Hormonal Girls
Comments
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Good news for me ! Was taking Fenugreek to up my RBC and had not bargained for this :
".....Our experiments show that while the soybean extract acts as a promoter of MCF-7 cell growth, the fenugreek extract induces apoptosis"
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Cancer-Causing Hexavalent Chromium In Tap Water For 89% Of US Sampled Cities
Carcinogenic hexavalent chromium, the "Erin Brockovich chemical" was found in the tap water of 31 cities out of a total of 35 tested by the Environmental Working Group. The scientists estimate that at least 74 million people in the USA in 42 states regularly drink chromium-tainted water, and a considerable proportion of it is in the carcinogenic hexavalent form.
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I"m very confused as to how turmeric can both supposedly cause estrogen dependent cell proliferation:
and yet shows EXTREME promise in binding to the receptors and preventing it! http://www.common-sense-health.com/turmeric-for-breast-cancer.htm
This explains how it actually down regulates BC cells: http://www.herbcompanion.com/herb-profiles/Spotlight-on-Turmeric.aspx?page=3
"Horner writes and educates extensively about turmeric and breast cancer. She says the herb can block breast cancer-causing toxins, such as DDT and chlordane, which mimic the estrogen molecule in our body (too much estrogen has been found to be the primary cause of breast cancer). Turmeric can reduce the estrogenic effect of these pesticides and help block them from attaching to the estrogen receptors in the breast. In addition, turmeric "down regulates" the estrogen receptor so the response isn't as great, and breast cells don't divide as rapidly as they normally would."
http://altered-states.net/barry/cancer/curcumin.htm (Worldwide clinical trials have chiseled out a definite place for curcumin in oncology. Among them are New York Presbyterian Hospital and the Weill Medical College, which reported that curcumin, a curcuminoid found in turmeric, directly inhibited the COX-2 enzyme (Zhang et al. 1999). So excited are various oncologists regarding curcumin that the potent anti-inflammatory has been classed as a potential third generation cancer chemopreventive agent.)
These are just a couple of the sites I was able to find - there is a lot more - mice who were given turmeric, etc. Women from cultures with a diet rich in turmeric have lower BC rates.
I am confused as to why some of these studies are now saying that it actually caused proliferation? Something's missing somewhere - it can't do both!
By the way, that's an awesome signature line Luan!
(Ring the bell and run....) -
Hi Calamtikel, great research u,ve done, thanks ! Will read when i,m at the computer. The only thing i can say for now is that before dx and for at least 5 years prior i was taking this miracle supplement for fibromyalgia, chronic pain & co: Ligamend by Nu Life, an excellent cndn co. One of the major ingredient is curcumin, 1500 mg (standardized at 95% curcuminoids) amongst many other great ingredients. Obviously, it did not prevent BC for me. Did it slow it down, kept it to a grade 1? Only God knows. If we could clear this up (we all have sooo much to research), i would love to continue taking it, am a bit reluctant right now, my tumors were 95%+ . Thank u so much for your contribution and let,s keep each other apprised, hugs. Oh and one of my favourite spices is curry, use it a lot....
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You're asking hard questions - I think we all do that when we are diagnosed. "Did _____ that I did cause this? Or did it hold it off?" I wonder about my four pregnancies - would I have gotten BC earlier? Or did nursing four children, and having VERY bad boughts of mastitis especially in the left side cause my BC by damaging the cells? Or was the BC there and that is why I had the severe mastistitis 7 years ago? Did all the carrot juice and dandelion juice and beet juice I drank during my pregancies and nursing hold back BC or did it just do nothing at all? Do I have this because I chewed my Barbie doll's feet when I was five? Or is it from the water I drank?
They are all hard questions and ones we all ask. I know what you mean about the turmeric, and if I'm hit with a recurrence I'm sure I'm going to ask all of these all question all over again, examining my life under a microscope.
I'm one who refused tamoxifen because the three weeks I was on it were three weeks of hell far worse than chemo ever was. Yet there are women who have recurrences on the tamoxifen.
