Curing Cancer with Diet

Marienne, wow, you have a doctor that has knowlege of nutrition....That is the exception and I for one am envious...I feel that since we can have at least that control (diet) fighting this bc to give it our best shot!!...I have been on arimidex since Jan 14....I do notice a few more hairs in my brush, but no ohter se's to date..My onco score was close to yours and only a 1-2% change so I chose diet change to make that up.......good luck

Deanna...so glad I read your post...this is the first I have heard of a target number for estrogen.  I haven't ever heard of anyone prescribing AIs actually checking to see if they are working.  I need to re-look at my last bloodwork report but I think my estrone and estradiol are still in the 20s.  What is the optimum goal?  You mentioned <10.  Is this for estradiol, estrone or both? 

daisy6,

You are so blessed to have such a knowledgeable dietitian near you.  I can't find any dietician's in my area, much less a good one, or holy cow one that actually specializes in breast cancer!  I'm jealous!

Luna ~ I don't have a specific answer to your question, but I don't think our oncs do either.  All I can tell you is, when I've had my blood work done, the report gives a normal (untreated) reference range.  For postmenopausal women it's 130 mg. or less for total estrogens (mine was 107) and for Estriadiol it was ND-37 (mine was <10).  This was about a year after I stopped HRT and 3 months after I started I3C.   

For anyone who is premenopausal, here are the normal (untreated) ranges given for that:

Total estrogens:  Early Follicular Phase 70-400 pg/ML, Late Follicular Phase 100-900 pg/ML and Luteal Phase 70-700 pg/ML.  For estradiol, there's a much wider range based on cycle days -- anywhere from 11-69 to 146-526. 

I have heard anectodotally that the objective of the A/I's is to get our estrogen as close to 0 as possible, but that scares me re. depriving all of our organs, like our heart, of it.  Also, in my case, I had been on HRT and was 100% ER+.  So, I feel that removing the HRT (which I firmly believe was a factor in causing my bc) was huge for me.  But women who are premenopausal and ER+ have an entirely different challenge.

Hope this helps some.  I have an appointment with the integrative specialist @ UCLA later this month, and the whole question of I3C/Dim/Myomin is on my list of questions for her.   

Marie, I'm very sorry about your friend.  Unfortunately, a lot of people who choose diet over chemo do so out of fear, when chemo may have made a difference.  On the other hand, many times cancer is going to trump anything we do -- conventional or alternative.   But that doesn't mean that some healthy diet modifications may not be beneficial for people living with cancer or the fear of a recurrence.  For example, while low-fat dairy products are considered a healthy part of a normal diet, several renown integrative specialists caution us about the amount of hidden hormones they contain -- especially if we have a hormone-sensitive cancer.  The very fact that many of us who developed bc had always eaten very healthy diets suggests to me that there may be things we may want to do (or at least know about) to fine tune our diets in view of our bc dx.   JMHO...   Deanna

I

Luna5,

What is DIM?

vivre,

Just as fyi.....In all my research I have uncovered two things about grapefruit: 

1) all citrus (except grapefruit) are natural aromatase inhibitors

2) grapefruit also interferes with high blood pressure medications

Interesting question.  My guess is you won't find the answers in your doctor's office and there won't be any statistics from insurance companies either.  You will find stories on the internet and in a lot of books out there.  But if you refuse chemo, or any other treatment, I don't think you are "followed" statistically by anyone.  Lot of good accounts in one of the books I read.  I think it was the one about fighting cancer with nutrition.

Marianne 

There are also some other things out there that help, depending on your particular type of breast cancer.  There are some books devoted exclusively to nutrition and breast cancer and some books just deal with all cancers.  Also, if your bc was ER+ and your recommended therapy would be hormone treatment (aromatase inhibitors), there are some foods that are natural AI's.  I personally am skeptical about medications and how they actually work and worried about a lot of side effects.  The trick is to find out what quantity of natural foods and/or supplements would equal the traditional med's.  Some really interesting information out there.

Marianne

Large white common mushrooms and Grape Seed Extract (GSE) have been shown to be high in natural AI's.

http://www.mushroom-uk.com/health_professionals/report.htm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/5000582/Eating-mushrooms-daily-may-cut-breast-cancer-risk-by-two-thirds.html

**********************
http://www.cbcrp.org/research/feature/schen.php

Featured Researcher-Shiuan Chen, Ph.D.

