Grief About a Foot IV

cinnamonsmiles · June 2013

I am getting the spinal stimulator implant for pain on Monday,June 24. I was discussing with the nurse in detail (I am now armed with more information since the last appendectomy in Feb and IVS). I told her that I want written in their surgical ink NO NEEDLE OR BP ON THIS ARM. On the left I want written IV in hand only in emergency. She said, oh we have blaze orange wrist band we put on you. I said some times those are overlooked. I know for a fact that the nursing staff does not regularly look at the blaze orange bands because I have been going to this clinic for two years now, and I STILL have to remind staff that I have blaze orange bands on and there are NO blood pressures in my arms.(And how would they know that left hand only in emergencies? Like the last surgeon who was a jerk, just picked a hand and happened to pick the arm with the most problems)

Then she argued with me that she has only done one foot IV in xy many years. She said the risks are too high with blood clots and phelbitis. (I am at high risk for blood clots and I have diabetes). I didn't tell her about those two issues. Then the nurse said, But we will only use a little needle. I informed her it doesn't matter about the size of the needle, it is the poke. I told her people can LE from a mosquito bite.

So, it is up in the air on what to do on Monday.My pain doctor SUCKS at putting in foot IVS. Even when I am well hydrated, it takes him 2-4 pokes to start one and that clinic doesn't use a small lidocaine injection to the foot to numb the area. They tried a useless cream (and then the pain dr didn't put the IV in where he told them to put the cream).

What do all the rest of you do with bilateral LE and foot IVs, and have your surgical team argued with you?

Are there any out there prone to blood clots and/or have diabetes and bilateral LE? What do you do?

Binney4 · June 2013

Cinnamon, it's a true thing that if you're prone to clots (and if you have diabetes) the foot becomes an issue. Is the neck a possibility? Usually easier anyway (sounds worse: isn't!) See what you can do about arranging a neck IV. I'm assuming there will be an anesthetist involved? If so they're your best bet for insertion of IVs, whether arm, foot or neck.

Keep us posted!Binney

cinnamonsmiles · June 2013

I should add that they have been against foot IVs from the very beginning. Even before it was known that I was prone to blood clots and before I got diabetes.

The nurse claimed that she has only done one foot IV in her entire nursing career, that they don't approve of them period.

Beckers · June 2013

As far as pain, the surgical center put cream on my foot in a few areas then tape over that and let is sit for a good 20 min. I had no pain when IV started. The anesthesiologist said it is painful to the foot when he starts meds to put me to sleep so he was kind enough to place mask for me to breath to go to sleep before he pushed meds in IV. Too bad we can't have one of those under the skin ports for those of us with both sides affected. Good luck to you.

exbrnxgrl · June 2013

The cream is called EMLA (lidocaine/prilocaine combo) and it works very well if it is covered with an occlusive dressing after application and allowed to remain on the skin for 45-60 minutes. It might work in 20 minutes but the longer the better! Wishing you the best.

Caryn

Natlie38 · June 2013

Hi cinnamonsmiles, I can understand how you feel.

I have lymphedema on my right side arm and back.

Couple of months back when I had my prophylactic mastectomy on the left side, I was very scared how they would do my BP and IV line. And the nurses had told me they cannot use my left arm since that's the side they are operating. Anyway after some phone calls at my surgeons office, I made sure they use my left arm only at the time.

I also took print outs of "No BP, No IV line" on Right arm and had my husband post it above my bed in the hospital.

I know the looks on the nurses when you say No BP or IV on either arm. so for me after the surgery, they started taking BP on my leg. The nurses told me an IV line in the leg is not so secure/stable. God knows what that means!! But I know you don't want to mess with the people taking care of you in the hospital.

Its a difficult situation. Even though I don't have lymphedema on my left side, the risk remains (4 nodes out). I use my left arm for blood draws and I have been refusing BP measuring all together for routine doctor visits. (Not a great idea I know!)

I have no clot issues or bilateral LE, so I know I am not helping you with the answers that you are seeking. Still just wanted to write and let you know I can understand your dilemma!

