I say yes, you say no, OR People are Strange

RetiredLibby

Good piece on voter suppression:



http://www.nationalmemo.com/ari-berman-exposes-the-gop-war-on-voting/#dsq-form-area



There are lots of good pieces out there, but this one gives a lot of info and a lot of links. Here is a particularly meaningful pull quote:



"According to the Brennan Center for Justice, 10 percent of eligible voters don’t have government-issued IDs. That’s a lot of people, but it also means that most Americans do have ID, so I’m not surprised that voter ID laws poll well. I think more Americans need to understand a few basic facts: a) there is no evidence of voter fraud that a voter ID law would stop; b) a significant percentage of Americans don’t have these IDs and don’t have access to the underlying documents needed to get the IDs; c) these laws are a politically motivated attempt by Republicans to shape an electorate in their own favor before anyone has even cast a ballot; d) these laws are expensive to implement, costing millions of dollars, and that money would be better spent elsewhere; e) these laws will create confusion and long lines at polling places, which will negatively impact a large number of voters who have valid ID; f) voting, unlike buying Sudafed or flying on a plane, is a constitutionally protected right that people have died for in this country and is something we shouldn’t restrict without a significant and compelling reason to do so; g) we should be making it easier, not harder, for all eligible voters in this country to cast a ballot."



L

gardengumby

Yorkie - that is a PERFECT representation of what has happened in this country over the last 20+ years.  The divisiveness is acute.  When they are caught doing something nasty they're like two year olds pointing at the other person saying I didn't do what he/she did!!!  I used to think that only a war would bring us back together - but two wars and we're further apart than ever.  Each "side" sees mostly what they don't like about the other.  It reminds me of people just before they get divorced - they don't look for common ground or for common interest - anything bad that happens to them they blame on the "other".

The media compounds the issue.  The Republicans castigated the "liberal media" for so long because most of the time the media would point out the wrong-headedness of the conservative position.  So good ol' Reagan threw out the rules the media used to have to follow about equal time....  I know that Reagan is still looked at like almost a god by some, but I will bet that sometime in the future he will be known as one of the worst presidents of all time.  Of course I'll be long dead by the time that happens, I only hope the country isn't as well.

1Athena1

Oh, gardengumby - how awful - sounds like something that would happen in a developing country. I hope you find out who did it. That's scary!!

Probably in the minority here, but I don't appreciate Ann Romney being told off and compared to Michelle in that article. It isn't fair on either. Each human being takes what she can and comes to life with her own weapons, strengths and weaknesses - many of which are hidden from the public. We don't know what Mrs. Romney has or has not suffered. It has to be painful to watch your husband fail in such a massive, public way.

She has also had serious health problems and had to raise five BOYS - even with nannies, that must have had its hellish moment.

I feel for first ladies/first lady candidates who have to see their husbands being taken through the ringer. They are often unwilling participants. Michelle, whom I love, has faced a lot, but she is healthy and her husband in many ways has had a very successful run.

Both are good women as far as I can see.

Edited for typos - as usual!

Anonymous

Understanding what Willard did ( and still gets lotza $$$$$ for) at Bain, you need to know the term "cash cows" ( don't know who created the label, but BCG, Boston Consulting Group, uses it often) and below are a few comments: THIS WAS NOT ABOUT CREATING JOBS, this was about making MONEY for the investors at Bain.

http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com/2012/05/the-bain-of-this-campaign.html

http://alittlethoughtplease.blogspot.com/2012/07/splitting-hairs-over-bain-capital.html

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/07/27/hes-no-averell-harriman/

Willard's "business" was about creating MONEY for himself and his partners at Bain.  It was NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT about building long term companies, or good paying jobs.  Not.  Not.  Not.

lassie11

Sorry - I have no sympathy for Ann Romney. Many of us have raised a bunch of children, had some health issues and combined that with working full time outside the home. And we did it without nannies, without a cleaning service and some of us did it as single parents. We also managed with not even close to one million dollars, much less their unending millions. Running for president has some risks, and having done that one time before, they had (or should have had) a good idea what was coming.

pip57

Remeber the book for parents called "Go The F&^k To Sleep."  This is along the same lines.  Hilarious.

 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/27/samuel-l-jackson-to-voters-wake-the-fck-up_n_1919317.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

alexandria58

Garden:  What a bummer! You really didn't need that!!  

On Ann Romney: I would feel sorry for her if she didn't so often show her distain for "you people, " if I had seen even a glimmer of sympathy or empathy for those less fortunate than herself,  and if I didn't get the feeling that what she finds so hard, is that she had expected Romney to waltz into the presidency just by attacking Obama and much to her dismay, her husband is also getting attacked.   She reminds me of the Captain in Casablanca who is shocked, terribly shocked to find that gambling is going on.    

