Steve Jobs & his liver transplant

Halah

cocoapuff, I saw a video yesterday of Steve talking in front of an audience and he stated he had a liver transplant coming from a twenty something year old who died in a car crash. I wish I could cite the source but I was all over the web yesterday.

suzieq60

I don't approve or disapprove of this post, but I did find this article which questions whether he rorted the system.

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2011/01/how_did_steve_jobs_get_his_liver.html

He would have been extremely lucky to get a match and I don't know how long he waited.

suzieq60

Another article that says that delaying surgery when diagnosed (to try alternative treatments) and the transplant may have contributed to his demise:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/10/05/steve-jobs-dies-his-unorthodox-treatment-for-neuroendocrine-cancer.html

dawn31337

I think you would like to punish a man because he is rich.  Did his liver transplant impact you in any way?  Do you really know all the facts in this case?  Was his pancreatic cancer stage 4?  I don't know if it was or wasn't.  

Steve Jobs was a genius.  He contributed to the society of the world in incomparable ways.  He did not grow up rich, he was self made.  Isn't that the American Dream?  I have him and his company to partially thank for my very lucrative and challenging career.   

I suspect if you had all the resources he had, you would also pull any string to get a cure.  Who wouldn't?  Get over yourself. 

bcincolorado

Hello,

As the spouse of someone who received the precious gift of life by a liver transplant, I know first-hand how the organ donation system works in the US. 

I do not know if Mr. Jobs perhaps went out of the country for his or had it in the US, but here, you are are catagorized by your MELD score, which determines the probability of dying without it.  The higher the score, the higher you are on the list.  Blood type is an important factor as well.  The average wait in the US for a liver is 5 years.  For a kidney it is higher.

Also, once you have received a transplant, you are immuno-suppressed the rest of your life, and more suseptible to cancers appearing elsewhere in the body.  I know DH had an extensive physical before, as do all patients, and if known cancer was there, it would have shown up.  It does not mean he will not get cancer later though and if he does, it could kill him faster.

Anyone who wants the facts on Organ Donation can go to UNOS web site and all stats and regulations are listed.

Please also do not think you cannot be a donor because of your cancer donation.  When the term "organ donation" is mentioned, people just think of solid internal organs as a rule.  Your skin is an organ as well and can help burn patients.  Blood also qualifies.  Bone can be used as well for cancer patients.  Please do not hesitate to sign up with your State Registry.  At the time of your passing, a determination can be made at that time.  Please also remember to TELL YOUR FAMILY!  I know of someone who wanted to be a donor but did not do the designation or discuss with their family.  At the time of their passing the family was so grief stricken since it was unexpected they declined, even though it was what they had wanted.  Most States have laws that if you sign up your family cannot over-ride the decision but not all.

Many people think of October now as "Pink Month" but it is also National Organ Donor Awareness Month.   Please get the facts and consider signing up if you have not.

profbee

Yay!  I'm so glad to hear that I could still donate!  Thanks!  I will definitely look into this more.  

rosemary-b

For any type of transplant tissue types have to match.If it is true that money can buy a transplant it can only happen if that match exist

Cowgirl13

My choice today is to honor and respect him. period.

And today I learned that he came from very humble beginnings.  I like that.

SpecialK

As far as blood donation after a cancer diagnosis, it is up to the blood collection agency how long you have to wait to donate.  I worked for Florida Blood Services and their restriction is one year after the end of treatment.

suzieq60

Maybe not such a nice guy after all - I'm giving you this link as you may not see it in the US papers - make your own judgement

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/biz-tech/apple-workers-in-china-react-to-steve-jobss-news-20110902-1jov1.html

apple

that would be nice if one could give 1/2 a liver..

my sis is looking poorly lately.. she had a big tumor removed but her skin is yellowing.    She'll yell at me if I tell her tho.. maybe email will work.

annafrederik

I sincerely hope that no one digs up my dirt or mentions the skeletons in my closet when I'm dead.

lrr4993

Susie - thanks for the link. He is not a nice person because he did not respond to a letter that was likely never even seen by him because it was diverted to HR or legal (as it should be), and written by fully recovered workers who received full compensation for the problem per the applicable law? Really? Yeah, on second thought, he did not deserve that liver.



