B17 vitamin

Momine

Light, I suspect the source claiming that about B17 is not the most credible.

Chemo basically moved childhood leukemia from being a sure death sentence to being largely curable. I am not sure what kind of alternative treatment was involved in that achievement.

lightandwind

I suspect that you're only willing to acknowledge one side of the story.

Momine

Light, no, not at all. But conspiracy theories are rife in this area and this sounds like another one like that.

Which have been the successful alternative treatments developed for childhood leukemia?

lightandwind

Momine, If you are genuinely interested in effective holistic treatments for leukemia, then research them. You will need to be willing to accept testimonials, and be open to look into websites that you have probably avoided due to your belief that they are non-credible. check out IV Vit C., and here's a study for starters.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15863210

Momine

OK, so nothing that has been incorporated into standard care, from what I can understand. Fair enough.

lightandwind

Momine, it would be impossible to say generically how many years, holistic and complimentary treatment have tacked on because there has been no "standard" practice of tracking this.

Momine

Light, sure, but I thought you meant that there were alternatives that had been adopted across the board in childhood leukemia because they worked so well. Just my misunderstanding.

lightandwind

Momine, unfortunately that's just not how it works.

Momine

We will have to disagree on that being the reason. My onc routinely advises patients to use baking soda as a mouth wash against thrush, for example. Doctors also routinely advise consuming lemon juice to prevent kidney stones and I am sure those are not the only examples.

lightandwind

That really has nothing to do with how drug companies profit.

Momine

It does have to do with alternative/non-big pharma approaches being widely adopted. 

geewhiz

Momine - do you do any "alternative" treatment?

juneping

momine - regarding your onc's advices, that's not really routine in the US...we live in a culture that there's a pill for every thing. 

i don't think the medical field is that interested in curing cancer. ppl are NED from gerson's therapy but the medical field is not interested in finding out more about it. and they still stuck on chemo. that speaks volume to me. i wish the medical field investigate more on the less invasive approach (slash, burn and poison). life does not need to live up to the motto of no pain no gain. 

i don't get why ppl are so forgiving when ppl die due to chemo is not working. but when an alternative treatment fails, it gets all the bad reps.

personally, i had two friends died from cancer, both had chemo. both were under 40. that's just my experience. i don't know anyone made it, except one but she's not exactly my friend.

Momine

Juneping, the friends being "prescribed" lemon to prevent further kidney stones were in the US. It is also my impression that cancer docs in the US are far more up on getting their BC patients slim and exercising than cancer docs are here (I think docs here give up before they even try, given the resistance to exercise of most Greeks).

The difference in judgement of alternatives failing and chemo failing is that statistically and on average, chemo is still, unfortunately, your best bet in the majority of invasive breast cancers.

Chemo is not a cure. It is a very imperfect treatment. It is, however, a treatment with a proven track record of improving survival significantly in breast cancer.

Lily55

research shows that regular exercise that gets you breathless every other day or five times a week reduces recurrence by 50%, and combined with a low to normal body weight, increases survivability significantly.

Momine

Lily, yes, which is why I consider it the most important (as well as well researched) alternative approach.

juneping

momine - you wrote:

Chemo is not a cure. It is a very imperfect treatment. It is, however, a
treatment with a proven track record of improving survival
significantly in breast cancer.

it's well documented because it's one of the treatments that's legal and well funded in the US. my point was nobody bother to keep track of the record of other alternative methods. with the kind of money and research invested into cancer treatments (conventional), it is obviously not good enough. i think if half of that money invested into alternative treatments, we might have a chance of some break through. but it's not happening.

Momine

June, in most cases, if you check, somebody has looked into a given alternative and has found it wanting.

Heidihill

Alternative approaches as well as many conventional approaches both have the weakness of not being targeted to those who could really use them because we still don't know who really could use them. Cancer is not one disease. Chemo or radiation is not for everyone. Some people may not respond even to exercise's ability to prevent BC mortality. But I think we should really find out why it does for many people (see below). As for Chinese traditional medicine, I think this is being studied more in the West and China itself seems to be committing more yuan to research (I read that somewhere).

http://www.cshl.edu/Article-Page/nobel-laureate-james-watson-publishes-novel-hypothesis-on-curing-late-stage-cancers

http://www.cshl.edu/Article-Page/nobelist-james-watson-proposes-an-unconventional-view-of-type-2-diabetes-causation

It's anybody's guess whether vitamins in mega-mega doses act in a pro-oxidative way, and if so, following Watson's logic, may not work for those resistant to chemo and ionizing rads.  I'm still trying to understand the new paradigm being proposed by Dr. Watson. It does sound like it would involve a lot of fine-tuning, i.e., measuring levels of pro- and anti-oxidants.

For whatever it's worth, regarding fine-tuning, I know someone on a prostate cancer clinical trial here whose blood gets tested before he gets meds, and based on lab results an hour later, has his meds cocktail and dosages adjusted each time. Pretty cool.

mila_vegas

hello ladies, i have been on b17/laetrile IV's (12grams 5 days a week) for treatment of my stage 4 (lung, liver, bone mets) for 3 weeks now. So far i feel great, i was extreamly in a urge to vomit all the time, due to the liver mets, now i can eat all day long::I am a nurse, so i self administer it, i researched it a lot before i started it and ooo well, what do i really have to lose?!? I am out of conventional treatment since last august, did and still do many more alternatives. My oncologiest told me that most likely i will not benefit from chemo. I will keep you posted after i do scans, not sure when:  btw stop saying that b17 is a poison, i took 150 grams (150 000mg) and i am still alive, had a friend that went into coma from chemo and another one had a severe toxic reaction and died from it! God Bless you all!!

juneping

mila - i am so happy for you. pls keep us posted. i read that both vit B and D are vital to defend our bodies. thank you for sharing.

