The "Be Positive" myth

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  • momtobkandsd
    momtobkandsd Member Posts: 16
    edited November 2009

    Thanks for the hugs, guys. I am having a harder time getting through this reconstruction stage then I did the year of active treatment. I went straight from one to the other and now wish I had taken a break between. My body and spirit needed it. 

     I agree with the others assessment of Otter's post: well put.

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  • hollyann
    hollyann Member Posts: 2,992
    edited November 2009

    cmharris, which hospital are you having surgery in?.....I live in Norht Atlanta and would love to visit you........And I am "positive" I HATE CANCER!.....

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  • Ang7
    Ang7 Member Posts: 1,261
    edited November 2009

    Wow, what a great thread.

      My extended family has peppered me with the "BE POSITIVE" refrain.  Mom asks "Is your glass half-full or half-empty?"  I tell her that "my glass is broken and it is spilling all over the floor."  She is not pleased with this response. 

    Brother says "What real problems have you had in your life before cancer?"  Not many.  A miscarriage.  Have 4 wonderful kids, great husband.  It is hard to go through this and keep a happy face all the time.  The only one that I have dumped on besides my husband has been my oncologist.  She listened and did not preach about being positive.  That is the reason I chose to go with her.

    Ang

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  • cmharris59
    cmharris59 Member Posts: 496
    edited November 2009

    Hollyann/Lucy

    I will be at MCG Health in Augusta. My surgery is Dec 21

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  • Bonnygg
    Bonnygg Member Posts: 115
    edited December 2009

    Dearest cmahrris59 - Georgia huh? Dang, smear butter on some bread & fry up some chicken!

    2004-2005 were tough years for me. Now, here I am BRACA1+ and my lovely 31 year old daughter is BRACA1+ too. Positive - you bet. Positive that I've pretty well ruined her young life. Positive - you bet. I've ruined my grandchilderns lives & they haven't been conceived yet. They get to live with knowing they too will probably be BRACA1+ and live in fear.

    I get to go back under the knife and willingly & consciously have my body mutilated by getting a bilat mx. Positive - you bet. Positive that I'm going to wake up tomorrow and that's as far as it gets for me. If I look at the future, all I can do is cry.

    Femara SE's have taken my hands & feet. Positive - you bet. Positive that when I ride my Harley that my hands/fingers or feet are going to have issue and probably cause me to dump it. Positive - you bet. Positive that I'm going to give it hell trying.

    I have no doubt that our Be Positive well-wishers haven't a clue about what is appropriate to say to us as we struggle just to take a breath, brush our teeth or pee. Hell, we don't know what to say to ourselves most of the time other than, "one more inch".

    Trust me, I know many of us have wanted to find a way to end this once & for all. But somehow we manage "one more inch". We suck air just one more time. I'm sure many of us can't even figure out why we are still breathing.

    But somewhere along the rock-strewn, broken-glassed path that we walk with bare feet (or in some cases crawl on our hands & knees), we see the sun come up and we move "one more inch".

    We've all been robbed in so many ways. But for my Be Positive well-wishers, I smile and tell them how strong I am today and how I continue to look forward for another day. I haven't the heart to rain piss&shit down on their day just because I have a burden to carry and their "Be Positive" is nothing but hot air (in the middle of my hot flash - just what I need).

    Yes, B+ is just a myth. It's smoke & mirrors. It's several cocktails/beers/wines to numb our brains. It's the phoney smile in Chrismas pictures with the goofy wig, no eyelashes, can't eat anything thanks to chemo. It's the grunts & groans when bc throws us another curve ball and we can't duck fast enough. It's the acidic tone in our voices when we say "Sure, I can do that." all the while we have some drain tubes hidden under our shirt. It's the gallons of tears we've cried and the gallons more we've yet to weep.

