DIEP 2015
Comments
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I have a new concern ...... HAIRY FOOBS! My belly skin had quite a bit more hair than my breasts did. It is mostly fair and fine, though a little longer than my chest hair typically would be ...., but in addition to that, two or three "dark and curlies" have sprouted and I've pulled them out!
At least having no feeling that doesn't hurt!
I just did a search for this issue on past threads, and it definitely is a thing, not just me, so thought I'd mention it here. Apparently the foob hair does lessen over time, but if it does continue as an issue the answer is lasering (once you are all healed). Apparently some PS will do it at their office, so talk to your surgeon if you have this concern
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Morwenna: Thanks for a very much needed laugh.
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Well I'm joining! Surgery is next week- possibly tues. I will find out very soon, had all my pre op work done. I asked about recurrence and my BS doesn't feel it is a problem or risk. I asked her if I could get MRI s and she said she would consider. Sorry I'm really tired after a full day at the hospital- off to bed.
I hope all those recovering can find comfort in sleep zzzzzzz
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I feel like I'm in an iron bra, also. I thought the discomfort would go away when the drains were removed, but it seems to be worse because my mind knows there is nothing in there to cause the feeling. I tried to get through yesterday without any narc pain meds. I ended up being miserable this am, especially my abdominal area. So I took half a pill and will try to use the pain relief to be a little more active today. I did get a chuckle about the hair. I'm waiting for my first to appear, but I am only two weeks out. Ah cancer, a life disruptor that just keeps giving.
slv58, welcome to our club. Today I would say I am sorry I did this, but then I look at my beautiful foobs, and feel how natural they feel, and know I won't end up sorry.
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Thank you mefromcc! I'm trying to get ready for my surgery- zip up tops- big high wasted yoga pants- flat slippers - body pillow etc. my last day of work will be fri. I have to go for the lovely sentinel node nipple injection on Monday. I have to be at the hospital for 6:00 am tues. I'm nervous and excited at the same time. I just hope I can find a comfortable way to sleep because I can get very cranky/bitc*y if I'm not sleeping well-lol
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Feeling good today. I went (somewhat nervously) to the first indoor training session of the season for the Sistership Dragon Boat Race team last night.
I did some cardio, stretching, light weights, and even a few minutes actual paddling. Had to stop paddling cos left shoulder too stiff and sore and worried about overdoing tummy work!
Anyway, the good news is that I feel no ill effects (as yet) this morning. If anything my chest feels looser, so I'm thinking it is really time to get moving!
I'm seeing a physio this week to see if she can help loosen me up
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Hi everyone,
I signed my consents on Monday for my upcoming surgery (3/27). I'm both nervous and excited. For those that already had their surgery, what did you wear to leave the hospital? I'm thinking a zip up jacket/stretch yoga pants. Am I on the right track? Does anyone have a packing list for the hospital...things you wished you would have had but forgot etc? Thanks in advance.
Also, are there any pictures on these discussion boards of people who have had the procedure? When I signed consents, the PA told me that the surgeon will make the call at time of surgery whether it will be TRAM or DIEP... is this what you all encountered as well?
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Just heard my surgery date is April 6th. I'm finding this thread so useful and if feels so much less scary to know there are so many others going through the same and coming out the other end.
Sarah
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I would love a list of everything needed to prepare! I'm hung up on the sleeping issue- I'm such a side sleeper and hate sleeping on my back lol
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It's so funny but when I was pregnant, ALL I wanted to do was sleep on my back. It felt sooooo good. (and of course you can't). But I am a side sleeper too.
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Morwenna, I can't believe you did a workout! Good for you, this gives me inspiration to bounce back! I'm happy your feeling better!!
Shari
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What I did to prepare (lengthy post!)
I went to Walmart and bought some oversized pjs for hanging out in at home until I felt like getting dressed. Extra large to be comfy round my middle, and button up front so I didn't have to pull over my head. I wore pjs for at least a week or two.
I also bought a couple of pillows for under $4 each, and extra pillow cases. I found a waterproof mattress cover to protect my rented powered recliner in case I was oozy. I also got a couple of bed drawsheets for my bed but didn't end up using those. All of these I got from Walmart. I borrowed a V shaped "nursing pillow". I collected together all the spare pillows we had in the house!
