Polygamist Sect Under Investigation
Comments
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Althea,
They will put the men in jail. But first they have to identify them. This is the problem. The women will not give their last names or identify their legal or "spiritual" husbands, nor will they identify which children are theirs. Many of the children and mothers are from Utah and were sent there to become the wives of other men, as their husbands were banished for some reason from the sect in Utah.
Just as DNA testing is used in child custody cases in regular mainstream society, they will have to use DNA to identify who the children belong to and who their fathers are. It's going to be a mess. Many times a man will marry a pair of sisters, niece or cousin, so the bloodlines are a mess and completely intermixed.
I think a little namecalling might be okay in this case.
Bren
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>>I think a little namecalling might be okay in this case.<<
LOL Bren! I agree, but I'd still have the dilemma of what words to choose! Perhaps we could all just make our own lists and keep them to ourselves. No need to drag ourselves down in the face of something so egregiously loathsome.
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"Egregiously loathsome"
Althea ... by George!!! I think you hit the motherlode with that one.
love,
Bren
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I have heard of a man's wife being "transferred" to another man ... did not know that the children went as well. Never dawned on me that it could happen. I know Big Love is a tv show ... and it did show that men were threatened with their loss of wives but in the show the wife who was going to be "re-allocated" did not have children.
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BTW, I believe the good ole ACLU will be getting involved with this.
Shirley
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If the ACLU gets involved in this somebody needs to override them.
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Rocktobermom...I found this article about the clothing...
By HILLARY RHODES, Associated Press Writer Mon Apr 21, 6:01 PM ET
For a society accustomed to the likes of Paris Hilton and Lindsay Lohan, the images of the women from the polygamist compound in Texas are almost shocking in their understatement: Ankle-length dresses, makeup-less faces, hauntingly uniform hair.
And while no one would accuse the women of making a fashion statement, the pioneer-style outfits are a rare example of how in an age of overexposure, modesty, too, can give pause.
The puff-sleeved, pastel dresses worn by the women in the sect are a combination of original 19th-century wear and 1950s clothing that was adopted when the church took a conservative turn, according to Janet Bennion, an anthropologist who studies polygamist women.
The dresses are meant to show modesty and conformity: They go down to the ankles and wrists, and are often worn over garments or pants, making sure every possibly provocative inch of skin is covered.
John Llewellyn, a polygamy expert and retired Salt Lake County sheriff's lieutenant, says the women cover themselves "so that they're unattractive to the outside world or other men."
The appearance of unity through uniform dress, however, can belie the jealousy that often arises when the women - who might all look alike to an outsider - find themselves in competition with one another over the affections of the same man, Llewellyn says.
The clothing is also stitched with special markings "to protect the body and to remind you of you commitment," Bennion says. She declined to go into detail about the stitchings because she said it would be an infraction against the fundamentalist Mormon community to talk about their sacred symbols.
Pastel colors evoke femininity and don't come across as bold or strong, says Bennion, a professor at Lyndon State College in Vermont.
Then there's the question of the elaborate hairdos.
The women never cut their hair because they believe they will use it to wash Christ's feet during the Second Coming, Bennion says. A Biblical quote says a woman's hair should be her crowning glory.
The bangs are grown out and rolled (but usually not using a curling iron, because that would be too modern). There are sausage curls on the sides and often braids down the back.
The exact history of the hairstyle is unclear, but it is reminiscent of the Gibson Girl image of the 1800s. It's a pre-World War II look, exaggerated with the pompadour, Llewellyn says. Chloe Sevigny's character in the HBO show "Big Love," about modern polygamist Mormons, has mastered the 'do.
Celebrity stylist and salon owner Ted Gibson thinks it gives off a "homely" impression.
"It says 'I don't really care very much. I really don't have time to worry about the way that I look, because I have 20 children,'" Gibson said. "He's going from wife to wife to wife, so why should I look any better than the other ones?"
Still, it's not outlandish to imagine the prairie look influencing today's styles, given that trends can come from unexpected places, and Sevigny is known as a style-setter. You can already find blouses with high necks and ruffles in stores, and puffed shoulders on short and long-sleeved shirts.
Prairie skirts are in fashion this season, while dusty pastels and neutrals are being introduced to offset trendy bold colors and patterns.
Long hair is also on its way back in, preparing to replace the currently fashionable bobs, Gibson says. Buns never go completely out of style, according to Gibson - he often gives celebrities a half-up-half-down 'do, essentially what we're seeing in the photographs coming out of Texas.
But for the most part, the looks that arise from the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints are likely to stay there.
On her blog, the fashion editor of glam.com wondered if the spotlight on the Texas raid would make otherwise innocuous pastels unsavory, given their dubious association with polygamists.
"Unexpected perversion? Right-wing fads?" Susan Cernek wrote. "Sounds like a good Halloween costume ... or Marc Jacobs Spring '09."
Allison Berlin, founder of Style Made Simple, doesn't expect Mormon-inspired fashion to go mainstream.
"Women don't actually want to look like that," she says. "I can see the Brooklyn hipsters rocking a French braid, but not in a serious way. Maybe ironically."
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Paulette, great research ...... Remember the 80's with our prairie skirts, the blouses with mutton sleeves and high necks, even ruffles down the front.
