To Nipple or Not to Nipple.

MT1

I have an appointment to get 3d nipple tattoos on August 3. I had a double mastectomy without reconstruction. My 'close' was quite good. My chest is pretty darned flat. I have a slight hersheys kiss on the inside of the right scar, but I like it. It seems to be flattening out by the day and if it stays as a kiss, I am OK with this.

Last month my Man and I went to a yoga retreat center that we have gone to several times over the last few years. They have a whirlpool, that I have loved and is the big draw, beside the yoga and food. I never wore a suit before, so I made a point of not wearing a suit now. Needless to say, when I entered the pool and dropped my towel, the room went silent. Two nights in a row. Laughing, talking, I enter...crickets. I am not really one to recite an autobiography like, 'I am a cancer survivor and this is my decision, I feel comfortable with it and hope you do too'. So that was really difficult.

I came home, made an appointment to have nipples tattooed and here I am.

Now? I don't know.

Visually, I think it will be soothing to have the look of a normal body. Everyone has nipples.

But then, I am flat. I do not look like I have breasts, I don't. I have scars, my unaffected side is still red, which will fade and become skin colored, but scars. Nipples on top of scars?

Vinnie Myers (the tattoist I have the appointment with) has one double mastectomy without reconstruction in his portfolio: http://vinniemyers.com/artwork/2058326_Spring_2011.html

Her scars are more red than mine and her surgery not as flat.  

Last week I was in a restaurant and I leaned forward, revealing my chest. I caught the eye of a man as he saw. In this scenario, I think having nipples would sooth me.

So to nipple or not to nipple. should I go for it? I am an artist and the visual is important to me, but I also think embracing my new form could mean not suggesting nipples and not caring what other people see and how they react.

sherry67

I think you need to do what you think feels best for you..I don't have nipples and don' t care to though I was able to keep my aero las at reconstruction ..I also had a BMX my choice..good luck with what ever you choose

loriio

Hi MT1. My BMX is 2 weeks from today, and I do plan on reconstruction. I had planned on surgical nips but now Im considering going to Vinnie. I noticed on his site that he has some amazing artwork he's done on mastectomy patients instead of nipples. I think that's a beautiful option as well. Whatever you do, do it for you and no one else. Good luck to you.

Erica3681

I had wondered about how nipples would look and how they would make me feel. I, too, am quite flat after a BMX. I decided to order silicone nipples. When they arrived, they looked very realistic but I was disappointed in the look when I stuck them on my chest. To me, it didn't appear anymore natural than going without.

Have you experimented with fake nipples or drawing nipples on your chest? I agree that you should do what feels good to you. You're obviously brave and confident. I wouldn't have the guts to go commando into a whirlpool. And when you talked about leaning over and revealing your chest, perhaps in that situation, having nipple tattoos would give the illusion of breasts.

Please let us know what you decide and how it goes. Vinnie Myers work seems fantastic. He's the person I would choose if I were going that route.

SheChirple

MT:  I recently had BMX with reconstruction, and am still in the process, awaiting exchange. I have decided against nipple reconstruction, but am also trying to decide on whether or not to tattoo.

I ordered some temporary nipple tattoos on line and am trying those out.  I know the final tattoo will look quite different.  I'm just trying to test the waters.  I recommend this.

Ultimately, you cannot control how comfortable others will be, or how they will react.  Only how you react to their reactions. You do not really know if their reaction was to the scars, the flat chest or the absent nipples.  You will never know.  Either way, your body is your temple to be veiwed in your eyes.  Walk proud with whatever you decide.

River_Rat

I wondered about this myself, but not being flat decided that it wouldn't be worthwhile for me to pursue.  Since you're flat it might work well for you.  You might try the temporary tattoos others have mentioned if you can locate them in time.  Otherwise if you are close to someone with artistic talents you might consider having someone draw/paint some on to see what you think.  My sister wanted to use Magic Markers on me but so far I've resisted.  

MT1

OK, I just ordered some rub on nipples , this should be fun.

http://shop.embracingmastectomy.com/main.sc

I know that I should not do this for anyone but myself. I think this is an extra tough decision. I know I made the right decsion not to reconstruct. That I know. Right now I am finding it difficult to see people react to my body and lack of breast forms, I am not interested in wearing them. But still, I find it difficult to experience people checking me out.

I could easily decide not to get the tattoos based on something as frivolous as money. I have the money to do it, so I am putting that argument aside.

