Why do they have to remove my whole breast?

You have not run out of time. You have four doctors and none of them will listen to you?!? That's a bad sign! You need another opinion with a doctor who will address your concerns about your bleeding issues.

Sounds like it's time to get a second opinion with a breast surgeon not affiliated with your current medical facility. Please make sure it's a breast surgeon and preferably one at an NCI designated cancer center if you can arrange it. You are not out of time and should not have surgery until you have answers to all your questions, are satisfied with the answers, and comfortable with the recommended surgery whatever that might be.

We can't tell you what you should do and why you should do it, but it is YOUR body and the doctors are supposed to be working FOR and WITH you. You need to find a different team if yours are not.

Good Grief! I would be worried about the whole pack of them too. I would be worried about their recommendations anyway, but especially with your blood disorder thrown in. Third opinion?? Are there any breast centers/cancer centers or teaching hospitals anywhere near where you live? Does your clinic have a tumor board where your case could be presented?

I know, for sure, that a 2 cm tumor does NOT require a mastectomy, BUT, I don't know anything about DCIS. It would be a good idea to go over to the DCIS Board & people there will be able to help answer questions about that.

I am going to copy over a post by Beesie, one of our resident experts, about the mastectomy/lumpectomy choice (if you end up having a choice). It may be helpful for you in addressing your doctors. She talks about some of the DCIS issues in it:

Sometime ago I created a list of considerations for those making the lumpectomy vs mastectomy vs. bilateral mastectomy decision. I've reposted this many times now, and I've added input from many other women. Going through this list might help you come to terms with how you will deal with either of these options and what the best decision is for you:

• Do you want to avoid radiation? If your DCIS isn't near the chest wall, then it may be possible to avoid radiation if you have a mastectomy. This is a big selling point for many women who choose to have mastectomies. However you should be aware that there is no guarantee that radiation may not be necessary even if you have a mastectomy, if some DCIS is found near the chest wall. Radiation might also be recommended if it turns out that you have a large area of invasive cancer in addition to the DCIS and/or if it turns out that you are node positive (which is only possible if you have invasive cancer).

• Do you want to avoid Tamoxifen? For those who are ER positive who have DCIS, this may be possible if you have a mastectomy and particularly if you have a bilateral mastectomy. Tamoxifen provides 3 benefits: 1) It reduces the risk of local recurrence; 2) it reduces the risk of the development of a new breast cancer in either breast; and 3) it reduces the risk of a distant recurrence. For most women, a mastectomy will reduce the first risk to a low enough level that the benefit from Tamox will be minimal. For most women, a bilateral mastectomy will reduce the second risk to a low enough level that the benefit from Tamox will be minimal. The third benefit, protection against a distant recurrence (i.e. mets), isn't a factor for women who have DCIS, since by definition DCIS cannot move beyond the breast. However for those who have invasive cancer, this is a crucial benefit and is not affected at all by the type of surgery. So if you have an invasive tumor that is ER+, usually Tamoxifen (or an AI) will be recommended whether you have a lumpectomy, mastectomy or a BMX. However if you have DCIS (and therefore face virtually no risk of mets) or a very small non-aggressive invasive tumor (and therefore face only a very small risk of mets), it may be possible to pass on Tamox with little change in your long-term prognosis.

• Do you want to avoid having node removal? For those with any amount of invasive cancer, an SNB is necessary. But because DCIS cannot travel to the nodes, an SNB is not required for those who have DCIS.For DCIS women who have a lumpectomy, if some invasive cancer should be found in the lumpectomy pathology (as happens in about 20% of cases), an SNB can be scheduled later as a separate surgery. However, an SNB is difficult to do after the breast is removed, so for women who have DCIS who are having a MX, usually an SNB will be done during the MX surgery just in case some invasive cancer is found. Therefore the requirement to do an SNB with a MX is a significant difference vs. lumpectomy for those with pure DCIS. Any node removal presents the risk of lymphedema; after an SNB, the risk is estimated to be in the range of 5% to 10%. Once nodes are removed, lymphedema can develop at any time (even years later) and once it develops, it remains for life (although it often can be managed). (Note that sentinel node mapping is a new procedure, developed by Pink Lotus, that may allow DCIS women having a MX to avoid an unnecessary SNB, but this method is new and not yet widely used.)

• Does the length of the surgery and the length of the recovery period matter to you? For most women, a lumpectomy is a relatively easy surgery and recovery. After a lumpectomy, radiation usually is given for 6 weeks. A mastectomy is a longer, more complex surgery and the recovery period is longer. How do you feel about going through a longer surgery and a longer, more restricted recovery period?

