"Shoulder Pain"?

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Artemis
Artemis Member Posts: 759
edited June 2014 in Lymphedema

Hello, Ladies ~
I've seen "shoulder pain" listed as a warning sign and/or symptom of LE, and many of you here mention shoulder pain.  My question is:  just where is this pain?  Is it in the muscles, bones, both or what?

My node shoulder hurts almost constantly right in the joint.  At times, I wish there was a slot there so that I could shove a pain pill into it.  I know not to use anything like Icy Hot or a heating pad; I have recently been using Aspercreme since there's no heat in it, and I hope that's ok to use?!?

Also, I sometimes get a burning pain in my upper arm.  It feels circular and is about where a tribal tattoo would be. Oh yes, and I sometimes get that feeling that faithandfifty described as "pillow in my armpit"...but that's rare.  I have no cording or visible swelling.

I do MLD and wear a sleeve and gauntlet when doing things that may strain my arm (dance, crochet, play guitar).  I've not been diagnosed with LE (saw therapist in August '09), but I'm wondering it I might be getting myself a mild case of it. Undecided

Oh well, I feel like I'm rambling here.  Any input from anyone will be most appreciated! Smile

Artemis 

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  • Tamara67646
    Tamara67646 Member Posts: 293
    edited January 2011

    Artemis,

    I don't know if shoulder pain is related to LE but maybe this comment will bump you back up the thread. 

     I have shoulder pain and range of motion issues on that side and 2 1/2 years out from my surgery, just developed LE.  I think maybe the shoulder issues are related to "frozen shoulder" if you have begun to limit your movement on that side because of other issues related to surgery.  I also have rotator cuff issues on my non-surgical side and think that I may have similiar issues on my surgey side - I blame too many doses of Cipro on the rotator cuff issue - one of the SE of Cipro can be tendon problems.

    My shoulder pain is in the joint and when I move my arm in certain positions - the pain radiates across the top of my shoulder and into my arm. I don't have pain if I am "at rest" - just with certain movements.  

    Physical therapy and regular stretching helps my shoulder pain.

    Good luck  

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  • charmainejensenvoisine
    charmainejensenvoisine Member Posts: 369
    edited January 2011

    I am so happy that I have found this thread.

    I was dx with two types of breast cancer in the fall of 2009.

    I had chemo December 2009 - February 2010 and radiation therapy 30 session March 2010.

    I noticed that around August 2010 that I started to get shoulder pain on the side of my surgery (lymph nodes removed only 3 of them). Also have limited motion - I cannot raise my arm straight up and when I try I get pain from my shoulder and ball of shoulder down part of upper arm.

    Charmaine

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  • Alpal
    Alpal Member Posts: 1,785
    edited January 2011

    NOMB, as I don't have lymphedema, but your symptoms sound exactly like "frozen shoulder". Quite common in BC patients and there are at least 2 threads on here about it. Just do a search. PT is the answer, if that's it. Good luck

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  • LizM
    LizM Member Posts: 963
    edited January 2011

    I've had frozen shoulder twice and went through PT both times.  In hindsight I wish I would have had an evaluation by a lymphadema specialist at the time but didn't think of it because I thought you had to have swelling and I didn't notice any.  Now I am probably going to get my 3d frozen shoulder diagnosis but I am going to get an evaluation for LE as well since my symptoms are a little different this time.  Due to my BLMX, ALND and rads on my left side I am at risk for both frozen should and LE.  I have a lot of scar tissue in my upper left chest area and a left shoulder that does not function properly.  I also have some pain in the shoulder but what bothers me the most is the achiness and heaviness in my arm down to my hands.  I was not keeping up with my exercises to keep my frozen shoulder at bay and overused my arm during the holidays and then went into my hot tub at 105 degrees on New Years eve.  I think all of that may have triggered LE and is causing my pain.  Still trying to get on a waiting list for an appt with an LE specialist.  They are definately hard to come by and even harder to get appointments with.  Bottom Line:  We are at risk for both frozen shoulder and LE and I think they can be related and you can have both. 

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  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited January 2011

    YES YES YES.  Dealing with terrible shoulder pain.  Had MRI - diagnosed as "inflamation"  Seeing PT but that is going SOOO slow.  Many limitations,  like I can't  lift anything over 2 pounds over my head.  Every activity is limited, shopping, meals, laundry etc etc

    So frustrating.  Dr. said ICE on shoulder -- right on the top and heat all around, meaning the muscle area.  I also have a prescription gel I rub in twice a day for the inflamation.

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  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    The problem with standard PT is that it can often trigger LE with the repetitive motions, so it's important to be aware of that.

    I broke my LE hand, and my OT is LE certified, but I think I"m the first person she's treated for hand therapy with LE: and she pushed the weights too fast, and I flared. We both learned a lesson. Thank goodness she immediately "got it".

