Anyone heard of this?

jason222

Anyone heard of this?

jason222

Hi everyone,

I've been searching for other alternative options for cancer and stumbled upon this 2 sites..

(I edited the site out as it was pointed by Anne as spam)

It sounds interesting but have never heard of them. Are these scams or a potential form of alternative treatment?

Any idea?

ADK

Do NOT click on the above links and please report this comment.  This is spam.

jason222

Sorry Anne, if I pointed you to a spam.

But i came across the site and am wondering if the treatment they recommend is a scam or if may be beneficial.

I think i'll write here instead of putting a link.

It mentions about alternative treatment using method such as

1) Budwig diet

2) Robert O.Young protocol

3) Brandt Grape cure

Have anyone heard of those before? Or are they scams/quackery ? Any advice is greatly appreciated.

anondenet

The Budwig Diet is an old approach, widely respected. There is even a Yahoo email discussion group of Budwig users. This is not a spam or commercial enterprise.

The users either blend fleshly ground flax seeds in yogurt every day or try to obtain good, unrancid flax oil and mix that with yogurt. That is just the centerpiece of the diet. There is science behind it but you must read up on it.

As an aside, I ran across a mainstream medical doctor from Germany who said it was used with some success in Germany.

shed

can you use flax seeds if you are ER/PR+   ???

nixieschaos

There is a site  cancertutor.com  that my sister told me about when I was diagnosed. It can be overwhelming, but when you learn how to use it, it is really interesting. This guy gives all perspectives, explores so many alternative treatments, including the Brandt cure, Budwig, etc...Some of it is pretty bizarre, but again, he looks at all of it. I have stage IV Inflamatory ductal Carcenoma. I looked at the stage IV treatments and found the Amazon Protocol, by a company called Nutranomics. I have been on it since November 07. I credit that, along with a radical change in my diet with my seemingly invinceable immune system, endless energy, and remarkable healing (as my doctor so mystified by my condition) put it. I complement the Alternative treatment with the chemo and radiation. I think the Amazon Protocol helped strengthen my system so I could literally sail through Chemo. I finished last Wed.  

nixieschaos

There is a site  cancertutor.com  that my sister told me about when I was diagnosed. It can be overwhelming, but when you learn how to use it, it is really interesting. This guy gives all perspectives, explores so many alternative treatments, including the Brandt cure, Budwig, etc...Some of it is pretty bizarre, but again, he looks at all of it. I have stage IV Inflamatory ductal Carcenoma. I looked at the stage IV treatments and found the Amazon Protocol, by a company called Nutranomics. I have been on it since November 07. I credit that, along with a radical change in my diet with my seemingly invinceable immune system, endless energy, and remarkable healing (as my doctor so mystified by my condition) put it. I complement the Alternative treatment with the chemo and radiation. I think the Amazon Protocol helped strengthen my system so I could literally sail through Chemo. I finished last Wed.  

jason222

Dear Nixie,

Yes, thats the website I stumbled upon, but what they claim about the conventional treatment is kind of unbelievable.

Thats why I am not sure about the alternative treatment that they recommend is a quackery or otherwise.

But then again, some of the points they brought up seems logical, thats why I am kind of confused here and would like to get some feedback on those and see what others think before giving it a try.

By the way, nixie, what do you think of the budwig diet? 

althea

jason, I'm over 3 years post dx and I'm still confused.  On my quest to get my thyroid imbalance corrected, I've ventured into the alternative side of medicine.  The volume of information is overwhelming.  Some of it makes sense, some of it doesn't.  Like these coffee enemas I keep hearing about.  That just doesn't make sense to me.  If it's good enough to put up my butt, it should be good enough to put in my mouth where I can enjoy it! 