• If you have a lumpectomy, how will you deal with the side effects from Rads? For most patients the side effects of rads are not as difficult as they expected, but most women do experience some side effects. You should be prepared for some temporary discomfort, fatigue and skin irritation, particularly towards the end of your rads cycle. Most side effects go away a few weeks after treatment ends but if you have other health problems, particularly heart or lung problems, you may be at risk for more serious side effects. This can be an important consideration and should be discussed with your doctor.

• If you have a mastectomy, do you plan to have reconstruction? If so, be aware that reconstruction, even "immediate" reconstruction, is usually a long process - many months - and most often requires more than one surgery. Some women have little discomfort during the reconstruction process but other women find the process to be very difficult - there is no way to know until you are going through it. Are you prepared for this?

• If you have a MX or BMX, how will you deal with possible complications with reconstruction? Some lucky women breeze through reconstruction but unfortunately, many have complications. These may be short-term and/or fixable or they may be long-term and difficult to fix. Common problems include ripples and indentations and unevenness. You may have lingering side effects (muscle pain, spasms, itching, etc.) on one side or both. If you don't end up with symmetry (symmetry is not a sure thing by any means, even if you have a bilateral mastectomy with reconstruction done on both sides at the same time), will you regret the decision to remove your breasts or your healthy breast? Are you prepared for the possibility of revision surgery?

• If you have MX or BMX, how you do feel about your body image and how will this be affected by a mastectomy? A reconstructed breast is not the same as a real breast. Some women love their reconstructed breasts while some women hate them. Most probably fall in-between. Reconstructed breasts usually looks fine in clothing but may not appear natural when naked. They may not feel natural or move naturally, particularly if you have implant reconstruction. If you do choose to have a mastectomy, one option that will help you get a more natural appearance is a nipple sparing mastectomy (NSM). Not all breast surgeons are trained to do NSMs so your surgeon might not present this option to you. Ask your surgeon about it if you are interested and if he/she doesn't do nipple sparing mastectomies, it may be worth the effort to find a surgeon who does do NSMs in order to see if this option is available for you (your DCIS can't be right up near the nipple).

• If you have a MX or BMX, how do you feel about losing the natural feeling in your breast(s) and nipple(s)?Are your nipples important to you sexually? A mastectomy will change your body for the rest of your life and you have to be prepared for that. Keep in mind as well that even if you have a nipple sparing mastectomy, except in rare cases (and except with a new untested reconstruction procedure) the most feeling that can be retained in your nipples is about 20% - the nerves that affect 80% of nipple sensation are by necessity cut during the surgery and cannot be reconnected. Any breast/nipple feeling you regain will be surface feeling only (or phantom sensations, which are actually quite common and feel very real); there will be no feeling inside your breast, instead your breast will feel numb. For some, loss of breast/nipple sensation is a small price to pay; for others, it has a huge impact on their lives.

• If you have a MX or BMX, how will you deal emotionally with the loss of your breast(s)? Some women are glad that their breast(s) is gone because it was the source of the cancer, but others become angry that cancer forced them to lose their breast(s). How do you think you will feel? Don't just consider how you feel now, as you are facing the breast cancer diagnosis, but try to think about how you will feel in a year and in a few years, once this diagnosis, and the fear, is well behind you. Keep in mind as well that most women are pleased with their decision to have a mastectomy or bilateral when it's first done - they are relieved that the cancer is gone and the surgery is over and in most cases it wasn't nearly as bad as they feared. For women who are affected by the loss, the real impact usually doesn't hit until many months or even years later. That's why trying to think ahead to a time when this diagnosis is long behind you is important.

• If you have a MX or BMX, will removal of your breast(s) help you move on from having had cancer or will it hamper your ability to move on? Will you feel that the cancer is gone because your breast(s) is gone? Or will the loss of your breast(s) be a constant reminder that you had breast cancer?

• If you have a lumpectomy, how will you deal emotionally with your 6 month or annual mammos and/or MRIs? For the first year or two after diagnosis, most women get very stressed when they have to go for their screenings. The good news is that usually this fear fades over time. However some women choose to have a BMX in order to avoid the anxiety of these checks.

• Do you know what your doctors estimate your recurrence risk will be if you have a lumpectomy and radiation? Is this risk level one that you can live with or one that scares you? Will you live in constant fear or will you be satisfied that you've reduced your risk sufficiently and not worry about it except when you have your 6 month or annual screenings? If you will always worry, then having a mastectomy might be a better option for you; many women get peace of mind by having a mastectomy. Be aware however that while a mastectomy will likely significantly reduce your local (in the breast area) recurrence risk, a recurrence or the development of a new BC is still possible after a mastectomy. Lots to consider.