    Positive - you bet. Positive that I'm going to move just "one more inch" today even though I want to slap this shit outa who ever invented bc. I want to tell them it ain't funny any more.

    bonny

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  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited December 2009

    I hate when people in my life tell me to 'be positive"  I agree with Otter's take on it.  Otter you are right. You put it perfectly.  I believe being positive is a day to day thing anyway.  It changes each day and with each days circumstances.  I've had really negative days and then tormorrow comes and the day looks brand new again.  You can only take one day at a time, and I am grateful to do that.

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  • Kitchenwitch
    Kitchenwitch Member Posts: 374
    edited December 2009

    Thank God I found this thread! This is has been one heck of a year for me. In late June, I had my first colonoscopy. They found a flat polyp, high-grade dysplasia in the bendy part, so I had another colonoscopy and then was scheduled for surgery to possibly remove that part of my colon. (Wasn't necessary, but you can imagine the fun months I had until Oct. 12. And I will be having another colonoscopy in about 4 months.) 

    A week before Thanksgiving I had a routine mammogram. A week later I had a most un-fun stereotactic core biopsy. The radiologist said to me (when I was complaining to him about my horrible year) 'Oh, I couldn't have a colonoscopy." Please. Colonoscopy was a day at the beach compared to the biopsy.

    A week after that he called to tell me I have stage 0 precancer, and I'll have a lumpectomy and radiation. I'm scheduled to meet with a surgeon tomorrow, and one the day after that, and then I'm sure I'll want to meet more (unless I love one of these two so much it's like a sappy movie, which I doubt).

    Think positive? Look on the bright side? Please, my life wasn't going that well BEFORE the dx (will bore/depress you with more details another time) but I've always tried to be thankful and positive and look on the bright side. Well... these days I just am having a very hard time doing that. It seems like a neverending stream of bad news coming my way. So I feel sad and angry, and that's reasonable and valid.

    I'm happy for people who feel positive. And those who don't... come sit by me!

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  • Stonebrook108
    Stonebrook108 Member Posts: 237
    edited December 2009

    Kitchenwitch

     I sent you a pm

    Ann

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  • KaeLaVie
    KaeLaVie Member Posts: 8
    edited December 2009

    Kitchenwitch - just now seeing your post. I haven't been back for visit the forum for several weeks.  Glad you found the thread and I hope you're doing okay.  You've found the right audience to complain if you wanna.  I'm fine with being positive - but I'll be positive on MY terms, when that's how I really FEEL.  Not ever when I'm told to be for someone else's sake.  We're allowed to be ourselves here.

    K :)

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  • KaeLaVie
    KaeLaVie Member Posts: 8
    edited December 2009

    Bonnygg,

    Also wanted to say hello to you, too!  Plus I have to ask who that beautiful cat is in your avatar.  I have a sealpoint siamese name Samantha Jones, and a little fuzzy, miniature maine coon cat named Veronica Mars (yes - I like my tv shows haha) 

    Speaking of cats - THEY never try to force us to be positive or anything else than what we are.  They accept all the moods.  My family and friends helped me get through, but my Cats were the unspoken heroes.  There with me all the time.
    K :)

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  • sparkyhammerjigsaw
    sparkyhammerjigsaw Member Posts: 24
    edited December 2009

    Glad to read this...I'm a husband trying desperately to not overplay that positive card....She calls me pollyanna. My wife seemed to accept the diagnosis to be cancer right from the second mammo, US and core biopsy that all occurred in one day.  I refused.  Two negative results and I was convinced I was right. She was convinced something was screwed up or incompetence was prevailing.  She's now "officially" right and I'm wrong.  I am working harder to be her support than anything I've ever done except convince her to marry me.  I don't want to scream positive attitude but I've got to keep her from jumping of that cliff she hangs on.....conclusion cliff.

    It's good to read this...I will remember what you all say and take it to heart.  On that you can be positive.