Knowing how I set up the decision to have the tattoos is one thing. But on the other side of the equation I am quite excited to think of seeing myself with nipples. I think I will feel more confident with 'nipples', and I think it will help me not feel so... medical. I especially like to think of them as art to help me heal. And, I would like to have something to feel modest about (not that I will wear a suit in the whirlpool next time!). So I guess I feel a bit vain too.

Perhaps I should just tell myself to try the rub-on nipples and be gentle and compassionate as I figure out if I am making the right decsion for myself.

breast cancer and all the details can be so messy. 

Thanks all.

momof3boys

I did a BMX with TE's (will have final exchange in nov) I'm 99.9% sure I will not do nipples...

Went out to dinner with a bunch of BC women last week that are in my exercise group. One of them just had her nipples tattooed. She made an interesting comment that I've replayed in my head. She said she decided to do the tattoos because having "nipples" was like having "lures". She said the eye is naturally drawn to the nipple... And it made her happy to look at herself again. I've been thinking of it ever since. I think she's right. I'm glad she figured this out and it pleased with her tattoos.

momof3boys

To be clear: she didn't have surgical nipples, just the tattoos. That's what I'll more than likely do too....

lisa2012

I am still in chemo, had BMX in Feb, awaiting TE exchange probably november. I have been leaning away from nipples, I'm annoyed that they have no feeling . I laugh with my PS that the round bandaids seem like nipples. What are the tattoo nipples? What are surgical nipples? My sister is going to do the tattoo areola and the snips to make a bump. Is that what you are talking about? I guess I am a true novice. What are 3D nipples? I know, I can google all this! interesting to learn about it, since we are in this situation.

SheChirple

Let me just say that having no nipple, either reconstructed or tattooed, means nothing visible through tops, either.

My husband giggles that I can walk around the house topless not worried that anyone might see through the window.  I figure they would just think I had on a light body stocking or tan top.  No nipples = no nakedness to be ashamed of and nothing to hide.

I am quite enjoying not having to wear a bra, though I do most days because it just feels right.  If I had nipples I would have to wear a bra or something to cover them from peeking through.

Anonymous

I never got a chance to get nipples when I had implants. Too many issues, so after everything was removed and undone, I am plain Jane. I can't believe I am going to say this, but I have actually come to like my scars. They tell a story without my having to say a word. I was initially horrified by the disaster on my chest after deconstructing, but it has been a little over a year, and even the concave areas, extra skin and bumpiness have come to look familiar and okay to me. I love that my body is so strong; it has been able to survive and adapt to everything that was done to it. It still takes me where I need to go, lets me move, love, dance, create. It is a beautiful thing. My heart and soul are tender, but I am one tough chick!




Circumstances will occasionally trigger sadness and loss. That is inevitable, I think. However, during my everyday activities I find that the more I shed expectations for my new body to look, feel, or behave like my old one, the happier I am. Old clothes that fit because I had breasts or implants, they must go away and be replaced by what works for now. Practicing kindness to my body as far as exercise, movement and sexuality lets me think more about discovering the new me vs mourning what my old body could do. I stand naked in front of a mirror, my arms outstretched, and I am blown away by what IS. I have hopes and dreams for greater fitness and ability, but I will let LE set the pace and show me how far I can go.

Adey

Go Tina!

MT1

I received my Rub On Nipples in the mail today. I love the words Rub-On Nipples. 

I  put a pair on, they are off kilter and not centered properly, but I get to see my body with them.  My initial responce was happiness. Then relief. Then ambivalence. 

Having the whirlpool experience was harsh.  Moving away from that is, of course, easy. I no longer feel I 'need' a 'nipple buffer'. Now it is a question of wanting them or not. This is a better place to work from. And it feels good to have a temporary look.

crystalphm

It interests me that even women who have had reconstruction are faced with the nipple issue.

 MT1, I think I would eventually feel like you, ambivalent. My breast are missing, I don't think a second prize (nipples) (LOL or booby prize) is going to help my thinking at all. And the room grew quiet bot because of what they saw, but because they were dropped to their knees by your courage!!!!!!!!

But yet I agree with  your heal with art thought, and I am doing this with beading elaborate scarves which I usually end up not wearing.

hey, I truly envy your getting in that hot tub. I can't (yet) walk around the house without a shirt on. no one but the doctor has seen me breastless in 6 months now.

