Brazilian berry 'Acai" destroys cancer cells
Comments
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I just think it's incredibly rude and borderline juvenile for jeninmichigan to post about the miraculous effects of the ACAI BERRY--bolstering her claims with the "fact" that she knows of multiple studies that she's just too busy to type about--and then leave in a snit without providing further information. It's like a 3 year old hollering, "That's for me to know and you to find out!"
If ANYONE has links to "clinical studies" of this berry, I'd sure be interested in seeing them. FYI, I did a lot of research about herbs and supplements (and took many) before my dx. I currently take MELATONIN because, for me, it works great. I am not anti-alternative, but I damn well DO investigate EVERYTHING that I consider taking, alternative or not.
S'okay to laugh, fairy...I think it's ludicrous that someone would get their panties in a bunch because a poor, defenseless berry has been "ATTACKED".
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I have to say, non - attacks aside, this berry is in the news a lot. I get tons of spam on it, and would love to know what it is all about, but I do want some scientific studies, not hearsay. I have an appt. in a couple of weeks with a naturopathic doctor - I will post what I find out!
Susan
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Thank you, Susan. That would be wonderful.
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I have an appointment next Wednesday with a naturopathic doc, so I will get info also, maybe we can get some actual data on the poor berry!
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I'm only saying everyone want's to discuss scientific facts but no one wants to discuss the science behind conventional treatment. Talking about defensive! Why does everyone not hold "all" treatment up to the same magnify glass? Spending billions on research has not proven chemo or rads cure. Stating this is condescending and rude? Excuse me but as a stage iv patient that has been through tx for 3 1/2 years and have a 25% hope of making it to five years...I will dam well tell everyone CHEMO AND RADS DO NOT WORK! Ask any patients with a recurrence what their life line is now....maybe five years??? Just because billions spent on pharm do they work? What is their failure rate? Why do you not want to discuss this? Why do you not want to talk about the very toxic side effects for unproven treatments? It is horrifying to know that we are relying on a system that does not work except for surgery? Because it is to me. Most in this area notice are stage 1. Why do you continue to look for hope if your conventional tx was all you hope for? Please feel free to ask your doctor for continued support after tx on how to continue with preventive measures. Most of you feel he is the know all for your disease. Please follow on his advice. He will give you zero...oh let see maybe a low fat diet.
I have worked with research companies and you can have the best product out there and if you can't play the political & marketing games you will never have your product evaluated. Do your own research and follow your own heart on what you feel comfortable doing. Bottomline you are in control. Until we have more proof I will try everything I can to fight the beast!
Flalady
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Why don't you folks who want to know more just go to google or medworm or some other search engine and do some research? That will certainly be more objective and sincere than demanding that someone else provide all the links and other sources, which people can really get weary of doing. I do, especially because I do find that 9 times out of 10 the person ignores the sources and data and simply switches to a different line of attack.
There is considerable evidence on message boards that when people demand links and sources they are using that as simply a way to undermine what someone else has said without doing any work or presenting any counter arguments yourself. If someone is sincerely interested, I find they do some preliminary research themselves, even if it is only to google the subject, and then return with questions, specifically citing what they have independently discovered. If someone cannot be bothered to google something for a few minutes, then I'm not all convinced of the sincerity of their request. That may or may not be the case here, but I'm not seeing any real signs of respect or consideration along with these requests for documentation, so I'm not sure I would be into doing all that much work on your behalf, either.
Flalady regularly does a good deal of work to provide documentation, she has a great deal more patience than I do. She provides a great service here.
I know next to nothing about the acai berry, and I'm not going to defend someone who says she has considerable evidence of benefit for it and has not provided it. These fads come and go, and there is a huge marketing campaign going on now about the acai berry, which for me is always a bit of a turn-off.
I personally prefer to study the classic traditional medicine alternatives which have withstood the test of time, and have survived through generations, such as acupuncture and Chinese medicinal herbal formulas, some of which have been utilized by people for literally thousands of years. They aren't a fad, there is no marketing scheme pushing them, and poor people take them at great cost to themselves because they improve their quality of life. That piques my interest.
None of them cure cancer, but there is a growing body of evidence being gathered by NIH that some can slow cancer, and improve quality of life while having cancer. Some may improve the efficacy of conventional treatments. But then, I have been studying this for 35 years already, and have a considerable background as a paramedic and medical writer in conventional medicine as well. Most of conventional medicine has little scientific data that governs it's use, and much of it is placebo, untested, and unproven, so attacking alternative medicine for lacking evidence doesn't carry much weight with me. I know that is the way all medicine is practice, conventional or alternative. All I really care about is figuring out what really helps patients.