Shiuan ChenDr. Chen is the Director of the Department of Surgical Research, Division of Surgery in the Beckman Research Institute of the City of Hope.

Developing Breast Cancer Prevention from Natural Products

Dr. Chen has studied the chemopreventive properties of the aromatase inhbitors in grape seed and white button mushrooms. Aromatase is an enzyme responsible for making estrogen. Dr. Chen has found that the activity in extracts from grape seed and in white button mushrooms is capable of blocking tumor growth in animals. Based on these observations, he is developing a breast cancer chemopreventive drug. Read more about Dr. Chen's work >  http://www.cbcrp.org/research/PageInvestigator.asp?person_id=1657
Ask an Expert

If you'd like to ask Dr. Chen a question about his research, please email your question to shiuanchen@cabreastcancer.org any time between March 12 and April 30. New questions and answers will be posted regularly, so check back for updates.

* Q. How much grape juice would you have to drink to prevent breast cancer?
A. Based on animal studies, we estimate that 250 - 300 ml of grape juice per day could have a protective effect against breast cancer. The use of grape seed extract may avoid concerns about the sugar content in grape juice. We can only get precise dosage after human trial.

The City of Hope has an active clinical trial to determine the dosages of grape seed extract that can suppress estrogen formation (i.e., aromatase suppression) in postmenopausal women.

* Q. How many mushrooms would you have to eat to have an effect on aromatase activity?
A. Based on animal studies, we need to eat 150 - 200 g of white button mushrooms everyday. The City of Hope plans to initiate clinical trials to determine the exact dosages of mushrooms for suppressing estrogen production in postmenopausal women.

* Q. Do ALL mushrooms affect aromatase activity? Do some work better than others?
A. As indicated in our paper published in the Journal of Nutrition in 2001, most types of mushrooms we tested can suppress aromatase activity. The good news is that the most common type of mushrooms, white button mushrooms, are equally effective as some unusual types of mushrooms. From our preclinical studies, the anti-aromatase effect of mushrooms remains even after they are cooked.

* Q. Are the aromatase inhibitors that you find in grapes different from the ones you find in mushrooms? If they are different, which ones seem to be more effective?
A. Yes, the anti-aromatase chemicals we isolated from grapes (i.e., procyanidin dimers) and from mushrooms (i.e., conjugated linoleic acid) are different. From our studies, the chemicals in grapes (grape seeds) seem to be more potent than those in mushrooms. In addition, the modes of action of these chemicals are not exactly identical.

* Q. In what ways could the inhibitors that you've found in grapes be different than the ones currently used in the clinic?
A. The inhibitors in grapes are clearly less potent than those currently used in the clinic. Therefore, they may be useful in prevention, with less side effects (that associated with the elimination of estrogen in our body). In addition, grape chemicals are found to suppress the expression of the protein aromatase, and also to inhibit aromatase activity. Based on such results, we would like to hypothesize that grape chemicals may also be useful against premenopausal breast cancer. The synthetic aromatase inhibitors are shown to be only effective for postmenopausal breast cancer.

 *****************************

http://www.cancerdecisions.com/content/view/280/2/lang,english/

 Anticancer Power of Supermarket Mushrooms
Sunday, 18 October 2009

Most people have heard by now about the healing powers of exotic medicinal mushrooms, such as reishi, shiitake and maitake. But what about the white button mushroom (Agaricus bisporus), the kind that is so boringly abundant in American supermarkets? A study at City of Hope hospital suggests that it too may have anticancer effects if taken daily.

"You don't need a strong effect to cause cancer prevention. Eating 100 grams or even less of mushrooms per day could have an effect on preventing new breast cancers," said Dr. Shiuan Chen, director of the Division of Tumor Cell Biology at the Beckman Research Institute of the City of Hope in Duarte, California. Results of the ongoing study have appeared since 2006 in several leading scientific journals.

Mushroom extracts turned out to be effective aromatase inhibitors. Aromatase is an enzyme that helps the body make estrogen, a hormone that feeds the growth of breast tumors. Of seven vegetables tested, mushrooms had the greatest effect. Other forms of mushrooms (such as portabello, crimini, and shiitake) also were aromatase inhibitors, so one could vary the type eaten to add a little variety to the regimen.

The button mushroom extract reduced the proliferation of breast cancer cells in the laboratory. Giving the extract to mice with breast cancer also suppressed tumor growth. Based on their laboratory experiments, the scientists estimated that 100 grams of mushrooms (less than four ounces) taken per day would probably help prevent breast cancer growth.