I shaved my armpits a couple of days before (although I don't think I had any instructions on that) I didn't worry about my pubic hair .... But someone did that for me as I slept! I think they prefer it that way to avoid infection? I showered and washed my hair before going to the hospital and left all my jewelry ay home.
I decided to wear into hospital what I intended to wear home, to save having extra clothes there or dh having to bring stuff in. This was an extra large pair of yoga pants, (stretchy, comfy waist), a sleeveless "vest" top, (again large and stretchy), and a slightly oversized fleece jacket with front zip. I didn't bother with underwear, coming home. My drains were simply pinned to my vest.
***Make sure your ride home brings you a pillow to put under the seat belt.***
I wore hospital gowns all the time I was in hospital. I took my phone and charger, and also my kindle, but didn't really use them. I also took in a small washkit, but only really used my toothbrush, lip salve, and a little breath/mouth freshening spray which I figured I might use if I was unable to clean my teeth at first (think I used it once or twice?). I took some dry shampoo, and I did try it on about day 4, but couldn't wait to wash my hair at home! DH helped, at the kitchen sink so I didn't have to bend too far.
I took in some face wipes to freshen up but they never made it out of my bag.
I did use my own slippers. You want some that go on easily but don't fall off when you walk, as PT might want to make you climb stairs before d/c. You might want to use your own gown/housecoat, but I made do with hospital issue. It has to be fairly loose to get your arms in/out without strain.
At home I found a shower stool (Walmart $25) was very useful to sit by the sink to wash, but never actually used it in the shower, although I did sit down to dry myself after. Hubby helped for the first couple of showers.
You could use any stool or eg garden chair I suppose.
Some people use a walker to start with, but I didn't want to go there, and it is actively discouraged at our hospital. I was allowed to hang onto the IV stand for support and balance.
Stock up on docusate (Colace) stool softener, and sennakot or similar bowel preps that both soften stool and encourage motility in the bowel. I used Tylenol and Advil (OTC) mainly, for pain, but you may have a prescription for something stronger. All analgesics are constipating, as is immobility, so drink plenty water and get up and walk at least every hour.
Consider buying in high fibre snacks and fruit (prunes???) If you don't have someone who cooks at home, buy or prepare in advance meals that just need heating through. My friends found a website that they could use to organise who was dropping off food and when. I still ended up with a foodbank overload, and eventually begged them to stop! If I'd have been more organized I would have cooked and frozen meals myself pre-op! A lap tray was useful, and a hubby to bring me my meals for the first week
OK, well this isn't supposed to be prescriptive, but if it helps, this is what I did ..... Good luck to all who are coming up surgery!
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Morwenna,
Thank you so much! You are so awesome. Great info...
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Morwenna, thank you! Did you find pajamas were ok around your hips? I was thinking of a shower stool also but not sure if I will use it. How about a knee wedge pillow?
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The pjs I got were loose and quite high-waisted, so I pulled them way above my new belly button
That's why I bought a good one size bigger than normal.
I had some others that tended to ride just about on my scar, so I would just pull them down a bit, or roll the top over to wear them just below my incision.
I didn't get a knee wedge pillow, but used two pillows under my knees when I first went to bed, gradually reduced to one when ready.
I quickly tired of sleeping on my back and tried even a quarter turn with a pillow behind me, to get the weight off my tailbone. Have to be careful as it pulls on the tummy if you twist.....
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Thank you for all that information, Morwenna. How long was it till you started wearing underwear again? Do you wear a compression garment after the surgery?
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Regarding the immediate recon vs. delayed conversation, I had immediate because my PS said I would get a better cosmetic result. I thought that breaking it up into two surgeries would cut down on the anesthesia time, but apparently this is not the case. I had a team of three surgeons working simultaneously. The BS worked on the mastectomy while 2 PS harvested the flaps. What was supposed to be a 9-10 hour operation turned into 13. Didn't matter to me, it only felt like a second, lol.
