Guidance needed--dating a woman with double mastectomy

decent_guy

Hi, All,

I hope I'm making this request in the right forum and apologize if I'm not.

Here's my situation--I've met a truly amazing woman who informed me on our first date that she's a cancer survivor and has had a double mastectomy. Other than the obvious concern that she'd had to suffer through that experience her revelation didn't really upset or shock me--face it at our age (early fifties) many of us have had or will soon have some type of major illness.

Without being presumptuous it looks like things may become sexual in the near future and I need some advice. I've never made love to a woman who has had a double mastectomy but I can imagine such a procedure changes how a woman feels about her body. And I know that her breasts won't feel the same as "the real thing" to either her or to me. I am afraid that I'll say the wrong thing or do something that might hurt her feelings. I would really appreciate the advice of women who have undergone this procedure. This is an honest, heartfelt request, not some silly desire to be salacious. I care for this dear woman and want her to know that I find her attractive but I feel at a loss as to how to proceed.

Any insights you can share would be most appreciated--it seems like there's very little information about this on the Internet!

J

DiveCat

Well, I guess my thought is...if you are going to become intimate, then you probably outght to be able to be emotionally and verbally intimate and honest then, and it is probably a good idea to ask her beforehand how she feels about the changes to her body as every woman is different, and no one here can answer for all women, or for this woman you are dating. Depending on what kind of recon she has had, assuming she has had recon, they may actually feel pretty "real" to you (i.e many flap reconstructions can feel quite natural), and she may still derive some pleasure from them, or maybe none at all, or maybe she never has found them a source of stimulation in any event. You can't know until you ask her, though I do appreciate that you are trying to understand and that is great, really she is the one you need to ask.

Using myself as an example: my circumstances are different in that my BMX was prophylactic. I was 34 at the time, now 35, and honestly, my surgery did not change how I feel about my body in a negative way at all. While they look different, I have minimal scarring that is not visible unless you look hard under my breasts, and I still have my own nipples. They do look a bit different than natural breasts of course as they aren't natural breasts, and they are different than MY natural breasts, but they are identifiable as breasts and I am pleased with their shape and appearance. I actually like their appearance BETTER than my old ones and actually feel more comfortable with them - and with them on my body - than I did my natural ones. And, because my breasts were both a source of anxiety AND some discomfort and pain due to fibrocystic conditions, I no longer had much pleasure from them BEFORE the surgery in any event so did not feel I lost out on that. I have implant reconstruction, and while I can't feel the same feelings I used too, I still get pleasure with my skin on my breasts being touched and so on - I still have sensitivity in places, and I still enjoy seeing my spouse appreciate them. So yes, a mastectomy changed how I felt about my body but probably the reverse of what you expect...I am actually far more accepting and loving of my body now (and as a disclaimer, I have struggled with body image a lot in my years including with eating disorders like anorexia and so on) for many complex reasons that aren't simply explained just by having a new chest, but are rather tied to having gone through that experience as a whole, for making that decision for myself to reduce my risk and give myself a chance that my mother and other relatives have not had, for seeing myself right after surgery and realizing that I was going to be okay whatever happened, that even if I had NO breasts I would be okay, and so on.

I have, however, learned from many stories that *my* experience is not like others, because everyone has their own experience, their own stories behind their changed body, their own feelings about their new chest. For this woman, there is also a cancer history there, that can play into how she views and perceives her chest, and it may not be what you expect. I have also learned that some women still derive a lot of pleasure, even if they cannot necessarily feel it, as their is still a mental connection, or they enjoy their partner's reaction, or whatever else. We are ALL unique and all have our own unique experiences.

As for wanting to let her know that you find her attractive, well, just be honest and let her know? Don't say what you can't yet mean. It's hard for example to say the feel of them won't bother you, until you know what they feel like, right? And if she is anything like me, well, let's say I would not be impressed by a statement like that. But you CAN tell her that at your age you also know bodies come in all shapes, sizes, and have been through a lot in life, and that you see her as more than what she does or does not have on her chest. And if that is your truth, then that is the truth, and that WILL come through.

