Anyone with lung/heart damage from left breast radiation?

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  • TB90
    TB90 Member Posts: 992
    edited July 2014


    If you want to find problems with any treatment, even with taking one Tylenol, you certainly will by asking for negative reactions to anything.  Just read about the side effects possible from most things all of us take for granted.  The vast majority of persons who have had radiation for breast cancer do extremely well.  And every problem encountered post radiation cannot be contributed to radiation.  I for one am much more afraid of the SE of a recurrence.  There is lots of evidence of that on just about every thread on bc.org.  Those persons who did well after radiation and have gone on with their lives just aren't here to speak up, they are living their lives. 

  • Infobabe
    Infobabe Member Posts: 1,083
    edited July 2014

    No rett, they certainly don't tell you all the possible side effects.   I  had a cursory informed consent that did state possible lung zaps.   When I asked about this they said it is about impossible to avoid the lung entirely.  Also a pamphlet said to stay out of the sun for possible skin cancer.  I am already a candidate for skin cancer because of age, sun damage and ethnicity.  I probably would have soldiered through with it if not for possible long term damage.  Like you, I was pressured by relatives to go through with it.  They want what is best for us and think rads are a piece of cake the causual way doctors throw off the recomendation.  In the end, I refused rads.

    I don't really know if I did the wise thing.  I have a friend, diagnosed just like me, small left side DCIS, who also refused rads 7 years ago.  She is recently diagnosed with a tiny IDC BUT in the other breast.  The only thing she could have done too avoid this is double MX 7 years ago for a small DCIS, a bit extreme.  Rads would not have helped her.

    Like you, I believe, we need a cure, not feel good programs.

  • lucylucy
    lucylucy Member Posts: 3
    edited July 2014

    I am dealing with enlarged heart and fluid buildup after chemo and radiation anyone with experience in treatment and duration of this. Trouble breathing, particularly at night

  • MomtoIrishQuads
    MomtoIrishQuads Member Posts: 128
    edited July 2014

    Just wanted to chime in - I had rads 3 years ago for DCIS.  Never had a problem - got a little tired toward the end but that was it.

    Recently diagnosed with Stage 1 in the other breast (left).  Did chemo as an "insurance policy" but dropped out after one session - the side effects were horrible (in a word).  I'm starting rads in a week or two on left breast - I'm not worried, except that it's closer to my heart.  Apparently they set things up so that it is directly away from the heart - hoping that's the case.

    Radiation is a piece of cake compared to chemo - where your body is poisoned - and for less of a percentage decrease in recurrence than rads.  I'll take rads any day.  

    Deb

  • MomtoIrishQuads
    MomtoIrishQuads Member Posts: 128
    edited July 2014

    Just wanted to chime in - I had rads 3 years ago for DCIS.  Never had a problem - got a little tired toward the end but that was it.

    Recently diagnosed with Stage 1 in the other breast (left).  Did chemo as an "insurance policy" but dropped out after one session - the side effects were horrible (in a word).  I'm starting rads in a week or two on left breast - I'm not worried, except that it's closer to my heart.  Apparently they set things up so that it is directly away from the heart - hoping that's the case.

    Radiation is a piece of cake compared to chemo - where your body is poisoned - and for less of a percentage decrease in recurrence than rads.  I'll take rads any day.  

    Deb

  • ruthbru
    ruthbru Member Posts: 57,235
    edited July 2014

    6 weeks of radiation on left side....7 years ago this summer, no problems then or now. I was glad to do be able to do everything I could at the time in hopes that I never have to play this game again; and so far, so good.

  • Lilyluv
    Lilyluv Member Posts: 160
    edited August 2014

    I have some lung scarring.  Finished left whole breast rads with boost in February and it was discovered by accident.  Scared the heck out of me!  I went to the ER for a bad allergic reaction and they did a routine chest xray.  The results came up in my online file and it said can't rule out primary lung cancer or metastasis.  I was freaking out of my mind because there isn't a clean margin on my chest wall, and of course it was a Friday nite!  The ER said followup with my primary care doctor for a lung CT.  He said the rad onc should do it.  Rad onc said I should have a pulmonologist do it.  I don't have a pulmonologist.  So my surgeon's office called to schedule my 6 mo. post surgery followup and I asked if she would do it.  She said she could order the CT.  By this point a couple weeks had passed and I still had to schedule the CT scan.   Good thing it really wasn't lung cancer after that wait and playing musical doctors.  Supposed to have contrast...they couldn't get a vein.  Radiologist said BTW we don't need contrast after being stuck repeatedly with uncooperative veins by 2 different techs.  CT showed I have some scar tissue and a bit of fluid around my heart.   Nothing major.  But I started what sounds like a smoker'scough a couple of months ago.  Onc says possibly due to scar tissue but doesn't know for sure.  Still coughing.  It can be quiet for hours and then can't stop the coughing spasms again.  Still a lot of fatigue...from rads or from this crazy cough - who knows.  Sometimes I wonder if all of this is overkill for DCIS, but with grade 3 with necrosis it wasn't worth taking the risk with the lack of a clean chest wall margin. I don't take Tamoxifen though because it only added a 3% reduction in risk factor in my case, and isn't worth the side effects.  I'm not much of a worrier though about recurrence after rads.

