natural girls

Merilee

AMEN to that!

AnneW

Interesting about our "beliefs" when it comes to hormones. I ws on low-dose OCPs from age 30 to 44, when I was diagnosed the first time. Not for contraception, but for all the non-contraceptive benefits that I needed--control of migraines, control of acne, control of mood swings, control of premenstrual breast pain--all quality of life issues.

My cancer was a very indolent one. As un-aggressive as a cancer can be. I researched OCPs and breast cancer, and went to a great talk by Dr. Vliet, and came to the conclusion that the amount of hormone I was getting was actually keeping my cancer "fat, dumb, and happy."

I personally don't think the Pill CAUSED my cancer, but I could be wrong. That's just my belief, which means it's something that I WANT to be true.

Be glad the FDA isn't involved in nutraceuticals. Can you imagine the lawsuits?? Big Nutra wants no part of standardizing and rigorous testing.

Britchick, you're right on.

MBJ

I think it's interesting that BC pills cause BC.  I was on and off them for hormonal imbalances since I was 14.  Add the misuse of them to "treat" my fibroids and heavy bleeding plus my last dr's negligence. 

Anonymous

MBJ, that's a real awful loser doctor you got, sorry 

Corian, you go Girl !

Hi all, let's not forget that a tumor takes a loooong time to develop, starts out with one cell which doubles onto itself and so on. So basically, a 1 cm tumour could take up to 10 years or more to develop, the larger it gets, the faster it grows, at least that's what I've read.  AND the damn machines do not detect a tumour if smaller than 1 cm.  By then, it's too often too late !

Wanted to go back on BCP at around 40 and my GP refused even though I was not a smoker.  Should I thank him for it now ?  Not sure.  Could it have fueled the tumor that was already growing ?  Not sure.

All this fiddling and f&?%$# around with our hormones is a bad deal.  Our bodies work hard to keep us healthy and we only listen to them when something very dreadful happens.

I cringe at the thought that I took pharmaceutical grade natural HRT with concentrated soy isoflavones for pre-menopausal symptomps for approx. 3 years before dx, did this fuel the tumor ?  Don't know......

AnneW

There is no proof, to my recent knowledge, that BCPills CAUSE cancer. They may stimulate a cancer that is already there, but do not cause cancer.

MBJ

AnneW:  It's in the BC Pills pamplet that it could lead to cancer.

corian68

If pharma could patent & make a bizillion dollars on Nutriceuticals......you betcha the FDA would be involved. Thank God they are not. Fortunately there are 100's of international studies done on alternative medicines that are accurate and spot on in recognizing risks and benefits. Germany, Demark, New Zealand......are way ahead of us in many areas of research. One of the reasons is the FDA is not in their way......

Anonymous

AnneW, Health Canada's Policy Paper on Nutraceuticals/Functional Foods and Health Claims On Foods at http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/label-etiquet/claims-reclam/nutra-funct_foods-nutra-fonct_aliment-eng.php

"Products with proven physiological benefits should be available to Canadians.

The regulatory environment should fairly and responsibly permit the promotion to consumers of food and drug products that have been shown by valid scientific evidence to improve health.

To benefit consumers, health claims should be supported by information that is clearly stated, substantiated, truthful, not misleading and not likely to lead to harm"

I am not reading anything about any legal actions ensuing from the above.

Sherbear

Not saying they do or do not cause cancer, but I found it very interesting that every doctor I saw (3 Onc's, 1 radiologist, 1 ND, 1 private doc, my GP....) regarding my cancer and treatment protocol asked if I had ever taken birth control pills within the first 3 questions they asked.  I had for 8 years and stopped because I didn't want to mess with my hormones anymore...lol.

Anonymous

Hello Britchick



I have another question, i hope u don,t mind. My estrogen being " repressed" by Tamox, what is happening to my progesterone and testosterone, am i going to overdose on those two? excuse my medical terminology...:)

DesignerMom

I just read this study linking elevated CRP blood levels to breast cancer outcomes. I will be asking my doctor to test this along with my D3 levels. Another good reason to focus on anti inflammatory diet and fish oil supplements. It irritates me that our Oncs don't advise about these lifestyle things that are obviously very important. Here's the BCO link (sorry linky thing won't work)

http://www.breastcancer.org/symptoms/testing/new_research/20110603.jsp

AnneW

Once again, thank you, Britchik.

Luan, I don't know HOW progesterone and testosterone figure into the big equation. I'mnot sure anyone really knows, though doubtless there are theories and supposations.

