help with vit D levels

Yazmin

Looks low to me, too. Obviously, your oncologist does not believe in the Vitamin D3-Cancer connection. I would find a good naturopathic doctor in your area to monitor my D3 and other nutrition/supplement related issues, in cooperation with the oncologist....

Nan56143

Dear bennets1,

I am not a doctor, and as one of the members replied to me, nor do I play a doctor on TV! However, if you go to page 1 of this thread, I posted 9 different articles on D3 and many have references to the deficiency of D3 and breast cancer. Apparently your oncologist is not keeping up with the most recent research on D3 and the multitude of illnesses/diseases linked to D3 defiencies. Apparently niether is Vanderbilt! Doesn't surprise me one little bit. If D3 was a pharmaceutical med, she would be prescribing it in a heartbeat!

I would suggest that you email her all the links. Now if you think that would pi$$ her off, please allow me to forward the links to her, along with a message that she needs to be reading her oncology newsletters. 

You see, one of the articles was from OncologyStat, a newsletter to which probably all oncs subscribe.

 "Normal ranges" for D3 are between 32ng/ml and 100, and everyone needs to be in the upper range...closer to 100 for optimal health. The vitamin D council newsletters contain much information.

For every 10ng, you need to add 1000 IU's per day, and for you that would calculate to adding approximately 5000 IU's per day to get you to a reading of 85. My D levels are 66, and my daughter Lori's levels are 82.6. Lori was  dx with TNBC in June of 2007.

Hope this helps...

Edited to add:

Oh...and Yazmin is right on target recommending a naturopath, and I would add, finding an antiaging specialist in your area, as they will look at all your levels also.

Meece

I checked my lab request for my physical today, and they did not draw blood to test for Vit D this time.  I plan on taking my last report from my onc, to my GP today and see what she says.  I have about 7 weeks before I go back to my onc, and hope that I can get mine higher by that time.

MaryNY

I had my Vitamin D level tested last week. My result was:

18.8 ng/ml. (NOTE) VIT D 25OH Reference range: 10-24 ng/ml - Mild to moderate deficiency 25-80 ng/ml - Optimum Level 

Even by the lab's conservative reference range, my level is very low. Onc told me to increase my daily intake to 1200 IU/day. At the beginning of chemo treatment, onc told me to stop taking all supplements. Last week she told me to start taking B6 and increase Vit D3 intake. Two weeks earlier she told me to start taking a Ca/Vit D supplement and prior to that told to take an iron supplement. I wish I could just take a multivitamin once a day as I did before. 

unklezwifeonty

Love your post dear Mary! Looks like the doctor created a problem of sorts first and is now fixing it by loading you up on supplements!

MaryNY

Onty: Yes, I argued against stopping all supplements. Then when I consistently have low haemoglobin levels, she kind of blames me. I've eaten practically no meat since treatment began and that would be my primary source of iron. I haven't been good about taking the iron supplements as I now suffer from constipation most of the time and the iron it likely to make that worse.

unklezwifeonty

The oncologists just love to blame everything else but the chemo drugs! The supplements have nothing to do with haemoglobin really. Take lots of green, leafy vegetables. Have you tried wheatgrass juice powder? It is excellent for rebuilding haemoglobin levels.

Makratz

Nan,

Can you provide a link to the vitamin D study you mention?  The one in OncologyStat?  I would love to print it off and bring it to my appointments.

Thanks so much for your info, and everyone elses!

Nan56143

Dear Makraz,

This was on page 1 of this thread in a post which I made. See where it says oncologystat? Now, I said they most likely subscribe to this....but in all probability, few actually read it.

 http://www.oncologystat.com/journals/review_articles/AEP/Vitamin_D_for_Cancer_Prevention_Global_Perspective.html

There is another "grassroots" which you may want to print off also. I believe that someone else in a previous post on page 1, posted a video containing the same information.

11tyBillion

I am wondering ... I do not know if I have a Vit. D deficiency yet, and by the reaction of my Onc., I doubt that he will test me for it.  I DO want to start taking Vit. D., but I am supposed to start Chemo Jan. 6th.  Are we supposed to take the vitamin D during chemo?  Or after, once the rogue cancer cells have been killed (knock wood) and we are helping our bodies rebuild into better shape than before the Cancer?  I really want to start taking it now, and through Chemo, but I also don't want to counteract any good that the chemo might do!

what to do?

unklezwifeonty

Dear 11tyBillion,



Ask your onco. I am taking 5K vitamin D3 daily during chemo but I ran it by my onco.

Makratz

Thank you Nan!!

Linda

bennetts1

Nan,

Thanks so much for the information!  You may not be a doctor, but you know more information about Vitamin D levels than my oncologist!!!!  I am going to start on some supplements and print out the articles and take them with me when I go back to her  in March.  I cannot understand why she said there has not been enough studies done on the effects of Vitamin D and breast cancer ... I will see what she says when she sees these articles. I am really disappointed that she was not concerned with my concerns over my Vitamin D levels.  I am so glad I found this post on the boards!!!  Thanks again!