  • kimag
    kimag Member Posts: 114
    edited August 2014

    I have lung scarring after radiation, 43 days of radiation 18 years ago, the scarring did not show right away, my ct from 2010 was ok, this year it shows scarring first time, during radiation I did not have any issues, I preferred it over chemo but.... so many years past and now I am seeing changes in my CT scans, also my recent BC is radiation induced and it is not my privet opinion so the treatment from the past helped me but there is  the price for it... new cancer 18 years later, not mentioning removal of thyroid few years ago due to suspicious cysts.. there is always pros and cons and the point is to have a good wise doctor to help determine is it really a must,  what are person risks and true benefits..

  • Mariael
    Mariael Member Posts: 7
    edited August 2014


    Hi, I had a lumpectomy in July for a 1.75 cm DCIS, high grade tumor with comedo necrosis. I'm upset right now because my radiology oncologist told me she could keep my heart, lungs and ribs out of the picture this past Monday, but on Friday when I was about to get on the bed for the simulation, she responded to something I said, by saying that a little bit of the lung and rib would be in the field. That is too scary and concerning to me. I had the simulation, I wish I hadn't because I received 4-5 CT scans during that (a good amount of radiation), part of which may need to be repeated if I get a different doc. I had 4 and 5 mm surgical margins. It stinks because the high grade/comedo aspect gives me a higher chance of recurrence, and some of you have had negative radiation side effects, and I agree, the docs don't tell you everything. I have asthma and I know how scary it is when you can't breathe. My trust has been shaken with this doctor. Maybe I should get partial breast radiation. Have any of you tried that? Any thoughts? I'm trying to figure out what to do, and I'm scared it will come back as invasive if I don't get rads.

  • Infobabe
    Infobabe Member Posts: 1,083
    edited August 2014

    Mariael, I refused rads after the simulation.  Because my DCIS was small, big margins, low grade, I determined not to have rads or any further treatment.  I do caution that I am not advising this as I could be wrong.  I have my yearly mammogram this September and it is not a fun prospect.  I do know that if I have further problems, I will have a mastectomy with no reconstruction.  I have thought this through.

    I woman's age has a lot to do with how an individual will proceed.  Your DCIS is more serious than mine was.  So your only choice is rads or mastectomy.   You have complicating factors with the asthma but the decision is only yours.  Preserving your life with as much comfort as possible is the goal of all of us.  Once you decide, your mind will be more settled.  The trouble is, it all sucks.

    My best wishes for you and I sincerely mean that.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited August 2014

    There are so many reasons why I should never have had radiation after lumpectomy and chemo:  I had a new primary in the exact location after 4 years; Many problems with reconstruction because of radiation;  Metastasis and scarring in the lining of my left lung last year.  I asked my doctor if radiation could have possibly caused all my problems after first diagnosis.  He said, "Yes, it is possible."

  • yoga_girl
    yoga_girl Member Posts: 234
    edited August 2014

    Mariael,

    Ask your onc rad team if you are a good candidate for prone position rads and if it's available at the facility you are seeking treatment from.  It's only available at a few medical facilities across the US as it requires special equipment set-up.  Several years ago it was only available in trials. 

    In my case it was the only option I would consider as my tumors were one inch from my heart.  I did my research and started looking for the best doc with the most experience in this treatment option.  It was only a portion of my breast that was beamed.

    I did ask many questions of all the specialists prior to treatment.  What is the machine mfgr? Do they have a brochure on the machine?  What is the error rate of the machine?  How new is the machine?  When was it last calibrated? 

    Ask for a color copy (on disk and paper) of the simulation model for your tumor bed so you know the entry and exit points of the beam(s).  This allows for you to see how close to all your organs the beam(s) will be.  Stand your ground on having the documentation you need to make an informed decision.  They may not be happy about you asking, but you're paying for the simulation model and are entitled to have a copy.  There are risks and consequences with every decision we make.  Do what is best for your situation, your piece of mind and your quality of life. 