I guess nothing is the silver bullet. And the question would be how estrogenic is curcumin? IE - how much estrogen would say three pills a day cause? As opposed to exposures to plastic or even soy or lavendar/tea tree oil? I would be interested to see studies on that -- it could also be how each person's body synthesizes these compounds.
I do know that a lot of it has to do with how the liver processes estrogen and what it does with it and how it removes it from the body. So a key factor in at least helping to reduce recurrence is a good healthy liver that has been detoxed and can function well. Certain pancreatic enzymes have also been found to destroy cancer cells in the body. So it's important to keep the pancreas in a good place too.
I for one, would like to see some of the money that is always being raised for BC "awareness" and such, going for actual, definitive studies on these substances that we are all in question about so that we have definitive answers as to yay or nay to soy, turmeric, etc...........
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Good thread. I am strongly ER/PR+ and have tried to figure out what I should/should not eat since getting diagnosed. I too have been reading www.foodforbreastcancer.com and The Anti Cancer. I am trying to do as much of the recommended things as possible. It still seems very contradictory on some things......It's so confusing! You feel like you are always second guessing what to eat/not eat. For the most part I have eliminated refined food, refined sugar, plastic water bottles, any canned foods (due to BPA), soy, food with hormones/antibiotics, non organic fruits/veggies/dairy, trans fats, soybean oil and I rarely eat any red meat. I eat limited organic dairy or at least lowfat dairy with no growth hormones. I need to add in some green tea and I was going to add turmeric but now I don't know what to do about that. I need to focus on omegas too. I feel like doing these things helps think I am helping myself now that chemo is over. I feel like I am doing something to fight this from coming back. Who else is drinking green tea? Any recommendations for brands? I don't like any coffee or tea....how can I prepare this so it tastes OK? I hate the thought ot gagging it down every day....blech!
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Calamtykel - I hear you ! First the earth stood still then the questions: what was it that I did or didn't do ? and the same questions still haunt me 18 months later as I'm obssessed at trying to prevent any recurrence at all costs. I want my life to be normal again, but I think I'm asking too much.....
Being stage 3, I can't afford a pass on Tamox and you're right, it's hell, worse than chemo, plus the more probable interactions, the more intricate it becomes. I am so with you about the liver (an amazing organ which can be cut to a 1/3 of its size and regenerate) and the pancreas. Am taking a supplement with mostly silymarin to restore function after such an assault as chemo and all the meds. Am also taking probiotics. I want to do a lot more research on the digestive system, as it might be the source of all evils, the intestines being a major source of our immunity.
You are sooo lucky to have four precious children and you defied more than one of the risk factors by having them in the first place and breastfeeding. I believe they have to rethink the risk factors and pour a whole lot more of research money into the carcinogens that we breathe, eat, drink, touch, etc. I totally agree with you that more research money is also needed on natural substances.
I've got the book mentioned in my OP and the back-up research is very impressive, I tend to find them credible. Also, I've got another title, cannot afford the book right now, so cannot speak for it: "The anti-estrogenic diet: How Estrogenic Foods and Chemicals are Making you Fat and Sick" by Ori Hofmekler
Hi MDG ! You've done a great job at eliminating ! I absolutely agree with you that the more proactive we are, the more power we feel we have over our health. I'm religiously taking my Omega 3, helps with a ton of issues. As for green tea, I'm with you on that one, DO NOT like the taste....I've read that the best is the Japanese Macha, organic of course, always buy the leaves as they are more potent, never boil the water, pour over leaves just before boiling point. There is a thread on green tea you may want to ckeck out. The ladies have come up with some pretty neat ideas, i.e. a bit of lemon juice to counter the taste and you are not alone in not liking
My ex-boss has skin cancer and he swears by green tea !Many many kinds of Japanese green tea at : http://chanoya.com/boutique/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1
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mdg - I drink the Brassica Green Tea that is recommended by Johns Hopkins Breast cancer site. I have only found it online. The Green Tea with orange is my favorite and I put some tangerine or orange wedges (without the skin) in the tea. It's quite good and I've learned to drink it without adding any sweetner. I have ordered the decaf green tea for drinking in the afternoon. I don't find that as good but try not to have caffine after 2 PM. 2 cups a day is recommended.
