Guilt ridden for drinking/ eating~ anxiety

Nicole112

I am having one of those oveanalyzing nights where I sit here and think and think... I hate the night, I can almost forget about the word "cancer" in the day but my brain can't seem to calm down at night... and it is the same internal dialogue: I analyze what I ate for the day, drank... physical activity... GUILT that I did not eat enough veggies or fruit but I caved in to the sweets in the office, enjoyed a glass of wine with some girlfriends... I just want to go back to my "old" self and stop blaming my behavior as being the "cause". I mean, isn't it true, if we could blame it on diet, we would all be eating a bland diet and that would be the cure...
It's more complex, right????? Do any of you get this anxiety...

I know they say there is a coorelation between alcohol and possibly cancer... do I hae to feel guilty to have wine with my dinner? I'm 5'9" 160 lbs, not overweight, just average. My bloodcount is all in the"zone", so can I le my anxiety go? Why do we have to feel guilty on top of everything we have been through.

Please tell me if you think I am crazy, or if you think I am being ignorant that I haven't changed my diet and I still drink!

Thanks for listening to me vent, any opinions on this is greatly welcome!

Nicole112

... I meant to add, I am 37 years old, mother of two children with a wonderful husband... so I have sooo much life to live!... this is where the guilt comes in, should I be changing my habits even though I do not think they are "bad" habits. And, no it's not genetic, thank goodness, I have two little girls so I don't have to worry about that!

lexislove

I ate well to begin with and got BC. I could pick up on the exercise, but right now its hard for me to find the time being at home with my 3 year old all the time.

Look...this is what I think. You have to LIVE. I believe everything in moderation..which I did before the BC. There are people out there that drink,smoke,sit around and then get in their car to hit a drive through and they don't get cancer.Then there is the marathon runner who does! How? Why?

If we knew the answers, I'm sure there would be a "cure" or a preventative vaccine or something. I strongly feel that pre and post menopausal BC is triggered by different "things"

In my heart and gut, I KNOW what brought on my BC. So I have made changes to not go back to the old me. I did have to take Effexor after I finished my Herceptin.My brain would not shut down and I was anxious all the time. Now, 6 months later, I feel strong enough to slowly come off it.

Also, the old saying, time heals goes? It's very true. More time passes the whole BC thing is not so raw. I think of BC don't get me wrong, but not the way I use to think about it. I don't have the anxiety or fear , except the week or 2 before my checks.

It is a one day at a time thing, one foot in front of the other.

As for the drinking, I have drinks here and there too. It's ok. A treat is always nice.

Remember...life is suppose to be fun. How can you have fun when all you eat is broccolli ,drink mineral water and then spend an hour everyday on a treadmill

Nicole112

Thanks Lexi for your post, ironically this is my babies name Can you share with me in your heart of hearts what you think caused yours...?

Interesting fact, you have a 3 yr old, I have a 2 yr old and it appears we were bot diagnosed when they were approx. 1... do you think our hormones were raging from pregnancy?!? See, why do I have to analyze!!!!! I need to take an ativan, this helps me sleep for the night, it's getting a bit easier as time goes by, I guess I had such an aggressive "grade I just tend to overthink!.. next they will say, stress is the cause!

lexislove

We call our daughter Lexi, it is a shorter version of her actuall name. My daughter was 23 month when I was diagnosed.

Yes my hormones were raging while I was pregnant..BUT, I think stress brough it on. 4 years prior to being diagnosed I went through a bad break up with my fiance at the time.and he basically dumped a whole bunch of finacial stress on me as well.I hated my job and my parents were moving 3 hours away...so the idea of moving back home untill I got sorted out flew out the door. My whole paychecks went towards rent, a $750.00 car payment a month,cell phone,gas for that car. I took food from family and friends. It was horrid! I never experienced stress like that in my life.

When I heard the words, its malignant, I knew why.

Nicole112

Thanks for sharing, I think stress can be an issue... hence the reason I hate to even allow my brain to "analyze" Truly I have a blessed life, and much like you there has been my share of stress... I've learned to try and simplify my life and keep connected to my inner core!.. and to stop sweating the small stuff, easier said than done sometimes.