There was a woman posting here for a while who followed advice given by Dr Richard Schulze.  It sounded far fetched to me, but by the time I was not getting help for my thyroid from my mainstream doctors, I took a leap of faith and tried some superfood.  Just that one change has made a huge difference in how I feel.  So I believe that changes in our food can bring dramatic health benefits.  There are a lot of newsletters at his site, and even though I think he's mightily opinionated and full of himself, I also find his information credible.  I didn't realize how little I knew about natural healing until I learned what he has to say.  And to me, what he says makes sense.  It resonates with me.  You might want to give it a look for yourself.  www.herbdoc.com   

anondenet

Shed,

Yes, the Budwig Protocol is widely used on ER+, PR+.

nixieschaos

Dear Jason,

I know what you mean about the claims about conventional treatment.My instincts told me that conventional treatment  is important, but more important is the food we put in our bodies and what goes into our heads (attitude). I hadn't looked at the cancer tutor until my diagnosis, but on the day that I scheduled my  lumpectomy, I adapted a diet that was very much like the budwig protocol. Whole foods, absolutley no processed foods, ORGANIC fruits & Vegetables. I love bread, so that was devastating, but I found sprouted bread, which is fabulous. The only thing is the flaxseed oil and cottage cheese. I use ground flax. I buy organic flaxseeds and grind them in my coffee grinder and mix them with juiced organic apples. It's the cottage cheese that i have the issue with because it's dairy. What happened is that by the time I began chemo, my body was strong enough to handle it. I was also taking the Amazon Protocol, by Nutranomics, which I found on cancer tutor. I think some of the supposed cures on that site are ridiculous, but to their credit, they explore everything. We just need to use our common sense. i investigated Tumor X which I found on cancer tutor, but it was really expensive and there were some red flags with that. Look into Amazon Protocol. I was able to speak with the founder before I made my decision. he sent me loads of info, clinical trials, etc...I swear by the stuff. And they have a couple of nurses on staff to speak to you and answer questions. Man, what the heck have we gotten ourselves into???  But when I think about it, this is probably the best thing that could have happened to me. It opened my eyes to so many things. My life, and what is truly important, and my body, which was so mistreated for so many years. I just pray that this is the beginning of a second chance.

And re the Schultz superfood...I have friends that swear by it. I am taking cat's claw, 5 greenest, spirulina, coral calcium, in addition to the Amazon protocol. About 60 pills a day. But I don't dare stop. I have really made my doctors scratch their heads. They said I had a 20% chance to survive in October. Now, I am told that my future looks pretty darn good. (That was on Tuesday).    

althea

nixie, a big high five to your prognosis!  I haven't been to the cancertutor site yet but it sounds really good.  I grind my flaxseed fresh daily also.  I've been mixing it with yogurt and superfood.  I never thought to mix it with juice.  Will have to give that a try. 

Shed, my tumor was er/pr+ and I've been eating flaxseed on a regular basis for over a year now.  I read about it in Northrup's book on menopause.   There are so many benefits associated with it.  The one I was most interested in was relief from fatigue, which didn't materialize, but it did take care of my the chronic constipation that plagued me since starting tamoxifen.  Supposedly it will improve your cholesterol.  I wish there was a magic window that would tell me what it would be without the flax, since I've had a 223 and a 233 in the last six months.  

Anyway, I've read that phytoestrogens are weaker than the estrogen made by our own bodies and for that reason we are not at increased risk from food because the plant material is not strong enough to feed a tumor.   Taking the same material as a supplement would be a different matter.  I suppose it's speculation just like everything else.  Since we all have to pick and choose, that's the theory I'm siding with.  

nixieschaos

Althea,

I was mixing my flax into smoothies, but it got so thick, I was full before finishing a glass! I am trying to do 1/2 cup of ground flax per day. It just got to the point that I needed to do something where I could just get it down if I was in a hurry, so I tried the apple juice. I do a small glass with a tablespoon or two of flax at a time, until the flax is gone. It tastes so good. It's a great combination. It'll be interesting to see how I do with the fatiguethat they tell me will happen, during radiation, which begins today. 

