Privacy compromised

leggo

Here's a dumb question Athena. Can somebody track me down using my IP address. I'm such a computer idiot.

1Athena1

Gracie:

Yes - but they would have to have access to more info than almost everyone.

Day knows more and she can explain it to you. You can make your computer "invisible" to Google and others and you are probably only in danger that way if a psychopath runs a discussion form or blog that you pot to. I would no0t worry about that sort of thing, though. That takes more effort. It's the very basic information we post that is so easy, peasy to track us down by.

I have my settings so that I am "invisible" to Google, which is the only search engine I use.

Again, though, Day and others know much more than I do.

leggo

Thanks Athena. How do I make myself invisible on google? Day, any suggestions.

KittyKitty

I have always thought it was either incredibly open or inviting trouble for people to post their actual photos here, but then it seems that is encouraged by bco, with the place for photos to be posted.

I think most people, me included, never thought that threads would be imported into another site, like facebook, however. That just seems creepy and beyond bounds, and I hope the moderators will definitlely comfirm when all of those threads have been removed, and when they have verified that for a fact.

AlaskaAngel

I appreciate very much the constant, thoughtful maintenance of this site. None of the forums online that I know of could do more or better with this issue. I am thankful for the mods quick awareness and understanding of the concerns expressed about it.

The sharing of our very personal matter of breast cancer here is quite precious, and so much of it is helpful to others!

Personal photos are an issue unfortunately anyway for me, as I particularly worry about any form of potential identity theft in a world that is not always kind.

A.A.

Stormynyte

The site has a FB page, why wouln't they link posts to it? They are doing their jobs and getting the word out that this forum is here.

I think it is a great idea, as I said befor, the more people who find this site when they need it, the better.

As with anything on the net, if you don't want people to know it's you, don't use your real name or pic. We can be as anonymous as we want to be if we try.

hrf

I also expressed my concern about the Facebook link through the Canadian thread. I recognize that anyone can use Google to find this site. Many of us found it that way. However, it should be my choice if I want to be on Facebook and that choice should not be taken away from me. If I want to talk about breast cancer on Facebook - that is my choice - not anyone else's. So I am also upset that our threads were linked to Facebook. Even though the mods have stated that the link has been removed, some people are saying they are still there. So, it's one thing to be out there via BCO. It's another to be pushed out there to Facebook by BCO. And if our PMs are public, I had better go in and delete a whole lot of personal stuff. Thanks mumito for bringing this to our attention. 

Anonymous

I wonder if I'm correct, WITHOUT OUR PERMISSION the Moderators of this website are using our words on another site they use????  Please say it ain't so...

I don't care HOW they promote their website - but they do not have persmission to use MY WORDS to do it.  Sleazy - not surprising, after some of the ads we see on this website, but sleazy.  Maybe the Executives of BCO want higher salaries?  Sounds like it's going Komen, as in not the right direction. Probably not an "illegal" activity, but definitely sleazy.

Too bad, I've always trusted my words to be useful to users of BCO.  I am NOT on Facebook, and do not choose to have someone else posting MY WORDS there...

time to go....

KittyKitty

Some people may not have been aware of the facebook site.

Other people may have had the idea that they would be in control of sharing  their own personal comments and personal photo on facebook, if they wanted to do that, by posting directly to facebook.

Does it say anywhere in this site that comments and personal photos are potentially going to be posted to Facebook? I haven't seen that, and I would think that would have been an appropriate warning to post. Perhap I missed it.

Kittykltty does not publish a photo for that very reason. But I can see that some people did not have the expectation that their comments and photo would find their way to facebook.

gumshoe

I don't see private messages appear in Google results when I search my username, but I do see saved results for every search keyword I ever plugged in to bc.org...

That seems a bit invasive, and very unexpected. I am pretty savvy when it comes to computers but I wouldn't have thought search keywords would be tagged by username and indexed by Google.

I am also not on Facebook, although I don't worry too much about anyone finding me here based on my username.

Shrek4

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leggo

Thanks for that info Day. (I'm not important to anyone but my family) ?? but, I've had a stalker on this site before who made it her life's work to make my life miserable. Had to change my phone number, email, etc. and didn't want it happening again. Long story...on the board somewhere...but am happy to hear that she can't track me through IP. I'm not very computer literate so I was a little concerned about that. You never know what lengths some psycho will go to when they have a hate-on for you. The info you gave me makes me feel comfortable. Thanks again. I still would like to know how you make yourself invisible to a google search.

Shrek4

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elimar86861

Day, Considering that probably less than 5% of women on BCO are employed in the computer technology sector, it is helpful that you are sharing your knowledge here.  However, leave out the adjectives (i.e "ignorant," "panic-spreaders," "beyond obnoxious," "self-centered") and the other 95% of us can appreciate it.

Shrek4

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1Athena1

Day, I don't think anyone is spreading false information on purpose. Many folks here don't have a reason to be familiar with these issues - or didn't until now. 

What you can hide from Google is the web sites you visit (or your computer visits) but, as Day said, not the contributions you make to sites that crop up in Google searches.