Fallleaves

mila_vegas, I am so glad this is helping you feel better, and I hope it continues to!

new_direction

mila_vegas - I hope you will continue the improvement. What you described sounds like a rather significant change. Best wishes from here.

The posts about exercising - must keep them in mind. It's great motivation to keep moving. It can be difficult some days...

Tomatoman

This is my second post. I know little about Laetrile, a.k.a. amygdalin (apricot kernals) but I recently read something about it on this site:  http://breastcancerconqueror.com/the-power-of-apricot-seeds/ that discusses the toxicity concern. Actually, Dr. V. has some interesting information on the effects of EMF and cell phone radiation; the dangers of the chemical bromide; and iodine deficiency.

I was interested in the iodine deficiency concept as I have one type of hypothyroidism (Hashimoto Thyroid Disease.)  On the breast cancer conqueror website,) Dr. V. make this statement (that was not attributed or cited):

"Women with hypothyroid conditions and who are taking thyroid medications, appear to be 2 times as likely to develop breast cancer compared to women not taking thyroid medications."  Dr. V sends out a seven day email termed the seven essentials in natural efforts with breast cancer.  Its pretty good, and gets one to thinking. 

myth451

Well B-17 works for me!...my pet scan in June /14 showed several cancerous lymph nodes in both sides of my neck , 2 cm lymph node under my arm and in both sides of my pelvis also...my Dr gave me 1 year to live he told me he couldn't do nothing for me ..He send me to Yale hospital to try to get in a clinical trial..my daughter hear about b-17 she ordered online ..I took b-17 for 6 weeks when I went for my biopsies the Radiologist couldn't find the cancerous lymph nodes in my pelvis , my under arm he just found two lymph nodes in the left side of my neck they were cancerous TN I didn't do chemo I didn't take any other vitamins or medicines before I went for the biopsies....I started chemo ( Gemzar and Carboplatin) ,but during chemo I was taken B-17 ....I had last pet scan October/24/2014... my pet scan was clear..

new_direction

Myth - that is so good to hear that. Happy smiles from me.

I have my apricot kernels and wonder how much b17 you were taking? Scientific or not what else should be the explanation for your change when that was the only change you made.

xyzzy

**Feb 26, 2014 09:40PM Moderators wrote: DDOL here's what the main Breastcancer.org site has to say about amygdalin, also known as laetrile, vitamin B17, apricot pits. Included at the link is this: Are there any risks? Amygdalin is converted into cyanide and other toxic enzymes. Oral doses of amygdalin have led to cyanide poisoning, coma, and death. **

Can you please post the evidence or details of the cases involving poisoning, coma, or death? Thanks!

xyzzy

amyds

I'm lucky (well...lucky enough I suppose, because I really didn't want to join this club!)- in Jan 2015, lump/mass gave concern, biopsies in Feb to determine additional info, yes a tumor, lumpectomy in March 2015 that showed an additional Phyllodes tumor inside (good clear margins) and also incidental finding of DCIS that has 1/2 mm margin. Onc recommends radiation, which I start next week, and tamoxifen (later Summer?) A good friend is almost aggressive in alternative treatment, and is insistent I MUST read the work (and pay $300 for his "personalized" report) of Ralph Moss.

First, I do not see my DX as dire. That's the big one- this WILL be treated, successfully, and the tamoxifen will further decrease my recurrence rate. I BELIEVE THE NUMBERS (amazing Wisconson cohort study period 1995-2006). BUT...what if I'm in the small numbers for recurrence? I mean, someone's going to represent. Who am I to say it won't be me, even with my current faith and confidence? So I guess I think, OK, maybe if my situation becomes more dire someday, THEN I'll look into Laetrile and Ralph Moss, etc. But until then...

NEXT- here's my big one: if these alternative treatments- apricot kernels, B17, Laetrile- EVERYTHING- if they worked, they'd work across the globe. Wouldn't it seem logical that someone, or some team over all these decades would have been awarded with a Nobel Prize for SOMETHING? I have a hard time reconciling myself that Big Pharma has been able to so stifle. Just MHO (my humble opinion)

Good luck to everyone and hold your faith strong. I didn't want to join your club, but now that I'm here, I'm grateful for the incredible knowledge and experiences being shared.

Momine

Amyds, Ralph Moss? That is a new one on the list

Momine

xyzzy, until the mods get around to it, I thought I would ask Mr. Google. This page actually has a perfectly clear and reasonable overview of laetrile: http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/cancers-in-general/treatment/complementary-alternative/therapies/laetrile

Apparently laetrile is particularly risky if taken by mouth and/or when taken in conjunction with vitamin C. Repeated reviews have failed to show any efficacy from laetrile. Also, having just skimmed several articles on it, I wonder if the "lysing" symptoms that laetrile always talk about are simply symptoms of cyanide poisoning.