Vitamin C

Member_of_the_Club · July 2007

I read in the transcript of the last ask the expert that vitamin C can actually fuel some forms of breast cancer? Wha???? I have a habit of sucking on vitamin C lozenges through the day. I figured it was a harmless habit at worst and maybe helpful at best and now I am quite concerned.

Does anyone know anything about this? I consulted Dr. Google and found nothing. Any info or links would be appreciated. Thanks.

kats · July 2007

MOTC,
I found this article when I was looking for info on Tamoxifen possibly raising triglycerides levels. It's an article from 2001 so I'm not sure if the info is still considered valid but I thought I'd pass it along as there is some info in it about Vitamin C and breast cancer.

http://www.vitaminherbuniversity.com/Newsletter/vol_5_num_4.pdf

nosurrender · July 2007

MOTC, I used to take the vitamin C in edible form- tablets, lozenges, etc. until my friend who is a dentist told me to stop it immediately. She said I was eating away the enamel on my teeth. Told me to switch to pills.

I haven't heard anything about it causing cancer- but that is just this week- wasn't it last year they were giving vitamin C as a type of chemo???

I can't keep up.

Member_of_the_Club · July 2007

The link isn't working for me.

kats · July 2007

MOTC,
I just went to the sites home page and it said:

"We apologize for any inconvenience but this site is currently undergoing maintenance.

Please visit us again."

The site was up and running this morning, I checked it before I posted it this morning to make sure it was still an active site, maybe try again later.

Rosemary44 · July 2007

Linus Pauling is spinning in his grave right now. I can't even imagine such a thing at it causing cancer or promoting its growth. They do use it in IV form as a chemo.

saluki · July 2007

This is from the transcript.

"Dr. Deng: Vitamin C was used initially for cancer prevention. Several large-scale clinical trials have tested the potential in cancer prevention. Unfortunately, none of those trials showed a benefit. There are people who did laboratory research showing certain cancer cells appeared to require Vitamin C to thrive. Hence the caution that Vitamin C may not be good for cancer patients. My opinion is that a moderate amount of Vitamin C is helpful, but I do not recommend taking excessive amounts of Vitamin C. By "excessive," I mean more than 2 grams per day. At this point, we do not know for sure whether Vitamin C would help or hurt cancer patients, so a moderate amount of Vitamin C intake appears to be the safest way at this point."
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Not that it spur them but they can't exist without it. I'm sure thats true for other substances as well that we probably take all the time.

Here is an update from Dr. Weil that makes sense. Moderation seems to be the key.

An Antioxidant Update?
You used to recommend taking 1,000-2,000 mg of vitamin C, three times a day. Now it's 250 mg twice a day. Why?
A
Answer (Published 10/9/2006)
It is true that I used to recommend taking 2,000 to 6,000 mg of vitamin C a day divided into three doses. I changed this in 1999, after examining two important studies showing that significantly lower levels of vitamin C more than saturate the body's tissues, and thus are sufficient protection against cancer, heart disease and other chronic illnesses. I now recommend only 200 to 500 mg divided into two doses.

A review of clinical trials published in the April 21, 1999 issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association concluded that 200 mg of vitamin C a day is the maximum human cells can absorb, making anything above that level a waste. The second study came from the Linus Pauling Institute and was published in the June 1999 issue of the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition. It identified a similar dose, 120 to 200 mg, as the optimal amount for reducing the risk of cardiovascular disease, cancer, cataracts and other chronic conditions.

Sierra · July 2007

I take about ..
600 x 3 a day

Just got all my vitamins
from the Naturopath

Yes.. Linus Pauling
must be rolling over indeed

Rosemary44 · July 2007

When you think about it, some vitamins can enhance tumor growth. It could be probable that vitamin c will do the same once a tumor is established. Tumors need nourishment like other cells. This might give us reason not to take vitamins if we have an active tumor, unless we know which ones to take.

It's hard to believe that something that is used as a chemo can also enhance the growth of tumors. Can they have it both ways?

kats · July 2007

MOTC-The site is up now, here's the link again:

http://www.vitaminherbuniversity.com/Newsletter/vol_5_num_4.pdf

Anonymous · July 2007

I didn't take vitamin C and my cancer grew to a whopping 4.5 cm without any help from it. I had a mammo in March and found the large tumor in December (when I found it). Yes, I guess I'm a bit bitter about that.