Ok, so this might be a weird question, but recently, they talked about 15 minutes per day of unprotected exposure to sunlight to get that vitamin D, being beneficial to breast cancer patients.  I am hearing that after 3 weeks or so, I will be burned from the radiation.

So in my weird little mind, I am thinking about sunning the girls to get them ready for the radiation effects. I try to use my common sense. My husband thinks I am being ridiculous, but I think it might be something to think about!! I would love any thoughts re this...    

althea

I find myself drawing a big blank on what exactly radiation treatment does for us.  I can remember that chemo targets rapidly dividing cells.  I can remember that radiation targets a specific location to zap any remaining cancer cells, but I can't recall how or if it differentiates between cancerous and healthy cells.  I wonder if I ever knew?  Things were getting blurry by the time I got that far. 

My gut tells me radiation treatments are entirely different from getting adequate vitamin D from sunlight.  But hey, if you want to sunbathe your girls beforehand, I think you should go for it!  Just dont' get sunburned or arrested!  And your husband can suck on a rotten egg.  There's a thousand ways he could respond to this idea, and he chose to diminish your point of view.  For shame.  If your intuition says to sunbathe, there's probably a good reason for it.  

<> 

jason222

Hi Nixie,

So you are not using the cottage cheese? Actually when I researched about the Budwig diet, it mentions cabbages, and sunlight as well.

And I found recent articles which also states about the benefits of sunlight and cabbages. So it kind of confirms some of the benefits the diet is recommending.

The only thing is, shall i get the flaxseed oil or just the flaxseed like what you are doing? But without the cottage cheese then it's no longer adhering to the budwig diet.

Any thoughts?
What's the rest doing with their diets and how's the result so far?

nixieschaos

Hey Jason

I am not using the cottage cheese, but that is just based on my own feelings about dairy. The fact that the cancer is in my bones is a big part of it. I need to get my bones re-calcifying, so the dairy is really out for me. I also can't hang with the flaxseed oil. Bleh. I really like the taste of the ground flaxseed, and combined with the apple juice, it's really good. That's me...The reasoning behind the cottage cheese and flax oil makes sence, though. And the Budwig Protocol is an entire program, everything working together. Johanna Budwig was really an amazing woman.

A friend of mine sent me an email. This was one of the links she sent me:  

 http://grouppekurosawa.com/blog/2005/06/flaxseed-lignan-precursors.htm

Something really interesting I found about the sunlight...When I was pregnant with my first daughter, I was REALLY eating WELL. I took these amazing pre natal vitamins, lots of greens...I did everything 'right'. M husband & I went to Lake Havasu for a few days with friends. I was about five or six months along. We went to a small cove, on the lake, where we spent the day. I dug a hole for my tummy and just hung out on the beach while everyone played in the water on sea-doos. At the end of the day...a FULL day, everyone was very sunburned. We had no protection at all in that little cove. I was a bronze goddess... No trace of burn. I had not been exposed to any sun until that day. It was my diet and the vitamins. 

We had a really hot couple of weekends recently. I spent the day outside, both weekends. Same thing. I got a healthy glow, but no burn. When I am not eating right, I always burn. I read a very tiny article a few years ago about nutrition and sun exposure. It was buried in the middle of the news paper...heaven forbid we actually see it and catch on to the whole idea of truly proper nutrition!!!   

jason222

Hi nixie,

read through some articles, and they do mention about dairy product contributing the breast cancer.

if that's the case, maybe we should skip the cottage cheese as well, but will the benefit of the budwig diet still applies without the cottage cheese?

And by the way, where do you get the flaxseed from?

nixieschaos

Hi Jason

I get my organic flaxseed at the health food store. Buy it in bulk. I think I pay about 1.79 per lb. You can buy it packaged, but it's more expensive.