     

  • Fossildame
    Fossildame Member Posts: 1
    edited September 2014

    I like your approach Yoga Girl!  I refused a PET CT yesterday and my Onc was bewildered. 

    With  ACT chemo behind me (shy of 2 Taxols due to interstital pneumonitis or lung damage with fever, cough and chills), I have bi-lateral surgery scheduled next and then the protocol is for 6 weeks of radiation. I am questioning the radiation. It is my left breast that needs to be irradiated and I am concerned with further damage to my lung. I am a runner and would like to continue my active lifestyle. The Taxol caused my pneumonitis...the Onc said that having the last 2 infusions would have killed me. Lungs do not regenerate and  pneumonitis can be fatal later in life. Weighing risk/benefits is something we all have to do and while I have not decided what to do yet regarding radiation, I know that unnecessary ct scans should be avoided. When you read the data, ct scans are being used too liberally in medicine and I was shocked to read how much more radiation they expose you to. Well beyond an old fashioned Xray. Furthermore, the machines can emit much more radiation than is necessary to acheive the image. Calibration varies so much and the studies I read in JAMA where nothing short of shocking. We all receive huge amounts of radiation through the scans we must have to get the full picture of our cancers and their presence in our bodies...but please question the necessity of each ct scan. Remember that radiation changes our vary DNA and I find it to be yet another irony of our cancer journeys that we must rely on testing that causes cancer to help us learn about the existance of our existing cancers.  Preposterous.

    I will ask about prone position rads.   Deciding between 2surgeons now...one is at a teaching hospital with access to rads and pulmonary oncology teams...leaning towards them even though they are 2 hours from me and the other surgeon is well known and local.

    best to you all. 

  • yoga_girl
    yoga_girl Member Posts: 234
    edited December 2014


    Rads and choices

    Although I did choose my rad onc doc, the facility and the treatment option, those are about the only things we agreed on during the entire process for eight weeks.  I took a camera with me each and every day I had treatments.  I took pictures of the data screen before each weekly session, I interviewed the rad onc nurses to know how much experience they had in rad onc, how many years and what machines have been used throughout the years of treatment at the facility.  Who would think to ask about the calibration of a rad onc machine, how dare us ask such a question.  Ask for the make and model of your rad onc machine (rad onc nurses will have this info), google it, read about the accuracy of the machine, ask how old/new the machine is.  Accuracy is key to the beam and what it contacts along the way, a term called scatter.  A heart, a lung, etc. take a look at your picture models in 3D color, it gives you a new perspective on other organs behind your breast you may not have thought about and how close to that beam they are.  We each have to do a personal evaluation on what your body can endure, survive and handle.  Understand the percentages of each treatment plan you agree to.  Weigh the pros and cons, be informed.

    I would go 15-30 minutes early and stay 15 minutes after, talk to all the women who were there for treatments in my one hour before/during/after session.  I learned more about the reality of rads, how different each of us are to reactions and yet how similar each of us are to reactions.  We compared notes.  I received more honesty from the patients than I did from the docs who were treating me about real side effects and reactions.  I was not alone, everyone in the waiting room had a story or two to share.  The common thread, the truth about side effects was not disclosed prior to rads, no matter how minor or significant.  Why is it a secret?  Why not be honest so we can be prepared?  If it doesn't happen, then all the better, at least we can be informed prior to and not find out after the fact.  

    In the clinic waiting room we discussed how we were handling each day as we faced a new challenge and reaction.  Understand, not everyone has side effects to rads, but I am finding out more people have, than do not.  People do not talk about this outside of a cancer treatment center.  It isn't published anywhere and this community reaches the greatest population for questions and concerns.  We are on this site because we have chosen to be and reach out to others with concerns.  There are hundreds of thousands of people out there who did not join this web site.  They choose to be silent and deal with the process in their own way.  I talked to 25 different women who were scheduled during the same dates/times, none of them joined a website such as this to discuss anything about their personal journey, they did not want to walk thru it again and wanted the memory behind them.  None of them attended any of the sponsored survivorship classes or lectures prior to or after treatments.  A personal choice to participate or not.

    Be informed, ask lots of questions, get copies of all your reports (paper and electronic), take pictures, ask for 3D color models of your beam plan, find an advocate through a referral and get matched to someone who will talk to you about your cancer journey, ask for a breast MRI with contrast prior to surgery as your baseline (if you have the option or share the knowledge with someone else who has just been diag w/ BC), get another one after surgery and all your rads are complete and you are at least six months post rads (you will need a prior approval from your insurance company for this test).  This is a fairly new test available for breast patients (be sure your insurance provides a pre-approval for this test as it is expensive).  Gave me peace of mind prior to surgery to know and confirm which lymph nodes would be checked and cancer tumor location/size; also cross checks ultrasound and mammogram.