On a side note, how is your hair looking these days? I am 9 months post chemo and mine is curly curly and CRAZY, I don't wear my wigs anymore but seriously, I feel like I had to let my vanity go out the window for a while. My pic is one with my wig cap...

kittycat

I thought wine had antioxidants!  LOL!  You have to live!!!!  There's no way to know what causes you to have cancer. 

HelenaJ

Nicole - there was a post here once when a lady said she knew women who were vegetarians, who didn't drink, who didn't smoke, were thin, exercised and they still had a recurrence.  I must admit I am in denial but I have a glass of wine (or 4) whenever I want to.  I must admit that isn't as much as I used to but I don't beat myself up about it any more - I love relaxing with my friends, my husband or just with me. 

Yeah Kittycat you do have to live and to live in a way which is a new way of normal is the way to go for me.

Nicole you look just beautiful in your cap and wig.

idaho

Nicole-  Just for your information:::::I have not had an alcoholic drink for 21 years- I had breast cancer this year......you do the math dear.      If anyone knew what causes this crappy stuff they would be rich- I think they just make good guesses- LIVE your life don't obsess over every little thing- easier said than done- but if you start to get the "crazies" (that's what I call them)-   I tell myself - I am NOT going to waste this time on worrying- I am going to LIVE.    Peace to you, Tami

lexislove

Nicole I love your photo!!

You couldn\t tell it was a wig!

I finished chemo February 2008, my hair is about 7 inches now and the curl is looseing. BUT...I bought hair extensions almost a year ago so my hair is about 19 inches long!

LibraGirl

Hi Nicole

Just wanted to let you know that I was one of those virtuous people pre-diagnosis - vegetarian, marathon runner, non-smoker, sunscreen-wearer, very occasional drinker  - and I still got bc.  I've been watching other women around me make radical changes in their diets and lifestyle, and I think this is great - there are so many other health benefits to be gotten by making these changes - but I am almost the opposite. I feel like being on top of my diet and exercise did not protect me, so I am not going to make any further changes, and I am trying not to worry about the occasional glass of wine or pint of beer - for me food and drink are essential pleasures of life!  And like Lexislove said, there are so many people who live hard and never get cancer, that diet really can't be the only explanation.  I tend to believe that my pre-menopausal ca was caused by a combination of hormones (bc pills), stres, and genetics.  I have made a lot of changes in my attitude and outlook on life.  I'm really working on not being a control freak and letting go of things that are not important or a waste of my precious time (and it is so much clearer post-diagnosis which things are really important).

Anyway - it is completely natural to ask the quesitons your're asking and to try to "be good" and want to do whatever you can to prevent recurrence, but let yourself enjoy the things that bring you pleasure in your life.  It is not selfish.  You will be a happier person and bettter mom/partner for it.

Hugs

Michele

lisa-e

My diet has always been pretty good, although not perfect.  When I was dx with bc I had approximately 4-8 alcoholic drinks per month.  Since my diagnosis, I think I have improved my diet and have cut my drinking by about 50%.  However, at this point, I refuse to worry too much about my diet or to stop drinking completely.  After all, I've lost my breasts and tamoxifen has flattened my libido.   It would be just too grim if I were super strict with my diet and cut out all alcohol.

In general, I think people waste too much time on guilt.  You do what you can do and if you don't meet your goals, try again.  But feeling guilty or worrying is non productive.  Go do something you enjoy instead.

Celtic_Spirit

Look, I've known two vegetarians who not only got breast cancer, but had recurrences. Linda McCartney, the high priestess of vegans, died of breast cancer. As for me, I'm the kind of patient that physicians give gold stars to for healthy living: low-fat, high-fiber diet; takes vitamins; exercises 5+ hours a week; 1-2 small alcoholic beverages per week; never smoked; don't take drugs (illegal or otherwise); low-stress individual. And I still got bc.