Have you all googled Sentencedtolive  's  photos? I believe that is her name. Those few photos have inspired me greatly.

I would love to be proud of my new body, I have fought hard to get rid of the cancer...but I don't know how to be proud of what I am left with.

River_Rat

MT1, interesting goings-on here.  I clicked on your link to the rub-on nipples and DH and I were looking at the color chart.  We are nowhere in the same ballpark as to what color would most closely match my originals.  It's been almost six years, we don't know which one of us is closest and if we want to find out we'll have to pull out the memorial pics we took before my surgery...now where the heck is that CD?!  

Crystal, I Googled Sentencedtolive and came up empty, but I'm glad her photos have inspired you.  I'm going to tell you one of the things I've used to become comfortable with my body.  I check out all the women about my age (59) and look at where their breasts are hanging.  Flat looks better every year. 

crystalphm

Oh, I am sorry, I got it wrong. Sentenced2live under flickr is where I saw her photo.

River_Rat

Crystal, thanks.  I have seen those photos elsewhere and they are wonderful.

MT1

I have decided Not To Nipple. Wanting to get the nipples was related to the experience of going into the whirlpool. Now that I know what that experience was like, I bet the next time, I am prepared. This last month helped me to figure out what I care about and what I can let go of. I care about my thoughts and feelings first and foremost. I don't need nipples to make me feel normal. I like my scars. I like my body. I am OK, just the way I am. I don't care what other people think. I may want to get nipple tattoos in future but now is not the time to make that decision.

I do sorta want a tattoo though. I like/love to sew, so I was thinking I might get a tattoo on my scar of stitches with a needle tucked into the skin as though I had stopped sewing for the day and I would like it to show in a summer tank top. We will see.

But this week is my 1 year anniversary from surgery and I would rather revel in my bodies ability to heal and give myself time to relax.

Melly 

crystalphm

Melly, It is a good choice to simply wait and see. Good for you. I do think  your idea of "healing through art" has strong merit, and yes, a tattoo seems appropriate for you. I fully expect sometime I will get one, just to create something positive on my body.

Your hot tub experience is just so awe-inspiring to me. I wish I could feel so free. I want to like my new body. I want to not care what other people say or think. I will get there, someday.

This may sound like an odd thing to say, but your hot tub experience reminded me of how I felt when I went into a VA hospital to visit someone. There was a huge engraved in stone sign that said "Beyond these doors is the price for your freedom".

Wow. And it is the same with us, our scars show the price of being cancer free. It is enough to silence a whole room, appropriately so.

You have such courage. I do too, I just have yet to find my path.

mclark55

MT1 - I think you made the right decision.  Love the idea of the tattoo, sounds cool.

I decided to have a nipple reconstruction (8 yrs ago) and it failed, oddly enough.  I got a staph infection from the surgery and despite all of my best attempts to keep it completely clean and sterile until it healed, the staph infection got the better of me.  I agonized over that darned nipple WAY more than I did with the surgery and cancer diagnosis (I don't understand why, but that's what happened!).

I like what you said about liking yourself just the way you are.  Wonderful!  Good for you.

Sending you a big hug today.

Galsal

For now, I've decided to forego the surgical nips and instead go with 3D ones.  There's enough surgeries without having to worry about them surviving, etc.  My humble opinion, suitable for me of course.  I'm contacting Vinny to learn what they might run.  Can fly up to stay with my Sister in that area.

MT1

You know, when I made the decision not to reconstruct my body, I told myself to stop feeling modest and just go for it, live life and proceed as if nothing was different, and as if it was all very different-I didn't have the modest making breasts to contend with. I used to feel quite modest about my breasts, they were large for my small frame and I never really liked them. I still don't like what our society makes of breasts. But at the same time, I had them, so I accepted them. Now that I don't have them anymore, I do (at times) feel conflicted. Confused about my body and my relation to it in the past and conflicted by society and its focus on gender and accepted norms (in this case getting reconstruction after breast cancer treatment)

But I want to go with my original thought. No more modesty. Perhaps my hesitation in wanting to fully embody what my current experience is, lays in the fact that I used to have large breasts, perhaps it might be easier for an A cup woman to go flat, rather than a DD. Maybe not though. My mom was trying to tell me that as you get older that you tend to care less about what other people think, but then, she has not had to go through a life changing experience, where your form is not what you have related to for the past 42 years.