    Sherry Lebed Davis who has LE and has an exercise video, also has short videos on YouTube (where she doesn't wear her sleeve and glove) including stretches for frozen shoulder.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bneh_bB-5Yw&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNHshPi6lCE&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJ_w7f3fE68&feature=related

    She has a couple more, as she has 45 videos on YouTube, with several focusing on frozen shoulder.

    Just from wearing my cast, my shoulder got messed up--my deltoid is sore, and I wasn't able to fully stretch. These exercises feel good to me.

    Kira

    Liz--here's a way to find all the qualfied theapists in your area: use the therapist locator feature, and always talk to the therapist first and make sure it "feels right" to you:

    http://www.stepup-speakout.org/Finding_a_Qualified_Lymphedema_Therapist.htm

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  • NatsFan
    NatsFan Member Posts: 3,745
    edited January 2011

    My LE therapist diagnosed me with a shoulder impingement on both sides in addition to my LE - she said it's not uncommon in b/c patients as we get in the habit of hunching forward to ease the stress and pain in our chests after surgeries.  She incorporated treatment of that along with my LE therapy and did a great job with both. I have incorporated some of the shoulder exercises into my regular workout routine to keep the impingement issue at bay.  I was lucky Kira that my LE therapist was qualified as both a PT and LE therapist and could treat that that particular issue so I didn't run into the problem you had with a PT not having expertise with LE.       

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  • kira66715
    kira66715 Member Posts: 4,681
    edited January 2011

    Mary--my OT is Norton trained, but she kind of slipped into "hand therapy" mode with the fracture rehab, and got excited when my grip got stronger, and wanted me to do 40 reps twice a day with the weights, and my tennis elbow showed back up and my hand swelled. And she was mortified.

    So, a few minor adjustments: more putty, less weights, alternate sides with the weights to give the LE arm/hand a break, and it's all better. 

    My LE therapist is an LMT--so she doesn't touch PT issues, and my OT wanted to work on my tennis elbow, but the prescription was for hand therapy....

    It's just in my experience, some PT's don't really understand about LE, unless they're trained, and will often prescribe exercises that can cause a flare or trigger. Or, in the case of my hand OT--she knows, she just compartmentalized. I was worried about so many reps, so I never did the full 40, but still did a number on my elbow and hand.

    But, she's a great OT, and worked to fix the problem instantly. 

    Makes sense that we hunch, and get impingement.

    Kira

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  • LizM
    LizM Member Posts: 963
    edited January 2011

    This is probably a question that hasn't been asked in the LE forum but I just got back my routine blood work for my annual follow-up and my liver function tests, AST and ALT were slightly elevated.  My PCP wants me to repeat the test in 30 days but I am wondering if there is some connection between my arm pain and the elevated  tests.  My arms was really aching when I had the test done and I know that I overused my at risk arm during the holidays.  I have been reading that muscle damage/inflammation can cause elevation of these tests as well as possible liver damage.  Anyone know?  Getting a little worred.

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  • annamari
    annamari Member Posts: 82
    edited January 2011

    Shoulder pain and frozen shoulder are also side effects of radiation.  My Rad Onc told me this.  I have some discomfort but usually don't take any anelgesics for it.  I don't let it stop me from doing most things.  I find I get the most discomfort when I cradle my phone on my shoulder and do some other work.  It bothers me most in the eveningswhen I am tired.

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  • crystalphm
    crystalphm Member Posts: 1,138
    edited February 2011

    I too have been having alot of shoulder pain...I had a mastectomy 9 months ago, and am now seeing a physical therapist who is also an LE therapist, so I am hoping for the best. I have been doing stretching and range of motion for 4 weeks now, but no improvment. Pain all the time. How long could this take?

    I think my posture has been poor too, with having only the one breast removed, I have spent almost a year of hunching over....the bras and forms only make the shoulder worse.

    Thanks for anyone who can help or say a kind word...

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  • Binney4
    Binney4 Member Posts: 8,609
    edited February 2011

    Crystal, that's a bummer!Frown What does the PT say about what's causing the pain? It can take awhile in therapy to undo all the hunching and guarding we do after cancer treatment -- very discouraging! But with stretching and strengthening it does get better.

    If your bra and prosthesis is giving you grief, you may need to switch to a lighter weight form or a cami instead of a bra, or some other arrangement that doesn't aggravate the pain. Do you have a good fitter you can re-visit and get some ideas? Here's a website with lots of information about what's available for those of us who haven't done reconstruction:

    http://www.BreastFree.org

    Keep in touch with us and let us know how you're doing. By the way, I read your other recent post and just wanted to say that I hear you on the "anniversary of breast cancer" anxiety. Once treatment is over it's a struggle to deal with all we've been through. It's a kind of grieving -- it takes time, and it's hard work, but you're not alone! Tell us how we can help.

    Gentle hugs,
    Binney

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