Talk me down!
News from the San Antonio Breast Cancer Symposium:
This is great information, and I am so grateful for this research. Kiri is currently enrolled in an identical trial, comparing neoadjuvant chemotherapy with taxol plus herceptin & lapatinib, taxol plus herceptin only and taxol plus lapatinib only, randomized into three arms. She was put in the taxol plus lapatinib only arm. Initially I was thrilled as lapatinib seems to cross the BBB, as herceptin doesn't. But the results of the earlier study indicated total tumor response in 50% of the combo arm and only 25% of the lapatinib/taxol only arm, with the worst SE's in the taxol/lapatinib arm.
Lapatinib is not currenty approved for neoadjuvant chemotherapy (I'm pretty sure herceptin is) so there is no way she can request the combination treatment. And I am of several minds about this (as if I have a mind left at this point).
1, Kiri is 25 and I have been told clearly from the get-go to "step away from the computer and let me handle this and don't take over like you ALWAYS DO, Mom." I'm sure she and her extremely competent harvard team at Dana-Farber will discuss this and come to a conclusion that they're all happy with.
2. This is a clinical trial, and this is what you sign up for when you sign up for a clinical trial: chances. The opportunity to contribute to research that will help others down the line. And the chance you might not end up in the most successful section.
3. She WILL get herceptin, after her surgery, for a year. So maybe the combination sequentially will be just as effective.
4. Lapatinib is a small-cell molecule and works from the inside, as opposed to herceptin, which is a large molecule and works from the outside, which may explain the difference in the physical response. I am just guessing here. Kiri's tumor is getting softer, becoming more like a sponge. It's pretty much the same size from the outside. So maybe it's just a matter of a different effect on the cells.
5. In terms of shrinking her tumor to the point where she could get away with a lumpectomy rather than a mastectomy, the herceptin/lapatinib treatment might have been a clear preference. But she has extensive DCIS, which would probably necessitate a mastectomy anyway.
(Are you girls beginning to appreciate how good I am at rationalization yet? GRIN)
6. I did read, somewhere, I think, that significant shrinkage of tumor cells via neoadjuvant therapy was also sometimes associated with a similarly significant increase in circulating tumor cells, as if this "melting away" of the tumor had only released cells into the bloodstream. But to be honest, I don't think tht's the case with Herceptin--I think it really does destroy the HER2+ cells. Still, the correlation between preoperative shrinkage and long-term NED isn't entirely clear.
7. Kiri is at a great place, getting great treatment. I have to trust she will be taken care of.
8. There is not enough alcohol in the world....
Comments
-
"Lapatinib is not currently approved for neoadjuvant chemotherapy" but they do seem to be having excellent results with it for advanced HER2+ cancer. This is why it is now being tested with early HER2+ cancers. It was the same way with Herceptin. First they tested it with advanced HER+ cancer. It was successful so then the trails moved on to early… and Herceptin is now standard treatment for both.
I also posted this thread today: http://community.breastcancer.org/forum/80/topic/761920?page=1#idx_2
-
Thanks, Lago. I was just reading your thread! I agree it's frustrating to be in the middle of chemo when all this exciting new stuff is coming out, but to look on the bright side, this certainly improves the future for girls like you and Kiri--there will be so many more avenues of attack should you need them as time goes on.
Keeping a positive outlook!! Hope you're enjoying the holiday season.
-
Hi ladies,
I am also in the middle of neoadjuvant chemo, I did 4 FEC and my tumor shrunk so much that we can not feel it anymore, i have to do a ct scan to confirm it. My Chemo regime is 4 FEC and then 6 THC then surgery and then one year of Herceptin. . They were thinking if ts better to do surgery now or do it after finishing the 6 THC. Finally they decided we do the surgery after THC because i wanna do double mast with construction and there will be a recovery window from the surgery in between the chemos. Now i am little bit confused and scared by reading that the shrinkage of the tumor via neoadjuvant chemo may increase the cancer cells which travel in your blood. I was so happy that my tumor shrunk but is this possible that I am doing the wrong thing by letting the cells travel more??
I was so happy about doing chemo before surgery because i was thinkng this is the best thing u can do to stop those cells which travel in your body even before surgery. Now i am lost.
anybody asked this from her onc?
thanks
-
Oh, God, no, Melania, you will be fine! That was just one stray article I read--I can try to find the link for you but please don't worry. It wasn't a recent article anyway. Maybe you could have your onco do a circulating cell test if you are worried, but it's great that your tumor has completely shrunk. I wish Kiri's had.
I'll try to find the article for you and get the specifics. I'm sure it will put your mind at ease. I'm so sorry if this upset you.
-
melania Are those cells that float away dead cells? This idea that the melting away causes live cancer cells to float around in the body is just that, a theory. If this theory was proven and caused metastasis there is no way they would be recommending chemo before surgery. Seems to be the studies have found just the opposite… and the quoted article still does not say if they are dead or live cancer cells circulating.
-
I am not in this position, but i know of several woman who went this route and have been NED for over 10 years. About 10-15 years ago they started to think that doing chemo first then surgery then more chemo if needed was benificial. they have found that this is extreamely helpful b/c you dont delay the time to give chemo. i have a very good friend who is 13 years NED and had a 3cm tumor and did this route and is doing great! just wanted to send a positive thought and a real life example!!