I know that given time, I will release all these self assessing and deep thoughts and just live. In the meantime, I hope my ramblings have some interest.

Outfield

I wish I could try some of the things I consider in a temporary way.  

What I'd really like to do is put in piercings where my nipples would be if I were a male.  But I'm worried about them leaving scars if I don't like them, and I'm worried about them showing through shirts at work.  There are no surgical nipples in my future, I do know that with confidence.  

Vinnie Myers's work is beautiful; I have not seen its equal online.  But he's far away, and the reasons for doing a tattoo seem to me different than those for doing piercings.  A tattoo would be to fool people.  Piercings would be to create visual focus, but with no intent to fool anyone.  I know my partner and I won't be fooled, and we're the ones I care about.  Well, really me.  So although I truly admire his work, I am not myself considering that.  

But, oh, I miss the sensation. 

Blessings2011

Oh, MT1 - thanks for that link! I'm totally going to order some, once I figure out if I'm a "Barely There", "Toasty Brown", or "Peachy Tan" kinda girl.

My mom had a radical mastectomy 29 years ago, so flat seems kind of normal to me.

But I decided to have a go at reconstruction (TEs/implants) with the idea that as soon as I had any issues at all, out they would come.

I have absolutely no desire for surgical nipples, and in fact, I'm with SheChirple on the ability to not have anything show through clothing while going bra-less.

PixieNel

i want mine free and easy. No nipples, i don't need to wear brassiere all the time.

River_Rat

Melly, I saw these back when I was first Dx'ed.  At the time I thought I might do something like one of these, but later health issues made that unadvisable.  I've been trying to find my original links for this thread and finally gave up and Googled and found them.  I think you'll really enjoy looking at these:

http://www.blingdomofgod.com/celtic-tattoo-bra.php

http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/5425?size=_original 

And I ran across this site searching for the others: 

http://tattooroadtrip.com/blog/gallery-tattooing-over-mastectomies/

Anonymous

MT, I do understand your mother's comment, as by the time I was diagnosed with BC at 50, I had already observed changes to my body brought on by aging. Exercise, all the right foods, etc couldn't stop it. And I mourned these "little deaths" of what it used to be like to be young, have a body that was vital in every way and looked pretty damn good in the process. After having a mastectomy, a recon gone awry (and chronic pain at the time), truncal and arm LE, I feel like I have been fast forwarded to a different decade. Undoing the recon and relief from pain gave me a few years back, but I still feel quite confused about where I am. My body looks a hell of a lot older, I can tell you that. LE is a daily reminder of the things I can no longer do, and I hate it, find it frustrating, and have had to deal with those losses. I try to approach LE as a reminder that there are many things I can do in life. I happened to like certain activities, but maybe this is a wake up to break out of doing old favorite things and try some new ones. Either that or I continue to wish for what was . . . and it's not to say I don't ever go there. Sometime it hits me like a truck out of nowhere and brings me to my knees. ALL of these changes are major life altering experiences, and no one can truly understand unless they've been there or gone through some sort of permanent body disfiguration or malfunction. It takes a while to find your way back from where you've gone. Frankly, I'm still pretty effing lost at times. But I sure am trying, and each day I'm on the lookout for friendly signposts.

greenfrog

Some of the nipple tattoos I have seen have been exceptional MT1 - but have you considered other types of tats?

I have been toying with the idea of an amusing (rather than profound or cutesy) tattoo to disguise my revolting, huge hypertrophic MX scar.

I think these are brilliant. I'd love to come up with something for my ex-tit as hilarous as the lawn mower on the balding man.

http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/26835

MT1

Yes, Greenfrog. I have decided against nipple tattoos and am thinking about honoring the part of me that loves to sew by getting a needle and thread tattood in that area. I love the links that River Rat posted!

Outfield

Greenfrog, those are GREAT!

As someone with lymphedema, I worry about the particulate load of the tattoo into an area with compromised lymph flow.  I know I saw that in the oceans of lymphedema stuff I've read since mine reared its head.  Lymphedema in generaly is so abysmally poorly studied that I can't imagine anyone has ever investigated whether or not tattoos have any effect on it.  But just on this thread there are links to women with loads of dye and beautiful tattoos and presumably no lymphedema, so . . .

Mellie, I like your idea of the needle and thread.  Hopefully the humor of it will keep the murmuring going in the yoga hot tub for your next appearance.