Stop SUGAR Support Thread

bcisnofun - if you are trying to reduce just sugar, then yes...if you are looking at total carbs (which convert to sugar) then you want to look at the carb content.  I'm not crazy about any of those "vitamin" drinks - they taste very sweet to me.  I am finding V8 Fusion Light to be somewhat acceptable but more carbs than I usually "drink".  I also have an OceanSpray Cranberry that has just 4 carbs in the whole bottle.

Another "gotcha" on drinks is that the nutritional content on the larger containers is for 8 ounces only.  So keep that in mind..you can easily drink several tablespoons of sugar without realizing it!  I prefer to eat my carbs, especially since I limit them to between 60 - 100 a day.  That is a "maintenance" load that keeps my blood sugar in check. 

Michelle

ma111, 
Firstly, thank you so much for encouraging me to go back and look more closely at the study as I have read through it many times and missed the vital link I've been looking for.  These studies tax my brain so I end up skimming over parts of them.    

The whole study was about dietary energy restriction (DER) in order to reduce our blood glucose levels as cancer requires glucose to grow. High energy diets (HED) were also shown to increase the growth of cancer.

*First, in the introduction they established known facts from previous studies, ie;  

- A large prospective study has defined an increased risk of mortality from breast cancer up to 2.12-fold for women with increased body mass index (BMI) compared to normal weight individuals .
- ...diet-induced obesity has been shown to promote the incidence of mammary tumor development...
- Caloric restriction has been demonstrated to be an effective method to decrease cancer incidence and tumor growth including mammary tumors...

*They then set out to find out if it's the calories that are the cause of these previous findings, if not then they need to pursue other reasons.   They inform the reader that Metformin mimics caloric restriction by  "increasing insulin sensitivity. Increased insulin signaling results in reduced insulin levels, reduced hepatic gluconeogenesis and increased glucose uptake by muscle".   So Metformin is a caloric restriction mimetic (CRM).  That's the missing puzzle piece for me as we can mimic the therapeutic actions of Metformin by restricting our calories.

So in the study they showed that whether they reduced calories or administered Metformin, the effect was to slow or stop primary cancer growth.  When calorie intake was raised the cancer grew quicker regardless of whether Metrormin was given.  So in other words, Metformin on it's own won't work.  It has to be balanced by a low to average dietary intake. 

*Note that "When metastatic disease was evaluated, only the application of DER resulted in a significant repression of lung lesions."  Metformin is not enough and they think maybe the addition of an anti-inflammatory might work, but it has been shown in another recent study that including sufficient anti-oxidants to the diet prevents the cancer from obtaining it's large glucose requirements and starves the cancer till it dies in mice. 

In other studies requiring high anti-oxidants they use Alpha Lipoic Acid (the supplement ALA) which works best in one dose of around 600mgs, preferably before fasting overnight.   ALA may also be an anti-inflammatory.

So to summarise, a low caloric, high anti-oxidant, anti-inflammatory, high anti-cancer nutrient diet has the potential to prevent a recurrence or nip early mets in the bud, subject to further trials. 

When evaluating studies on humans (and mice, eh I tend to have a hard time extrapolating mice data to humans much) - remember that fat folks' biochemistry is definitely different than thin folks regarding insulin response to sugars. Speaking as a former very fat person, I have read alot about the biochemistry of fat people. Our insulin and leptin mechanisms get driven by the fat we already have on board, not to mention what we are consuming. So what works to improve metabolism, etc. in normal weight people has to be considered differently than in obese people. For example, obese people do not have normal leptin responses to food - leptin should decrease appetite and increase metabolism. Doesn't work that way in obesity.

Well, I am a long-time diabetic, on metformin since 2001, who lost 40 pounds and now has a bmi of 22, who still got breast cancer.  I've restricted sugar and calories for a decade.  I suspect the metformin clinical trials will find certain types of cancers for which metformin might not be effective.  In any case, I'm still taking it (2000 mg a day) and I'm sticking to my low carb diet (most of the time) on the hope that it will prevent mets. 

