Dating After Recostruction (and CANCER!)

musiclovermom

I am so insecure right now after the past year.

I would like some kind of male attention other than my plastic surgeon telling me how good I look and how great I will look after this is all overwith.

He is amazing and I can't wait to test drive his work this summer with a date!

I am not only dealing with the new boobs, but my husband left me! (2 months before the cancer)

I have a bunch of issues!

Kimberly

Bigapple09

Here is my untested two cents.

I broke up with my S/O for good the week before Thanksgiving. 12/16/09 I lost my right implant due to a staph infection. It will be February before we can start setting a surgery date, and it may have to be a DIEP with an implant to get extra skin and fat for the lower pole of that breast (rads damage).

I am dating, I was going to wait till I was all done, but I decided this may be an opportunity to avoid making some of the same old mistakes.

#1 I don't need to disclose anything about my medical history until I know I want to look into a committed relationship with this man.

#2 I need to spend the beginning of the relationship listening and deciding if I want to spend time with this man. Not getting him to want to be in a relationship with me.

#3 What he thinks about me is secondary to what I think about him (man I need to write this in my iPhone)

#4 Physical intimacies must follow true emotional intimacy. 

#5 In the words of my very wise cousin, a man will say and do anything to have sex. I don't want that guy. I want a guy who will never refer to me as his "trophy wife; girl friend ; etc" I want a guy who values me, me, me, including my emotional vulnerability,  and will wait, wait, wait, until I am ready to share the physically intimate part of myself.

#6 Once, I really know and trust him and know that I (me, me me it's got to be about me) want to move that relationship to a physical place, (and not just because I feel randy) then and only then will I have a discussion with him about my medical history and the state of my surgery.

#7 At that point the choice is his, he can stay or he can go. (Odds are I am not taking off the bra or tee shirt anyway, because I am not comfortable,)

#8 If he goes, it is not about me, it is not about my value as a person. It is about him and his lack of depth or failure to see me as anything more than a really pretty girl, forever flawed because she temporarily has one boobie. In which case, what a bone head. I am smart, kind, pretty, I have a great figure (sans one boobie) a great face, fabu sense of humor, I am smart as the day is long, I make my own living, own my own home and have the worlds most awesome teenage daughter.

#9 If he stays, I will explain that the lack of disclosure was not an attempt at dishonesty, but that until I knew if I wanted a real relationship, it was not relevant. That once I knew him and knew that there was something here, more than just attraction, I shared this very intimate information so that he could decide for himself if this was something he wanted to be part of.

#10 If he gives me the time to decide for myself, and he takes the time to listen and really understand how vulnerable this all makes me, well he will be a man who is worthy of all of that trust and disclosure, and a man who is looking for a real relationship, the good, the bad, the trials and the triumphs.

My good friend who has been with the same man since she was 17 told me, "If a man really cares about you, he is not going to ask for a sexual relationship till you let him know that you want that." I really think she is right; a lot of men see a pretty, successful, woman and think that conquering that shows how much of a man they are. They really will say and do anything to get that.

I don't want that man.

Think of all of the men, who have raised the issue of sex or tried to take a make out session to the next level right in the beginning of the relationship. If you said no, how many of them did you ever hear from again?

While I might feel bad when I don't hear from that guy again, i try and think about how bad I would have felt if I trusted him and had sex with him and then did not hear from him. I am not a commodity, I am not trading sex for the chance at a relationship, it is a part of a relationship, and like my friend says, the right guy is going to be more interested in spending time with me than with getting with me.

 Well that is my two cents and we will have to see how it goes

musiclovermom

Wendy

You are savvy! Can I be you when I grow up?

Kimberly

Bigapple09

Kimberly:

I'm not grown up yet.

Believe me. 

And like I said it is untested, but I at least have my vanity to give me a back bone as there is no way in heck I am being seen sans top till I am all put back together.

musiclovermom

Yeah... I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up yet!

I am glad you have vanity! Where can I get some to cover my insecurities?

Bigapple09

Kim:

Everyone is insecure. A fellow attorney, who is fat and bald and has known me for years, once told me that he was so surprised to realize that I had insecurities; we had a long conversation about it. Everyone has something, it all comes down to how bad we feel if we are rejected and how much we make it about us as opposed to what the other person wanted.