This board blows my mind sometimes. Incredibly unfair judgment of a dead man based on flimsy, if any, facts. I am not surprised, though, as this is the same board that often produces complaints about breast cancer fundraising because it is pink and fluffy and high profile patients having the audacity to be positive about their diagnosis.

suzieq60

I'm not judging him at all - you can do that yourself - what I don't know is why he is so idolised. What did he do that is so great - he was just a rich man who owned a technology company.

2nd diagnosis October 2010 - IDC 5.8mm node negative - missed on mammogram in October 2009
Diagnosis: 10/13/2009, ILC, 1cm, Stage I, Grade 3, 0/5 nodes, ER+/PR+, HER2+

ruffy

My dad was on the liver transplant list in Canada. He passed away before he got paged, but we carried the pager everywhere. Above it was mentioned above re alcohol abusers getting transplants. Doctors here in Canada will remove you from the list if you are activly drinking. They do random blood tests to check alcohol levels. So yes, maybe an active drinker shouldn't get the transplant and in Canada, they don't. If they ended up on the list because they drank in the past - that's their business and its no ones business to judge. Should we stop treating lung ca patients because they smoked? Also, at the hospital where my dad was treated, cancer patients were at the top of the list, not sure the circumstances with each patient obviously, and not familiar with Mr. Jobs health records either-but he is a person with family that loved him, he's a bit of a big deal in the techy field so his death is all over the media. Regardless of how he got his liver, which I believe he got because he medically needed it and luckily a match was available. family or friends can donate also, if both people are a blood match and body size is similar.this topic just makes me sad too, it reminds me of my dad which brings me to the point of respecting Mr.Jobs. There's alot of people who loved him and are going to miss him and no amount of money is going to help out with that. Love and compassion help with that. So let's show some compassion, a fellow cancer fighter passed away yesterday. It's sad.

trinity927

Steve Jobs - A true Visionary, Inventor, a Genius.  Period.

I agree that this topic is totally inappropriate, although as pointed out by some, many good points have been made that are not directly attacking Mr. Jobs.

We are surviving cancer patients.   Bad karma to make assumptions based on "what exactly" ... news reports and articles?  You're kidding, right?

Yazmin

I made a decision to no longer be a donor after my breast cancer diagnosis. Frankly, I don't see how they can EVEN consider cancer patients for organ donations. They might decide that it is OK to donate today, for this and that situation, and then, tomorrow, they find out that it was not, after all.

How many times has science been dead wrong? How many times have they have to recall and backtrack on stuff that they were 100% sure of?

No, I don't want to be a donor on my Driver's License anymore.

Having said that, I don't think this is the right time to discuss whether or not it was ethical for this man to receive a liver transplant. Also: I am sure that, faced with the same situation, and having the resources to receive a transplant, most of us would have done it, no matter what we say on this forum............................. 

lrr4993

He co-invented the Macintosh.  He was very involved in its development back when apple was made up of only a handful of people.  The Macintosh set the stage for modern day personal computers.  You are posting on this board on a computer that has it origins in his vision.  And while he likely had a lot of help with the modern day apple products, he was a big part of their conception and development.  I don't think anyone here is idolizing him, but I for one certainly respect what he accomplished in his life and I benefit from it daily.  And at the very least, I think he deserves to rest in peace and not have people question the ethics of his liver transplant, his company's handling of a problem with a plant in china, or whether he really actually ever did anything worthwhile based on hunches or guesses. 

pp729

Wow -- I very rarely post on this forum lately, but had to comment on this one.  I am saddened by the lack of sensitivity and respect afforded to Mr. Jobs and his family by this post.  It is very untimely and very inappropriate IMHO.  This forum has been very informative and uplifting for so many with BC and for family members, like myself, who have used it.  I just do not see the value in debating how and why Steve Jobs got a liver transplant and I would rather recognize the life of a person who made a tremendous contribution to society in many different ways.  Despite all of life's challenges, we each have the opportunity to make a better place in this world.

trinity927

Ruffolo1 - I agree with what you stated ... love and compassion IS the way to go ... and, we need to remember that a fellow cancer fighter has passed away. 

Lisa - thank you for detailing Steve Jobs' contributions to this world we live in!

And, let's not forget the charitable donations he made during his life, and the many people who benefited from that.

I will certainly miss him!

LisaAlissa

You said: "I'm not judging him at all - you can do that yourself - what I don't know is why he is so idolised. What did he do that is so great - he was just a rich man who owned a technology company. I doubt he personally invented anything."