Best wishes.

Anonymous · June 2013

cinnamon I know EXACTLY the frustration you are goig through. This is a VERY sore point with me. Long story short I had to face a real ordeal about what youre describing. It included a formal complaint about my treatment and quite frankly though there appeared to be a satisfactory outcome at the time, it wouldn't surprise me AT ALL if this all just fell to the ground because of many extenuating circumstances, like a health board pushed to the limit - Blah Im talking about I have an "agreement" that from then on, they will get an anesthetist to place any future needles. Bet I have to do all sorts of hoop jumping to make sure this is followed up on, meaning, you can never relax about being your own best advocate. On a procedure before all this an anesthetist used an ultrasound guided placement. It was EXCELLENT. Thats how tricky my veins are.

I'll say this FWIW. *NEVER* let anyone incompetent poke you in the foot. NEVER!!!!!. That includes surgeons, doctors or the humble learner. It must be someone who knows what theyre doing. If there IS no-one, then look at other options like the neck which, granted, sound extremely scary but Binney says its not so bad. It could be an option. Back to the foot....As we all know, there is a close network and plethora of veins, tendons, nerves and they can slide all over the place. Clots aside...there is a real risk that you can suffer nerve damage as I have from an ill placed needle and that was from a SURGEON! . Yes we all face risks anyway but my point is, we've had enough on our plates already without this added risk of incompetency, and DONT START ME ON THE ARGUMENTATIVE TYPES GRRRRRRRR!!!

OK I'll be blunt. LET THEM PRACTISE FOOT DRAWS ON SOMEONE ELSE.

cinnamonsmiles · June 2013

Interesting that you mention incompetent doctors. My pain doctor SUCKS at hard veins. He is supposed to be an anesthesiologist as well, as pain doctor, but when I was well hydrated, he STILL had like four pokes in my foot to start an IV. Nurses their won't even touch me. When I was in the hospital for appendicitis and VERY dehydrated, the anesthesiologist got one poke. (I arrived at 9 pm and they couldn't get an IV started. The hospital had no anesthesiologist and refused to call one in so I didn't get an IV started until about 8:30 the next morning. I went the whole night with NO ice chips, no water, no liquids).

When I got IV's started in my arm before the LE crap, I used to let IVS in the left arm. I had a number of ultrasounds to start the IVs, too. It is a wonderful tool.

I wonder what he would do if I asked for someone else to start an IV.

I have very little problems with LE in the left arm and am considering letting them put an IV in teh left hand just to keep the peace.

I don't know what to do tomorrow. Most of the staff is clearly is clearly uninformed about lymphedema. Maybe I should be letting the head of the procedures center know about this problem.

Thank you so much for the support and understanding. I am so .... I can't even think of the words to describe it.

Just tired of this being an issue all the time.Tired of uninformed staff. Tired of informing them. Tired of the talking about how dangerous foot IVs are (even if no other health issues). They should be offering me alternatives to help me, NOT me telling them. Plus the hyper, argumentative pain dr I have now.

What to do....what to do...what to do....

Anonymous · June 2013

thank you so much for the support and understanding. I am so .... I can't even think of the words to describe it.

Oh I hear you ! Cinnamon this is sooo stressful for you. Im so sorry and these nightmare stories are awful! In the end we all have to weigh up what is the best for us out of a bad lot of options. Sucks I know. BIG HUGS.

I know how stressful this can be for those of us who would RATHER NOT ARGUE. As if it's not hard enough without that... In the end if we can find it within us, rather than cave we have to do what we've got to do...and that means standing up against these arrogant Medical professionals who ABUSE their position and know full well you are in a vulnerable position where they can take a power trip against you. This is unacceptable.

I wonder what he would do if I asked for someone else to start an IV.

What can he do? Surely you have a right if he cant do it?

Maybe I should be letting the head of the procedures center know about this problem.

Im not sure what time zone youre in and so I guess the time is so short to your procedure. I just don't know what more to say if theres time get on that phone and do what you can do try and get someone competent.

All the best. Please keep us updated.

Grief About a Foot IV

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