Here are some observations I made while hanging out in the oncology department: it wasn't filled with alcholics. It wasn't filled with obese people. It wasn't filled with smokers. There were people of all ages, races, and body types, including a lot of people who were naturally thin. 

Don't be hard on yourself. It's not your fault. If you want a cookie or a glass of chablis, have it.

Deb-from-Ohio

My diet is bad, I do have the occasional urge to get tipsy and I even still smoke..but ya know what? I didn't fight as hard as I did to live, to not have a life. No one knows what causes this and I refuse to hide in the closet and not eat/drink/do anything for fear of getting it back. I'm going to enjoy life the way I always have. Although I do plan on quitting smoking but that has nothing to do with the BC. I think God gave us life to enjoy and it would be a sin to hide out in fear of it coming back.

Hugs!

shiny

Hi Nicole, I was 38 on diagnosis, with two little kids. I had had a very streesful and exausting couple of years..stress. (must admit, I am a very glass is half full not half empty girl) However, had unavoidable stress and very little sleep for a good couple of years prior to cancer getting busy.

Life is for living, you are absolutely right you have a lovely family and a great hubby, and have everything to live for, your feelings are understandable, and you are thinking all those things because you so want to do good by your family and be there for them; So, for that same reason, live, enjoy, relish your life and thrill at every specious moment. Above all, be gentle with yourself.

My sister once said something she'd been told when she was stressing about her constant struggle to ballance her work/home life, and it stayed with her and with me.

GUILT IS OPTIONAL!

(OPT OUT!)

I always enjoy saying it to friends when they give themselves a beeting for just being human. And I occasionally have to remind myself too.

Pop that saying on your fridge, your miror and in your wallet, and cut yourself some slack. The oposite causes you stress, and that we DO KNOW is not good for you.

Hope am not too pushy, am such a mom..take it with the best intentions.

All my best!

Shiny

Mamita49

Lexislove,

 Do you really think, stress could be a cause of BC ?The last 2 years where very stressful. I was fighting emotionally a battle letting my daughter go. She was just 19 years. moved to another City to study, and started a very painful & stressful relationship with a much older man. It was very hard for me to see my daughter like that. Thank God, its all over, now at 21 years old she is doing great. 

But someone on the board said, stress can NEVER cause BC, unless you get sick due to weak immune system.

I like to know, if stress is a factor foe BC......

Any input ? 

nelia48

I'm the old lady of the group, so I have a lot of "guilt" about things --- way more than any of you "young 'uns" here!  I didn't eat right, overweight, lots of strress, love sweets, love bread, love butter, didn't exercise enough,  used the wrong deodorants, breathed in DDT bug spray as a kid, swam in polluted lakes, peed in the swimming pool, etc., etc., etc.  The list could go on and on.  I've done the same thing --- wondering if my whole lifestyle behind me caused this breast cancer.  But. . . . . my sisters are all the same as me, we did the same things, etc.  So why me and not them? 

It all boils down to. . . . we want a reason, a cause, something or someone to blame. . . even if it has to be ourselves.  At some level, somewhere on this journey, you just have to come to a place of acceptance.  Some have diabetes, some have heart problems, some have other very serious diseases.  And ALL ask the same questions we are asking here.  Trouble is, we can't take a pill and make it go away.  In some sort of way, we are all going through the stages of grief.  We are angry, we are guilty, we bargain with God, etc., etc.  But you will find a peace in acceptance.  And it is then you will rise up and fight for your life with a vengence!!!!!  So have a cookie, a pizza, or whatever.  and please know that it's ok!!!!!

reen

My sister is a heavy drinker and smoker.  I don't do either and I got the BC...... Twice!

misty123

It is not our fault that we have BC, if it was it would have been cured a long time ago, all the so called BAD things we do would have been singled  out and no one would have the disease. keep your head up, stay strong and positive for those little ones and remember, it's not your fault or mine.

lisa-e

Carol,  the two years and a half before I was diagnosed with breast cancer were extremely stressful for me.  I had a hip injury and was in a lot of pain.  I could barely walk.  I had a total hip replacement a month before my diagnosis.   I don't know if the stress I experienced had anything to do with my developing breast cancer, but I think it could have been one factor.  I do know that I had more colds etc  before my hip replacement than I normally do.

