do you really think diet can change our faith

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Mamita49
Mamita49 Member Posts: 538
edited June 2014 in Stage I Breast Cancer

I have changed my diet since many months. I was never overweight, never on junk food, but I do eat much better since my diagnosis. I believe that healthy nutrition is essential, BUT today was my last rads, and my oncology rad, doc told me that it is good for my over all health to eat well, but it has nothing to do with cancer coming back or not. Cancer has no rules, and is only molecules, DNA and hormones. So diet, she said, is good for you general health, but has very little influence on recurrence. She said, diet is something that has in influence over decades on our body, a sudden intake of veggies or fruits in large amounts is good, but it would not change your faith with cancer.

 What do you think........ 

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Comments

  • Jelson
    Jelson Member Posts: 1,535
    edited November 2009

    Mamita49,

     do you mean Fate instead of Faith?

    I am not a "nature girl" and I don't think that a change in diet can reverse what a lifetime of different choices has produced, but I think it can help! also I know that doctors who have gone through medical school in the united states learn very little about nutrition.  Over the last few decades we in the US, I don't know about Canada, have allowed our food supply to be adulterated. If it isn't the chemicals used in the actual production of the food, it is chemicals in the food containers.

    Like you, I am trying to eat better, for me that means less processed and more locally produced foods. It just makes good sense. lets hope it helps us both!

    Julie E

  • cookiegal
    cookiegal Member Posts: 3,296
    edited November 2009

    I think this is an area where there are more mysteries than answers. I guess eating local and healthy can help the environment and that could help ourselves and others.

    If we feel better, and have a better qualitiy of life, eating better is worth it.

    Still life is short, and it seems a shame to let cancer completely take away our favorite treats.

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    I've been posting this pdf link all over the place the last couple of days - I've read through it so many times.  To me it feels like one more weapon against cancer. 

    http://cancer.ucsf.edu/crc/nutrition_breast.pdf

    Of course a diet high in fruit, all colors of vegetables, whole grains, and the right fats in small amounts combined with daily exercise is not a guarantee that you won't have recurrence, but it can reduce your risk.  Mortality in survivors was reduced as much as 50% by one study listed in the pdf.  By the way, chemo, tamoxifen and AI's are not a guarantee, either.  They also only reduce your risk of recurrence.

  • cmharris59
    cmharris59 Member Posts: 496
    edited November 2009

    Rabbit,

    This is also my take on a healthy lifestyle.  It can certainly help matters. It definitely cannot make things worse. IMHO it is the perfect complement to traditional/conventional tx. A lot of research has proven this. I agree that it cannot prevent or cure 100%, but it has an impact and especially on certain types of cancers, in particular the hormone fed bcs.

    C

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    Then we agreeSmile

    There are also three excellent books on this subject that I recommend:

    Anti cancer A New Way of Life by Dr. David Servan-Schreiber,

    Foods to Fight Cancer by Richard Beliveau, and

    Life Over Cancer by Dr. Keith Block. 

    All are written by doctors or medical researchers who believe that diet and lifestyle are a vital part of cancer treatment. 

  • Husband11
    Husband11 Member Posts: 2,264
    edited November 2009

    Thanks for posting that link to the pdf on nutrition and breast cancer.  I haven't read it all yet, but it looks like great information.  I'll have to get my wife Bev to read it too.  I think nutrition can help, but I think you have to be strategic, as it looks like some foods and their nutritional contribution has more benefit than others.  What kind of rabbit do you have there?  We have two bunnies, a mini-rex and a netherland dwarf.  Bev's avatar has her holding Cleo, our mini-rex.

  • Jelson
    Jelson Member Posts: 1,535
    edited November 2009

    Timothy and Rabbit_Fan!

    we have a rabbit too, he is a very small black bunny with one white paw. Infact, he eats healthy with me,  We share boxes of organic baby romaine or mixed spring lettuce from BJ's Warehouse everyweek. 

    Julie E

  • baywatcher
    baywatcher Member Posts: 532
    edited November 2009

    Another good book is "The China Study" by T. Colin Campbell. This book details the largest study of nutrition ever written.

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    Hi Timothy and Julie - Oh my gosh, I could bore you to tears about my rabbit, I'm sure!

    I think she's a Havana rabbit - we got her at the shelter.  She's a little bigger than I wanted (I thought a dwarf would be nice too), but I still love her!  I think she weighs about 3 1/2 - 4 pounds.

