thoughts on vagifem post hormone receptive BC

bjb01

I am 99% ER+ and PR+, therefore having to stop my HRT.  I have read many things with regard to the continued use of vagifem for localized vaginal application.  My onc said that if it helps my quality of life then do it.  He indicated that there is nothing that points directly to it contributing to a recurrence as it is so localized and no absorbed in the same manner as a patch of pills.  Can anyone weigh in on this topic? 

Lamp

Hi bjb01, you are so right in saying, quality of life! That is what it boils down to! What's best for you!

I am too, stewing and brewing with this topic! Driving myself nuts! It's just not fair!

coraleliz

My MO says only if I'm on Tamoxifen. My BS & my urologist tell me there are other MOs that disagree & that BC patients need to "take care of their vaginas".

ICanDoThis

Been on it for 2 yrs. Makes the whole situation down there tolerable.
If your doc is comfortable, then go for it

bevin

HI there, My onco and Gyn both approved usage. Its a huge help .

bjb01

I am so grateful for the chance to ask questions of real women who are going thru the same thing right alongside me:) thank u all so muc

rgiuff

My Oncologist was also all for the idea of using vaginal estrogen. He says it's important to maintain vaginal health and avoid UTIs.

Imagineme13

hello ladies. I noticed all of the comments were from women that were stages I & II. I am HER positive, stage IV metastasis BC and only 43. I'm on Arimidex as of 2 weeks ago and taking Herceptin every 3 weeks. Is there anyone out there that was still recommended Vagifem with this diagnosis? I look forward Ito trying natural vaginal moisture relief such as 100% organic coconut oil or olive oil but wanted a lil estrogen for more relief from the dryness. Please help.

bjb01

even prior to my BR Ca diagnosis, I had a horrible time with yeast inf and UTI's. I went to a specialty vulvar clinic and was told to use Crisco shortening as a topical moisturizer 2-3 times per day. (you don't need much) Olive oil is used during sex. It's unbelievable how this has made a difference I highly recommend it. as far as the use of Vagifem......my oncologist said it's about quality of life. it took me 50 years to find someone that I LOVE having a sexual relationship with. My compromise was only using it one a week instead of every 4 days. I was grade 2 and 99% hormone receptor positive. My HERS2 was negative.

Lauralind5

Imagine I'm stage 4 also. My Onc said well your body knows how to grow breast cancer cells but if your gyn follows close and you think it will help your QOL then go for it. I agree. We don't really know what causes breast cancer we only have risk factors that we can weigh in on. I'm going for QOL. what's the point in trying so hard if I can't participate in life ?

rgiuff

Lauralind, I agree exactly about the QOL being important, and this has been my motto too. What's the point in all this if the life you are preserving can't be enjoyed?

Imagineme13

hello all, just saw MO about prescribing a low dose of Vagifem and he quickly voiced his decision against it. He said he didn't want to take any chances with my cancer being aggressive and HER2+. He recommended the KY but something tells me that will not work either. I'm currently taking the hormonal therapy & Herceptin every 3 weeks.It's my quality of life we are talking about but I wonder if going to the OBGYN would help.... Anyone with any other suggestions?

bjb01

imagineme13, I can certainly understand your frustration. 1. I URGE you to go back to my post and implement what I listed. they are natural, they are not contraindicated in any way to your treatment. (Crisco/olive oil) if done routinely they WILL make a difference. If your MO said NO to vagifem, then NO it is. For me, the decision was easier as I am HERS 2 negative. I hope this helps you. Keep your chin up and use that Crisco!!!! I swear by that and the olive oil. If you have any questions, just ask me.

Imagineme13

Dear bjb01, what type of olive oil? Extra virgin? (No pun intended ....lol..)

Just wanted the type of olive oil being there is so much to choose from these days. Btw... I saw your post and thought that it was strange but my PA said to try olive oil.

Last question: how did you insert it? I read a post of a lady making homemade suppositories out of foil. Great idea.

Thanks for your input

bjb01

funny :) I do use extra virgin, the lightest color you can find. The Crisco shortening is just applied topically to the entire area just like lotion onto your hands. I have done this for 2 years now and it's gotten to the point that I feel weird without it. I do this 3 times per day. The olive oil is just used in place of the KY. It's topical as well and used as a lubricant during sex. you will LOVE it. They are natural alternatives that really work. it will take several weeks for the Crisco to make a noticeable difference, but it's worth the wait. anything else?

Imagineme13

thanks bjb01

I believe you've answered all of my questions and have put my mind to ease. Lol

I'm assuming the olive oil is simply applied at the opening before sex. Not to be inserted deep within the vagina.

The hormonal drug I'm taking along with what the chemo did has nearly closed my vagina and I'm so afraid of having sex with my DH (never knew what DH meant other than some type of husband. Feel free to explain lol...). There has been NO sex for about 4 months. No desire either but I'm trying. 😂

Sorry to be so graphic

bjb01

graphic is the only way to get answers we use the olive oil both ways. just like you would KY, but also inserted from a small plastic squeeze bottle. (I actually use an old 3 oz KY bottle) It took me over 50 years to find the one person that I truly enjoyed an exciting and adventurous sex life with. Nothings going to stop me now :) stay in touch....literally and figuratively

nottoday

Forum: "Middle Age" 40-60(ish) Years with Breast Cancer → Topic: vaginal dryness

Ladies,

You may also be interested in the posts in the topic above.