I think the best protection is the sheer amount of data out there. If you are Khalid Sheik Muhammad, worry - or if you are being stalked by a criminal. If you are being confirmed by Congress, you will probably be OK unless you have set up a porn or a kkk site (probably no worries if you are actually running for Congress, though:( ). If you are the president, don't worry. The Secret Service will erase your information somehow and your allies will do the rest to hide the truth.

Everyone else, just a bit of caution goes a long way. You can discuss personal information with few privacy fears - just not information that personally identifies you - big difference.

In fact, there is now an industry of PR people, "consultants" and others who can make it so that positive or neutral information about you is easy to find on Internet search engines, while negative/overly revealing/embarrassing  information is not - but even they can't erase it. It is up to you to guard it.

leggo

Yup, Day I sure did. I thought she was legit, was brand new and scared out of my mind and she asked me for my personal info so she could send me some stuff and then....hell. Learned my lesson and urge others to be careful doing the same even via pm. You never know who's on the other end.

ETA: Athena, thanks for clearing that google stuff up for me. I wasn't sure what it all meant.

1Athena1

I almost wish we had a "sticky" thread on this issue, gracie, because what happened to you has happened to many others here on BCO, sadly. I fall on the skeptic side of the spectrum, but even I might have shared more if I had not heard some horror stories like yours. And there is nothing the mods or BCO can do about it.

A diagnosis of breast cancer, brain numbing chemo or hormonal agents and desperate need for support are not, together, a great recipe for fostering caution in one. You are too busy trying to survive. Many people assume they are safe because it's hard to believe that bd people get cancer too, but the truth is, there are bad people everywhere and even they look for support. Eschewing evil is understandably the last thing most people who come to support forums like this one think about.

But there aren't nearly as many bad people as curious/nosey people and corporations. Facebook is the nosey institution of our time, and as long as it is here, everyone has to be careful. IMO, the only thing more persistent than an ill-intentioned stalker is a company looking to make money.

KittyKitty

Well, we can see from what Day posted that the fine print (which is boiler plate usual language for websites), gives BC Org the right to use personal comments and personal photos for its own benefit, even if we find it morally reprehensible, and an invasion of privacy, in light of the personal informaton which might be in some  files.

Frankly, I expected BCO to hold itself to a higher standard than that.

I was formerly  under the impression that the BCO management would be of a higher ilk than the typical website, however, using more judgement, and courtesy toward its posters, and I am extremely disappointed to find out that BCOrg is not holding itself to that higher standard, no matter what its terms of service says..

but, as Day posted, they don;t have to do any better than the usual internet website's"terms of service"=== so beware with any  personal information or photos, if privacy is a concern.

The terms of service also seems to extend to PM's so that is a another concern.

To the Moderators: Where else do you publish or sell the posting and member information, as detailed in the terms of service? 

every8thwoman

What about our profile information we needed to include when we entered BCO?  Can this be traced back to us too???  This is very disturbing if true.

1Athena1

Kitty - the mods and BCO can't really do anything about it. The default option in the US is that cyber-information is freely available. BCO can move to protect it -as they have- to a degree, but they have no control over Google and others.

The United States does not recognize privacy rights the way other countries do - some people need to realize that. Robert Bork said that privacy was in the "penumbra" of the Constitution - I don't even think it has that much presence, for all our high flying rhetoric on the topic.

We wax philoophical about privacy a lot in this country but the truth is, most laws protect disclosure more than privacy. As a privacy freak, I applaud efforts by the EU and others to curtail what Google and others may share. Unfortunately, in America, corporations seem to have more rights than people - especially under the Roberts court. It's the sort of thing you would have to take up with Congress. BCO is not to blame. Their terms of use are designed to protect the information they publish ALL over their site - including the helpful info on BC that everyone can benefit from for free. They have a legitimate right to prevent copyright infringments; for that purpose, their description of rights of ownership must be expansive. Nothing wrong with that.

Think of BCO as a book, and we get to write chapters. But we are neither editor nor publisher nor publicist.

Yes, we definitely need a sticky thread.

1Athena1

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elimar86861

Who is able to read our PM's other than the recipient?  The moderators?  Their tech support?

1Athena1

Elimar: I don't know the answer to your question as a fact. I would imagine that the mods and techs DO have a way to see our PMs, as it is their information. That is no different from how other services we use operate.

I choose to send PMs and receive them without fear because I happen to trust the mods/BCO and because, as much as our society seems to prefer First Amendment protections to privacy rights, it is also a litigious one. Therefore, my personal reasoning goes, I know that BCO would not handle my PMs irresponsibly for fear of being sued - by me or by anyone. It's a sort of honor system, in a strange way.

But remember, you are using someone else's space and service. It can be hard to grasp this concept, as the cyberworld is so unique - I mean, here we each are, typing on OUR computer in OUR space (or perhaps an office computer in someone else's - be careful of what you think you own:-) ). It's easy and understandable to think: "well, what I type must be my business as well." But it isn't - not necessarily. Cyberspace is like a fourth dimension, if you will. It is a "thing" with no "matter" or "volume."