I can only go by what has happened to me re the effects of my diet. So, based on my results, I would think that the ground flaxseed and apple juice is still effective.   

nixieschaos

Althea...

Yes, I will have my husband suck rotten eggs... He is a dork sometimes.

Yep, I think the radiation kills everything it touches. I don't think it distinguishes between healthy and unhealthy cells. I asked the radiologist about the sun. She said it would make it worse. I wonder if she understood what I was getting at. Man, my gut says to give it  shot ...in the privacy of my back yard...Heck, I have FIVE tattoos now (radiation marks) I might just be seen on 'Girls Gone Wild'. or in my case...'Tattooed middle aged women with breast cancer gone wild'. Now THAT would be something to see...

How do you spell Tattoo anyway!!!!!

nixieschaos

Althea...

Yes, I will have my husband suck rotten eggs... He is a dork sometimes.

Yep, I think the radiation kills everything it touches. I don't think it distinguishes between healthy and unhealthy cells. I asked the radiologist about the sun. She said it would make it worse. I wonder if she understood what I was getting at. Man, my gut says to give it  shot ...in the privacy of my back yard...Heck, I have FIVE tattoos now (radiation marks) I might just be seen on 'Girls Gone Wild'. or in my case...'Tattooed middle aged women with breast cancer gone wild'. Now THAT would be something to see...

How do you spell Tattoo anyway!!!!!

jason222

Hi nixie,

One question, what makes you decide to take the flaxseed instead of the flaxseed oil? 

althea

I grind my flaxseed daily and I can tell you my reasons for choosing it over oil.  First, eating flaxseed whole usually results in the seed passing all the way through without breaking down, and you'll miss out on a lot of benefits.  Grinding it fresh daily will release the oil and result in better absorption of the omega 3 fatty acids and other benefits. Once the oil is released, the shelf life is very short.  That's why I choose to grind it each time I want it for breakfast.  Just an inexpensive coffee grinder is all you need for this. 

nixieschaos

I like the idea that the flax ground is in it's pure form. The taste of the ground seed is nutty. I like it much better than the oil. So there is no 'chore' in taking the flax seed. AND it's way cheaper! You can buy lignan and non lignan flaxseed oil. I know it's the lignan precursors that make the use of flaxseed so effective against cancer. I don't know how the oil, lignan free or not works, other than what I understand from the budwig protocol.

mamafig

I've been on the Budwig diet almost a year now.

I had a partial mast. followed up with 6 wks. of rad.

Been taking Arimidex since Januaray. I have no noticeable side effects. I beleive it's because of the Flax seed oil. My onc. is amazed but doesn't believe in any alt. treatments.

Hubby and I have done much research on alt. treatments. He has a double minor in Chemistry/biology, so understands the concept behind the Budwig protocol and says it makes sense.   But, you MUST  blend the flax seed oil into cottage cheese or yogurt to get the full benefits. ( must be a sulfer rich food).  I avoided dairy except for this. Supposedly, when flaxseed oil is mixed with c.c. it changes it molecularly. I read that even lactose intolerant people can eat it. This, then oxygenates the cells. And of course, we all know that cancer can't survive in an oxygenated enviornment.

Not every alt. treatment works the same with all people. Cancer tudor does have some strange treatments on there, and I'm not crazy about B. Henderson, but many of these treatments have been confirmed by other sources. And I don't trust the FDA, big Pharma., and the whole Cancer industry. But, when your life is on the line, it's scary to lean on only the alt. treatments. That's why I went ahead and did both. Although, I don't think I'd do radiation or chemo again. The survival times with and without are the same and my onc. didn't even tell me about most of the long term side effects of radiation. It seems they're more concerned about getting their 5 yr. success numbers on the books.

FEB

My alternative doc is participating in a conference this week in Chicago called the

health freedom expo. They will be having a lot of interesting speakers and exibitors. I hope I will be able to go. I know it may be hard for some of you who live far, but if anyone wants to come to Chicago and attend, I will be glad to advise you on places to stay and things to do. Chicago is beautiful in the summer and you might really enjoy a getaway.