If you have a sincere interest in the acai berry then a really productive way to be of service to your fellow breast cancer survivors would be to do some research yourself, and bring that back here, instead of burdening your fellow survivors with the job. Teach me something, eh?
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Business as usual on the Alt forum...
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fairy I am with you...smiling more than laughing....but entertaining none the least. flalady...you are absolutely right about cures....we just do the best we can and hope and pray for the best....
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Badboob67
I'll quote you here
"I just think it's incredibly rude and borderline juvenile for jeninmichigan to post about the miraculous effects of the ACAI BERRY--bolstering her claims with the "fact" that she knows of multiple studies that she's just too busy to type about--and then leave in a snit without providing further information. It's like a 3 year old hollering, "That's for me to know and you to find out!"
This is funny. I didn't leave in a snit. I was unable to post more than 5 time in a 24 hour period so I couldn't reply. So I didn't leave in a snit. I did try to provide you some clinicals (not the first web sit I directed you to). And, if you would calm down and read my secondary post you would see I offered to send (fax) abstracts of studies that I do not have links to. So, I absolutely offered the studies. The Acai berry is not a promise of anything. However, the Riovida I referenced is much more than the Acai Berry. You need to open your mind a little further to Transfer Factor which has been around since 1949. It is just in the last 12 years that they have developed the means to take the molecules and put them into an oral. Transfer Factors has to be delivered via syringe previously and often. I too am Stage IV and I am a single mom with two young daughters. I, too, do not have the time to make a career out of finding alternative. BUT you can bet I am going to explore all the options I can to extend my life. I am not a vitamin store clerk or whatever unknowledgeable type of person you have made me out to be. I have gone to conferences on this product and I sit in on Monday and Thursday night conference calls by scientific researchers, naturalpaths, and medical doctors listening and taking notes on this product. I KNOW this product is helping me. I know the huge difference in the first four chemo cycles I had (twice with infections, horrible GI issues, fatigue) and the last two cycles and through rads with huge improvements in GI, bone pain, fatigue and I have not had even a common cold since I started taking this product. I currently take Herceptin, Tykerb, Aredia and Tamoxifen. I don't have bone pain, drippy nose, low blood counts, diarrhea, rashes, or hot flashes which are all the very common side effects of these drugs. My QOL is wonderful. I work full time, raised two young girls, live on a 10 acre farm with 35 animals which I maintain alone. This is not really a personal boast, but I am trying to stress that you don't have to be run down and feel like crap going through this awful disease. You just don't have to!!
I am going to leave you ladies and hope that you do research this on your own. If anyone wants me to send the studies and info, I will gladly do so. I would love to be able to have the last 8 months of time I have put into learning be able to benefit another bc sister. If you find me not to be credible, I can certainly hook you up with some very very knowledgeable people. Again, you all need to read the book by Dr. Duane Townsend, "A Maverick of Medicine Speaks to Women". Ask your oncolgoist if he/she knows Dr. Townsend. I assure you they will.
I am not leaving in a snit. However, part of my healing is to reduce stress and somehow this board has caused me stress that I don't want or need
Wishing you all the best in your health. Please always take the time to explore your options. If you blindly follow your MD, you are not doing yourself justice.
Jennifer
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Jeninmichigan - wow, two kids and all those animals to care for - you are amazing!
I have heard and seen so much about this berry - thanks for sharing what you know of it. I will post what my naturopath has to say on it for her 2 cents - although by then we all may be tired of hearing about the berry as I see her in two weeks.
I am happy that you are finding relief from side effects with it. That is what matters. We each have to take what works for us individually.
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Jeninmichigan - don't let the nasties get you stressed out, enjoy every precious moment of life!
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Flalady,
I don't think that the question on this thread is to hold all treatment up to a magnifying glass, we just want to know scientific info on the berry. I am also interested in doing some alt treatment. But as I researched my conv. treatment, I would like to research any alt. treatment.
HUGS TO ALL,
Trish
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JeninMichigan
I feel that since you have personally taken the Acai berry and found it to be woking for you would you be so kind as to share your experiences and also study results which you have.
I posted this post so that everyone who may have some experience with it or some study results or some other form of evidences could share to help others with the knowledge.
Please be calm and may all the blessing of amithaba buddha and also god be with all of you and help you through your suffering and also extinguish them.
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Most of conventional medicine has little scientific data that governs it's use, and much of it is placebo, untested, and unproven, so attacking alternative medicine for lacking evidence doesn't carry much weight with me.
Wow 07rescue, what a blind statement to make! I'm pretty sure the FDA would have something to say to you.