    She has so much personality - I would never have guessed that about rabbits.  I can't really pick her up because it's a little too awkward for me, but my husband can - he picks her up and holds her in his lap and pets her and she honks like a goose!  Really!  It's hilarious.  And she has a pet hedgehog stuffed animal that she grooms a lot - so cute!

    Julie, your rabbit sounds cute - and lucky - ours only gets organic lettuce once in a while.

    Timothy - I'm going to go try to find your wife's picture.  OK - found it - only one Bev holding a rabbit Smile.  She looks cute - I wish our rabbit was a little easier to handle - I can only pet her on the floor.  But, she knows that I never pick her up, so when I go to pet her, she totally relaxes and stretches out because she's not worried.  When my husband approaches her she stays a lot more on guard.  So I'll take that as a trade-off.

    Go rabbits!

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited November 2009

    I do - I believe diet and supplements make a big difference.

    PS - I have a bunny too :)

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    Sounds like we need a rabbit club!

  • Husband11
    Husband11 Member Posts: 2,264
    edited November 2009

    I hope this brings a smile to your faces:

  • Husband11
    Husband11 Member Posts: 2,264
    edited November 2009
  • 2z54
    2z54 Member Posts: 261
    edited November 2009

    Hey rabbit fans!

    I do believe food plays an important role in cancer; but I have't totally adjusted/fixed my diet yet.

    I just wanted to hop in here because, I love rabbits too!  This is PeeWee, or adopted wabbit. She used to come to our backyard patio door after her peeps abandoned her, and we fed her every day for a few months.  Eventually she was comfortable enough to come inside, and she's been living with us ever since.  (She's gone from 4.5 lbs to about 7.5. But, she's got the run of the house. No cage for our little girl; she survived the whole outdoors for quite a while - and there were coyotes, hawks, snakes, racoons, etc. Besides, you wouldn't believe how much personality a bunny could have once you give them their freedom (i.e. the run of the house)!  She's a delight, and we love her!! And yes, she's litter box trained!

    Sue

  • Jelson
    Jelson Member Posts: 1,535
    edited November 2009

    oh Timothy, too funny! the photo you attached came out huge so all I could see at first was part of the print in the background and the crook of your arm, but I figured there was a bunny in there somewhere, I just had to scroll around to find it and did I let out a hoot when I found her?!

    Julie E

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    Wow, Sue!  What a great bunny story!  That's really impressive that she survived so long outdoors.

    I'd like to give our rabbit run of the house, but she chews up all of the rugs and the first foot of all of the furniture if we don't keep an eye on her.  She has a big pen in the living room and we let her out in the morning and evening.  How do you keep PeeWee from eating everything?  Our Lucy is litter trained too - I can't imagine having an untrained rabbit in the house - what a mess!

    Timothy - I think you need to try your picture again - all I can see is the wall and the right edge of the framed print.  I don't seem to be able to scroll on it like Julie.

    Eileen

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    OK - I tried on a different computer and oh my gosh, Timothy!  I can't believe you can get your rabbit to wear a dress!  I love the little arm sticking out.  How cute - she looks like a real sweetie!

  • Mamita49
    Mamita49 Member Posts: 538
    edited November 2009

    Sorry,

    YES I meant fate, not fait. Sorry, my English has to improve.... 

  • CrunchyPoodleMama
    CrunchyPoodleMama Member Posts: 1,220
    edited November 2009

    I'm realizing more and more how important diet is, not just to our health as in whether we have disease or not, but our well-being and happiness, too. I thought I had eaten healthfully in my 20's... I usually had a salad with chemical-laden dressing for lunch, and a Lean Cuisine for dinner. I thought I was healthy because I was thin (oh, to be that thin again!). In reality, all those chemicals were anything BUT good for my body. Oh, I was also a caffeine junkie so I'd have energy to get through the day... also not good. A cup or two a day, no problem... but I was drinking buckets of it.

    I did a radical 180-degree turnaround when I was first told I had bc... I had fallen so far off the wagon, the wagon had backed up and run over me a few times... when I switched to eating mostly organic vegetables, raw or lightly steamed, with some good anti-cancer nuts, seeds, grains, etc., I was amazed at how much I felt physically difference -- very quickly, too, within just a few days. Another thing I wasn't expecting (I'm sure thanks to quitting caffeine) is that I'm sleeping a lot better too. I've been a lifelong insomniac, until these last couple of weeks.

    Okay, I have to say... I am SO jealous of all the rabbit-parents here. My husband and I would LOVE a bunny... but we suspect our Poodles would love one too... as a chew toy or a snack. Tongue out Can't put a sweet bunny through that, so I have to live vicariously through the lucky rabbit owners here!

