ER+ & Soy ???

I take Tamoxifen, so after I read truebff's post about soy in fish oil supplements, I called the manufacturer and checked. They said, yes it's in there (it doesn't say so on the label in any of the names I could find used for soy). Then I found this list for people that are allergic to soy so they would know what to avoid.  Well, just about everything it seems!  And I saw the name that the soy in my supplements must have been hiding behind - mixed tocopherols.

Here's the link to things that contain some form of soy:

http://foodallergies.about.com/od/soyallergies/a/List-Of-Soy-Ingredients-To-Avoid-When-Following-A-Soy-Free-Diet.htm

momoschki, near the end of the article is a link to other products besides food that contain soy. 

Of course, it's impossible to avoid all of these things, so I will at least quit swallowing these 2 giant pills (my fish oil) intentionally everyday.  Also, I noticed the first ingredient in mayonnaise is soybean oil!

Edited to add: I remember when I was in college, my boyfriend worked for the Agronomy Department at UGA. We would drive by fields and fields of soybeans. I asked him what they were; he said these are going to supply protein to the huge projected world population in the future. In the 80's, the soybean business formed a powerful lobby and now they have soy put in everything. So, no, most of us were not raised eating soy.  I don't think it started appearing in our diets - unbeknownst to us - until the 1980's. 

Mark Messina is "the executive director of the Soy Nutrition Institute".  That's not to suggest that he isn't an expert on the topic - clearly he is - but it might suggest a level of bias in which studies he chooses to talk about and which he passes by.

Here's a small recent study that shows a negative impact of soy on pre-menopausal women: Soy Isoflavone Supplements Did Not Provide Breast Cancer Protections

The following study is interesting because it notes a benefit of soy consumption for Asian women but not Western women.  This confirms a concern that many of us have with the positive soy studies, because almost all have been done exclusively with Asian populations.  So the relevance and applicability to those of us who grew up with Western diets is suspect.  Soy isoflavones consumption and risk of breast cancer incidence or recurrence: a meta-analysis of prospective studies. 

Here's an interesting article that looks at human studies, animal studies and at the biological effects of isoflavones. Does consuming isoflavones reduce or increase breast cancer risk? The authors make some interesting statements and conclusions:

"caution needs to be taken in the interpretation of the epidemiological studies in that they may have simply identified a 'healthy user effect' - in which the participants in the studies are more likely to have healthy lifestyles than the general population - and not reflected a direct effect of soy intake." 

"Although epidemiological studies suggest that isoflavones can decrease both breast cancer risk and even increase survival of breast cancer patients, the intervention studies and animal experiments are not as conclusive. We can at least say that for post-menopausal women there are no serious adverse effects following the consumption of soy isoflavones for a limited period of time. However, for younger women, children and women with a genetic predisposition for breast cancer, the ratio between beneficial and adverse effects remains to be elucidated."

"...the possibility that isoflavones have different effects on breast cancer risks between different ethnic groups with different genetic backgrounds needs to be taken into account." 

And here's the HER2+ study referenced by Deanna:  Differential influence of dietary soy intake on the risk of breast cancer recurrence related to HER2 status. 

I was also wondering about hair color. The other day my hairdresser was unpacking her haircolor and I notice on the box it said Soy in big letters, and yes there was soy in the dye.  She did have some that didn't have soy and used that on me.  Do we really have to be this carefull?  Who would have thought it would come to this. 

Here's an interesting study on soy, which suggests that soy is beneficial for those who consume soy continuously from childhood but may be harmful to those who start to consume as adults:

Link Between Breast Cancer Resistance And Timing Of Soy Consumption 

my understanding is that fermented soy (like soy suace) is fine. It's all the other stuff and the oil you have to watch out for.

wenweb, thanks.

I love fermented soy and cook with Thai spices and Asian dishes and love them. Give me hot Thai peppers too! Yes! 

As far as the "added bad soy" in so many things, I am actually eating better than ever and healthier leaving all that behind and learning how to make my own salad dressings and using grass fed cow butter and great better oils like grape seed oil and avocado oil, for sauteing and cooking and walnut oil and aged raspberry vinegar for dressings, etc.

Edited to include: We all need to make our own choices. It is helpful for me that these threads and sharing and conversations help me to learn more and more.

My cancer centre pharmacy has advised no soy or flax seed, and I'm on Tamo. There's soy in everything and they told me that a small amount won't hurt but to try to avoid it as much as possible. I've been on Zoladex to shut down my ovaries since September and take Tamo and suffer from hot flashes, so I'm not willing to "test" out whether the phytoestrogens will feed my cancer or not. My cancer is regressing and I've avoided soy and flax, etc. So I'm going to continue to avoid it.