I think it also has to do with what our parents valued about us, or made us self conscious of. For me, they always fussed over my appearance and if my hair was right or I was tidy enough (I seriously grew up thinking I was some dorky freak, only after reuniting with childhood friends did I find out that, that was not their perception at all) and if anything bad ever happened my parents would make tell me it was because I did this or that or I was not smart enough or did not work hard enough, if I was more  like this person than that would not happen etc., which all makes me think people value my outside more than my inside, causes me to stress out about my appearance and makes every rejection about me. IT IS ALL STUPID, people pick you because they like you and being with you makes them happy and makes them feel good, if those people really care, they show up for you and even do things they don't want to do when it is important. People make choices and reject others based on their own wants and desires and there is NOTHING we can change about ourselves that will make them accept us. CHANGE is good, if it makes you happy, change that compromises you and makes you unhappy is not good.

I have these awesome friends the wife is like the sister I always wanted, they have this great New Year's party every year, and well, I was not going to go, and she was like Wendy, you have to be there, it will be fine no one will notice anything. So I went, my daughter, my foam boobie, and me. No one noticed anything. I had a great time. My daughter, me and another family stayed over, as the roads were bad. This morning I came out in a tee shirt and a sweat shirt, without my foam boobie and my reconstructed c boobie in a compression bra. I asked my friend if it was noticeable and if I should change, she said" no, but if you go around asking people and they start staring they might notice something, so don't ask"  No one noticed anything, why, because no one was staring at my boobs trying to see if something was wrong. I had so much fun a breakfast, and not once did I feel like anyone was looking or noticing, why? Because my right boob was the least important thing. The most important thing was how much fun we were all having. THIS was the absolute best New Year ever. SO, have your insecurities, nothing you can do, they are like shadows, but don't let your shadow block out your sunshine, if you do, you will miss out on awesome things.

OK, enough from me, I have to plan a dinner party menu for tomorrow (nothing like the last minute)

Wendy.

musiclovermom

Now I am crying...

Emotional baggage every where!

Mai605

Wendy I am so inspired by you!  You have such an amazing spirit, and I can't imagine how tough it was with your infection and losing an implant.  I'm uptight b'cuz that's my fear now, with capsular contracture, my right foob is as hard as a rock and hurts.

This will be the ultimate test ladies, to find Mr. wonderful throughout all this.  Somehow I believe God will bless us in spite of all this as we learn to love ourselves again.  I'm printing off your list for reference... I hope you don't mind

Edited cuz I can't spell....

Bigapple09

Mai:

Part of why I am so optimistic,is that I am finally without the pain I have had in my rads side for the past 6 months. Granted, I would rather have two boobies, right now, but the physical relief is amazing.

Ok, I am really signing off now.

thepinkbirdie

Mai - Thanks but I don't think it's confidence so much as that I sometimes just don't give a sh*t what others may think.

It's true, men are visual creatures.  I used to struggle with that and get really aggravated some times over it.  What helped was when I realized that although they are visual they don't all have the same taste in women.  At the risk of sounding bad, I would think that many of us at least once in our lives have seen a good looking man with what we may think of as a not so pretty woman and wonder what he's doing with her.  To some, she's not pretty but to him she's beautiful.

Wendy - tons of great advice and good points!  It's amazing how our childhood has affected our adulthood. 

cookiegal

listen I was single for a long time, I just got married in 08 at the age of 41.. As far as being honest with your picture during chemo....on a dating website I might just go for a wig. If you don't normally wear a wig, maybe a pink or blue wig just for fun.

I think the cancer thing is TMI on a dating site.

And I dated 2 cancer patients I met on line, it was never a big deal to me. I respected them.

I have a very very cute guy friend who just finished chemo last week. I am so excited for him to meet someone nice.

Good luck ladies, I really admire y'all. 

imnyc

Wendy,

 Nice list for the new year!!  Here's to #3 on this list specifically!!  I need to have that written on a post-it and stick on my wall!!

 Everyone - Happy New Year!!