"Results from this and other laboratories support the hypothesis that white button mushrooms may be an important dietary constituent for reducing the incidence of hormone-dependent breast cancer in women," the authors wrote. "Prevention strategies involving mushrooms are readily available, affordable, and acceptable to the general public."

Many women who have completed their initial therapy for estrogen-receptor positive (ER+) breast cancer take synthetic drugs for years to inhibit aromatase production. It would be most interesting to see how ordinary mushrooms compare to drugs such as anastrazole (Arimidex) in their actual anticancer ability? Anastrazole has some potentially serious adverse effects, and so dietary substitutes would be most desirable. But do not be surprised if pharmaceutical companies do not rush to do such studies. In 2007, AstraZeneca reported $1.7 billion in sales on Arimidex. This translates into a cost of several hundred dollars per month for women taking the drug. Four ounces per day of mushrooms will set you back about $15 per month, or less if you buy in bulk. From a drug company's point of view, the economics do not favor such nutritional agents.

Comparative studies of the sort I am proposing are rarely performed and when they occasionally occur are usually stacked against the less expensive approach. Oftentimes, the information we receive about cancer is inaccurate. In fact, the typical cancer patient is kept in the dark and fed a load of manure...just like the proverbial mushroom.

 --Ralph W. Moss, Ph.D.

Edited to add a link

Thanks, Marianne.

i had chemo, hormone treatment and a lumpectomy and lymphs removed.  i stopped normal treatment after the hormone stuff and did not have the recommended mascetomy.  i am now treating my cancer using diet only and visit a chinese doctor who is helping me.  i feel great actually, and it hasnt come back (touch wood).

 my diet is: no red meat, no diary, no sugar.  only eat whole grains, vegetables, fruit, nuts, seeds, beans, lentils chickpeas, eggs (in moderation) and fish (in moderation). 

i only drink water (non flouridated, mineral spring water is best), vegie juice, fruit juice, green tea; herbal teas and wheatgrass juice.

i eat herbs regularly from my chinese doctor and do qi gong and acupuncture.

since i saw him i felt good for hte first time in ages and i also felt hope again and belief that this can be beaten and there is help available out there.

the book 'the china study' by dr campbell went a long way to satisfying me that correct diet  (no red meat, dairy or sugar) can cure cancer and that eating the wrong things can cause cancer to grow.

 also i eat seaweed as often as i can and take magnesium baths as i think getting enough magnesium is critical for your health.

Sheila....one of those things...I don't know if it is biophosphonates or something else can cause jaw necrosis  so google whatever you are considering

Why don't you find out what your hormone levels are.  If you want to go off Arimidex, you could see if you estradiol goes up too high when you are off it.  I got my estradiol down from 32 to 15 using natural AIs like Chrysin, melatonin, organic apples, quercetin with bromelain, 375 mg grape seed extract (Masqueliers Tru OPCs) and a bunch of other things.  Just started Thorne mushroom extract also.

All I know is the docs always seem to tell the women on these boards who are taking these drugs that their symptoms aren't caused by the drugs and then they want to give them more drugs for arthritis or something else that they didn't have before the Arimidex or Tamox.

Best wishes to all the wonderful women who have gathered here to support and share info with each other.

Mahouna,

Have to agree with you. I opted for the same treatment as you. I only had lumpectomy and rads for my DCIS. My DCIS was so small that it was actually removed when I had my biopsy. When the lumpectomy tissue sample came back, there was no cancer left in the 1.5 inches of flesh they took off my breast. DCIS measured at 2.4mm. Yes, you read that correctly 2.4mm. Small, eh?

My husband suggested to the breast surgeon that maybe rads was overkill, and she told him it was a very strongly suggested thing for me to do. Hence, my decision. However, I often wonder if I damaged my lungs and heart because of the rads.

I opted out of Tamox, despite doctors telling me that it was a good course to take. All my docs thought it was a good idea to take for prevention, but I really can't hack the thought of it.

Now, if I had invasive cancer, I'd probably try something in the chemotherapy suite of drugs, but I feel very comfortable in my choice not to take the Big Pharma drugs.

MRI - M= Magnetic.  Images are from magnetic resonance.  No rads there.  However, they do use a dye, but I don't think it's ever been implicated in cancer development.

I have been reading The China Study and Anti cancer and trying to make good life style choices.

I am newly diagnosed and appreciate the help found on these pages.

Abundant blessings!