On the other hand, stress is a normal part of life.  Few of us have stress free lives and I suspect we would find them dull if we did.    I don't know if matters if I figure out exactly why I got bc or not; it is more important that I do what I reasonably can to prevent a recurrence.  I think taking tamoxifen and regular exercise are the two most important things I can do.    To bring my post back on topic, a better diet and less alcohol would probably be good things in terms of preventing a recurrence.  But I don't think I can achieve much more in terms of diet and alcohol and I refuse to spend much time worrying about it.

DomeGal

Hi all...new to this site unfortunately and only posted one response so far.  I too have wondered at "why".  I know that I drink too much, eat the wrong foods and have slacked on the exercise and have been under such unbelievable stress(son served in Iraq 2 tours, lost 2 jobs due to economy, and finances), but I always knew deep down that I would somehow end up with cancer due to my family history.  Both sides have breast cancer and even though my paternal grandmother never drank or smoked, she died of breast cancer when I was 4.  We also have skin, ovarian and colon cancer.  We are like the cancer "poster family"!  My mother and one of her sisters have been diagnosed with breast cancer, mother w/DCIS no nodes and my aunt with the same, but they took out some nodes.  I am having surgery next week and will join the rest of this group on the journey that nobody asks for, but will willingly participates in for the journey to help those coming after us.  I am having Bi-Lat even though only one breast is affected, but personally, I can't do this a few years down the road.  Best wishes to all...and try (as I am) to stay stress-free.

lexislove

Carol,

YES, I do feel stress/anxiety brought on my BC. Stress is proven to weaken the immune system, allowing illness to thrive. I was majorly stressed for about 2 years. Couldn't sleep, my work was affected to the point my office manager came up to me and asked if I needed some time off! Of course I declined, because I was so wrapped up in dept 1 day off work I could not afford.

I noticed my lump 6  months after my inlaws left too. They came to visit for 4 months and my mother in law drove me crazy (old school Eastern European) . She put me down, redid things that I did, told me how I should be looking after her son (my husband who is 38!)

I KNOW..it was stress. I mentioned before, when I heard those words, "its malignant" those horrible stressed years ran through my mind like a film.

auriga

When I was first diagnosed, I burnt the midnight oil researching BC on the internet. One of the articles I found stated that stress might be a factor. It said if you have had 3 or 4 major stressful events 7- 10 years before being diagnosed, you were at risk.

In my own situation, I certainly fit that bill. My only child, died unexpectedly 10 years ago, at the age of 16. A few years later, I had some more very stressful events.

I am convinced this has what caused my cancer. Perhaps stress does weaken your immune system.

vivre

Auriga-sorry to hear about the loss of your child. My heart goes out to you.

As for stress and bc, I think it is the deciding factor. When we are overstressed, our bodies just cannot function. We cannot get all of the stress out of our lives, but we can make a huge difference in how it affects us. As women, we tend to take care of everyone but ourselves. We need to take time everyday to put everyone else's needs aside, and take care of ourselves and destress. For me, I found long walks or bike rides to be the answer. Others may prefer a book or a bath, but take the time  and do not feel guilty. In fact, I can look at a lot of things that I think led to my bc, and I have tried to change as much as possible, but I do not feel any guilt that I caused my bc, because  I just chalk it up to experience. If we go back to the same old habits, whatever caused our cells to mutate before, will cause them to mutate again. We need to make changes that are more healthful and make it easier for our cells to act properly and not mutate into cancerous cells.

As for the alcohol. I do not touch it, except for a very occasional glass of high quaility wine. Though alcohol may make us feel relaxed, the effects on our cells are counterproductive. Alcohol affects every organ of the body, and most importantly taxes the liver. The liver needs to filter out all the toxins we are exposed to every day. If it has a lot of alcohol to filter too, it cannot do the job. There is a correlation between bc and alcohol use.