• Do you know your risk to get BC in your other (the non-cancer) breast? Is this a risk level that scares you? Or is this a risk level that you can live with? Keep in mind that DCIS cannot recur in the contralateral breast so your current diagnosis doesn't impact your other breast. However, anyone who's been diagnosed with BC one time is at higher risk to be diagnosed again and this may be compounded if you have other risk factors. Find out your risk level from your oncologist. When you talk to him or her, determine if BRCA genetic testing might be appropriate for you based on your family history of cancer and/or your age and/or your ethnicity (those of Ashkenazi Jewish descent are at higher risk). Those who are BRCA positive are very high risk to get BC and for many women, a positive BRCA test result is a compelling reason to have a bilateral mastectomy. On the other hand, for many women a negative BRCA test result helps with the decision to have a lumpectomy or single mastectomy rather than a bilateral. Talk to your oncologist. Don't assume that you know what your risk is; you may be surprised to find that it's much higher than you think, or much lower than you think (my risk was much less than I would ever have thought).

• How will you feel if you have a lumpectomy or single MX and at some point in the future (maybe in 2 years or maybe in 30 years) you get BC again, either a recurrence in the same breast or a new BC in either breast?Will you regret your decision and wish that you'd had a bilateral mastectomy? Or will you be grateful for the extra time that you had with your breasts, knowing that you made the best decision at the time with the information that you had?

• How will you feel if you have a bilateral mastectomy and no cancer or high risk conditions are found in the other breast? Will you question (either immediately or years in the future) why you made the decision to have the bilateral? Or will you be satisfied that you made the best decision with the information you had?

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I hope that this list is helpful. The thing to remember is that everyone's experience with surgery is different, everyone's pro vs. con list is different and everyone's emotions are different. Additionally, there is so much in this situation that you can't control..... how you feel about your breasts after reconstruction..... whether you have pain from your mastectomy or reconstruction or not... whether the fears you have now, just after you've been diagnosed, will still be as strong in 6 months or 2 years..., etc.. So don't make your decision based on what someone else did or the experience that someone else had or how someone else felt. Make the decision based on knowing yourself. Do what's best for you. Good luck with the decision!

Definitely get a third opinion. You need to hear this from a doc who will listen to you and give you the time you need.

EbonyEyes Nobody does radical mastectectomies anymore. Doesn't matter what the situation or stage is! Get yourself to the closest university based teaching hospital ASAP! I can help you find one in your area if you would like. Private message me and we can discuss but don't let anyone do a radical mastectomy on you!!!

Ask for a copy of your biopsy, if you had one.

As food for thought, my stereotactic biopsy showed DCIS. I had a modified radical mastectomy in the BC breast and preventive total mastectomy in the left. Look at my diagnosis. After the mastectomy, yes, there was DCIS, and some LCIS, but mostly there was a multitude of small (as in 1 mm or less) IDC, ILC and ICC tumors in a "sea" of ILC that no mammogram, MRI or biopsy had detected, and a 3 mm tumor in the sentinel node. What do you think would have happened and where do you think I'd be now if I would have walked away from having a mastectomy?

I know, this is probably rare. And it's a tough decision you're facing. Make sure you think well about it. A life is more precious than a breast.

EbonyEyes - The problem really is the combination of both the IDC and 3 areas of DCIS. Since you've already shown to have invasive cancer, they are all going to be less likely at any cancer center to wait and see if those areas of DCIS are going to turn or not. I am guessing that those areas of DCIS may be so large that it is impractical to do anything but a full mastectomy. That is the situation that I was in. I had 2 small areas of IDC, but the DCIS areas were so large that a lumpectomy was not an option; I"m guessing that is why they are saying it is the only option. I had multiple opinions, but no one would do anything but a mastectomy for me. They showed me exactly why in placement, etc., and it turned out good because there was even more DCIS there than they knew when they actually did the mastectomy.

tomboy,

This thread is a bit older, but I agree with you completely. I think some folks might be confused, because as you said, no one does a radical mx anymore (I suppose there could be some rare extenuating circumstances, but don't know of any personally) and has not for quite some time.

Enerva, I doubt that radical mastectomies are done in Canada, with any regularity. As tomboy mentioned, a radical scraped away every bit of muscle and underlying tissue they could find as well as nodes. If Halsted could have, he probably would have amputated the arm on the effected side of the body! He felt that the more you removed, the better. Radicals have gone the way of the model T.

Edited to add: It's been about 40 years since the radical mx fell out of favor. There was also a short period of time when some surgeons took iteven further than Halsted and removed ribs. Yikes! I'm glad we've moved beyond that.

Hi 39andhip!

I was just curious if your hip pain was any way related with your BC?

SpecialK, Thank you! I am new to this site and am still figuring it out! Where is the section with all the new posts