    Thanks

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  • NativeMainer
    NativeMainer Member Posts: 10,462
    edited December 2009

    weclome, sparky--I'm sorry you have to join our club, but I'm glad you found us.  If you go back over the posts in this thread (which I know you don't really have time to) you will find that we aren't totally anti-positivity, but we are VERY anti-being-told-how-to-feel and the current trend to totally ignore the downside of having a cancer diagnosis.  It's OK for you to hold on to positive thoughts and feelings.  Just don't push your wife to feel the same way. 

    Being diagnosed with bc is devastating, frightening, infuriating, and overwhelming.  These feelings need to be acknowledged and allowed.  When your wife expresses these kinds of feelings all you need to do is listen. Men are hard-wired to fix things, but these feelings can't be "fixed."  Trying to "fix" things by trying to help her feel better won't work. What we women hear in that instance is that our feelings are somehow wrong, that we aren't "haivng cancer the right way."  What women at that point need and want is someone to listen.  Just listen. 

     Your more positive point of view is OK,  Nothing wrong with feeling that way.  I'll bet your wife is actually depending on your more positive feelings while she works through the beginning of her journey.  The fact that you are willing to "walk" into a room full of emotional, angry, depressed and witchy women says a lot for your love for her and your committment to helping her through this.  I'm certainly impressed.  I'm sure you and your wife will get through this time intact.

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  • NativeMainer
    NativeMainer Member Posts: 10,462
    edited December 2009

    KaeLaVie and Bonnygg,

    my dogs where my touchstone during treatment (and before and after).  Unconditional love, don't care if I'm crying all over them, laughing all over them, or sleeping against them.  While I was getting the rads torture treatment they'd actually pin me down in my big recliner until I took a nap every afternoon.  Sometimes they knew what I needed before I did.  One of them died the year after treatment got done, but the german shepherd is 10 years old and still going strong! 

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  • EWB
    EWB Member Posts: 2,927
    edited December 2009

    Ang, I realy like the feel of this one, some days it is perfect:   "Is your glass half-full or half-empty?"  I tell her that "my glass is broken and it is spilling all over the floor."

    Sparky - just hold her, tell her your sorry this is happening and just be there for her. If you can, pick up some of the slack around the house, talk as much as you can about whatever, cancer related or not, just don't shut down. Its about having hope, not being positive; it's about acknowledging whatever the feelings are at the moment, not denying the fear, anger or sadness. Its all very real - you both need each other now. Gentle hugs to you both.

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  • wesel
    wesel Member Posts: 5
    edited December 2009

    Two things:  I have in-laws who basically told me early on (after surgery)  to "suck it up"; "you can't lie in bed"; you should get out" and the like and are in complete denial about how I'm feeling--physically, emotionally, etc.  I have not asked for their help (they live 4 hours away) since then.  The other night on the phone when they asked how I was, I told them the gritty details (constipation, fatigue/anemia, chemo brain, how i only \want quiet most of the time, etc.).  "Oh, reeaaally . . . " was the reply.  Hmmph.  Yeah, REALLY.

     Number Two:  I was laying in bed last night, aching and twitching and anxious, thinking about a huge T-Shirt with bright, all cap letters, "CHEMO REALLY DOES SUCK" on the front--and on the back "SUPPORT CANCER RESEARCH--MAKE CHEMO A THING OF THE PAST".  Or something like that.  I mean, really, most of the chemo meds have been around for 30-50 years and we're still suffering their ill effects . . . . !

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  • NativeMainer
    NativeMainer Member Posts: 10,462
    edited December 2009

    wesel, I agree whole heartedly.  But there is no money in curing a disease, just in treating a disease.  Pharmaceutical companies are in business to make money.  Until something happens that changes that basic fact of economics, I won't allow myself to believe in or hope for a cure. 

    Your in-laws are jack-a$$es.  I bet neither one has ever really been ill, seriously ill, and so they have no idea what it's like.  That doesn't excuse them for being totally insensitive donkeys.  