They don't know what they don't know, with diabetes and with breast cancer. 

Michelle

Both Metformin and low energy diets work on the first source of cancer's energy needs; circulating blood sugar. When blood sugar levels run low the cancer uses a protein compound in the body called NF-kB to switch over to glycolysis where it can manufacture glucose itself which is the second source.  This is where the strong anti-oxidants come in as they are NF-kB inhibitors.  By inhibiting NF-kB, the cancer can no longer get glucose from glycolysis and with very high glucose requirements, it dies.  For this to work, both sources of glucose must be dealt with.  So the slim health food eater may still not be getting a low energy diet but enough to maintain her weight. The diabetic on Metformin may still be getting too many calories as it only works with a low to moderate energy intake, and neither of them would be getting enough anti-oxidants as it takes large doses.

I too was only a little overweight and with a healthy diet, drinking green tea etc before my diagnosis so I'm a big skeptic.  For cancer to starve, (if this works in humans), we need a lot of anti-oxidants at the same time as the low energy diet and no cheating.   I envisage myself doing this for three months every year to nip anything new in the bud.  The rest of the year I'll just eat healthy.  I have a relative waiting to find out if she has pancreatic cancer, the same cancer that killed my father six weeks after his diagnosis.  Another close relative and father to two young boys died from oesophageal cancer, and a non-smoking friend died from lung cancer at just 21, all of these were diagnosed too late to save them.   Probably a third of my elderly relatives died from cancer.  I won't live in fear, after all, I have this formula now that I believe in until someone proves otherwise.

Who knows if it really works, but surely it's worth a try, especially for our stage IV sisters.

Both parts of this formula must be used daily:

1. Either a low energy diet OR a low to moderate energy diet combined with Metformin.

2. High anti-oxidants from a strong supplement. 

The exact formula needs to be trialed.  Unfortunately many Metformin trials are planned or have just been started without the benefit of knowing the recent low energy diet plus high anti-oxidant study results. 

Thank you Michelle and Amy for your excellent observations and questions.  Michelle, I suspect there may be another factor with those aggressive cancers that strike down young women so tragically.  One doctor has a theory that cancer is a form of metabolic illness that explains why we are more vulnerable as we age.  But at a young age it may be something else.

I agree there are no guarantees and this is just something that looks promising.  For me it is very doable and also will get my weight down and hopefully keep diabetes away. What do I have to lose?

XmasDX:  I'm right there with you -- trying to quit sugar AGAIN. It's an ongoing battle. You're on the wagon, you fall off the wagon, you try try try again. I  was doing well until July and then it's just been a good week here, a bad few weeks there, a good couple of days, a bad week...on and on thru the summer. But I am re-committed to making healthy choices and as of last Wed night (Oct. 12) I have not had any sugar. I keep telling myself, "it's not worth the extra calories -- or the mood swings!" My naturopathic chiropractor keeps reminding me that sugar just puts the body in such a state of imbalance, it's the culprit for a lot of woes.

Oh, also like you mentioned -- there is an addiction quality to this for me, too. The first few days were so bad -- I was prowling around the kitchen just using all my willpower to not grab something sugary (in my case, chocolate). Every time I finished a meal, I felt all sad and deprived cuz I'm so used to always having some chocolate afterward (yes, even breakfast). I felt like I had nothing to look forward to and that made me depressed. And then I  thought " well , wait a minute. How pathetic is THAT? Chocolate has become so much a part of my life that I feel like there's nothing good in my day now? Let's think about that a little, shall we?" So I have been really analyzing my feelings and why I have let sugar have so much power in my life. I hope this doesn't sound crazy.