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My DIM contains curcumin along with green tea extract, black pepper, and wasabia japonica. Would be strange to put something estrogenic in a product that's supposed to facilitate the elimination of estrogens. Although I guess it's more for the 'bad' estrogens and their pathways. Oye! Will have to ask my ND.
Regarding green tea, I love Japanese Matcha in powder form, that way you only make a 'shot size' amount and can consume it quickly if you don't like the taste. I also add it to my smoothies sometimes.
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Valgirl, what does Brassica mean, any relationship to the brassica family ? That's what I find with green tea, it prevents me from sleeping
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Luan - I think the Brassica is just the name. The Brassica tea has SGS in it (the antioxident found in Brocco Sprouts) . It was developed by a team of scientists at Johns Hopkins. You can read more at www.brassicatea.com. I only drink the decaf green tea in the afternoon. It's not as good as the green tea with orange but I add some tangerine wedges to it and it's fine. I'm drinking my green tea at least 2 cups a day as recommended.
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Thanks Valgirl ! I'm guessing we'll have to be careful and stock up now on Japanese green tea......
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I hate green tea!
I need to find a way to "like" it. For a while, I was on a special green tea supplement but since my supplements are based on "nutritional response testing" through muscle testings (my herbalist is a chiropractor/naturopathic dr) it's an on again off again thing as my body tests for it. (Kinda confusing, but it works.) Can someone tell me exactly what green tea leaves are? Is it he same as making green tea from the mint or red raspberry leaves I have growing outside? Or are they a special leaf?
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I hate green tea!
I need to find a way to "like" it. For a while, I was on a special green tea supplement but since my supplements are based on "nutritional response testing" through muscle testings (my herbalist is a chiropractor/naturopathic dr) it's an on again off again thing as my body tests for it. (Kinda confusing, but it works.) Can someone tell me exactly what green tea leaves are? Is it he same as making green tea from the mint or red raspberry leaves I have growing outside? Or are they a special leaf?
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Calamtykel, yes it,s the same, buying the whole leaf is the same principle as the french coffee press, to obtain the oils where all the medicinal phytochemicals can be found. Chin, chin
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I read the article about chamomille and it didn't make any sense to me as proof to avoid chamomile tea. Not all research is good research. However, everyone has to do what they are comfortable with.
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Hrf, i believe that when many sources come to the same conclusion, one has to start questioning. i have no personal interest in promoting or not chamomille....it grows in a field near you ! Do u have research that says chamomille is non estrogenic and beneficial for bc? but then there are people who do not give credence to hormonal impacts on bc, everyone has the right to their own opinion. Enjoy that cup of chamomille tea !
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Copied from other thread for Luan.
Marciroberts, I use Glucomsamine, Chondrotin and MSM. Must have the MSM. I take it twice a day. Also try cutting down on inflammation causing foods.
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Thanks Pip, am adding the bit about the tea
, hope you don't mind"Green tea is great but white tea is over looked and is found to have even more antioxidants. It also has a much smoother taste."
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Coincidence, just came upon a note (have zillions) on the best green tea available.
"Gyokuro is the finest Japanese tea known as "precious dew". Carefully grown under diffused sunlight for 20 days before harvesting. It has a rich, sweet, dense infusion with a hint of marine flavor and a long lingering aftertaste. Nothing like in other teas. Uji, Kyoto is traditionally specialized in Gyokuro and Macha production. Their tea leaves are often blended with other prefectures' tea due to their small product quantity. This gyokuro is a pure Uji product without being processed or blended, owing to a direct distribution from a tea producer. This unique type of farmer's tea is difficult to find recently, and its natural flavor is in demand in the tea market in Japan. Suggestion; For a special occasion, a unique gift for tea connoisseurs. It's important to transfer the infusion into a cup completely. The true flavor of Gyokuro is in the last drop."
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Sorry, didn't know you wanted the tea bit too. I am a huge tea fan so of course I don't mind at all!
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As requested Luan...x
Another member recently asked what kind of leaves are in Green tea? I also wondered the same thing when my girlfriend bought me some bags of green and oolong tea from a herbal shop in China Town. I couldn't understand what was written on the packaging because it was all in Chinese.