1Athena1

I'm not saying anyone has to feel sorry for her - but we should withhold judgement. Being rich and white is not the panacea for happiness - study after studty shows that there is zero difference in degree of happiness between people who live above poverty and the richest person on earth. That is, there IS a difference for the very poor, but as long as you have a safety net (meaning, you have enough food and a roof over your head), researchers have found no difference in various --albeit subjective-- measures of happiness.

It's sad, because Romney has not only behaved in a cruel, callous manner - he has tarnished the reputation of people who bear certain superficial resemblances. He really polarized people. He showed his own prejudice, he showed that he is unfit to lead, but he also caused others to show their prejudice.

Ann Romney appears to, overall, have led a good life. But that doesn't mean she doesn't have the right to feel bad. I just think empathy is empathy and it cuts both ways. No, I don't wake up at night feeling sorry for her. In fact, I am surprised that the media made so much about her comments - they are unimportant in the scheme of things. But I am sure being married to a presidential candidate who is having the worst candidacy in recent memory (albeit through his own folly) has to be hard.

River_Rat

Garden, geez what a bad start to the day!

I quit feeling sorry for Ann Romney after her, "it's our turn" comment.  It wasn't just the words.  It was the way she said them.  Her comments since then have only amplified the feelings I have for her.  She speaks as if she's talking to somebody in customer service and she's really upset but trying to not scream at them, but talking to them as if they're too stupid/uncooperative to accommodate her needs. In real life with her friends and family she may be charming, I do not find her public persona to be so.

1Athena1

I have no opinion of her one way or the other. She is certainly a better speaker than her husband, and she is good looking. Other than that, she doesn't really register on my radar.

QuinnCat

Garden - someone actually came into your garage?  That type of crime would be the talk of my little town.  That's some gall.  I'm glad you and your DH were not confronted, or worse.

On the Bain capital topic, on one of my long drives coming home from pdx, I was listening to a former Goldman-Sachs employee explain exactly what vulture capitalists, like Bain do.  He took no sides, just the cold hard facts.  He has written a book about it, but alas, did not get the details of that.  One of the most noteworthy things he said was that Romney et al would NOT know how to run any of these companies they take over.  They still rely on the existing or new mangement.  What they do is make money for their own clients.  They do this in one of two ways....they load up the company with debt first, take that money, the company either suceeds or fails with that debt.  If the company suceeds, good (maybe - it is unclear what they do to unions, benefits though), but if the company fails, they keep the money they borrowed and raided (pension funds, for instance) and the employees lose.  Lose their jobs, their pension money (what's not insured by the federal government).

It is a sick form of business with total disregard for the people or services of the company.  It is coldhearted. It is definitely not about creating jobs for anyone, though that MIGHT be a by-product. It is purely about making $$$ for the vulture investors. 

gardengumby

To be frank - I don't like Ann Romney.  She exudes the aura that she is better than everyone else.  I have no patience with people like that.  Although I do not like her, that doesn't mean that I wish her anything but well - I just hope she doesn't become the First Lady of the land.

So, for an update on my morning...  First - no they didn't break into the garage - that's been tried before and was a failure.  The truck was parked in the driveway - the car was in the garage....

The fairly incompetent thieves unscrewed the light bulb so that it would be dark - it was nice they didn't break it, as the bulb itself is like $50.00.  Once the sun was up, and the cops were here we found that they weren't very successful thieves.  They got the truck up on jacks, and removed two of the wheels totally.  The other two were still on the truck, with all the bolts but one removed from each wheel.  The truck must have shifted on them slightly, as one of the bolts is apparently bent - we'll find out more when the fixer person gets here.  You'd have to see our property to understand, but there is our driveway (where the truck was parked), and then down the hill aways there is a second driveway.  They parked in the second driveway (which is hidden by a lot of shrubs) and were apparently working from there.  In their attempt to get the wheels to the second driveway, they rolled them down the hill.  Easy peasy, right?  Well...  no, not so much.  What they didn't realize is that there is a hidden fence halfway down the hill buried in a bunch of rhodies.  So, all of that work and they didn't actually end up getting away with much.  I think they stole a couple things out of the back of the truck - but nothing as expensive as the wheels would have been.  We've got to get new nuts - I think hubby is getting locking nuts, so this doesn't happen again...

By the marks in the gravel of the second driveway they were really peeling out.  I think it's probable that they were disturbed when we started getting up, as we are fairly early risers - cuz I've got such a long commute.

so anyway - all's well that ends well.  Right now the wheels are laying out in the driveway next to the truck - so I hope someone doesn't see them as easy targets - in fact I think I'm gonna go take a look.... 

QuinnCat

I swear, you look "over there" and it takes all of 5 seconds to find a falsehood.  I think I could have a full time job being a factchecker 

pupmom

GG, oh nooooo! Hope you get those tires back soon! Jeez, that's a very traumatic way to start off your day! : (

1Athena1

Yikes gardengumby - what makes me shudder is the violation of your space - and while you were asleep. I really hope they catch these people - they might get better at it otherwise.

