Screening, does it catch cancer early

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  • runor
    runor Member Posts: 1,798
    edited May 2017

    MTWoman:

    Choking on a chicken bone (snicker) the way I go at a plate of chicken wings, this is a very real possibility!

    What I hope women realize is that whatever they decide, there is no right or wrong decision, this is so VERY personal, but the decision should NOT be made at that moment when you hear the bad news. Very few of us are at our best in those circumstances. Very many of us cannot think clearly right then. I appreciate the patient advice of my surgeon to think this over for a while, before making any decisions. Get all the facts, weigh them as they apply to your situation, and even then many women feel more comfortable removing their breasts to never have to worry about this again. I GET THAT! But even that decision should be made with clear headed thought and consideration and not 10 minutes after you receive a cancer diagnosis.

    Surgeon did ask me though to please make my decision known BEFORE surgery because as they wheel me into the OR and I suddenly announce that I've changed my mind and want something different, apparently all hell breaks loose and nurses become very upset. So in the interest of NOT freaking out the medical staff, please make all decisions well known in advance. I considered announcing that I had decided to have my leg amputated instead, just to see what would happen.

    Loopy

  • fredntan
    fredntan Member Posts: 1,821
    edited May 2017

    the radiologist that reads your mammo is so important.

    I was young...I didnt know..If I had picked up my mammogram reports....I would have gotten a second opinion.

    mammos are difficult to read. my mammo report I later found out had this ??area. It went on for 2 mammos. I know the last radiologist that read my mammo, that later did my breast biopsy was later fired. I was screwed.

    so in hindsight I would just go to big centers that the radiologist only reads mammos. and gives same day results.

    A needle biopsy is no big deal...sure you get scared for 4 days....I have been through hell. If only he had put a needle in it. I saw a lawyer. These cases are difficult to win. He acknowledged I had been screwed by one of the radiologists in the very group that I worked with. I did file complaint with medical board. and I sent a letter to be forwarded to him when it had metastisized.

  • Needinfo
    Needinfo Member Posts: 9
    edited May 2017

    Can anyone explain what kind of complications there are from surgery?  My doctor was so vague about the whole thing that he never touched on any complications?  I was just recently genetically tested for PALB2 and am positive.  Mammogram came back normal.  I don't know what to think anymore, I have thought and thought for the last 3 weeks and just feel like I could be a walking time bomb too.  I have a very extensive family history, father passed at 62 of prostrate, mother, breast cancer at age 70 (she died from an aortic aneurysm) at 73.  My sister has had ovarian cancer twice and now at 63 is dealing with breast cancer and lymphoma.  I run a small carry-out restaurant and have the added issue of nobody to keep the business going while I might be laid up.  No retirement so I cannot quit and not old enough (55) for social security.  Not to mention, my insurance is sky high. I am still trying to pay for medical bills associated with two years of stress hives.  I have extreme depression problems, especially since the death of my husband five years ago due to renal cell carcinoma.  I really can't afford to speak to someone about the depression especially when thinking about future treatments.  I am estranged from what family I have left and so thankful to my sister for calling me regarding this but I just don't know who to talk to, never had kids so that isn't an option either.

  • JRad
    JRad Member Posts: 14
    edited May 2017

    runor

    Thank you for your very honest and beautifully written post. I'm sorry that you are facing cancer. I'm sorry that you had to go through all of those emotions! BUT i'm glad you had a surgeon who helped you to come to the decision that is best for YOU. And, you are right, there are no guarantees. I also agree that a mastectomy is such a huge decision. I am still very confused about my "real risk" for cancer. I was told I have a 38% chance but when I dug into that I feel from my research that that number is just wrong. I have met with other doctors who have agreed with me. I may still be high risk but not nearly to that extent. I, like you had the initial reaction to cut them off...I wanted them gone. But, then I took some time to digest it and really think about what it meant and I have backed off of that decision, at least for now. I am currently working on a third opinion and will go from there.

    Again, thank you for your post!!!!!!!

    My mom passed away five years ago due to a very aggressive and terminal brain cancer. A cancer that by the way is in no way like breast cancer. While she was going through treatment I gave her this quote...and I love it!! I think this quote represents a lot of things in life. Hang in there runor....you've got this.

    "I have heard there are troubles of more than one kind. Some come from ahead and some come from behind. But I've bought a big bat. I'm all ready you see. Now my troubles are going to have troubles with me!"

    -Dr. Seuss

  • Bingle
    Bingle Member Posts: 3
    edited June 2017

    I did annual mammograms and MRIs for 7 years which lead to 4 biopsies. The last one found 7mm DCIS. At that point I opted for bimx which just occurred recently. If you go the screening route just be prepared for call backs and additional tests since MRIs have high rate of false positives. Also try to find a good high risk group and MRI facility with radiologists that are experienced in reading breast MRIs.