My husband has seen me with natural breasts, when I was just out of surgery, as I recovered, as I pointed out flaws I thought I had in my former implants, as I had a surgery to exchange my implants, and as I was out of that surgery. And I have always felt loved, appreciated, and accepted by him. He has never seen the flaws I have seen for example. And I have never doubted it when he has told me I am beautiful, or that he loves me and thinks I am attractive for far more than what is on my chest. I trust him when he says that, because we have a developed relationship. If he told me that when we just started dating though, before he ever saw my chest, I might not have trusted his statements My point is, keep your statements to what is true, to what can be true based on experience. You may very well in time be able to tell her that you think her chest looks great, but you can't do that BEFORE you really mean it, if that makes sense. And, you also have to go by her feelings, if she expresses to you that she is very self conscious about her chest, then don't compliment her just to "make" her feel better. Again, if she is anything like me, she will see right through that!

decent_guy

DiveCat,

Thank you for that very detailed and enlightening response. You confirmed my guess that it's really all about communication like so many things. I guess I was worried I'd squash spontaneity by asking but spontaneity is only good when you happen to guess right! And you really educated me--I had no experience like yours to help me realize that a D-M (yes, with reconstruction) can actually be a more comfortable state than the "natural" condition that preceded it! It's hard for a guy to understand the whole situation but you remind me that ultimately we are people first and male or female second. I will try to substitute something I CAN relate to in place of her experience and then simply treat her with love, respect, and an honest desire to be authentic and supportive.

I am glad you seem both healthy and happy, appreciate you taking the time to respond, and wish you the best,

J

charli2012

Wow Decent Guy,

It is so nice to see a man coming here to get input and advice on such a sensitive subject. I think you got the best advice from DiveCat. It is all about communication and being genuine. The fact that you took the time to research and write this post indicates you will know what to say or not say. I think this is a great topic and would love to see input from others, especially males on their actual thoughts on dating someone with a mastecomy. How many women have been rejected because of the mastecomy, either with or without reconstruction. Guys, would you date a woman that did not have reconstruction? I was lucky and my double mastecomy without reconstruction did not affect my current relationship, as he is not overly concerned with this issue, but often wonder what dating would be like in this situation.

Trvler

There is a thread about a woman whose husband won't touch her after her mx. It's sad. My heart breaks for her.

DGuy: I think you are going to do just fine. I would just say take it slow, because she might feel 'inferior' in some way, like you are doing her a favor by being with her. You don't want her to feel that way or be with you for that reason so don't rush into the sexual part. Let her know you are with her for her and the other thing is just what it is. Take it at her pace. (Sorry if I sound crazy). I am hyped up on steroids today.

4happygirl

Decent guy I am a 55 yr old married woman with a single mastectomy and in the process of reconstruction, so I haven't experienced my fully reconstructed breast yet. The only thing I have to add to the previous ladies' wise comments is Don't Be Nervous. My attitude toward my breast cancer is that I was d**n lucky it was early stage and that I will live. I feel like I dodged a bullet. And I view my reconstruction as the silver lining to the fear and stress I went through during diagnosis. I will have two twenty-year old quality breasts and a flat stomach when my plastic surgeon is through with his brilliant work, which will be far superior to my post breast feeding 55 year old breasts and post pregnancy tummy. Your lady may be excited and happy about her reconstructed body. Tissue reconstructed breasts will develop some sensation as the body rebuilds the nerves in the tissue, although a reconstructed nipple will never have it's natural super sensitive sensation again. So, I would advise not focusing on the nipple, if she still has her natural nipples, as you might with natural breasts. It will be important for you to know if she's taking a SERM like Tamoxifen or an aromatase inhibitor like Arimidex. They both suppress estrogen availability to the vaginal tissues, which will affect the vagina negatively, unfortunately. The tissues will become drier, and shrink or atrophy over time, but many things can be done to maintain those tissues. Her medical oncologist may be allowing her to use an e-string or estrogen suppositories to maintain those tissues. If so, she's probably not having issues with atrophy. If not, there's a lot of advice on BC.org about what to do if this is the case, so don't despair. I just started taking an AI and I have quite a few ideas about how my husband will be able to help me with tissue maintenance, mostly involving sex toys and coconut oil. Even in the absence of breast cancer, once you get to be our age, a thorough review of vibrators and water based lubricants is most helpful.  Using an AI may have a silver lining; technically it works by preventing the enzyme aromatase from converting testosterone produced by the adrenal gland into estrogen. So, for some women, the slight increase in the amount of available testosterone may improve their libido. As so many women on BC.org complain, doctors never tell you this stuff. Good luck with your new relationship!