Sandy

vivre

It just infuriates me that there are still doctors out there who refuse to learn about the importance of vit d. The evidence is overwhelming. Here is some more:

http://www.grassrootshealth.net/press-20091104

I have to say that this issue is the main reason I started to question my doctors. When I finished treatments, I went to a chiro to help me with nutrition. The first thing she said to me was, we need to check your D levels and explained how it is a precursor to bc. My test came back in the low 20's. She insisted that I start on 6000 iu a day. We tested 3 months later and I was up to 44. While the charts said this was in a normal range, she felt I needed to get it near 100. So I kept up with the 6000iu and retested a few months later and my level was over 100, but I have since learned that the Genova lab that did my tests was incorrectly overcalculating.  I have since cut back to 4000, and will test again next month. The bottom line is that I learned two things from all of this.

1. Supplements do make a huge difference, as my numbers prove, and I feel so much better

2. Main stream medicine is so controlled by drug companies that the standard of care is extremely lacking and I have pretty much given up on all of it.

MaryNY, I cannot believe that you are taking iron? I have read lots of info that says that iron feeds cancer. Even if you blood hemoglobin is low in iron, that is probably not the reason for any energy loss. It probably has more to do with lack of overall nutrients. Please check out some of the info we have found on the alternatives threads. Many of us have felt huge differences by supplements such asVit D, C, iodine, Lglutimate, etc. Also, start doing lots of reading. One of the first books I read after DX was by Dr. Ray Strand- "What your doctor doesn't know about nutrition may be killing you". He really opened my eyes to the whole "food is medicine" mindset that I now live by. You all need to learn as much as you can about your own personal body chemistry, see what it lacks and go from there. There is no one size fits all to this disease, even though they treat us as if we are all the same. Do your homework ladies. You can do a lot to prevent this disease from recurring and taking Vit D is the vital first step.

123Donna

I'm not sure how long it will take to get D3 levels up.  After chemo, my D3 level was 19 and I started supplementing with 5K - 6K of D3, plus 2 Citracel and a Mulitvitamin a day.  About 8 weeks later, my levels are now at 47. 

Nan56143

Vivre,

A few articles which speak to iron and copper...I never knew!!

http://www.consumerhealth.org/articles/display.cfm?ID=19990303204921

CANCER Iron can reactivate a latent infection or tumour. In one experiment they put rats on severely restricted low calorie diets and these starved animals lived a lot longer than those on normal diets. The iron content of the food was subsequently identified as the major life-shortening factor rather than calories. In a study in Carcinogenesis, 1991, three groups of rats were given iron deficient, regular or excess iron diets, then injected with a carcinogen. The rats on the low iron diet developed a lower rate of cancer, and the rats on the elevated iron diet had higher rates of cancer. When the iron in their diet was removed, their cancer rate decreased. Iron feeds cancer cells and causes them to metastasize. Many studies have shown that up to 88% of metastasized breast cancer patients have elevated serum ferritin. Cancerous breasts have three times as much iron as normal breasts.

Excessive copper is often involved in cancer and may be a risk factor in estrogen-dependent cancers. Research has shown that there is a 72% increase in the copper content of malignant tumours of the ovary, uterus and cervix (Cancer, Sep 1983). Other studies have shown similar high copper contents in breast cancers. Estrogen increases copper absorption, causing your copper levels to rise. This may occur when you take birth control pills or hormone replacement therapy (Journal of Fertility and Sterility, Nov 1979).

This was a trial that was to take place last year.

http://www.annieappleseedproject.org/recofrbrcapa.html

Meece

I just looked at the recommendation my GP gave me for VitD yesterday.  She says 800-1200 iu per day.  She thought 25 is on the cusp of being normal.

Estepp

This iron thing is amazing to me..

I have been LOW LOW iron all my life.... they even wanted me to do shots about five yrs back... hmmmmmmmmmmmmm....

Meece

My iron has actually been fairly high.  I remember one dr. asking me if I lived in high altitude, because they usually see high iron in those conditions.

thenewme

Has anyone been able to find the sources for the research supporting the statement " Iron feeds cancer cells and causes them to metastasize?"   I'm curious to see the research, but haven't been able to find much on it.

The  Consumerhealth.org article referred to above is written by someone by the name of Rebecca Lavie/Adeena Robinson, a former special education teacher treated by Dr. Paul Cutler with chelation therapy.  At the end of her article, instead of citing her references,it says:

"For more information and journal references on iron overload please refer to her book or call Rebecca at 416-494-1285.  For more information about chelation therapy, call Dr. Paul Cutler at 716-284-5140, or fax 716-284-5159."