    Can I steal the "glass is broken and spilling all over the floor" line?  It's an absolutely perfect descripiton of the way things are some days.  

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  • hrf
    hrf Member Posts: 3,225
    edited December 2009

    There'd still be lots of money in a cure and/or a vaccine for prevention. Then they could earn even more billions from treating  diabetes, heart disease, autism ... there's still lots of diseases to make money from. Even if they found a drug that treated the disease effectively, that would be progress ..... so far there is nothing that is proven to keep bc from killing us ....each drug is just a guess.

    I also like the "glass is broken" line .... hope it's ok if I also use it.

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  • elimar86861
    elimar86861 Member Posts: 7,416
    edited January 2010

    "Is your glass half-full or half-empty?"  I tell her that "my glass is broken and it is spilling all over the floor."

    I've been known to answer that question with, "What glass?  It's gotten so bad, I'm drinking straight from the bottle!"

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  • NativeMainer
    NativeMainer Member Posts: 10,462
    edited January 2010

    LOL!

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  • EWB
    EWB Member Posts: 2,927
    edited January 2010
    Tongue out
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  • flash
    flash Member Posts: 1,685
    edited January 2010

    Elimar_   ROTFL!

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  • Flmgkat
    Flmgkat Member Posts: 25
    edited January 2010

    Hello,

    Well, after today, I guess I hit the wall, so to speak. 

    The following I wrote earlier and it's to some people I know that still is clueless of what I am going thru.  And so, ahem:

     Listen people,
    Imagine getting the news after the mammogram of the suspected lump and the biopsy that this was cancer. I did not ask for this. I did not ask for the finding in October, the dianogsed in November, the surgery in December, the chemo treatments starting in January and who knows what's happening in February. And oh yeh, I also have rhuematoid arthristis, that I had to stop all meds and yes, I did have one major flareup and hoping right now for a pain free day. And one more thing: I have been unemployed for a good year now, but was going to school to up my skills. When I decided to take the quarter off to heal properly from my surgery and to see what this chemo treatment will do to me, all heck broke loose and I don't know if I can continue getting unemployment. One quarter, for crying out loud!
    Please...do not tell me that all will be fine, as I am stressed enough as is. I don't want to hear about how your Auntie Matilda fared and she just turned out great. Everyone is different and takes things differently, so don't be surprised when I chew your head off on one of my bad times. Unless you understand and is good at really listening, I've been told that I can yell better than a barker at a circus.
    My family (with the exception of my father) has been estranged for many years; I have good friends who looked in after me, done things for me without strings and know when to stop 'helping' when needed. So now my blood family wants to get together after 30 years of not talking, to make my disease a reason for a family reunion. Case example: was told that if I stayed married, I would be taken better care. REALLY NOW??!! It was the other damn way around and that's why he's an ex! Family was what I made and my blood family couldn't hold a candle to my friends who stuck by me.
    I do have faith, so no new religions. I have to turn off a Jehovah Witness, two Mormons, and a New Ager. I threw out more booklets, crystals, bad herbal mixtures and biofeedbacks that when off the charts. I may get in trouble for this, but I believe in God and am quite happy with it.
    I have looked into support groups, but it takes time to find the right fit and I don't need someone to tell me that I am not giving it a chance. I don't need a counselor now, as some people I know are telling me that I do. I know what I need and I will ask when the time comes. I was told that I am not having the right attitude and will crash soon. So much for your confidence in me!
    Overall, right now, the way through the next few months is a challenge, getting over the hurdle, and learning new things (my health counselor was right...I know more acronms that I have ever learned). So, this is my beef. Like it or get off my ride!

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  • elimar86861
    elimar86861 Member Posts: 7,416
    edited January 2010

    Right on, my raging sister.  My comments, in no particular order:

    No, you don't have to be the "poster girl" for the family reunion. 

    Sounds like you have some nice friends that know how to step up.