There's a lot of info online...and I found these very informative...
http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/green-tea-000255.htm
"Green, black, and oolong tea are all derived from the leaves of the Camellia Sinensis plant. Originally cultivated in East Asia, this plant grows as large as a shrub or tree. Today, Camellia Sinensis grows throughout Asia and parts of the Middle East and Africa.
Green tea is prepared from unfermented leaves, the leaves of oolong tea are partially fermented, and black tea is fully fermented. The more the leaves are fermented, the lower the polyphenol content and the higher the caffeine content. Green tea has the highest polyphenol content while black tea has roughly 2 - 3 times the caffeine content of green tea."
http://www.greenteainformation.org/
"Unlike black tea, which is completely oxidized, green tea leaves are simply steamed and hence ensure the preservation of useful antioxidants, tannins and flavonoids.
The best way to get a good cup of green tea is to keep the temperature measured. The ideal temperature will bring out the best in those green tea leaves. As a general rule, a temperature between 140F and 185F is suitable. If water temperature is too scalding, it will make the tea bitter and the delicate aroma will be lost."
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Well now I know why my green tea is sooo bitter.
Breville has a new kettle called...the Variable temp kettle with 5 temperature settings - Because different teas need different brewing temperatures. (Makes sense)
http://www.breville.com.au/professional-800-collectionr-variable-temperature-kettle.html
I don't think I'll run out and purchase one straight away...because I recently purchased a new kettle. But I'll leave my boiled water to sit a little before adding it to my leaves.
Victoria
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White tea? What is that? I'm showing my All American girl love of coffee I suppose! ;D
Back on the turmeric, this may have been posted, but Foodforbreastcancer.com recommends it for BC - it cites some articles............
It does have some precautions, but I don't see any that are estrogen related. It also states that black pepper is shown to enhance the benefits, but I think that was discussed here previously - however, there is a lack of population studies and most of the testing was done in vitro.....(of course, - no drug company is going to fund a turmeric study....)
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White tea is from the same plant as green tea but the leaves are less fermented and picked at an earlier stage. Here is an article with an overview.
http://www.whiteteacentral.com/whiteteavsgreen.html
I drink both, depending on my preference. I only use the loose leaves. Green tea matcha powder, without any sweeteners, is also a favorite of mine on yogurt and fruit every morning.
Re turmeric: We have a shaker that we mix garlic powder, black pepper and turmeric in equal parts. We sprinkle it on soups, veggies...well just about everything we eat.
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Hello ladies !
Love, love herbs and spices. I use the curry powder on everything, eventually want to make it from scratch and grind as I go, apparently incomparable.
LOVE LOVE the sweet spices, I buy a mixture, the Garam Masala, which I want to grind myself also (when I get organized, if ever
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hi,girls! yesterday I was on one meeting about Chinese medicine.
speaker told about "Chaga"-cancer sells killer
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Hi Hopeinfitcher ! Thanks for the info, I believe that it was also a topic on Dr. Oz
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Thanks Susan. I will check up on that.
Sometimes I think that my body is made up entirely of antioxidants now! LOL
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In place of tamoxifen I used to take i3c, and it was combined with Rosmarinus officinalis (rosemary). I now drink rosemary tea and consume the leaves in several dishes. Not a bad little addition for us ER+ girls...and overall healthy well being.
http://www.ehow.com/about_6701191_rosemary-breast-cancer.html
Victoria
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pip - that sounds fabulous =- I'm going to try that in s shaker! DOes anyone order from Penzeys? That is my FAVORITE spice place. Their Cajun Blend contains turmeric, among other things- it's amazing on popcorn!
Right now I'm growing rosemary in the garden along with oregano. I love rosemary but I haven't much luck growing it so I use it sparingly. Again - it's great on popcorn (just about anything is!) Trader Joe's sells organic popcorn reasonably.
My herbalist says he likes to use turmeric with rosemary since they work synergisically probably like black pepper and turmeric.
Going to make a concerted effort to drink green tea today in this heat wave - have a box of organic green tea that I need to give some attention to!
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