I heard about the CRP link long ago. Not sure how it really relates. My docs don't know how it relates, either. I've never had a CRP done, but keep my b vitamin intake high to hopefully combat it.

vivre

Lyle MacWilliam, editor of the Nutrisearch guide has just finished his research on the causes and prevention of breast cancer:

http://www.nutrisearch.ca/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=44:breast-cancer&catid=12:breast-cancer&Itemid=58

His research is always very impressive and the guide in which he rates Usana as the best of the best is one of the reasons I am committed to only use those supplements now. He is not assoiciated with Usana. He is Canadian. Usana is an American company. Companies do not pay him to do evaluations. He is paid by selling his guide. It is a great investment at under $15 and it is full of detailed info about what role supplements play and how they are rated.

He has said he will come to my Think Beyond the Pink event in the fall. I just need to get enough participants to cover his expenses. I also have some other great docs who will be speaking about prevention, and some fun events as well. I am going to price it as low as possible and all the profits will go to benefit autistic kids and the riverwalk foundation in my town. It would be a great way for you all to meet and have fun together. Keep the weekend before Halloween open if you are interested.

Anonymous

Thank you so much Britchick for your extensive response, as always, you're very kind  

Will have to do much research on this.  The Tamox is addressing my 90% ER+ but not my 90% PR+ and I suspect I must be a real mixed hormonal soup right now with the progesterone and testosterone not having the estrogen to play with, to counterbalance, must be having the time of their life

Anonymous

Corian, looks like you're right on  

"Stress is enormously important," Prof. Jablonka says. "It can affect the development of cancer and other chronic diseases, and may also have long term impacts on ecology." At the conclusion of the Human Genome Project, researchers hoped that the findings would provide relief from several diseases. "What they weren't prepared for," she continues, "is that genes really do so many things, and that gene expression patterns can be heritable. We can learn some things about diseases from our DNA, but it doesn't tell the whole story"

What was it that our parents were exposed to, DDT and ?

"Prof. Jablonka advises that it might be prudent to reconsider all the environmental pollutants being introduced into the planet's ecosystems. Some pesticides and fungicides are androgen suppressors and have many effects on gene expression -- and these effects can be inherited. Whether and how future generations can endure with these altered gene functions are still open questions, she says."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/03/110323104737.htm

corian68

I believe ( only my belief) it that the Adrenal glands also play a role in low progesterone. Adrenals produce adrenaline, cortisol under stress. When under chronic stress progesterone is reduced and the body favors cortisol. Too much cortisol can contribute to weight gain that promotes estrogen. Environmental toxins can also be metabolized as bad estrogens " estrone " 4-OH and 16a-OH. Creating estrogen dominance.

I am doing a full mapping of my hormones & metabolic panel. It will be interesting to see just how jacked up my body chemistry is?

Everything is connected and can create a domino effect. When we consume one drug to heal a part of our body, we have to make sure it is not destroying another. A scary balancing act.....

corian68

Absolutely Luan-

We had the Gov. Assuring our parents/ grandparents that DDT was the Miracle drug to kill pests! Spraying through neighborhoods, schools & homes. Then.......oops! Sorry, it kills bugs but will also give you cancer. But here there is a pill for that too......

And let's not forget about DES!

peggy_j

Britchick, thank you. All your information is so helpful. Yeah, I didn't think birth control pills created cancer but I figured the extra boost of estrogen was probably feeding the tumor all these years. This might be oversimplified, but my understanding is that mutations happen in our body all the time and that our bodies fight them off via the NK (natural killer) cells. Most of the time. When that doesn't happen, the mutation grows until Dx. Part of me wonders if the extra boost of estrogen was enough to turn the tide those early fateful days. Whatever.  I can't do anything about that now, but I would sure love to know specifically what to avoid so it doesn't happen again. Guess that's the big question for all of us (including the scientific community).

kira1234

My question is about the p53 gene. I know it was on my path report, and I seem to remember it being important, but have no idea how to know what a good number for it is.

Sherryc

With all the talk on hormones I have something interesting.  I have been on Tamox for 4 months.  I know my hormones are going crazy.  I had a hysterectomy in 1994 but kept my ovaries.  Had female problems and had a dry vagina for at least a year befor my hysterctomy and it never got any better.  Since taking tamox I no long have a dry vagina, I have been breaking out with acne like I am a teenager and my sex drive is through the roof.  I see my Onco the end of this month and will have a discussion regarding all this.  Don't know if it is anything I need to worry about or just enjoy it.  DH is loving it. haha 

Anonymous

If hormones fueled breast cancer, wouldn't breast cancer patients taking hormones get more recurrence? They're doing pretty well.

http://www.obgmanagement.com/pdf/1406/1406OBGM_Article1.pdf

Cyborg

Corian66 thank u re the cortisol connection/ adrenal connection. I have been under tremendous stress and job just pumps me full of adrenaline. Used to really like tha feeling too bit after awhile.... No. After years... No.

corian68

Kira1234



Well first of all, you're lucky they tested P53 for you;) my Onc. Just gave me a look & said " we don't test for that". Psh!

