Soy or no Soy?

marshakb

Friends and family mean well I am sure, but I am getting conflicting "advice" on soy. One friend insists I have at least one soy shake a day and others are saying absolutely NO soy with BC. Anyone here know? It is hard to listen to people who have never had to research foods that will harm their bodies like we have to. Thanks, Marsha

Rosemary44

I wouldn't soy if your ER+. We can't get away from it, it's in everything boxed lately. They are doing other studies which say young girls will benefit from taking soy in their preteens, to ward off BC later in life but I'm suspicious of those studies. Are they following up these girls for 30 years to see if they do or don't get BC? How do they know without doing a very long term study?

But if you want to know everything bad about eating soy go to Dr. Mercola's site, he'll give you quite alot to think about before eating soy in great amounts:

http://www.mercola.com/article/soy/index.htm

A little won't harm, but you have to know which kind of soy is not harmful. Soy sauce is not harmful and it is rich in antioxidants, and some other types won't harm in small amounts either, but you have to know which is which to eat if you like a lot of it.

A warning, it's hard to read about what happens to infants that are on soy formula, yet Pediatricians still advise Mom's to give the babies soy.

marshakb

Thanks RoseMary for the link. I sent it the friend nagging me about introducing soy to my diet. I've decided to not change anything until after my onc. visit on Monday and then take all vitamins, current diet habits, suggestions and the like to him for approval. Marsha

Rosemary44

Marsha,

I'll be very interested in what your Onc has to say about vitamins and such. It's kind of a joke around here. Onc's usually have nothing to say about diets and vitamins, but I could be surprised. So don't be surprised if you get a shrug.

marshakb

WHAT???? You mean to tell that my onc. is going to start a chemo cocktail for me and cannot tell me things to avoid etc? Thanks for the heads up! My onc is with an ocology group that is connected with the Moffit Center in Tampa and are considered cutting edge. How cutting edge can you be if they are not dealing with the whole body? LOL Marsha

Rosemary44

You'll just have to wait and see. He may surprise you and me. Ask the pertinent questions about diet and vitamins, which you should take and which you should stay away from, such as antioxidants during chemo treatment, and see what he has to say. Then let me know.

linny

All of the medical personnel I saw - medical oncologist, radiation oncologist, surgeon, case manager nurses, had nothing at all to say about food, what I should or should not eat. One nurse said to me that food does not cause cancer and food does not cure it. However, do NOT eat a lot of soy, if you are hormone receptor positive.

Rosemary44

I'm not too sure your Nurse is correct. Everytime I think about all the pesticides they spray on fruits, that makes me sick.

marshakb

Thanks gals....I am ER/PR Pos like 97% so I at least now know to not do the soy thing. Obviously can't avoid it altogether but my friend wanted me to go to a Soy diet! Jeez.............Marsha

Amera

I am ER/PR- but my surgeon still said to avoid soy in great amounts. I asked if the occasional tofu burger was okay and she said yes but to avoid the heavy duty soy (shakes!) on a daily basis. I'm sure the advice would've been different if I were ER/PR+. I will ask my onc when I see her Thurs. Her area of research is actually exercise and weight gain pre and post diagnosis. I'll bet she has an opinion on the soy/vitamin debate. We shall see.
Amera

Amera

Talked to my oncologist yesterday about soy. She said that there have not been enough studies about the benefits or perils but...it does contain natural estrogen so to be careful. They just do not know enough yet (she is forever touting research) but that the occasional tofu stir-fry or veggie burger probably wouldn't hurt. She also mentioned that tofu is not the wonder food it was once thought as and that you can get the same nutrients from other foods.

She also said a multiply daily vitamin was fine but to watch the extra calcium as it can contribute to constipation while on chemo.
Amera

nanabirdofangels-2007Jan15

My onc nurse just said to avoid soy milk and whey at all costs cause it fights the tamxofen. So much for all the years i drank it to prevent bc,huh!?

marshakb

I'm not touching soy with a ten foot pole. Organic dairy and meats for me! Marsha

risetolife-2006Dec16

I have never heard that Whey fights Tamxofen. It is not the same as Soy, at least from what I have been able to research. What is you onc nurse's authority regarding her opinion? Thanks.

carolinakatlady

My onc says the studies on soy are still inconclusive. I am er/pr negative and her2 positive. She says that even though I am her2 positive a new cancer could be er/pr negative so I should be careful about phytoestrogens like soy. She says not to go on any "fad" diets but make sure I get my omega 3, and lycopenes in addition to my multivitamin, c and calcium.

Anne

jah4377

One thing that has not been discussed here is Soy and the thyroid. Many studies show how bad soy is on the thyroid gland. I have thyroid disease so I try to stay away the best I can. It does seem to bee in everything!!!!!

gracejon

Jody, please post your articles on soy and thyroid. The soy queen I work with is this huge soy consumer and has hypothyroidism. I wouldn't exclusively and in large amounts use soy but do ingest some on ocassion. I do not believe it is good for breast cancer girls. I do like salads and dressing and if you look salad dressings contain soy. I also eat veggie burgers and love soy crisps but again do not go overboard. I do not think my coworkers would listen if I presented something but would love to offer an article or two. She tends to be one of those "I know it all and you can't tell me anything" particularly about healthy eating and lifestyle.

lzcait

Jah4377...I switched all my Starbucks over to soy a year ago at the advice of a dietician to see if we could lower my cholesterol...and it quickly interferred with the uptake of my thyroid medication. I don't worry about a little soy here and there in salad dressings, etc. But I won't ever go overboard with it again.