  • Mucki1991
    Mucki1991 Member Posts: 294
    edited June 2017

    mamo picked up my 2+ cm tumor that was a palpable but it missed 2 others 1.6 and 1.8 as did US. I pushed for an MRI and that's what caught mine. Just be your own champion and if you have dense breast push for better screenings.

    Best wishes for you

  • dtad
    dtad Member Posts: 2,323
    edited June 2017

    Just want to say that MRIs are the best screening tool for dense breasts. However it is true that there are false positives which may lead to biopsies. Good luck to all...

  • Jbauer_78
    Jbauer_78 Member Posts: 8
    edited June 2017

    Rubyred3

    I am BRCA2 positive, I found out after I had genetic testing (at 25) due to my mother being diagnosed with stage 3B inflammatory Breast cancer. She is 1 of 5 sister all of whom have had some bought with the disease (pre menopause). My Grandmother (moms mom) died from breast cancer as did my great aunt her sister. I have two cousins who have been diagnosed all before 40 & I at 38 have now found that I have Ductle carcinoma in the Situ. They found this at stage zero, no lump only micro calcifications that where not on my last mamo. I have been having mamos/ultra sounds & MRI done since i was 25 every 6 months to a year. I do believe early detection is possible if you are VERY diligent & I believe it is why I/they caught mine so early. If i had not done the geneitic testing I would not have been having the mamos or have been so diligent, it is a mixed blessing. At 25 I was told I had a 80-85% chance of being diagnosed with breast cancer by age 40... I'm 38 & will now do a bilateral mastectomy in a month I was planning on a prophylactic mastectomy next summer at 39 but didn't make it. When I got the news from my biopsy I was really regretful I didn't do this prophylactic prior ... But it seems I still have a lot of options with the O stage & because my cancer in non invasive DCIS. If I where to have a tumor that was invasive my options would significantly change.


    Keep that in mind - This is only my experience, I wish you luck & I know your struggle, try to remember the knowledge you have does not mean a death sentence, that helped me to see the information instead of letting it consume me.

  • MinusTwo
    MinusTwo Member Posts: 16,634
    edited June 2017

    Ruby - point being - you should make an appointment with at least three breast surgeons and get three opinions. It would be great if at least one of them could be at a National Cancer Center - or at least a major teaching hospital. Not sure where you live, but I think it would even be worth a drive.

  • Utgrad82
    Utgrad82 Member Posts: 2
    edited June 2017

    I need no scientist to tell me early screening and detection work. After having my typical screening mammogram we found incidence of DCIS and after the needle biopsy we found a small, small mass (.3 cm). We planned a lumpectomy and reconstruction on left breast and then reduction on right.

    During surgery my surgeon found a second mass, same size. Diagnosis of the cancer? E-negative, P-negative, HER2- positive. Chemo and radiation come next.

    The point is, screening works!

    Good luck to all!

  • voraciousreader
    voraciousreader Member Posts: 7,496
    edited June 2017

    The great controversy of population based screening is that we are overdiagnosing those tumors that may not ultimately lead to mortality. Unfortunately, we do not have a good way of determining which ones will cause us trouble and which ones will not. Regarding "catching cancer early"... we are moving away from that frame of mind, despite what the radiology community might tell us otherwise. What the Yale researchers are telling us is that population based mammograms are doing a great job of finding small tumors that MIGHT do us no harm long term. I sincerely believe from the studies that I have been carefully following is that it is the DIAGNOSTIC mammograms that are saving MORE lives AND the tumors found in our younger brethren are the more troublesome. Furthermore, for those who are younger and have dense breasts, population based mammos miss those potentially serious tumors.


    Bottom line...we need a better method of screening. I sincerely believe that imaging will be out of favor in a dozen years. I think blood markers will determine who will need imaging.THAT will be the way of hopefully "catching" tumors that will need aggressive treatment.


    Finally, I am disappointed in BCO because they CHOSE not to link the latest New England Journal study. I think it is an important study that sisters need to know about and digest ESPECIALLY with respect to threads like this one

  • MinusTwo
    MinusTwo Member Posts: 16,634
    edited June 2017

    Thanks for posting VR. Very interesting write up. Did you send a PM to the Mods?