And as one of those who now drinks mineral water and eats veggies all day, I have to say, I do not feel as though I am not living life to the fullest, or sacrificing anything. The reason is I feel so incredible. I am 55 and have more energy than I did as a 25 year old. My skin and hair is softer, I have my flexibility back because of daily exercise, and I have no aches and pains. The walks keep me calm, and even though I still have a lot of family pressures, I do not let it get to me anymore. I offer my loved ones my support, but if they are not responsive I just let it go. I do not take any medications, including hormone blocking drugs and I no longer fear a recurrance. I truly believe that cancer has many causes. We need to eliminate as many as we can and live a cleaner life. Cancer is preventable. We may not have all the power to prevent it, but we can do a lot towards it.

As far as vegetarians getting bc. The link could be the fact the many vegetarians may unwittingly be consuming large amounts of soy, which is the most sprayed crop we have. Pesticides,besides being poison, are estrogenic and can create havoc with our cells.  Also, a lot of veggies are from GMO crops which have caused cancers in animals.  And I know  vegans who are very tired and sick all the time because they rely on sugars and carbs, which really mess with insulin levels. A balanced diet is the answer.

To your health, all!

simmonba

Nicole - I am an analyzer too - as I resarched everything I could find, I realised it was making me nuts, so I made a list of all the "risk factors" I had - see if it makes you laugh like it did me:

Started menstruating early (11 years old); had first child after 30; only breast-fed 2 kids for 6 months each time; lived with a smoker for 5 years; drinks 3 - 5 glasses wine a week; has been known to eat McDonald's; has a pet (seriously); doesn't like milk (seriously); likes steak rare; also likes hamburgers well-done; middle child in the family (I guess that's a stress-linked one!); stressful job; child of an alcoholic (more stress?); member of an atypical family (don't ask!); uses plastic dishes; eats non-organic dairy and veggies; likes whole-fat cheese; doesn't get enough vitamin D, E, or C.......I think we all have to deal with the WHY question, but I do think it's one of those things - we are all living in the world, we are all "at risk" in some way; and we can't let that stop us from living.  Hugs.

KEW

Once I found myself letting my brain go crazy, I did so many things right, and some "wrong" blah, blah, blah, my oldest son looked at me and said, "mom being alive gives you cancer."  I'm still doing all the right things and less of the wrong things--I still like brownies, but when my mind wanders to why, I think about what he said, and I can't find an argument against it.  We've all done the best we can, unless it is genetic, who knows why.  However, I do think stress plays a huge role, the 10 years prior where deeply difficult on every level, devastating relationship, single parent, no family to turn to, financial stress, laid off, went back to college, moved 7 times, I was in survival mode constantly, I pictured myself as one of those Halloween cats with all their fur standing up, topped off by a 5 hour a day commute 2 years before dx, I wanted the job because I thought it would move my boys and I forward and it has--I love it, but my son was a senior in high school and didn't want to move--I was determined to do it all and make everyone happy.  I put 45,000 miles on my car in 10 months, sat in the car for 5 hours a day and at my desk for 8-9, I think that pushed me over the stress edge and my hormones and immune system where in horrible shape.  I found my lump sitting on my deck thinking life had finally come together and felt like I was in a really good place...Although I worry about recurrence, I feel healthier and happier now than I was before. Live, Laugh, Love, not original, but good to remember.

Karen

http://rfcp.convio.net/site/TR?team_id=42052&fr_id=1110&pg=team

auriga

Vivre: Thank you. It'a a hard hand to be dealt, but you learn to go on.

Nicole112

All,

I have thoroughly enjoyed reading all these posts! I am just getting back from an 8 day vacation with family and I LIVED LIFE to the fullest! We were at a lake and just enjoyed each others company, We had campfires at night, horseback rides in the day... we ate hamburgers, hot dogs, watermelon, had an occasional glass of wine, hiked, biked... I CAN GO ON, it was the MOST enjoyable 8 days since my diagnosis! Today I participated in our local relay for life and it felt so RIGHT putting on my Survivor shirt. I walked with my 10 year old daughter and we just enjoyed each others company. I felt the energy in the air and it was captivating!

