over active bladder or bladder mets?

wallycat

I see my onco on the 23rd but thought I'd post here since I probably won't learn anything that day.

My gyn (via patient portal discussion--I see her Oct 29th) thinks it is uro-genital atrophy (I have not started the vaginal estrogen for my atrophy, which I have). I know stress can do a lot of crap to us (DH recently dx with metastatic prostate cancer).

Guess I'm posting to hear if other gals have had b-9 results on overactive bladder. My daytime peeing has improved but I still get up more at night than is "normal"--whatever normal is these days. Maybe I just have "old lady bladder" and it is estrogen related. No bleeding. Never had a UTI and gyn thinks things would get worse by now if that were the case (though I'm reading some women are asymptomatic on UTIs. I've also used d-mannose for several days, just in case). This all started around the first week of August, so I've given it the requisite 6+ weeks for over-active bladder dx.

ksusan

I my household, it's very clear that although Tamoxifen causes me urinary urgency and frequency, my wife, who is simply a lady of a certain age, is up in the night more than she used to be.

KBeee

I get up about 3 times per night. My bladder has aged faster than the rest of me. I'll blame forced menopause and Letrozole, but maybe it is my age...49.

wallycat

LOL, KBeee, I'm 62. 49 seems so long ago.

Appreciate the feedback. We'll see if onco recommends scans or vagifem to see if symptoms go away. Always nerve wracking wondering what the outcome will be. I know you guys get it.

quick update: Last night I took a lemon balm supplement and slept like the dead. Got up only once. Maybe it will help others and maybe it helps calm an overactive bladder.

KBeee

Glad the lemon balm helped. I should add that for a while I had a lot of blood in my urine which bought me a trip to a urologist (wondering how many -ologists I've yet to see.....). They did an in office procedure to look at the bladder, and all looked good.

Another thing that can cause frequent urination is high blood sugar, so if you have any more problems, ask to have PCP check that.

wallycat

KBee, I'm glad your bladder looks good. Did they treat for UTI (aside from cancer, utis are most common for bloody urine)?

I routinely check blood sugar and A1c since I am prediabetic.

KBeee

They did not treat for UTI. I still often test positive for blood on test strips, but I don't see it visibly. They really do not know why, but I think I just tend to bleed easily and now that I am on aspirin, it is even worse.

wallycat

KBee, it could be interstitial cystitis as well or just plain old uro-genital atrophy.

So I saw my oncologist yesterday and she said if it were her, she'd do a urinalysis to rule out UTI for me. They let me do it there and preliminary results show a possible mild uti. So much for my gyn's office thinking it would be worse. Maybe it would clear on its own since the peeing has gotten much better. They are sending it out for culture to make sure and see what, if anything is there. I've started d-mannose so things don't get worse and I guess I should start to consider vag. estrogen. What fun.

KBeee

These symptoms are annoying, but I always have to remind myself that it's better than what it could be........

NancyD

I mentioned my similar problem to my gyn last year. She prescribed a med that she "though would help" with the night time trips, but when I went to get it filled, I found it was way too expensive (like $500 for 3 months) for what I consider a non-life-threatening condition.

Since I am 68, I consider it just part of my aging process. I have started cranberry supplements to help ward off UTIs, but the lemon balm sounds interesting. I have tons of lemon baml growing in my garden. Maybe I can make it myself.

wallycat

My gyn-nurse just emailed saying thus far, culture shows no UTI/bacteria so my initial urinalysis indicating possible mild uti...odd. Maybe just the atrophy or maybe the d-mannose did the job it is supposed to do.

Lemon balm is easy and certainly worth a try. I still think I probably had a UTI and between my body and d-mannose, it cleared it. If it is due to estrogen loss/atrophy, I know it will just keep coming back so I need to figure it out.