Rosemary44

This article tells all about soy and thyroid dangers:

http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/soydangers.htm

Anonymous

Hmmmm...my middle daughter was on soy milk for several months as an infant. She now takes thyroid meds. I wonder if this had anything to do with it. I also take thyroid meds. Or could it be that she inherited it from me?
Shirley

Robbin65

I just went to Trader Joe's, (which is a health food store) and purchaced a bunch of soy products. I am starting my first chemo AC on Thursday 25th.

Hum..... don't know what to think now.

Rosemary44

I know the feeling, I had a freezer full of soy this and that, plus the milk and then I found out about soy. It all went by way of the trash can eventually. It took me awhile to part with it since it was on my diet for so long before being dx'd.

shed

what about flaxseed??? I think that also contains phytoestrogens

Rosemary44

If we were mice I could answer that question about flax. They really need to do more human research.

I found this about tamoxifen and flax, again they used mice:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query...l=pubmed_docsum

and also this which gives us a good reason to toss the soy:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query...t_uids=16557589

vpiazza

i think we've had this conversation before ... probably a few times.

on one hand, you have cultures like the japanese, reporting less bc (and cancer in general) who have soy as a staple of their diet. there are 2 factors at work there. one is that they have always eaten it, the other is that it is not extensively processed (and their diet is generally very high in vegetables and fish).

then you have people, particularly in the u.s., that think soy is the wonder food, and begin consuming a lot of it as adults. at that point, your body is not accustomed to processing those phytoestrogens and the soy we tend to eat is highly processed.

i've seen people from all dietary backgrounds get cancer and not get cancer. i just try to eat whole foods and be happy. one woman suggested i stop eating anything in the nightshade family (she did, and her cancer returned, quickly and with fatal results), and i told her that i should die rather than not eat tomatoes and eggplant.

QueenSansaStark

I asked my BC nurse about soy and this is what she said: There's no need to go fanatically soy-free even if you are ER+ (like me). Something like the occasional tofu stir-fry is fine. However, don't consume soy every day. If you have a tofu shake every morning, stop. You really don't want to have lots of soy products if you are ER+. As for me, I'm hypothyroid as well as ER+ so I'm not even going to indulge in tofu stir-fry, edamame or any of that stuff from here on in! I'll just eat chicken or shrimp.

Unfortunately it's kind of hard to avoid all soy because "partially hydrogenated soybean oil" etc. is in so much of what we eat.

LillyJ

I'm Triple Neg and I avoid soy. If I were ER+, I'd doubly avoid it. If you want further information, The Weston A Price Foundation publishes a brochure called, Soy Alert - www.westonaprice.org.

They say,

"Soy isoflavones are phyto-endocrine disrupter. At dietary levels, they can prevent ovulation and stimulate the growth of cancer cells. As little as four tablespoons of soy per day can result in hypothyroidism wtih symptoms of lethargy, constipation, weight gain and fatigue.

"High levels of phytic acid in soy reduce assimilation of calcium, magnesium, copper, iron and zinc.

"Trypsin inhibitors in soy interfere with protein digestion and may cause pancreatic disorders."

"Soy phytoestrogens disrupt endocrine function and have the potential to cause infertility and to promote breast cancer in adult women,"

"Processing of soy protein results in the formation of toxic lysinoalanine and highly carcinogenic nitrosamines."

"Babies fed soy-based formula have 13,000 to 22,000 times more estrogen compounds in their blood than babies fed milk-based formula. Infants exclusively fed soy formula receive the estrogenic equivalent of at least five birth control pills per day."

Why is soy allowed???? Because it is a very, very big business!!

There's more - so check it out.

Jackie

Beesie

CrystalCat,

I got exactly the same advice from my BC nurse. What I do is avoid all obvious sources of soy such as vegetarian burgers, soy milk, tofu and anything that has soy included as one of the first few ingredients on the list. On the other hand, I haven't stopped using products that have soy listed way down the ingredient list. I find it's pretty manageable this way, except that I sure miss my mocha soy milk!

sjoc

My onc told me absolutely no soy if you are ER+, that it has estrogen properties. He also said no flaxseed. He also said to avoid any herbal remedies that are for menopausal symptoms, because most will mimic estrogen. The only vitamen he recommended for me during chemo was extra doses of B6 to help combat the fatigue associated with chemo.-Sandy

QueenSansaStark

I don't know if this has anything to do with us, but my cousin was fed on soy milk as an infant, and got brain cancer at 22. (Luckily she's NED now.)

Soy has been pushed as the wonder food, but how much of that has to do with the alleged benefits of soy itself and how much to do with the soy manufacturers? Soy is one of our biggest cash crops, and while I'm not a wild-eyed conspiracy theorist I'm not going to assume anything but self-interest on the part of corporations.

And it's amazing how much soy is in things. I strolled the health-food and supplements aisle the other day, and checked the ingredients lists of those boosts they put in Jamba Juice (I happen to love Jamba and drink one practically every day) and so many of these "just for women" type supplements have isoflavones, soy extracts, "natural estrogens" etc. etc. that are absolutely, positively, NOT for us ER+++ girls! Too soon old, too late smart in my case.

bookworm759

It's amazingly controversial. My onc said to avoid soy supplements, but okay to take say as a natural food. So no soy protein powders or power bars, etc. I also checked with a nutritionist from a well-known holistic cancer center who said moderate soy food -- maybe 3-4 meals a week - would be okay. She pointed out that the benefits of soy shouldn't be ignored either. I hardly know what to do, but I do have soy occasionally, esp. since I'm trying to avoid dairy so what else is there.