If for medical reasons your doctor recommends 2 surgeries then that's what you should do, but having to go through this only once, only one recovery time, is better than doing it twice. btw, while the tummy incision looks like it will be horribly painful, it really isn't. The drains are by far the WORST part of the entire ordeal. If you have two surgeries you will need drains twice - yuck. It was wonderful to wake up and have my breasts intact already.
Good luck to all of you!
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Thanks for a positive story. I know it will be a long time for those waiting, but to me will be what my now 16 year old would say when when he was younger - a blink sleep. Last time my husband went shopping and bought me something nice, this time he'll have so much more time to shop for me. The drain was the worst parts of my first mx, but in then end it was gone and forgotten.
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On the subject of underwear:
I don't remember exactly when I started wearing panties, but I expect it was when I needed to put real clothes on rather than just PJs!
I used to choose the waist high ones as the bikini line ones came right on my tummy scar ... now it doesn't bother me.
My surgeon "doesn't really do" the compression thing.
I've only worn a bra a handful of times, and that is only a "Genie" bar thing ... one of those soft, stretchy, pull-up type. Even that causes ridges especially on my left side. I am still a bit swollen, and I'm sure a difference of one possibly two cup sizes in L vs R. It feels like I have a tight bra on even when I wear nothing.
My PS has designs on reducing the right, as my left irradiated side came out tighter and smaller in consequence. I'm not in a big hurry to have another anesthetic to be honest .... My next pulmonary embolus could prove fatal!
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Is anyone else having trouble sleeping? I fall asleep just fine at night but I'm waking up at like 3 a.m. It's not from pain or anything, I'm just wide awake. I didn't know if it was some strange surgery trauma or anesthesia side effect
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alycallie, if you are curious about the Tram vs. DIEP chdck out the "ask the doctor" at the top of the NOLA in September? page.On there you can ask questions. There is a question dated Feb 21 called Flap that talks about this... Check it out.
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Alycallie: It depends on the doctor. I called a very highly regarded PS in Chicago and was told his conversion rate from DIEP to TRAM was 85%. I had read mixed reviews on whether this is good or bad. I still really don't entirely understand the difference. But since I had heard it was undesirable, I also asked the question on Ask The Doctor. Dr. D (who IS one of the PS's at the NOLA center) responded that he doesn't think ANY conversion rate is acceptable. I am intrigued to discuss this further with them when I got there next week to consult. It is all a matter of opinion what people think. Some doctors are fine with it, obviously.
I encourage you to go read some of the posts from Ask The Doctor because he is the doctor who doesn't think it's a good idea and you could hear his views.
Just as an aside, I went to an MO Monday because Dr. Stolier at BCRS in NOLA told me to have chemo first. The doctor was a complete jerk when he found out I was not coming to HIS hospital for surgery. I told him NOLA specializes in cutting edge techniques for this type of surgery and he assured me that ANY PS would do the same thing. (NOT true IMO, or I wouldn't be traveling to NOLA). But when I asked it was a dumb idea to travel up to 1 hour to his facility to have chemo when I could do it 5 minutes from my house, he said no, no, people come from out of state to have chemo here……so let me see if I get this straight? EVERY PS will do the same surgery but you are SO good at chemo that people come from out of state to see you? Ugh. God complex much, doctor?
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there is nothing wrong with having to have a tram over a DIEP, but if a doctor is saying that 85% of the time that theyhave to do a tram, that seem like he isn't that experienced with DIEP.
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I had to have muscle taken, she said about the size of a finger. She said it was because the donor vessel was small and need the muscle tissue to support it. My PT said that it wasn't a lot if muscle and that I should be ok, just means more pain post op for a while and different/ added exercises for PT. I'm fine with that- my pulse in my foobs was loud and perfect from the first hour out of surgery and have remained so. Thank goodness.
I went to UPenn, my surgeon is Dr Wu. Evidently this is her specialty and they do more than any other hospital in the country. She has more than 1000 under her belt.( Her teeny tiny belt ... She is one fierce little woman. )Even my MO was all swoony over her work and her rep. My PT just went nutty after seeing my foobs and incisions. A good nutty.
Guess it just depends on the doctor.