(Been reading too much physics theory lately :-) )

KittyKitty

Every 8th:BCO can sell profile info of use it for their benefit, according to the terms of service posted by Day.

Of course, we never expected that to be the case, but then we never expected to see the threads on facebook, either.

Athena: I am aware that threads will be findable by key words, but what was unexpected was the transfer of threads to a more public forum, facebook.

I think the bottom line is that some people are more concerned about privacy than others, and the people who are very concerned about privacy should not expect that this is a private forum, as pointed out the terms of service are very clear that photos, personal information, and so forth is evidently able to be sold or transmitted for the sole benefit of BCO.

So don't post anything that you don;t want used, highlighted, or sold, and modify your information accordingly, if you are concerned about privacy.

Don;t count on a higher standard by BCO; what you can count on, as Day posted, is the terms of service. That is the bottom line.

I think we learned a lot, today, about guarding privacy, especially when the website seems nice, and a place where that would not be necessary. Especially when the website asks for personal medical information, and personal photos. One can expect that info to be treated in a certain way, but bottom line, the terms of service do not protect the privacy of the individual. Heed that.

Cindyl

KittyKitty said:

 what was unexpected was the transfer of threads to a more public forum, facebook.

Hmm.  Facebook is actually less public than BCO.  Users there can set the restrictions on who can see their posts, etc.

I don't believe that's the case here.

You pretty much need to be a member of facebook to see much of what goes on there.

Here, you can read lots (all?) of the posts without joining. You just need to join to post.

As others have said, if privacy is important to you here: use a user name that isn't the same as one you use elsewhere.  Use something common so you can hide in plain sight, don't post things that identify you, and don't share personal info even in a pm.  That person you are chatting with  may not be who they claim to be either.  

I don't know about bco, but other forums I have been on... sometimes the owners/mods can read pms. Other can only read them if they "bounce"

Shrek4

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KittyKitty

 CindyI said:

Hmm. Facebook is actually less public than BCO. Users there can set restrictions on who can see their posts, etc.

Actually, Facebook has 700 million users, fyi.

I seriously doubt that is less public than BCO.

Further, what we are talking about is the transfer of personal information along with photos to facebook, of people who have in large part chosen NOT to be members of facebook. I don't see that your comment about placing restrictions on who can see those posts makes sense. ie: if they are not members, they can't place restrictions.

Anonymous

KittyKitty, can you expand on your statement below which is concerning to me and define 'advocate', you can PM me if you prefer, many thanks

"one well known advocate post here the other day, about working "with" the FDA, and I thought that was not even clear enough. There might be confusion that this person is an independent advocate working "with" or "in conjunction with" the FDA - If a paid poster is working FOR the FDA, (as in paid employment), and then obviously the FDA will be influencing what they post"

This could be stretched to include pharmaceuticals and a whole lot of undesirable interference unbeknownst to us

Day, you say "anyone who connects to the internet uses what is called "dynamic IP"; how are the mods addressing the issue of multiple identities on this site if that is the case ? Thanks

Beesie

Day, thanks for all the information.  And you are right - this does pop up as an issue every few months or so.  There is shock and then everyone forgets about it and goes on openly communicating personal and family information that probably is better left kept private. I'm constantly amazed at what I see posted here. This is the internet.  Everything is public. It's one thing to divulge highly personal details if you use an unidentifiable screen name and don't provide enough information for anyone to be able to figure out who you are.  It's another thing to talk about extremely personal details of your health or your family when you have your picture posted or use your real name or provide enough information to easily identify who you are.

There are two sides to this issue.  First is whether you want people from here to know your real identity. Second is whether you want people in your real life to know who you are here, and whether you want them to know everything that you are saying here. As someone who told very few people about my diagnosis - and didn't tell some family members - I'm concerned about both sides of the issue. For this reason, I've always been careful to not post too much identifying information.  My screenname has tremendous personal meaning to me but there are few people in the world - if there is even anyone - who would connect the name to my real identity. Athena, I went through your "raise your hand" list (great list, by the way) and I'm glad to say that my hand stayed down all the way through. I know that doesn't ensure that my identity is safe but at least I know that I haven't made it easy for anyone.  I'm on Facebook - under my real name - but I post very little private information and I've never mentioned breast cancer. When I heard that some of the threads from here had been linked on Facebook, it didn't worry me a bit because I'm quite sure it would difficult for anyone who knows me to connect my screen identity here with my real identity.  A couple of friends and family probably could - with a lot of reading and a bit of effort - but I'm not worried about them.

gracie, good advice about being careful about who you give private information to even in PMs. I know of several others from this site who've been stalked in their private lives by someone from here who started as a friend and turned into a wacko.  It hasn't happened to me but there have been a couple of times when I've thought "Phew, thank goodness I didn't give this person more information!"

By the way, one other caution to add to the list. Get togethers. There always are pictures taken and the pictures are posted.  If you don't want your pics to be up here, be careful about that.