  • voraciousreader
    voraciousreader Member Posts: 7,496
    edited June 2017

    Minus..yes, I contacted them and asked them to link it. They said i could post the study if i wanted to. They said it wasn't worth posting under research and clinical trials because it wasn't according to their editorial team "a research item, but more of an editorial article, citing research." IMHO sisters NEED to know this info. Shouldn't this website be enlightening? At the very least, sisters should be aware of the mammography controversy....perhaps if more sisters knew how controversial population based screening mammography was, then perhaps they would demand better screening. Also, IMHO if the US followed the screening recommendations of Canada and Western Europe, then perhaps there would be more money available to find that better screening methods AND better treatments AND a cure. But we aren't going to get there unless this controversy is settled once and for all..

  • MTwoman
    MTwoman Member Posts: 2,704
    edited June 2017

    voracious, here is the full text article from the NEJM

    http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMoa1600249

    What jumps out at me, in this controversy, is that there is no current way of knowing which bc will or won't "cause us problems" (as you said) and yet the phrase "over diagnosed" is still being tossed around.

    When they have evidence that can predict which bc will or won't kill women, and when that result is consistently reproducible, then women may get on board with it. But just look at the "not diagnosed but worried" forum. It's literally full of women who are convinced they have bc and are terrified at the thought of it. IMHO, even if "blood markers" became available, having women leave a known breast cancer in their body because it isn't going to "cause them a problem" is going to be a tough sell.

  • MelissaDallas
    MelissaDallas Member Posts: 7,268
    edited June 2017

    And most of the "not diagnosed" forum is not women who had a finding on a screening mammogram. It is women who have found some lump or change and have been referred for DIAGNOSTIC, not screening, imaging.

  • MTwoman
    MTwoman Member Posts: 2,704
    edited June 2017

    well, exactly. I was using that as an example of the level of anxiety around just finding a lump (that the majority of the time turns out to be nothing). Imagine the response of someone who is actually told they have bc, but not to worry b/c it's not the kind to be concerned about?

  • voraciousreader
    voraciousreader Member Posts: 7,496
    edited June 2017

    MT...The link you provide is NOT the New England Journal study that I was referencing. The one I refer to was published in the June 8, 2017 issue regarding Yale researchers. I read the article TWICE in my local library. Basically, what this study tells us is that we need to move away from the phrase of "catching cancer early" and the importance of population based screening. They are telling us that there needs to be a paradigm shift in how to understand cancer. What these researchers are telling us is that biologically and genetically, small cancers,so small, that are found on population based screening mammograms may be indolent and not harmful in our lifetimes. Likewise, what MelissaDallas touches on is the importance of DIAGNOSTIC mammograms and how they fit into the equation of catching cancer early....dr. Welch and others have stipulated that cancers found between routine population based mammograms are the mammograms that save the most lives....that message is confusing and frightful to some

  • MTwoman
    MTwoman Member Posts: 2,704
    edited June 2017

    darn, went to read that article and it's behind a paywall.

  • voraciousreader
    voraciousreader Member Posts: 7,496
    edited June 2017

    yep! That's why you need to go to your local library....

  • MTwoman
    MTwoman Member Posts: 2,704
    edited June 2017

    my local library, that doesn't carry it. When I worked as a health researcher at the Uni, I had access to everything. It is a rude awakening not to be able to read what I please.

  • voraciousreader
    voraciousreader Member Posts: 7,496
    edited June 2017

    mt....i am surprised that your library can't get it for you...sometimes a library system gets an online subscription...


    I know, as a voracious reader, that I need what I want to read at the tip of my fingers...it is like a coke addiction...i NEED to read what I NEED to read NOW!

  • MTwoman
    MTwoman Member Posts: 2,704
    edited June 2017

    we have a small library (Bozeman, Montana). I read as much as I want and is good for me. Sometimes, I actually have to stop reading bc bc bc, as I (and my interests) am better served when I expand my focus to a variety of topics :) My mantra these days is balance in all things. Some days I'm better at this than others. But I most certainly understand the drive to read and to know.

  • voraciousreader
    voraciousreader Member Posts: 7,496
    edited June 2017

    mt...join us on the book lovers thread...there are wonderful book recommendations there...medical books are mostly off limits...

  • MTwoman
    MTwoman Member Posts: 2,704
    edited June 2017
  • MinusTwo
    MinusTwo Member Posts: 16,634
    edited June 2017

    MT - agree with VR. Do come to the book lover's thread.

  • MinusTwo
    MinusTwo Member Posts: 16,634
    edited July 2017

    Good article VR. Thanks.

  • kira1234
    kira1234 Member Posts: 3,091
    edited July 2017

    They're using the mammaprint test to determine which patients can pass on chemo. My breast surgeon wanted to run it 7 years ago but my insurance wasn't willing to cover it. Unfortunately it's apparently not recommended if you get a second diagnosis of breast cancer.

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