamethasone but had dropped to 85 by bedtime.

Day 4, chemo day: Morning fasting blood sugar was 101 from dexamethasone. I ate nothing and went to chemo infusion. They gave me IV dexamethasone. I felt hungry but blood sugar when I got home from infusion was 104 which is what it would be after a snack or small meal under normal conditions.

So what is happening her is the dexamethasone is increasing glycogenesis even though I hardly ate anything. When this happened my ketones decreased meaning cells were consuming the glucose. That's not really what I wanted but my onco said the dexamethasone was necessary. It was spiking my blood sugar above 200 before I tried the fasting so at least the fasting was able to control that side effect even if I couldn't stay in a ketogenic state.

Jennie93

This is all so interesting, and I love that you are keeping track of everything so meticulously. Please do keep updating us. How are you feeling today?

Outfield

I am so pleased with myself! After struggling with how to do this on and off since I last posted (like a year or so ago), I had a few days off in the house by myself, and I just jumped into it. Feels like an old habit now. Easily hitting 13+ hours every day.

It's definitely true that the more I've done it, the easier it's gotten, and my energy/hunger swings in the morning have completely disappeared I usually don't eat until 10 or 11 am, depending on when my last food was the day before.

illimae

Hi all, I’m dipping my toes in the fasting pool. I’m starting Monday limiting myself to a noon-8 pm timeframe for a 16 hour fast. My main goal is weight loss and improved overall health.

MuddlingThrough

illimae, I've naturally had 12 hour fasting just by my schedule and habit. I've tried very hard to extend it, and often get 14 hours. I try very hard to impress on DH that I *must* have supper at 4pm. He agrees and wants to help but he's always mowing or in the garden etc and it just...doesn't...happen. Since he is so good to me, I'm not going to get angry. 12 to 14 hours is still good!

Good luck on 16, although if you have decided to do it I know you will!