    Circus folk welcome here!   Ah-ha-ha!

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  • karen1956
    karen1956 Member Posts: 6,503
    edited January 2010

    NM.....I so agree with your earlier post....it sums me up to a "T"....I liked who I was before BC...in fact, I liked the old e much better than the new me!!!!

    Our feelings are our feelings....no right or wrong...just our feelings....positive, negative or not feeling at all!!!!

    This thread is great.  Hugs to all of you newly Dx and just starting Tx....to the "old timers'...glad we are all here for each other! 

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  • blondiex46
    blondiex46 Member Posts: 5,712
    edited January 2010

    why what is the point of beng positive...making the other people feel better, they have no idea what we or me are feeling and they don't know what to say, like it really isn't there and maybe the diagnoses is wrong.  It's not...I continue to function everyday now I am one of the lucky ones that just got diagnosed and are on HT so far, I know that won't last, yea I am the glass 1/2 empty kind of person.  I know there are people worse off than me, does that help me no, I am a compassioniate person so my heart goes out to them and I know one day I will be on the other end and people will be praying for me like I do them now...still won't be postive...am trying to be stress free but I have teenage boys so that won't happen...

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  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited February 2011

    delete

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  • NativeMainer
    NativeMainer Member Posts: 10,462
    edited January 2010

    Isn't it amazing how many people who have never had a cancer diagnosis just KNOW how we should be feeling, what we should be thinking, and how we should be behaving?  I'm an adult.  I know how I feel, so, as hhfeidi said, until you've walked a mile my shoes, quit telling me how to feel! 

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  • Flmgkat
    Flmgkat Member Posts: 25
    edited March 2010

    Well, this one is a new one on me....

    I was attending a wellness group for cancer patients for a few weeks now and today, I get a call from the leader.  She says that she feels a 'lot of anger' in me and that this group was not a good fit for me.

    'Okay', I says, 'did I offend someone in the group?'

    'No. I sense a lot of anger in your and I think you are more angry about your cancer and other things, when someone mentioned that maybe counseling would help you.'

    Now, don't get me wrong. I am angry about this disease hitting my body. And in my past, that I have had counseling over anger issues that were worked out, forgiveness done, forgetting most of what has happened in my past....

    and when I am giving this statement without further talking about what was said, no answer to the question if others were uncomfortable, and that 'good luck in your future', what the hell am I suppose to feel?

    And what makes a good fit?? What was the purpose of a wellness group if I cannot vent?

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  • NativeMainer
    NativeMainer Member Posts: 10,462
    edited March 2010
    Flmgkat--Holy Cow, what a thing to hear from a support group!  Makes me wonder who exactly is being supported.  And since when is it "wrong" to be angry about getting a cancer diagnosis?  And since when does a wellness group not allow for venting of normal, natural feelings in a setting where others will understand?  Does the group's info specify "no angry people"?   It sounds to me like someone in the group is not comfortable around anger, and the leader isn't willing or is unable to deal with that person's discomfort with anger.  Or maybe SHE is the one who isn't comfortable with anger.  Good heavens but this sounds like another example of someone else deciding what is the "rgiht" way to experience a cancer diagnosis.  Yeesh. 
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  • Flmgkat
    Flmgkat Member Posts: 25
    edited April 2010
    NativerMainer: y'know, the strange thing is that this was from the Seattle's Gilda's Club...now, I know I might cause a chain reaction but please hear me out...if, and if I did made someone uncomfortable, I am the first one to apologize...but from hearing only one side, the leader and her boss without the boss even calling me to get what had happen (and being told by the leader that her boss told her that she was 'taking' her side), but NOT told to turn in my membership card...isn't that the mission statement of the Gilda's Club "come as you are" but don't come in with anger over your cancer and anything else?  What of others who also come in for support: friends who don't know what to do, family, and kids, the ones who are afraid and angry?  Is this positive?
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