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"I personally prefer to study the classic traditional medicine alternatives which have withstood the test of time, and have survived through generations, such as acupuncture and Chinese medicinal herbal formulas, some of which have been utilized by people for literally thousands of years."
Yes, where their life expectancy is, what, about 50 years? 60? And it's that high only since they have adopted Western medicine increasingly over the last few decades.
"Most of conventional medicine has little scientific data that governs it's use, and much of it is placebo, untested, and unproven..."
Completely wrong. Any drug brought to market these days has to be established as safe and effective in clinical trials, evaluated by an expert panel, then cleared after all the data is scrutinized.
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Well of course the FDA would have something to say - and usually, unless it makes them money, their comments are negative.. The point of an alternative site is so that if someone has had the benefit of an unusual treatment that it be shared here so that other's who might have exhausted their own treatments without any benefits can at least look at the possibility of the POTENTIAL of something else helping their lives..
And what 07rescue said was something that even many doctors who find themselves within this bubble of cancer will say.. there really aren't many solutions within the conventional medical community and since FlaLady has been able to keep herself healthy and strong within the treatment area of alternative medicines I say more power to her! (And anyone who has found a way to survive within this hostile enviroment (alternative board).. LB13 usually attacks her BECAUSE she is equipped with stats, but that isn't the intent of this board. If someone wants complete stats there is a piece of this organtiona (bc.org) that has pointers to a great deal of the conventional treatments and research.. AND their are doctors on the board of bc.org who endorse some alternative/complimentary modalities.. There is nothing exact about medicine. I have not done the investigation on Acai because I am not that interested in it but if I found it mentioned here by someone I had come to respect and I was in a position where it could be helpful THEN I would do my own studies on it. The treatments in all areas of the "support boards" are all subject to the line "please do your own studies and determine if this is appropriate for you and your present treatments".. This is a place for ideas and suggestions from individuals have themselfs found the information helpful - the scientific information is in another place on these boards. That certainly doesn't discourage anyone from placing scientifc data here or suggesting where it can be found, only that it is not necessary for someone to post here to have absolute proof of their theory. And LJ13 if you want to live in a fools world where everything in medicine is proven go there and do that, but it is a fairy tale!
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The last 2 times I confronted Fla"Lady" about her stats it is because they were wrong. Exponentially wrong. One time, by a factor of 10, the other time, much worse (factor of 80).
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"confronted"! you don't "confront" LJ13 you attack and then see everyone else attacking - you can challenge or contront without the sarcastic tone and comments and NO ONE is suggesting you don't have the right to speak - just that you should really try a little more respect.. Try it you might actually get somewhere here!
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07:
I couldn't agree with you more about the studies. I do my own homework and get help from a few others that I've met on the board. I read tons and tons of studies, some I save, some I don't. I remember what they say but not sure I could access them easily so I hesitate to even post. I came to this web site because I don't trust the drs. I do my own research on everything, but I have to admit that reading all these personal attacks is raising my anxiety level so I doubt I will be posting at all. If someone mentions a study, I will certainly try to find it on my own. The nastiness here is pervasive and I don't need the stress either.
Peeps
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That berry is getting a lot of attention. Not a scientific study, but a consumer news article from today's New York Times
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I found this statement on line: http://jscms.jrn.columbia.edu/cns/2009-02-17/solash-acai
"In 2006, the Journal of Agricultural and Food Chemistry reported that acai extracts set off a self-destruct response in up to 86 percent of leukemia cells in a test tube. Researchers noted, however, that similar results have been recorded for grapes, guavas and mangoes, and that test-tube findings do not necessarily apply to the human body."
The acai berry might be worth further research, but cannot yet me heralded as a miracle cure.
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Hi Peeps
The doctors don't trust the other doctors, either, so you are in good company on that score, I assure you. Some people live in a world where they actually believe that doctors, the FDA, and other authority figures actually maintain ethical standards and place their stamp of approval on drugs and devices based on evidence, and the evidence procured by the drug and device companies is actually factual. As a medical writer I have been a whistleblower on several drugs where the drug companies and investigators eliminated data that was not conducive to their desired ends, and fabricated more positive results that served their purposes. The amount of fudged data out there is shocking. If you ask most doctors they will readily admit that most of medical practice is based on tradition, not evidence, and it varies greatly across the country and around the world. Providers are trained to do things "the way we do them here", with no evidence based reasons for any of it. Patients don't want to believe their doctor has no good reason for what he or she is doing, so it's easy for them to get away with it.
It's very easy to tell on these boards who actually works in health care and knows what is going on, and who is just a consumer.