Bigapple09

One date down,it went well, we will be going out again. I felt very good about it,he lives in the city and wanted to go out there,I said, I would love to but I have a very busy day and have to pick my daughter up from a party, there is a great place in __,you can take the LIRR out and it is a two minute walk, yadda yadda. Very unlike me to have someone do what is convenient for me, I think it is a good start.

musiclovermom

You give me HOPE that I will have a date someday!

imnyc

Nice new profile picture Wendy!!  Way to go with your dates!!  Keep us posted.  I, like you, have less pain after the implant on the problematic side has been removed... although I am still getting used to the long scar across my chest that made me look like I had got bitten by a shark... and also being lopsided... well, I guess both of us would just have to wait it out...and hope for the best in our next surgery...

Sexy-bald-chemo-girl

Dating sucked before cancer and it hasn't picked up since. But I keep hope alive that it will. Life is funny. I had planned in 2008, that after I started my new job and got a little more comfortable with my new boyfriend... that I was going to buy a condo and work on having a baby because I was 39 and I felt that I needed to make moves. The first move I made was to have a lump checked out in my breast - finally had health insurance - and that lump turned out to be stage 3 breast cancer. Now, Jan 10, I am boyfriend-less, post-chemo, post-rads, post-mastectomy and post-reconstuction... but I am lonely and I don't know how to go about getting myself back.

 Meeting men is not a problem. Never has been. I'm an outgoing person with a nice smile. Men tend to be simple enough to attract. But keeping them around? Seems like I'm a failure there. And to make matters worse.. I decided to blog about my breast cancer experience and that really seems to be the wrong move. I like that my blog helps other women to understand what to expect but men just don't know how to deal with me. I keep hearing the same/similar line... that basically they think I'm great but they aren't quite ready to deal with me. I talk to guys who tell me that my cancer isn't a problem. That I'm still physically attractive and that my personality is a winner. But I'm still "kissing frogs" and its tiresome.

Cancer really feels like one bad thing after another.

Bigapple09

Ok,this is going to sound lame. I just started reading a book called how to be your own match maker and it has some interesting stuff on "qualifying" a guy to be considered as someone you want in your life. I have looked back over the serious relationships I have had,and I realized that each time, my gut was not to pursue a relationship with them,but because there were a lot of good "on paper" things,i talked myself into sticking it out. Sometimes the problem is that we keep picking the same wrong guy, because this time we think we are going to get it right. But the truth is, you can't because there is something there that cannot be made any different.

I am trying to keep track of the way that I felt in the "bad" relationships and keeping that in mind. I am also doing a big post mortem on the character flaws and it has given me very big insight, I Finally realized, it was not that the flaw was not there at the start, it was that I did not think it was important because the relationship was not important yet, but when the relationship became important and that same behavior was there,it was a very big deal. This is again helping me to cull the herd and just say no to the men who are showing the behaviors that will be a big problem for me later.

So, what I am saying is, there is nothing wrong with you. You have to be who you are, the man has to fit your life.Cinderella did not try to fit into the prince's shoe, she fit into her own shoe,he just happened to have it.

Sexy-bald-chemo-girl

How very profound. "Cinderella did not try to fit into the prince's shoe, she fit into her own shoe... he just happened to have it". 

Amazing. I love words (I'm a writer) and I am always amazed at the power that words have to make you feel better. Thanks for the insight. I do think that I pick the same guy over and over and I keep trying not to make that mistake. which is probably why I can't make up my mind about dating right now. I will look for that book. It sounds like a winner.

Alitman

I have been posting on another thread and this one was suggested to me.  I had a bilat mx (prophy) in June 09 and my exchange 11/09 - I recently decided to get nips 'cause I don't feel like these are even boobs anymore - may as well be elbows for all I care about them.  I'm hoping the nips will help.  Anyway - I recently joined match.com and I feel as if I am being completely rejected based on a paragraph and a head shot.  I sit down once a week and write a ton of emails to a ton of different men - I check their profiles to make sure smoking and body style are a match and so far I've had only 1 response other than a "wink".  We met for a drink and he told me he and his wife were going to marriage counselling.  Needless to say, I am not thrilled with the results.  Maybe I am not ready - I don't know. 

Allison

musiclovermom

Hi Allison!

You are further along than I am at least. I have yet to even have a date. What a jerk to go out with you while he is in marriage counseling. I just have the hardest time trusting anyone right now.

Kimberly

musiclovermom

Hey Wendy!