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I agree with nmh35 that with an 85% tram rate, that is the surgery that surgeon prefers. As a reminder, after my CT scan, my PS told me my vessels were iffy, and there was double the risk I would not get decent flaps for transplant. Fortunately he was able to get me one each. But I went in knowing a ms tram is okay because of what I learned on this site.
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Hi there,. I am back....Hope everyone is doing well. I have been gone awhile..I spent three weeks with my daughters..taking turns taking care of me. Then my BF took me to Florida for some needed R&R and sunshine. It was great.
Everything is going good, my surgery went well and everything is healing up like it is supposed to. My foobs are looking good, I have one that looks smaller than the other but actually isn't because my damn expander and radiated skin on my right side was so tight it made my chest wall cave in slightly. My Dr said it might correct itself , it might not. Oh well.
Dr. Lemaine and her team where absolutely the greatest. Some of you are asking what to bring to the hospital. You really don't need much, just your toothbrush, which I actually forgot so they got me one. Oh, and I highly recommend Colace. They do give you stool softeners but they are pretty weak, and these work fabulous !! Wear home what you came in with and you are good to go.
Those of you that had your surgery did you have those gowns that kept you warm? How cool are those? For those of you that don't know what I am talking about, before surgery they want you warm , I suppose for your blood vessels, and they put you in a gown that hooks up to something like a hairdryer and warm air blows in it. Oh, it feels so good.
I thought this surgery was going to be absolutely horrible, and I will say it was not as bad as I thought. I still have my days when I wonder if being flat would have just been better, especially when I've done to much and my stomach starts to hurt or my chest feels tighter than usual. Or when I get out of the shower and look at my ugly incisions and wonder if I will ever not feel self conscious.
But I do not regret my decision and am looking forward to the day when I can look down and not see ugly incisions but some faint scars and faint reminders of this horrible crappy journey that we have all been on.
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violet-just to clarify what I was saying. Yes I agree even the most experienced DIEP surgeon may have to do a tram. You never know what the blood vessels are going to be like in there and the safest decision has to me made for viability. But if I heard that 85% of the patients were changed to tram, that sounds suspicious!
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Annieb4, it's good to hear from you and that you're healing well. I'm glad you were able to spend time with your daughters recovering, and then onto a warm, sunny beach. That sounds wonderful!
Mefromcc, my CT scan shows very small, deep abdominal veins. My PS said I may end up being a challenge. I'm so scared that he'll go in, find the veins are too small, and not want to try the flap. In my area, he's supposed to be the best at diep reconstruction, so I'm crossing my fingers that everything will work out.
For those whose PS had to use a bit of muscle, is this different from a full tram? My PS is not a fan of the tram, so I was wondering if there was a difference in the procedures.
One more question; I've heard women say they get "swelly belly". Does everyone get it? Is there anything that can be done to prevent it?
Thanks for your replies!
~Andrea
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A muscle sparing TRAM is a good alternative to the DIEP, with equivalent long term success. There "may" be a little more pain initially post op, and you may have abdominal restrictions for longer post op.
The main difference is that rather than dissecting the perforating vessels out of the muscle, they take a very small piece of muscle which includes those vessels that supply the flap of skin and fatty tissue from the tummy area.
The full tram free flap takes a large portion of the rectus abdomus muscle, resulting in a larger defect and subsequently greater impact on abdominal muscle integrity and/or risk of hernia.
The original "pedicle" TRAM uses the muscle without removing it, but cutting the lower end, folding it back on itself, bringing it up under the abdominal skin, and popping it out of an incision in the chest area. This method does not involve the microvascular surgery of reimplanting a detached flap of tissue, so is less technically challenging, but again you do potentially sacrifice some abdominal muscle strength and wall integrity.
This procedure is still one of preference to some surgeons.
I'm only 8 weeks out from my own surgery and my tummy is still somewhat swollen mostly above my belly button. It does seem to go up and down a bit depending on activity, and I'm told it can take months rather than weeks to settle down. I'm not yet comfy in my tight jeans!
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Thanks Morwenna. I'm going to ask my PS about the muscle sparing tram when I see him next month. I really appreciate all the information you've shared!
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