P53 is a cancer suppressor gene. It goes after cancer cells & tumors when they invade. It is often mutated in cancer patients. The great thing is we can help nurish it back to doing it's job. Google : P53 & Selenium. It will get you in the right area. There are clinical studies and info regarding the gene.

Cyborg- ;( we hear all the time how bad stress is for the mind , body & spirit. But when we don't know HOW it effects us....it's kinda like " ya ya" I know. But it is real and has a chemical effect ;(

I make a conscious decision everyday to do my best....not to be perfect and happy all the time, cuz we know that is not realistic! But to try! My intention is GOOD HEALTH!

We all deserve it!!!

corian68

Peggy

Since you mentioned the NK cells..I wanted to add something. PSK ( Coriouls) induces NK cells. I am starting treatment soon for NK production with my N.D we may not be able to stop the war within our bodies but we can sure arm ourselves better!

Anonymous

Just love ure spunk and positivity Corian girl ! Edited to add Enjoy Sherry, Enjoy LoL!

Kathy044

Lucy, the article you mentioned was written in 2002 when HRT was prescribed to post menopause women with the believe that taking hormones might prevent heart disease and cognitive decline. Read the conclusion again.

Also before posting this article one more time I suggest that you follow up on the 'pending evidence' mentioned  in the article. Did any of these randomized studies planned or in progress in 2002 show post menopause women with a history of BC could use HRT without worry of recurrance? 

Anonymous

You may want to check the other observational studies which find the same results. 

Climacteric. 2004 Sep;7(3):284-91

Hormone replacement therapy after a diagnosis of breast cancer: cancer recurrence and mortalityDurna EM, Wren BG, Heller GZ, Leader LR, Sjoblom P, Eden JA.School of Women's and Children's Health, University of New South Wales, Sydney, NSW, Australia.OBJECTIVE: To determine whether hormone replacement therapy (HRT) after treatment for breastcancer is associated with increased risk of recurrence and mortality. DESIGN: Retrospectiveobservational study. PARTICIPANTS AND SETTING: Postmenopausal women diagnosed with breastcancer and treated by five Sydney doctors between 1964 and 1999. OUTCOME MEASURES: Timesfrom diagnosis to cancer recurrence or new breast cancer, to death from all causes and to death fromprimary tumour were compared between women who used HRT for menopausal symptoms afterdiagnosis and those who did not. Relative risks (RRs) were determined from Cox regression analyses,adjusted for patient and tumour characteristics. RESULTS: 1122 women were followed up for 0-36 years(median, 6.08 years); 154 were lost to follow-up. 286 women used HRT for menopausal symptoms for upto 26 years (median, 1.75 years). Compared with non-users, HRT users had reduced risk of cancerrecurrence (adjusted relative risk [RR], 0.62; 95% CI, 0.43-0.87), all-cause mortality (RR, 0.34; 95% CI,0.19-0.59) and death from primary tumour (RR, 0.40; 95% CI, 0.22-0.72). Continuous combined HRTwas associated with a reduced risk of death from primary tumour (RR, 0.32; 95% CI, 0.12-0.88) and all-cause mortality (RR, 0.27; 95% CI, 0.10-0.73). CONCLUSION: HRT use for menopausal symptoms by women treated for primary invasive breast cancer is not associated with an increased risk of breast cancer recurrence or shortened life expectancy.

Anonymous

Re HRT, my cousin (BRAC +, double mastectomy plus ooph) was put on the patch. She just finished chemo and rads, now Tamox for a ER+ tumor which managed to grow despite mx. If it were me, I would sue the $€£xx doctor. My cousin has been through hell

mollyann

Luan,

I'm so sorry about your cousin. She could sue the doctor or drug company but she would lose. The evidence just isn't there despite what you read in the papers.  We've been through this before on this group. Everybody wants to blame something.

Anonymous

Molly, i,m not a doctor but giving HRT to a BC patient just does not make sense and it blows my mind, not logic to me. Had she not been put on HRT, she most probably would have been spared chemo, rads and Tamox. She certainly is not on HRT now, and if the doctor told me i had to be, i would refuse to take it. I,ve been on this board two months now, and have not read that anyone here is on HRT ?? Or am i missing something ?