    Images of MRI w/ contrast:

    https://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images;_ylt=AwrBT7eEJ4VUV18Al3NXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTB0MWl0Y2w5BHNlYwNzYwRjb2xvA2JmMQR2dGlkA1ZJUDUyM18x?_adv_prop=image&fr=yfp-t-901&va=breast+mri+with+contrast

    I honor each of you in your personal journey, the choice to be silent and just read what we write about or be vocal and ask questions.  Unless someone has walked in our shoes, the exact journey is very different, just like our DNA, we are all unique and cancer does not discriminate. 

     

  • soccermom16
    soccermom16 Member Posts: 1
    edited October 2014

    I had 30 rads after left side mastectomy, A/C, taxol/herceptin. I did great throw the whole treatment. Never missed a day of work on the chemo or radiation. Was tired but I pushed through.  Finished the rads in April. I was seeing a cardiologist because of the herceptin. Was having echo's done every 3 months. March (before radiation) my heart was fine (EF 65). In June (after rads) left muscle of heart was damaged and my EF dropped to 40. My Cardiologist thought it might be the herceptin, so I stopped that for 6 weeks, had another echo-damage still there. He did some more investigating and realize it was the radiation that damage my heart. It is irreversible. Now I have cardiomyopathy and am on 2 heart medicines.  Also have lung issues. Constant cough and shortness of breath. And to top it off I have lyphedema in my arm and Frozen shoulder. My physical therapist says it all from the radiation. Would I do it again-I'm not sure. It has been a year since first diagnosis and I thought I would be able to go forward now. But I am stuck with a lot of problems now.

  • Moderators
    Moderators Member Posts: 25,912
    edited October 2014

    soccermom, Welcome to the BCO community. We are sorry, however, that so many issues post treatment have brought you here. This is a wonderful group of compassionate and well informed others. We hope that you will stay connected and feel the support that is within these boards. The Mods

  • danana
    danana Member Posts: 4
    edited October 2014


    I am at the U and not very happy

  • Infobabe
    Infobabe Member Posts: 1,083
    edited October 2014

    danana, tell us more.

  • BurntToes
    BurntToes Member Posts: 5
    edited November 2014

    I wonder if that is why I have COPD now. I keep trying to get a CXR, but they want more tests, which is just too many $$$. I work, have insurance, & am still paying off my old deductibles.

  • rgiuff
    rgiuff Member Posts: 1,094
    edited November 2014

    I had radiation almost 7 years ago on my left side. I have had no problems with heart or lungs. I never had any burns either, as I used the recommended creams as instructed

  • Carynbrit
    Carynbrit Member Posts: 51
    edited December 2014

    I go for the simulation tomorrow then apparently due to start 2 days after that. I have been a right royal pain in everyones butt so far and I don't care. I spent the last month reading through this sites discussions boards which meant I had a ton more questions to ask. The oncologist was very helpful but really did downplay the 'side effects' issue but then handed me a massive folder 'you and your radiation' which I brought home and read through.. and yup there are the possible side effects. I asked him about lung and heart issues and was told that was hardly ever.. I am going to be going over the scans and positioning with him..and as i just read above..i may take some pictures now! (Thanks!).

    I'd rather be over informed than not at all. I wasn't happy about the 'have to have' radiation (Im glad the oncotype dx score said no chemo)..but its 25% risk of local recurrence with me without it.. and 7% with. So.. and yes don't family and friends get on your nerves when they are almost punching the air saying its a no brainer and 'we' will go for that then. It's all scary.

    I'm not even going to start on my thoughts about tamoxifen (Im 43 and premenopausal).

  • Moderators
    Moderators Member Posts: 25,912
    edited December 2014

    Carynbrit, welcome to being an active member, we hope you find the networking and answers to posts of great value, as is the support of others here.

    Knowledge is power and allows you to make better decisions - and there are so many important decisions to make in these journeys. Glad your oncologist was so helpful with info too.

    We wish you the best results with no SEs for your radiation.

    The Mods

  • Hopeful82014
    Hopeful82014 Member Posts: 3,480
    edited December 2014

    Hi, Caryn - sorry you're here but hope you find info, support and camaraderie that you need here.

    Re: tamoxifen - I know several women around your age who are on tamoxifen without any issues whatsoever. Yes, some women have real problems with it, but you rarely hear from them. So, if you're on the fence about taking it, please don't reject it out of hand. You can always go off of it if it makes you miserable. On the other hand, it can make a big difference in how well you do long-term.

    Whatever decision you make, I hope it works out very, very well for you. Good luck with your radiation.

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