Now, I for sure do not plan to go rest of my life without chocolate. I just need to re-train myself to allow it as a special treat, not an every couple of hours necessity. Right now, it feels like a slippery slope. I am home on my lunch break and I just finished eating and am jonesing for some chocolate pretty bad. But feel that if I give in now...a Tuesday afternoon...I will just start adding it back in until I'm consuming too much every day again. So I am keeping an iron grip on my willpower for now...I do feel so much better off the sugar ! I have to keep reminding myself of that fact !

My new goal is to quit sugar- I admit, I think I am an addict!! I plan to read back thru the thread as soon as I can but I realize I have to get this under control. I am not overweight, I exercise 4 to 5 times a week,etc but my weak spot is my eating habits. I need major help!

I too heard that sugar basically feeds cancer so i have tried EVERYTHING as a substitute but kind of wanted to avoid the chemical route as well. I found the agave to be an amazing substitute but just don't know if it affect cancer cells the same way as sugar or if the low glycemic factor is what you look for in determining the benefit of an alternative...If it is, you should definitely try it - way sweeter than sugar but you lose so much less and to me, there's no bad taste, aftertaste...it's almost too good to be true; I'm waiting for some attorney to start shooting commercials about how it's really not agave, but sugar..that's how good it is...

I am a serious sugar and chocolate addict.  I gave up wheat gluten a week ago and as hard as you would think that would be to stick to, I did it.  I was trying to see if doing so would help ease my joint pain from Arimidex as one lady suggested it had for her.  I will give it another week.  You would think that if I could give that up, I should be able to do the same with sugar.  I think I will try to limit (no candy, cakes, cookies, etc.) along with the wheat gluten this week and see how that works.

Interesting article:

http://undergroundhealthreporter.com/turkey-tail-mushroom

I also am intrigued by the uses of some other mushrooms mentioned here... including something called Hen in the Woods which can help reduce blood sugar and blood pressure levels:

http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/QAA400904/Turkey-Tail-Mushrooms-for-Cancer-Treatment.html

Hi,

A friend of mine always said,"I don't know what you'd do if you ever became a diabetic." instead I am here. I love food, especially baked goods, chocolate and jujubes. I am just starting my journey but instead of loss of appetite, my sweet craving has quadrupled. I have gained 10 pounds since August. This seems to be a thread that may help me get back on track. Is it okay to join? What migght be a first suggestion? I am no good at stopping cold turkey.

dragonfly55:  Try removing as much white from your diet as possible.  No white bread, potatoes, rice, etc, and certainly no sugar.  Instead load up on vegetables, eggs, certain fruits like blueberries and rasberries, lean meat and fish.  You will be amazed that in a very short period of time you will no longer crave sugar.  If you just give up sugar and allow all the other stuff to stay in your diet, you will still have the craving because the body converts carbs to sugar if it is not getting enough from other sources like desserts and sugary drinks.  You have to make a comittment to try it for at least two weeks because that is how long it will take to detox your body from its sugar cravings. 

Since going on this diet, I have lost weight, and I really wasn't trying to lose.  I noticed that I have much more energy and don't get sleepy in the afternoon like I used to. 

Dragonfly - you are getting some awesome advice!  The one thing I found was the first few grocery shopping trips took forever because I read every label.  I looked specifically for the brand of whatever with the lowest carbs per serving.  You'd be surprised at how different brands of something like spaghetti sauce can vary in their carbs and sugar content.  I still check labels when I shop, and I've been at this for ten years!

I removed almost all refined sugar from my diet 4 years ago.  However, I have a treat EVERY night.  I have 90% dark chocolate (a small square that is 55 calories and 2.5g of sugar).  I put a nice soft dried apricot on it.  The whole thing is 75 calories and VERY yummy.  I look forward to it every night after dinner.  It is a tiny amount of sugar and really hits my sweet spot well.  Maybe this might work for someone else?

After lunch I  treat myself to a small piece of 72 % dark chocolate with sea salt and peacan. This goes very well together with a handful of blueberries and a couple of walnuts.

As I am weaning myself off suger I find that a little goes a long way.