That's why I am not nearly so bothered about the often paltry evidence behind most alternative care, because I know there is little or no evidence behind so much conventional medicine, either. Much of it is mere marketing and cashing in on public ignorance, but there is some real value out there as well. I see the greatest gift in alternative medicine being the exhortation to healthy lifestyle changes that the best practitioners promote, while insisting that something like a berry can help marginally, the heart of most alternative treatment is in the holistic care of the entire person, body, mind, and spirit. They don't pretend cure is found in a berry, but they are happy to help people stack the deck in their favor, if they have the willingness to try.
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No only do test-tube findings "not necessarily apply to the human body" ... they USUALLY don't when it comes to this type of research.
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Clinical trials are evidence. Chemo protocols and other adjuvant treatments are devised, revised, and approved only after conducting clinical trials, being reviewed by a panel of experts, then being cleared by FDA.
What there is no evidence of, OTOH, is that healthy lifestyle changes have any effect on cancer tumors. You cannot undo a lifetime of abusing your body with the bad choices many Westerners make. The damage is done. You might possibly lessen future risks, but right now, your body is manifesting bad choices from 10-20-30 years ago, and beyond.
Good lifestyles from birth often favor lowered cancer rates. From birth. Not from age 50.
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Clinical trials are only evidence if the data are reported accurately, which is rater seldom. Don't mean to scare you, but those are the facts. I would not say the medical industry is quite as bad as the finance industry, but we have our Bernie Madoffs.
Your opinion on healthy lifestyle and cancer is noted, and disagreed with by a majority of the public health professional community. Up to 30% of cancer occurrences and recurrences can be avoided by a healthier lifestyle, and the statistics on exercise alone are outstanding.
Also, many people die of other causes before cancer kills them, and healthy lifestyle can impact that endpoint. There is also the not so small factor of quality of life, which is not a result that is tracked - the investigators only track recurrence rate and mortality. That is where it is important to have people weigh in on how alternative measures affect them and their well being, because medical science isn't bothering with that. Like the boards where patients report drug side effects, there is value to hearing personal accounts that often give lie to drug company reports and physician understanding.
Of course, if you create a hostile, negative atmosphere on this alternatives board by attacking people most will avoid posting here, so we do not get the benefit of those personal reports. Quite a disservice you are doing, wouldn't you say?
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Facts are data that are established as true. If it were factual that clinical trial data is seldom reported accurately, there would be indictments and recalled approvals. Show me the "facts." Otherwise, it's just, you know, your opinion.
The 30% figure is bogus. It's an opinion, a guess, recently released by some irrelevant world health group. Some cases of cancer can be eliminated by improving lifestyles, but since the causes of most non lung cancers aren't actually KNOWN, then preventing them is problematic. If you choose to believe that using EVOO and walking on your treadmill is going to prevent recurrence, well, good luck with that.
Who has been attacked and by whom? Who threw the first punch? Make sure you know what you're talking about, before you make accusations.
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I read the article and this research was about antioxidants from Acai.
Please note it said that applesauce had the same effect, and applesauce is a lot cheaper.
It also was not used in fighting cancer, only antioxidants absorbed by the body were measured. However antioxidants are good.
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The article also states that they only used 12 people to see if the antioxidant was absorbed. It also states that more scientific research is needed.
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Get this right on front...what do drug trial's approval mean to the public. A drug can be approved with showing only 10% of the population will respond positively to it! What happens to the other 90% of us? Chemo needs to only show that it can stabilize your disease for two months without progression to be approved WOW A WHOLE TWO MONTHS! Drugs are only tested on less than .00001% of the population before being released. How does any one put so much faith in drug trial? They will continue to give patients chemo even after they used only the "known" chemo that your disease will respond too. As proven with anyone who has done more than one chemo. Patients are consider chemo resistant after three years on treatment. We all continue to get chemo after this time fram. Drugs are released to the public without long term side effect being watched. Because only time will tell. The toxic risk factor is never addressed for chemo patients. Patients have learn to expect to feel like shit. There is NO scientific proof that you have to destroy the body to kill cancer. We the patients just bought that line out of fear of our disease. Conventional med thought is pound the patient with toxic drugs fast. Alternative is a slow progression to battle the disease. Patients want drive through cancer treatment is why we have the medical industries make billion of us.
Everyone wants proof and we are all happy about any industries research. Bottomline there so many variations for each person life style and other issue to have proof any drug will work the same for us as the next. That why you must know your own body and do your own research. Everyone please read on about specific trails and see for yourself how little shows proof that drugs ever work any lenght of time without side effects and building resistance. If drug trials were the answer to all of America's needs we should have NO disease or health issue.
Flalady
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