  • RunswithScissors
    RunswithScissors Member Posts: 323
    edited November 2009

    Here's my angora boy... I'm still trying to get a picture of him when he yawns. I don't know what it is but there is nothing cuter than a bunny yawn!

    As for diet, I've become very annoyed with the studies - there are so many that are completely contradictory. How can that be?  If only one can be right, that means there are an awful lot of absolutely wrong studies out there.

    And if there are a lot of absolutely wrong studies, what does that say about the reliablity of studies in general?     ArGHH!  

    Anyway, I found my answer when I learned about epidemiological studies. (Also known as observational studies.)  The media reports the findings of this type of study all the time, as if the results were reliable, but they aren't reliable at all...   There are some really interesting articles that explain this in detail, if anyone is interested.  

    We raise most of our own food. (And no, before anyone asks, the bunny is a pet!) I feel good about eating all the food we raise because I think the problem has more to do with the terrible way  food is produced in industrialized places.   Funny, not too many studies out there even look at that.  

    Raising some of your own food not only is good for you to eat, it's good exercise, fresh air  - I highly recommend it! 

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    What a little cutie,Pill!  I love the shaggy flop-over ears.  I know what you mean about the yawning.  I think it's because they have tiny little mouths with a few big teeth - they are the cutest!

  • Jelson
    Jelson Member Posts: 1,535
    edited November 2009

    Mamita49-

    please, I didn't mean to criticize your English. The mistake made for an interesting, if unintentional  question.  And your actual question is obviously very important to all of us.

    Julie E

  • dlb823
    dlb823 Member Posts: 9,430
    edited November 2009

    How about the possibility that the answer is as individual as our breast cancers?  In other words, with some forms of bc in some individuals diet changes can make a difference; with others it won't.

    Or the possibility that it can make a difference, but only when pursued to a degree that some women don't totally grasp or are not willing to go?  What I mean by that is, prior to being dx'd, many of us (me included) considered ourselves health conscious because we ate nourishing food rather than packaged, junk or fast food, got regular exercise, and took nutritional supplements.  But in retrospect, that's a far cry from a vegan or plant based diet, eliminating all sugars, getting extreme exercise, being up on and using many of the cutting edge supplements, and other changes that those who feel diet can make a difference probably would advocate.

    Or how about the possibility that diet may factor into our ability to prevent an initial bc dx or a recurrence -- as long as it's not overridden by more problematic lifestyle factors, such as getting too much estrogen or maintaining a few too many pounds (because they contribute to too much estrogen), exposure to known carcinogens or other chemicals, or living with constant stress?

    Obviously, none of us has the complete answer, but these are some of the questions I've asked myself as I continue to make significant changes, because I am one of those who knows we can't control everything, but still chooses to control what I can and what a lot of emerging research says may make a difference.   Deanna

  • BFidelis
    BFidelis Member Posts: 156
    edited November 2009

    Mamita49 -

    Your English is way better than my French (though I know enough not to go to the hairdresser's and ask them to style my horses!)

    As far as diet and exercise, here's my opinion.  I've been overweight most of my life, and the weight has always been distributed 'evenly' over my body.  I've not had the best eating habits, and the veggies that are "the best" for us literally make me gag.  (I am kind of hypersensitive to bitter tastes.)  I do what I can.  I do love to swim, and so I do that about 3 times a week (about 1km give or take.)  I also take some nutritional supplements: Iodine, Vitamin D and something called DIM (which is supposed to provide the active ingredient in thos veggies I can't get down.)  I like to have 1-2 glasses of wine in the evening (and I prefer mine with bubbles, thank you.)  I also found that now that as my nest is emptying, I am no longer making those full meals every night.  I find I'm eating a more substantial breakfast, a 'normal' lunch and almost no dinner (maybe cheese & crackers with that glass of wine.)  And they say that's a better way to eat.  So...

     I'm doing some "good" things, but I REFUSE to obsess.  You see, I truly believe that STRESS is a dangerous killer.  And I'm not going to create MORE for myself by guilting up over everything.  The "experts" tell you it's all about learning how to handle the stress, but that platitude begins to sound like you have to learn how to take punches so some one can beat you up instead of jailing the person who's beating you up!  I figure there are plenty of outside sources of stress in my life that I cannot do a thing about, so I'm just not going to let myself join in with them.  HAH!

    Here's to our health and happiness.