I'm taking 1500 mg of Vitamin C.
Shirley

JoanofArdmore · July 2007

QUOTE:"I'm taking 1500 mg of Vitamin C. "
Shirley, me too.Three 500 mg every day.
I've taken them forever and my damned cancer WAS only .8 cm...

Even though Dr Weil is my guru, each time I try to cut down on vitamin C, I catch cold, my sinus gets inflamed, etc etc.Seems I'm in it for the long run.
Maybe those BEGINNING supplimentation can take 600mg...

saluki · July 2007

Quote:

QUOTE:"I'm taking 1500 mg of Vitamin C. "
Shirley, me too.Three 500 mg every day.
I've taken them forever and my damned cancer WAS only .8 cm...

Even though Dr Weil is my guru, each time I try to cut down on vitamin C, I catch cold, my sinus gets inflamed, etc etc.Seems I'm in it for the long run.
Maybe those BEGINNING supplimentation can take 600mg...

Well even if you are just peeing out the excess you and Shirley must be going a long way to resolve
any constipation problems. LOL

By the way there is a theory that if you get a nasty fracture---You can prevent RSD from occurring with
Vitamin C supplementation---Theory is Vitamin C is an antioxidant and it may help prevent RSD by speeding up nerve repair. Don't know how much the dosage but I wish I had known.---But then I didn't know the disease existed, never mind it was a risk with fractures.

Susie

Anonymous · July 2007

Joan, I too take 500 mg three X a day.

I believe the transcript said that if one takes no more than 2000 mg it would be safe. However, don't anyone trust my memory.
Shirley

Anonymous · July 2007

Quote:

Well even if you are just peeing out the excess you and Shirley must be going a long way to resolve
any constipation problems. LOL

Shoot, I waste more money on other things so, peeing out what I don't need is only a couple of pennies a day. LOL
Shirley

Rosemary44 · July 2007

Here's a rebuttal about those lab studies that Dr. Deng mentioned:

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/f-w01/cancer.html

Member_of_the_Club · July 2007

Thanks Rosemary. Everything this guy says makes sense, though i am a little put off that he is associated with the Linus Pauling Institute (if anyone was biased in favor of Vitamin C. . .) and Dr. Deng is with Sloan-Kettering, aka Cancer Mecca.

I think I will just try to ignore the whole controversy. it does seem that teh studies of actual people show a benefit.

saluki · July 2007

Thanks for the info Rosemary,
Curious that I'm getting two different articles---one in the e-mail notification and the one listed on the thread.

One thing does look like a concern if you are on a statin
and bears watching. Could the Vitamin E or beta carotene
responsible?
---------------------------------------------------------
Antioxidant Supplements and HMG-CoA Reductase Inhibitors (Statins)

A 3-year randomized controlled trial in 160 patients with documented coronary heart disease (CHD) and low HDL levels found that a combination of simvastatin (Zocor) and niacin increased HDL2 levels, inhibited the progression of coronary artery stenosis (narrowing), and decreased the frequency of cardiovascular events, such as myocardial infarction (heart attack) and stroke (50). Surprisingly, when an antioxidant combination (1,000 mg vitamin C, 800 IU alpha-tocopherol, 100 mcg selenium, and 25 mg beta-carotene daily) was taken with the simvastatin-niacin combination, the protective effects were diminished. Since the antioxidants were taken together in this trial, the individual contribution of vitamin C cannot be determined. In contrast, a much larger randomized controlled trial of simvastatin and an antioxidant combination (600 mg vitamin E, 250 mg vitamin C, and 20 mg beta-carotene daily) in more than 20,000 men and women with coronary artery disease or diabetes found that the antioxidant combination did not diminish the cardioprotective effects of simvastatin therapy over a 5-year period (51). These contradictory findings indicate that further research is needed on potential interactions between antioxidant supplements and cholesterol-lowering agents, such as HMG-CoA reductase inhibitors (statins).

Rosemary44 · July 2007

I thought about that, an LPI Dr. giving the rebuttal could be considered a bit biased, but who else gives a hoot about vitamin C? Someone has to keep those researchers on their marks. Too many shenanigans were going on with research back then.

Rosemary44 · July 2007

Saluki,

It could have been any of those vitamins. That's a nutty study, combining all those vitamins together. I think I'll go look up C and statins alone and see what I find.

Vitamin C

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