So, I thank you ladies so much, I am so grateful we have this website as an OUTLET as truly how can we expect "others" to totally "understand" what we have been through? Are there words to describe it?

I highly recomend you all take a small vacation with your loved ones, even a nice camping trip is wonderful. WE have a 5th wheel and we see the country.

I have read each and everyone of your posts, and I can relate to what everyone is saying. I am going to give myself a break on the "side of guilt". One thing I forgot to mention before, I truly have been lifting it up to God, crazy BUT it takes all the weight off my shoulders

Now, off the motherhood, I hear my  2 year old coughing in the next room, she has been sick since we have been home!?! Gotta keep me on my toes!

Good night everybody!

jezza

Nicole...I haven't changed my eating or drinking habits and I was dx in 1992. (no recurrence so far)

I am cooking a great meal right now...DH is getting me a gin and tonic and then we will enjoy a nice bottle of red wine...PLEASE don't feel guilty,,,enjoy your life.

jezza

Aliceann

Nicole - I have not been able to read all of the responses, but don't keep beating yourself up.  I eat very well and focus on vegetables, no fried food, fruits whenever possible.  No smoking and don't eat in restaurants where there is smoking.  I have reduced drinking alcohol, but I still drink wine moderately.  I was in Ireland in May and for two weeks, drank some great Irish beer.  I didn't worry about it and I came back home and drink wine. If alcohol caused cancer, the French women would be extinct as they start drinking wine at a young age.  The Germans drink beer at young ages as well. The environmental dangers we deal with are much more serious than having a glass of wine.  As a youngster, I was around pesticides on a grape farm, at a time when these pesticides were used copiously.  My mother, father, sister and brother have all passed away with pernicious forms of cancer.  Two of them (men) smoked and drank freely, and my mother and sister never smoked and drank rarely.  The only common thread is the grape farm with pesticides in the drinking water and on the vines where we all resided.  Yeah, I am going to have a glass or two of wine each day!  If you are anxious or upset, just do it on occasion.  Celebrate for special events.  Reward yourself for good behavior or finishing some phase of treatment.  I have no problem dealing with anxiety about such things.  Live large and live long!

Dx Oct/2002, IDC Mucinous, 5cm, Stage IV, Grade 3,  10 nodes left side, 14 nodes right side, 2 localized mets on reconstructed L breast & 1 distant METS to right Axilla; HER2+ 

Lindissima

Nicole,

I have felt what you are feeling and would like to offer a few words of encouragement and support.  All of the above posts contained great suggestions.  Here are a few of my own:

Wine:  Perhaps it's not the wine, but the massive amounts of pesticides used here in the US by large wine producers.  Try organic wine, or European wines where pesticide use is much less.  If it's more expensive, you'll drink less.  Moderation is key.

Exercise:  A well-respected oncologist spoke to our support group about walking.  She said walking just 30 minutes a day, 4  times a week could lower your risk of recurrence by almost 3%.  Though 3% may not sound like much, some women go through chemo for less.  And 30 minutes a day is very doable and will decrease stress levels to!

Sugar:  My nutritionist said keeping your insulin level from spiking is key. Before BC, I was addicted to sugar, but now only have high quality desserts as a special treat, and only after eating a well-balanced meal so my insulin level  doesn't rise as quickly.  I am trying to model myself on the fabled French, who enjoy only the best, but in moderation.

When I feel stressed out, I concentrate on small steps.  I am eating really healthfully now and feeling strong and energetic.  I try not to be hard on myself for slip ups. 

The cause of BC:  Although they don't know what the cause of BC is, (there are many different kinds of BC), they do know steps you can take to decrease risk. I read "In defense of of Food" by Micheal Pollard in which he talks about how agribusiness and food processors have transformed healthy food into food-like substances filled with corn syrup, fat, salt and chemicals.  This stuff is everywhere in our environment, 24/7.  I get angry about being manipulated, and it helps me to fight harder to stay away from this unnatural stuff.  Eiropeans eat very little of this stuff, and enjoy  wonderful meals, good wine and desserts, but in small quantities.

Best of luck to you.