-
Thanks, Jennifer, that is so encouraging.
I spoke to Kiri this morning. She was aware of the report out of San Antonio (here I was hoping to keep it from her! ha!) and not nearly as upset about the statistics as I was. Figures. Turns out she and her oncs are very happy with the way her tumor is responding to the lapatinib--she says it's much softer and more moveable, which indicates it is being eaten up from the inside out. Even if she doesn't have a complete response, this is giving them really good data about what the tumor responds to.
I need to read less and talk to my daughter more. GRIN.
-
KirisMum, I love #8!
Categories
- All Categories
- 679 Advocacy and Fund-Raising
- 289 Advocacy
- 68 I've Donated to Breastcancer.org in honor of....
- Test
- 322 Walks, Runs and Fundraising Events for Breastcancer.org
- 5.6K Community Connections
- 282 Middle Age 40-60(ish) Years Old With Breast Cancer
- 53 Australians and New Zealanders Affected by Breast Cancer
- 208 Black Women or Men With Breast Cancer
- 684 Canadians Affected by Breast Cancer
- 1.5K Caring for Someone with Breast cancer
- 455 Caring for Someone with Stage IV or Mets
- 260 High Risk of Recurrence or Second Breast Cancer
- 22 International, Non-English Speakers With Breast Cancer
- 16 Latinas/Hispanics With Breast Cancer
- 189 LGBTQA+ With Breast Cancer
- 152 May Their Memory Live On
- 85 Member Matchup & Virtual Support Meetups
- 375 Members by Location
- 291 Older Than 60 Years Old With Breast Cancer
- 177 Singles With Breast Cancer
- 869 Young With Breast Cancer
- 50.4K Connecting With Others Who Have a Similar Diagnosis
- 204 Breast Cancer with Another Diagnosis or Comorbidity
- 4K DCIS (Ductal Carcinoma In Situ)
- 79 DCIS plus HER2-positive Microinvasion
- 529 Genetic Testing
- 2.2K HER2+ (Positive) Breast Cancer
- 1.5K IBC (Inflammatory Breast Cancer)
- 3.4K IDC (Invasive Ductal Carcinoma)
- 1.5K ILC (Invasive Lobular Carcinoma)
- 999 Just Diagnosed With a Recurrence or Metastasis
- 652 LCIS (Lobular Carcinoma In Situ)
- 193 Less Common Types of Breast Cancer
- 252 Male Breast Cancer
- 86 Mixed Type Breast Cancer
- 3.1K Not Diagnosed With a Recurrence or Metastases but Concerned
- 189 Palliative Therapy/Hospice Care
- 488 Second or Third Breast Cancer
- 1.2K Stage I Breast Cancer
- 313 Stage II Breast Cancer
- 3.8K Stage III Breast Cancer
- 2.5K Triple-Negative Breast Cancer
- 13.1K Day-to-Day Matters
- 132 All things COVID-19 or coronavirus
- 87 BCO Free-Cycle: Give or Trade Items Related to Breast Cancer
- 5.9K Clinical Trials, Research News, Podcasts, and Study Results
- 86 Coping with Holidays, Special Days and Anniversaries
- 828 Employment, Insurance, and Other Financial Issues
- 101 Family and Family Planning Matters
- Family Issues for Those Who Have Breast Cancer
- 26 Furry friends
- 1.8K Humor and Games
- 1.6K Mental Health: Because Cancer Doesn't Just Affect Your Breasts
- 706 Recipe Swap for Healthy Living
- 704 Recommend Your Resources
- 171 Sex & Relationship Matters
- 9 The Political Corner
- 874 Working on Your Fitness
- 4.5K Moving On & Finding Inspiration After Breast Cancer
- 394 Bonded by Breast Cancer
- 3.1K Life After Breast Cancer
- 806 Prayers and Spiritual Support
- 285 Who or What Inspires You?
- 28.7K Not Diagnosed But Concerned
- 1K Benign Breast Conditions
- 2.3K High Risk for Breast Cancer
- 18K Not Diagnosed But Worried
- 7.4K Waiting for Test Results
- 603 Site News and Announcements
- 560 Comments, Suggestions, Feature Requests
- 39 Mod Announcements, Breastcancer.org News, Blog Entries, Podcasts
- 4 Survey, Interview and Participant Requests: Need your Help!
- 61.9K Tests, Treatments & Side Effects
- 586 Alternative Medicine
- 255 Bone Health and Bone Loss
- 11.4K Breast Reconstruction
- 7.9K Chemotherapy - Before, During, and After
- 2.7K Complementary and Holistic Medicine and Treatment
- 775 Diagnosed and Waiting for Test Results
- 7.8K Hormonal Therapy - Before, During, and After
- 50 Immunotherapy - Before, During, and After
- 7.4K Just Diagnosed
- 1.4K Living Without Reconstruction After a Mastectomy
- 5.2K Lymphedema
- 3.6K Managing Side Effects of Breast Cancer and Its Treatment
- 591 Pain
- 3.9K Radiation Therapy - Before, During, and After
- 8.4K Surgery - Before, During, and After
- 109 Welcome to Breastcancer.org
- 98 Acknowledging and honoring our Community
- 11 Info & Resources for New Patients & Members From the Team