    Peace,

    Beth

  • Mamita49
    Mamita49 Member Posts: 538
    edited November 2009

    BFidelis,

    I agree with you about the stress. I need to learn a lot about getting my stress in order. I have a 22 year old daughter. She is the sun of my life, and I cannot let go of her. I need to, but its so hard.

    She is great, and close to perfection, ( I think so) but my stress is in me, learning to re-organize my life without her. She moved far away to a University, and I see her only once a month.

    Why am I having such a hard time dealing with the stress of letting go.......... 

  • RunswithScissors
    RunswithScissors Member Posts: 323
    edited November 2009

    Mamita49,

    Some stress we can't avoid... mouring over the empty nest is normal! Don't add guilt by thinking you should not feel what is natural. 

  • vtmom
    vtmom Member Posts: 46
    edited November 2009

    Growing up - my mom was a horrible cook, and we were allowed to eat tons of junk and drink soda everyday. Once I moved out of my parents house I discovered "real" food. Went back to the land and had huge gardens, my own chickens / eggs and made my own jams. Then I discovered miso, tofu, seaweed and organic everything. I did yoga and meditated and lived in the country. Thought for sure I didn't ever need to worry about cancer anything.

    I was so sure that I would never have to 'go there' that I had never had a mammogram until.... I felt a large lump on my left breast. They insisted I have a mammogram along with an ultrasound. The lump turned out to be a benign cyst... but because of my "lucky lump" they found the 3 tiny calcification's that turned out to be cancerous.

    OH< and no one in either side of my family had ever had BC. Go figure.

    I will still eat as healthy as possible, and will drink green tea everyday once I am done with radiation. I will exercise everyday and think happy thoughts. BUT, have learned that you can't take anything for granted, and am working on being grateful for everyday. Ya Never Know....

  • Edelstoff
    Edelstoff Member Posts: 19
    edited November 2009

    OK, I am a former competitive triathlete, have been fit and lived a healthy lifestyle since my mid 20's.  I continue to run, exercise, lift weights, climb mountains and play hard.....and guess what?  Yup "you have breast cancer". I live this lifestyle because it gives me joy and I feel good.  I love the foods I eat, I cherish my upbeat intense exercise classes.  No matter what we do, even in early stage breast cancer we  have a 20-30% chance of having a recurrence within the next 12 years. http://www.lifeabc.org/risk_recurrence_more.html   It is frustrating that we only hear about the 5 year recurrence rates.  I have things to do beyond 5 years. I declined A.I. due to quality of life issues.    Geri

  • wallycat
    wallycat Member Posts: 3,227
    edited November 2009

    I have such HUGE mixed feelings on this.

    As a dietitian, I honestly feel that what and how we eat plays a role.  Having said that, I was vegetarian for over a decade, ate more fruits and vegetables than a human is known to, exercised more than required, had a BMI of 19, had NO cancer in my family....(what am I leaving out?)...I do drink wine with my dinner...and still do....

    I got breast cancer.

    My twin (fraternal) is overweight, exercises when the mood strikes her, eats processed food and enough junk food to keep a small country in business......no cancer.  She also drank up until last year.  She was also on birth control pills till 50. 

    I confess that since the diagnosis and since I had already done it all "right" and since the weight gain from tamoxifen....I still exercise; I still TRY to eat right...but I will never deprive myself.

    Life is short and clearly, cancer is a crap shoot.  It's my story; I'm sticking to it.

  • Rabbit_fan
    Rabbit_fan Member Posts: 166
    edited November 2009

    I'm not trying to say this in a mean way, but a story like this - I did it all right and still got cancer - is anecdotal.  It's the same logic that people use to disregard complementary treatment - I know someone who had lymphoma and wasn't responding to treatment - doctors wanted to do harsher treatment- he walked away, started juicing, etc, and went into remission.  No one ever takes that as proof that juicing cures lymphoma, and by the same token, anecdotal evidence also doesn't prove that diet and lifestyle have nothing to do with breast cancer risk. 

    There are hundreds of studies that prove that your risk of BC, recurrence and mortality can be reduced by specific nutritional and exercise choices (see link in my earlier post above).  Of course they are not a guarantee against cancer, but they also do not claim to be.  They reduce your risk.  You certainly could be one of the people on whom it has no effect, but you also could be one of the people who benefits from specific nutritional choices and exercise.

    You can also find many people who had chemo, or took anti-hormonals and had a recurrence.  Does that prove that those treatments are completely ineffective, or merely that they too only provide benefit to some of the people some of the time?

    edited for typos

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