Hope the police (or you) took good pictures of the tire marks.

YramAL

Gardengumby-wow! The mean streets of Seattle! Makes you feel so violated.

Mary 

alexandria58

Garden:  About twenty years ago, someone slashed the tires on my car and smashed all the windows.  Another time, someone broke into my garage and stole our bikes and car radios. It was a terrible feeling of violation.   I really sympathize. 

On Ann Romney: again, it's not so much whether she's rich or not.  I do understand that being rich does not mean happiness, and that the rich have problems and sorrows just like the rest of us.  It's Ann's attitude towards her privilege and towards the rest of us that puts my teeth on edge.

gardengumby

It's Ann's attitude towards her privilege and towards the rest of us that puts my teeth on edge.

I couldn't have put it better myself!!!  That's exactly the feeling I get.

1Athena1

To be honest I haven't followed her so I can't say much of anything. Once I am done taking in her husband's "gaffes" I am ready for bed -lol!

IllinoisLady

Ok, so I could be nice I erased my whole post, but in fairness to all that work I will say it was the fact that I did not feel too sorry for A. Romney. I think of the old saying....if you want to dance, you got to pay the fiddler.  She's paying...too late to cry Uncle now.

GG....hope they find the person(s) responsible and throw the book at them.  Definitely a rotten start to the day.  TGIF....unless of course you have to work tomorrow as well.

 Kam...I think you could do well as a fact-checker.  Sad that many on the right seem so uninterested in TRUE facts.  It still remains incredible to me what Pres. Obama has managed to do while the right just tried their darnedest to keep the boulders rolling on.  I am somewhat amazed that we are still ( started with Nixon ) resorting to outright fraud to try and win elections.  Somewhere the dirty, underhanded, fraudulent manoeuvres are going to surface.  The light of day always comes and so I would say....if your going to dance, you have to pay the fiddler.  It goes for both sides, but knowing the right must be feeling such desperation means it is not a surprise that some come-uppance is on the way.  If you lay down with dogs, best not be surprised when the fleas show up. 

Jackie ---- not known for style in writing.

ananda8

gardengumby,

Did the cops dust the garage light for prints? 

gardengumby

I don't think so.  I wasn't out there. 

Anonymous

Kam - hysterically funny you used the words "over there" - I'll let someone else explain..but it REALLY is funny.  Not laughing at you, just the irony of your choice of words...

Happy Today to ALL!!!!

Anonymous

Blue - hope your back is getting better.

1Athena1

Raising paw to gently suggest that we not mention the Conservative thread. We didn't like it when they mentioned us (from wherever), or came here with the objective of causing strife; we don't want to be doing the same back.

One can always have block settings on, or tune in to TV or the net to find about similar views (and be outraged).

It is better that we have these two threads. It benefits all of us on BCO - but only if we respect each other's space.

(Putting paw back down.)

riley702

Jackie, I LIKE the way you write!

Anonymous

oops...you're right, oh Lioness - slipped ;(

AnneW

GG, what a nasty thing. My stepson lives in East Lake, and his car has had its windows smashed twice. He parks on the street. Now he leaves it unlocked with NOTHING inside, not even the glove compartment. Cops can't do anything about it.

Ann Romney doesn't have half the grace and strength of Michelle Obama. Not even close. She's used to being handed things, including deference. If she wants to be a modern First Lady, she needs thicker skin (or lots more Botox.)

QuinnCat

Upcoming Debates:

October 3, 9 p.m. ET: Domestic Policy
Moderator: PBS NewsHour host and executive editor Jim Lehrer
Location: University of Denver in Denver, Colorado
Format: The 90-minute debate will be divided into six 15-minute segments on domestic policy topics selected by the moderator. Lehrer announced that there will be three segments on the economy, a discussion on health care, and a segment on the role of government and governing. Lehrer noted the subjects could change based on news developments.October 11 Vice Presidential Debate, 9 p.m. ET: Foreign and Domestic Policy
Moderator: ABC News chief foreign correspondent Martha Raddatz
Location: Centre College in Danville, Kentucky 
Format: The 90-minute debate will be divided into nine 10-minute segments covering both foreign and domestic policy.October 16, 9 p.m. ET: Foreign and Domestic Policy
Moderator: CNN chief political correspondent Candy Crowley 
Location: Hofstra University in Hempstead, New York
Format: This debate will be formatted as a town hall meeting. Undecided voters, selected by Gallup, will ask the candidates domestic and foreign policy questions.October 22, 9 p.m. ET: Foreign Policy
Moderator: CBS News chief Washington correspondent and host of "Face the Nation" Bob Schieffer
Location: Lynn University in Boca Raton, Florida 

Format: The 90-minute debate will be divided into six 15-minute segments on foreign policy topics selected by the moderator. 

1Athena1

Thanks Kam. Ooooohh - I can't wait to see the vice presidential one. The savvy liar versus the earnest, honest Joe.