The second article referred to above, regarding excess copper, from the annieappleseed project, refers to clinical study NCT00195091 ,which has no study results published since it began in 2005. 

Has anyone been able to find any objective evidence supporting either of these theories (excess iron and/or copper feeding cancer)?  I don't know my iron or copper levels offhand, but wonder if it may be something worth looking into?

Can anyone point me to clinical research showing the benefit of chelation therapy other than for physiologic disorders like hemochromatosis?  Are there any ongoing studies for its use in cancer treatment?  What, empirically, is chelation purported to do, exactly?  

Nan56143

Thenewme,

I have been searching for you, and this is all that I could find.Sorry if the articles I did post earlier were not of help to you.

Below is a paragraph from this link...

http://middlepath.com.au/qol/artemsisia-annua_wormwood_artemisinin_breast-cancer-remedy.php

The fascinating thing is that this was something the Chinese used thousands of years ago. The application certainly makes sense. There's a wealth of research linking iron and cancer: One study, for example, showed that three times as much iron could be extracted from malignant breast tissue as from benign tissue", according to Ralph Moss, author of the "Healing Choices" reports: for people with cancer, elevated iron storage^[3] was found in 88 percent of the breast cancer patients studied. Given this shared characteristic of Malaria and Cancer cells, why did it take so long to think of it? "Perhaps people just don't think of simple ideas".

In this link is the same statement and this is from Hulda Clark

http://www.huldaclarkzappers.com/newtopic1.html

If you see an antiaging specialist, your test results will include all minerals/trace minerals, metals, etc. Tests which conventional doctors very rarely order for anyone.

unklezwifeonty

The doctors don't have much of an incentive to promote better health thru' supplements, do they? Pay them for well patients and penalize them if the patients get sick and suddenly you will see them advicing differently.

MaryNY

Does anyone know if chemotherapy lowers Vitamin D levels? My D3 level (18.8 ng/ml) was tested for the first time last week after I had completed four rounds of AC. Just wondering if my level is typically this low in the Winter months or the chemo adversely affected it.

unklezwifeonty

That's an excellent question dear Mary. I've often wondered why most oncs wait till after chemo is done before testing for D levels.

LRM216

My onc also waited until my first 3 month visit after chemo to test my Vit D level too.  Don't know why - will ask her.  Just got the call that it came in low, and she has put me on 1 50,000 unit pill a week for 8 weeks and will retest.  So, obviously, she is one of the many onc's up on this Vitamin D scenario. 

Linda

Nan56143

Dear LRM216,

If you go back to page 5 of this thread and read, you will see that the pill which your onc prescribed is for D2 and not D3. There is no script for D3. D2 is basically worthless. I am not knocking your onc, but she needs to know the difference between D2 and D3. You need to take D3 OTC, and about 5000 IU's daily. What are your levels? The range is 32ng/ml to 100 and where you want to be is in the upper range, nearer 100. Ask your onc for a copy of your levels. My daughter Lori's levels are now 82.6. She was dx with TNBC in June of 2007.

Edited to add...then go and read page 2 where I posted a link to an article on D2 and D3.

Makratz

I did not have chemo, just rads, 36 tx's.  My d level was 20 a year after rads.  Never had it tested before.  I think we should all be tested.

get the d3, otc.

Happy New Years, Ladies (and Gents)

xoxoxoxo

Linda

MaryNY

Bought D3 today at the Vitamin Shoppe. Glanced at it briefly at Costco but I find the size of their vitamin supplement bottles so offputting, beside there was such a long line, it wasn't worth queuing there for this single item. I bought the 1000 IU size as the onc just suggested a dosage of 1200 IU/day and I'm already taking a Ca/Vit D tablet that supplies 400 IU Vit D3, so taking both with give me 1400 IU/day. I also checked that the ones I bought were soy free as many of those on the shelf did contain soy. I know you all suggest a higher dosage than this but I don't want to aggravate the onc, which is easy to do.

One other thing, apart from taking Vit D3 with food, are there foods that increase its absorption or ones that interfere with it? 

And Happy New Year!

unklezwifeonty

Dear Mary,



If the D3 in your blood is more than 80 already, then 1400 IU per day is fine. Otherwise you need to take about 3 times.



Sunlight and certain foods help the body process the D from foods (sorry I don't recall which foods) but if you are deficient, like most of us, then the easiest and quickest way to get back on track is to supplement. This is one supplement that not one onc I visited said no to.

Anonymous

Just my input, but 1400 IUs will not be enough.  Also, I thought it was important to take magnesium and calcium.  I have also read about K2.  I bought some Ds with K2 in them.

The reason the docs give the prescription for D2 is to jump start your levels.  Howevever, I agree with the other ladies...why not take more D3 as it is easier to absorb.