If you go to website, healthfreedomexpo.com you can look at the schedule. I will check in next week to let you know what I learned.

LindaM

jason222

Wanted to try the Budwig diet for my mum, and currently giving her flax oil, as cottage cheese was considered a dairy, we are still not sure whether to include these in to her diet as well.

Confusing...

mamafig

If you eat only organic cottage cheese, it won't have the growth hormone. Google the diet and see the science behind it if you're interested. I really think it got rid of most of the cancer I had.

mamafig

LindaM,

The health expo sounds very interesting. Wish I could go.

Yes, please let us know what you learn. 

cp418

Very glad I read this post as this information is exactly the area where I am trying to get educated. 

 mammafig wrote - And I don't trust the FDA, big Pharma., and the whole Cancer industry. But, when your life is on the line, it's scary to lean on only the alt. treatments. That's why I went ahead and did both. Although, I don't think I'd do radiation or chemo again. The survival times with and without are the same and my onc. didn't even tell me about most of the long term side effects of radiation. It seems they're more concerned about getting their 5 yr. success numbers on the books.

Wow - you sounded like me exactly in your reply!! I had lumpectomy, chemo, radiation (left side) and now Femara.  Recently identified heart murmur with all 3 heart valves have regurtation problems.  Also bone loss to hips and spine plus jaws.  Scheduled for oral surgery in July to replace bone in left lower jaw plus gum surgery to back of mouth all sides.  Permanent neuropathy in my feet never resolved from Taxol where on some days I can barely walk. I am age 51 and this is depressing to say the least.

 The hospital where I was treated literally exits you out the door after your last raditaion treatment (of course scheduling your 6 month appts), but they have NO internal services or referrals for diet and supplements, accupuncture and massage for pain management, etc.  These subjects simply DO NOT exist!  I had an an oncology nurse ask me why I was taking supplements like Co-enzQ.  She was completely clueless about vitamins and supplements post treatment.  They are all about testing and dispensing prescriptions for big pharma.  My Onc will not even discuss Calcium or Vitamin D doses with me but would hand me a prescription for Fosamax in a blink.  Note - I had SEVERE heart burn during chemo and was put on Protonix for 8 months.  What in the world can he be thinking that I would consider a drug that may give me more problems in addition to the ones I have already?

 So far, I've been making my own diet changes and supplements based upon articles I've read with NO medical guidance at all.  So I thank you for providing these links and alternative health sources so lacking in our so called cancer treatment centers. 

mamafig

cp418...........

I'm so sorry and angry for you. Was it the chemo that caused the bone loss?  I know left side rads. can damage the heart. Mine was on the right. Otherwise I probably wouldn't have given in to my onc.'s insistence on radiation.(it still did lung damage). But now that I know more and can think without the intimidation and fear, I regret doing the radiation. They only found residual non-invasive cancer cells in the tissue after the partial mast. I think the anti cancer diet my husband had me on was really working. 

How long ago was your dx and treatment? It's been just one year since my dx.

I'm 50, and praying that the radiation and Arimidex doesn't cause problems years from now.  My rad. onc., regular onc., and surgeon want to keep seeing me every 6 months. Why? I can understand maybe seeing one of them once a year for a check-up or something, but it seems to me they just want to squeeze as much money out of me as possible.  I finished my tx, had a normal mammogram, and have an appt. with my OBGYN soon. 

I have a friend who just finished 5 years of tamoxifin. She recently had a total hysterectomy  because of the uterine cancer risk. Now she's been told she has osteoporosis due to the tamox.

There must be a better way to treat cancer. Harming a person's body to "treat" the cancer just doesn't seem like good medicine to me. 

Sorry for ranting. I get angry when I hear of what conventional medicine is doing in the area of cancer.