Hi susieq58,

It seems to me that you have already judged him.  But to answer your questions, take a look at this obit in today's LATimes.  To hit a few highlights, he didn't start out a rich man.  His birth parents were students who put him up for adoption.  His adoptive parents were "a high school dropout who sold used cars and worked as a machinist and his wife."  He dropped out of college, and sold his van to finance the first Apple computer (which he and a friend, Steve Wozniak, designed & built), which was built in his parent's garage. He's had an uncanny ability to motivate others and to choose the path and product that's "next."

HTH,

LisaAlissa 

pickle

PP729...well said.

As a side mention regarding liver transplant matches...the liver is the most transplantable organ. It doesn't have to meet all the same criteria as other organs for match although, certainly there is criteria that needs to be met.  As I mentioned in my previous post, my BIL received a liver transplant. It was a live liver transplant from his BIL...not a blood relative. The liver, even though resected and transplanted has the miraculous ability to regenerate. The anti rejection drugs are more minimal than other organ transpalnt drugs. 

I understand people's frustration at cancer...it sucks...and it sucks far more for some than others..yet it still sucks..but I have to agree with some posters...people are judging this man...how sad for anyone, let alone a very recently deceased person.

Susie Q, He's not being idolized...he is being spoken about for his remarkable achievements. Give credit where credit is due. It's a  bit synical to say that he likely didn't invent anything himself yet reference an article regarding China that you seem to embrace with truism.

We have  few people that come along in our lifetimes that change the way we communicate, the way we do things, technological, medical, mechanical etc advancements...and we are blessed that there has been more achieved in so many fields in our lifetime than any other. 

Are we there yet?...is there more work to do?...absolutely there's more to do... but let's at least celebrate a man who was a genius and changed the way we do things. May we will be so lucky in the medical field..in the fight against all cancers. I hope a "Steve Jobs" of the medical field comes along and busts the cancer mysteries wide open. Be grateful for the innovators and Steve Jobs was one of them.

RIP Mr. Steven Jobs

Respectfully

Beth 

D4Hope

I agree with everything you said pickles.

susan_02143

willful ignorance.

bak94

Off topic, but did anybody hear his 2005 commencement speach to Stanford graduates? I heard the tail end of it on the radio, wish I had heard it all, but it was a remarkable speach, and just the last portion of it made me cry. Try to look it up, I am going to, I want to hear the whole thing. A quote from his speach-

"'If you live each day as if it was your last, someday you'll most certainly be right.' It made an impression on me, and since then, for the past 33 years, I have looked in the mirror every morning and asked myself: 'If today were the last day of my life, would I want to do what I am about to do today?'"

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/10/06/in-2005-speech-steve-jobs-muses-on-death/#ixzz1a3nCgp2b

Halah

bak94, I was just coming back to this thread after visiting YouTube. You can find the speech here: Steve Jobs 2005 Stanford Commencement Address. Very inspiring.

lrr4993

Bak - I saw that on the news this morning.  That quote is a great one.  It gives me a lot to think about.  I have tried to really live my life - something I took away from my grandparents' lives.  They worked so hard and saved all their lives.  They never travelled or did anything for themselves.  Then by the time they retired they were too old, set in their ways and/or ill to enjoy it.  Cancer drove that home for me even more.  But even still, I can't say I live up to that quote, which makes me a bit sad.  

bak94

Wintersstorm, thanks for posting the link, i am going to watch it!

nowords

Steve Jobs was a flawed human like the rest of us; however, he changed the way the world works, communicates, listens to music...he was a visionary and a perfectionist. His impact on the world of technology is huge and the ripples of that go on and on, effecting business and personal connections.

There are videos out there of his words. He left a tremendous legacy to the world.

RIP indeed.

Emaline

I know I am not from ths board, and sorry if I am intruding...but I had to add that a transplant is not always out of the question. I don't know the wheres, the hows, or the whats...but I know my co-workers sister was diagnosed with a very rare liver cancer. One of the major hospitals in our area, basically said here is hospices number, let us know what we can do to help comfort you.  The 2nd hospital said "Lets get you on the transplant list".  She was not rich. She was not powerful. She was just a daughter, a sister and a mother.  She did get a  new liver and it bought her 7 years with her family.  Her sons were young at the time and it gave them time with her to grow up. So no, I don't think money has anything to do with it.

 For me? I don't know if I could do that for myself. I think I would.  However I could say, if it was my child who had cancer...I would do anything. Anything. One more day to have them here in my arms, to see their smiles? Oh yes. I would do it.