Imagineme13

Thanks nottoday

Molly50

Hi ladies, this topic is very important to me because I have battled atrophy since my bilateral oopherectomy in 2011. Until my BC diagnosis I had found balance with estrace cream. My MO says no to it now. I haven't even started my anastrozole yet and life's a struggle. I found a product that so far works. It's called Neu Eve Neu Eve natural remedy for Vaginal health . It's a suppository to be used once per week and then I use Very Private Daily Intimate Moisture on the outside of my vaginal opening. Also I know many women who use coconut oil both internal and external as moisturizer successfully. If my QOL decreases with anastrozole then I plan to re address this issue with MO. I already have chronic UTI'S that estrace has managed and I have two pelvic floor prolapses that I need to prevent from getting worse. There are also Vaginal dilators you can purchase to help slowly open up the vaginal canal. You might also consider asking your gyn for a referral to pelvic floor PT.

rgiuff

My Oncologist said yes to Estrace. It worked well for inside and outside,  but I wanted a break from the messiness it sometimes xaused. So now, I'm trying Vagifem. I plan to always use some type of vaginal estrogen to combat Nature's cruelty to us postmenopausal women!

bjb01

I really think that u will like vagifem. Give it time tho , maybe 2-3 months . In the meantime, be diligent about the crisco 2-3 times per day.....at 59 I refused to give up a great sex life and these things make it possible :

pnmg02

I went through menopause in my early 40's, my doctor decided since I was so young and osteoporosis ran in my family a low dose HRT would be beneficial. I was on it for about 8 years. I winged myself off of it (which was very hard). Then about a year later I was diagnosed with DCIS. Since then sex has been very painful, along with itching and urinary problems. When I visited my BS I talked with him about it and he suggested one of these, Vagifem, Estring, or Premarin Vaginal Cream. I would have to have a GYN prescribe and follow me. I have an appointment tomorrow and so I've been doing research on these and read a lot of reviews and frankly I'm a little nervous about trying them. Not because of a chance of recurrence of bc but because of the other side effects I've read about. Hair loss, bloating, headaches, back and stomach pain, discharge, and the cost. I know this was a long way around this but I was wondering what any of you have experienced and your thoughts.

Thanks Pam

bjb01

pnmg02....I swear by vagifem and had absolutely NO side effects. It kept my wonderfully full sex life going. I have no perslective on the others, but vagifem is easy and NO mess like some of the others. let me know how it turns out??? you will be happy, just be patient as it doesn't happen overnight.

readytorock

Vagifem rocks!!

I am estrogen positive, but my surgeon explained it like this - nail polish is poisonous if you drink it, but if you put it on your nails, it is harmless. So the topical application of vagifem is not an issue with estrogen positive cancer.

I was told to use every day for two weeks and then twice a week after that. We "tried" sex for the first time after the two weeks (it had been about eight weeks in total as I had just had my ovaries removed.) It was fabulous!!

And remember - vagifem is NOT for dryness. It is meant to help the "strechiness" of the vaginal wall. I didn't even realize this was the problem until it was explained to me. Use astroglide or coconut oil for the "slipperiness" and vagifem for the "stretchiness."

Good luck!

pnmg02

Thanks guys for the great information. I was leaning toward vagifem because of the ease of use and no messiness. Unfortunately my GYN postponed my appt till the end of January. We've used KY several times but it didn't help much. I'll try some other things. Thanks I'll keep you informed.

cuddyclothes

I need to ask about entry pain. Besides dryness, the entry hurts like a BITCH! I'm back on Premarin temporarily but have to switch to Vagifem. Even with the Premarin, sex hurts. Any advice?

P.S. We've been using Crisco as a lubricant for some time. My doctor recommended it over anything else.

bjb01

cuddly clothes....I use the crisco as a two-three times a day moisturizer. Serious. If I don't use it, I feel like something's missing . As a lubricant during intercourse we use olive oil. Extra virgin only because it's so light. And I love vagifem, and I feel ok using it as it won't contribute to my hormone receptive cancer. The only prob I have now is no partner. I'm worried about atrophy... Very worried. Always something

Lamp

Hello...I've been on Vagifem six months, intercourse is still painful, upon entry etc etc Will it ever feel great..

bjb01

good morning Lamp are you doing anything other than the vagifem? I ask because for me, there is a combination of things that all come together to work. I would strongly encourage you to use Crisco shortening 2-3 times per day as an external moisturizer. (more if you can) It doesn't take much to cover the external areas. I've done it for so long that I feel strange w/o it. LIke the middle of winter and your hands need lotion? like that:) I also am a HUGE user and fan of olive oil as a lubricant EVERY time we have sex. It's natural and will not cause potential skin reactions that could cause yeast infections. Look, I know that it all sounds strange....and I resisted at first. After a year of trying/not trying, I realized that I needed to do all these things, just as my doctor had suggested. I did and what a difference. I'm 60 years old and my sex life is FAR better than it ever was in my youth. It helps to truly love someone and I do. I would encourage you to check with your OB/GYN just to be sure that there isn't anything medical that should be addressed. If you do ALL these things diligently, I would be shocked if things didn't improve for you. be patient (3 months maybe), but it's SO worth it. We have been through a lot and this is just a part of our way back :) We owe it to ourselves to NOT let this ruin the rest of our lives......................please let me know. any more ????, just ask

Lamp

Thanks bjb01, very informative! Ok I need all the goods here! I'm not going to be afraid to ask!

Cisco shortening.....that white stuff ....That my mother in law used for making pie crust! ? .. And...Olive oil! Who would of thought!

Right now I'm only using vagifem and during intercourse a lube.....with no success!

Anxious to try.....any remedy! What the heck.....seems reasonable!