Beesie

Wallycat, I recently had exactly the same thing. I had what I thought were signs of a UTI; the quick in-office urinalysis showed signs of a mild UTI but the full culture lab analysis did not. I was prescribed an antibiotic specifically for UTIs based on the quick analysis and when my doctor's office phoned with the results, I was told to stop taking it. I decided to run out the prescription and in fact it did eliminate my symptoms. Reading up on it, it appears that there are some UTIs that a urinalysis doesn't catch - kind of like mammograms... we are led to believe that they are accurate and reliable but they really aren't.

Missed UTIs? 'Enhanced cultures' suggest so

"The standard urine culture detected just 33 percent of 182 uropathogens, while the streamlined EQUC protocol spotted 84 percent of the uropathogens. But how many of those uropathogens make a clinical difference in patients? This is why patients were asked about their symptoms. In the group reporting UTI symptoms, the standard urine culture detected only 57 percent of uropathogens, while the EQUC spotted 91 percent". https://www.captodayonline.com/missed-utis-enhanced-cultures-suggest/

I take a cranberry supplement every evening and except for the recent situation, it's pretty mucheliminated my UTIs, which had become pretty frequent.

wallycat

Beesie, I will copy/paste this to my gyn in case they care. I've never had a uti in my life, so this was quite bothersome and concerning for me. Still, she did mention that atrophic changes can mimic UTIs and worse, start causing them routinely. She also mentioned Imvexxy, which is the newest vaginal estrogen and comes in as low as 4mcg (along with the traditional 10mcg). I asked for a rx and they have a coupon rx card on line so my 200/3-month is 35. Worth having even if I take much less than they suggest.

Always appreciate your feedback!

Nsbrown54

I’m glad I found this thread. I’ve been suffering for vaginitis and haven’t found a solution yet to resolve the burning and itching, Last week, I thought I had a UTI and saw my PCP. Initial test showed blood in my urine, so I started AZO and antibiotic. Culture came back with no bacteria, so I stopped the antibiotic and AZO.Unfortunately, my urinary frequency returned, especially at night. Reading up on causes, seems vaginitis could be the culprit. I see my GYN Tuesday and my PCP is ordering me a renal ultrasound.

I’ve restarted AZO and had some cranberry juice earlier today. I hope that at least gives me relief from the frequency.

KBL

Nsbrown54, I had a reaction about a month ago and ended up in the emergency room. I’m just checking to make sure you don’t use any kind of wipes in your vaginal area. That’s what caused the issue for me. I had some kind of reaction. I don’t use them normally but had been camping and used them. Just was curious. If not, I hope they can help you. There is nothing worse than issues in that area.

Nsbrown54

Thanks for the suggestion KBL, but I'm not using any vaginal wipes.

flashlight

Hi Nsbrown5, Because of a prolapse and Tamoxifen this started happening to me. My Gyn recommended I use Replens Long-Lasting Vaginal Moisturizer 3x a week. This did help and my MO gave the okay for estrogen cream if I needed it. I ended up have a total hysterectomy with a prolapse repair and that took care of the problem. I don't have any issues with vaginitis, but with the decrease of estrogen I still have to get up at night to urinate. Best wishes.

Nsbrown54

Thank you for the response. I'm post menopausal and had been using Estrace until my BC diagnosis in a June. I tried replens but the paraffin caused some burning. I tried a couple of different things the last couple of months with limited success. I see my GYN tomorrow and hope to get some recommendations

wallycat

I have been on vaginal estrogen since my incident (when I posted) and it took a good 3-4 months before the tissues and bladder responded. I usually only get up once in the night now and I don't have to freak out driving to find a toilet every 1/2 hour. I was never given antibiotics (I did order the Azo with antimicrobial incase things got bad but never took them). I also started taking a small dose of d-mannose till my tissue regained moisture and plumped up. I may stay on that since it causes no issues and may (or may not) help. A neighbor had horrible UTIs (6 in one year) and I told her about d-mannose; she hasn't had one since she started taking it.

I'm convinced between stress, aging and lack of estrogen, our bodies are unknowable to us.

KBL

Nsbrown. I’m glad you don’t use those. You sound just like me. I was on Estrace until diagnosis and it was wonderful. I have also tried Replens. Didn’t work for me. I hope you find resolution.