I was at the book store and was looking for the matchmaker book and almost spoke to a man in the same isle. ALMOST but didn't - I wondered if he was there for self help or just waiting for me to leave so he could look at the sex books on the next shelf. After he left the isle I glanced at the titles he picked up - on emotional health... Maybe not the best place to meet men - they might be more screwed up than I am! Anyway, i found the matchmaker book and one also called DEAL BREAKERS. Happy Reading!

Kimberly

imnyc

Allison,

FYI there are a lot of creeps on match.  I have been a member there for a few years now...believe me, please don't take the rejection personally.  It has to do with 'age' for the most part I found.  I got 'winks' and emails all the time when I first joined, but once you get to the 'mid thirties' in my case, i.e. as you age, I hardly get any emails... many men on that site are out to play the field so they tend to approach the young girls... that's my opinion based on my experience... I had the same thing written in my profile in my early thirties and mid thirties, just different pictures, and the age changed of course, but the responses I received are like night and day.

Alitman

Great..... I just turned 51 - maybe I should be looking for men in their 70's.....  Actually, I have a friend in AZ (where I lived until june of 08).  He has been pursuing me for about 5 years now.   I was in a relationship when we met but that didn't deter him.  He is nice BUT he lives in AZ and he is so much older than I am.  I have trouble picturing myself being intimate with him.  I know waaaayyy to much information.

Allison

Bigapple09

Never tmi,unless we tell you TMI.

The Patty Stranger book says to be open to dating men 10-15 years older than you are. I kind of draw the line around 55 for me I did go on a date with guy who admitted to 61, but even if he was younger I would not have dated him,he was great on paper,but I just could not.

My dad is only 19 years older than me, and it really still bothers him when I date older. The guy I broke up with in November was 9 years older and my dad's only comment was "My, he is quite a bit older than you."

I figure if prince charming walks in and he is 56,but I really like him, well then I will give it a shot.

I have a date for next week, he seems a little to much of a muscle head but we will see he is very smart so maybe the muscle head thing will balance.

In the meantime I am going out with girl friends on Friday and I am shamelessly letting people value know I am single and am looking to have some one make a match for me.

(I so love the STranger book, I feel so much smarter about men now)

Alitman

I hope you have a great time out with the girls and on your date next week.  I have let most people around me know that I am looking but so far, I've not gotten any help.  I will be working late tomorrow and probably working most of the weekend.  I'll be in Dallas thurs and fri of next week.  I think  I'll sleep in the spring....LOL

Allison

wabiwoman

Hi all,

I know some of you from other threads and it has been nice to read your stories here.  I'm concerned about confidentiality so when it comes to the dating stuff so I probably won't be chiming in too much.  Based on an incident a friend told me about losing some privacy on a community forum (she found a posting of hers repeated in the personal blog of a forum member - her name was not mentioned, but she felt very "exposed"), I got curious and looked up the BC.org forum rules - I mean how much of what I say here actually stays here?  The rules state "By using the Discussion Boards or Chat Rooms, you are granting Breastcancer.org a perpetual, exclusive, royalty-free and irrevocable right and license to use, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, distribute, transmit, publicly display, publicly perform, sublicense, create derivative works from, transfer, and sell any such messages, files or communications" and for some reason freaks me out just a little.  Anyway, because of this and because the community I live in is so small I'll be a lurker on this thread.  Hope you all don't mind!  I'll be dating soon, so know I'm joining you in spirit!

Geena

musiclovermom

Hi Geena!

When I have something to say that I am not comfortable posting, I usually send a PM to that person...

Kimberly

Alitman

Geena & Kimberly -  I must have been born without that "privacy gene"  I don't have very many personal boundaries but I will watch what I say.  Actually, I can't imagine I would say anything that would even be of interest to anyone else.  I guess I kind of pays to not have much to say that is worth while.

Allison

wabiwoman

(((((Allison))))) - You ALWAYS have great stuff to say!  I love reading your posts!

Kimberly - Yes, I must use the PM option more often....

Geena

musiclovermom

Hi Allison!

I guess I have the theory that once something is in writing, expect the whole world to see it. The Internet is a perfect example! You don't even have to be a member of this site to read all our posts.

I don't have anything to hide but sensitivity on a subject is taken into consideration.

I have been helped so much by these message boards and have to think there are so many women who read but don't post that are getting help also.

Have a great weekend - we are getting snow in Virginia today...Snow was a major reason I moved away from Maine!

Kimberly