I understand the idea about being "set apart" in a spiritual way. Hasidic Jewish people are noticed by their clothing .... the hat, the long uncut sideburns. Even up at Tahoe, you see women skiing in a skirt (they have snow pants on underneath. Even little girls. One of the churches around here, a Baptist one, does not allow pants on women EVER. But they can buy their clothes at the mall or whereever. Nothing low cut and must be below the kneee. For gardening, they wear culottes.
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I really worry about these women and children. I did watch much of the recent trial of Warren Jeffs; the young lady who was forced to marry her cousin at a young age was so brave.
Has anyone noticed that the women they are able to speak with on camera seem very thin--nearly emaciated? The have the same "look" in their faces that I've seen in others with anorexia.
Even though an argument could be made that the women should be protecting their children from all of this, I imagine most of them were born into this way of life and have been raised to believe this way. It seems as though they are kept from speaking out or rebelling by threatening them with the loss of their eternal salvation.
Very, very sad...
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It makes me sad to see just another example of men preying on women and children to selfishly meet their own "needs".
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Kind of like Stockholm Syndrome where the victim identifies with the abuser (kidnapper) and believes that is their salvation (ie way to survive)
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Amy:
20 Apr 2008 01:26 PM
Shirley-- maybe if you had more than one husband or if your husband had more than one wife you could have brainwashed them better
.I'm kinda slow and just reread this.
Amy, I didn't brainwash my children. Ya can't call it brainwashing when they are very capable of thinking for themselves. What we have taught them in this monogamous relationship is respect and to THINK FOR THEMSELVES! We have raised WONDERFUL daughters who have grown to be lovely, caring women. And they're self sufficient. They didn't have the need to run away from home. We darned well made sure of that!
Another thing, Amy, what I have found is to let my grown children be who they are. Whether we agree or not. I am quite a patient person (according to one of my impatient daughters). And, no, we were not the perfect parent BUT CLOSE!
Shirley
Again, Roctobermom, YOU ROCK! You are raising your daughter to be a WONDERFUL young woman.
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I don't think the woman get enough nutrients, I think they are so beaten down they seem so sad to me. Not happy. Worn out. I wish we could give them new lives with out these men.
Not one of them looks healthy.
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Thanks Shirley ... when you are a single mom, the thing you always worry about is being and doing enough!
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Roctobermom, I cannot even imagine being a single mom. In fact, I take my hat off to all the mom's who have a job outside the home. And, being a single mom and having to work and go through bc, well, let's just say, you are a very strong woman and I think you have and are setting a great example for your daughter. When our children hurt we hurt. If someone hurts our children we want to kill them. And no one better ever bad mouth our children (we can though...LOL). And, even when they are adults WATCH OUT FOR THE MAMA BEAR!
I love the new avatar of your daughter.
Shirley
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I can echo those sentiments Rocktobermom...being a single mom is our single most important job..we have to be Dad, Mom, driver, provider and the list goes on and on. Our children are our world...no matter what age.
Lisa
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Shirley, that's me in my avatar....... I was putting our pics together and I will post hers, we look like twins!!
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On Dr. Phil's show this evening he had a young woman on the show who escaped at 13. He went with her to the compound so she could try to reunite with some of her family. There was a lot of live footage tonight on the show. All the women were crying and wanting the children back. The young lady on the show wanted to find one of her sisters and eventually they did. When asked about "her children" she replied she was just a caregiver! These women have no ownership of the children they bore. The men in the hierarchy own and control all. Tomorrow's Dr. Phil program will be interviewing "The lost boys".....the ones who are kicked out to fend for themselves by the elder men. Very gripping show.
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OH YA and HAT"S OFF to you Rocktober!!! Being a single mom has got to be one of the hardest jobs on earth.......I have great respect for that!!!! You go girl!!
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I wonder how these kids are going to fare while attending public schools...I would think they will need extensive counseling...
Polygamist sect children being bused to South Texas
Officials try to keep family groups together, and some appear headed for Houston areaBy RICHARD STEWART and RENÉE C. LEE
Copyright 2008 Houston ChronicleSome of the 437 children from a polygamist compound in arid West Texas soon may be bound for group homes in green, tree-shaded locations in Harris, Montgomery and Brazoria counties.
Buses carrying the first 114 children left San Angelo on Tuesday after state District Judge Barbara Walther issued a placement order telling officials to make every attempt to place sibling groups together.
The order listed facilities from the Panhandle to southeast Texas, including Kidz Harbor in Brazoria County, Boys and Girls Country near Hockley, and Arrow Child and Family Ministries in Montgomery County.
The busing of the children immediately stirred controversy because it came before lawyers for the children were notified, said Guy Choate, a San Angelo attorney.
A list of where individual children would be placed was not made public, but an attorney who saw the list said that 47 of the 5- to 17-year-old children would be sent to the Houston area, and the San Antonio area would receive 125.
Child welfare authorities have said the children from the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints likely will not go to traditional foster care families, but to larger residential settings so groups of up to 20 siblings can remain together.
Child Protective Services spokesman Darrell Azar refused to say where the children are being sent in order to protect their confidentiality.
"We don't know how long we will have them," Azar said. "We are still conducting DNA tests to determine family relationships. It could take two months to get the results."
He said there are no plans to put the children up for adoption.
Authorities raided the Yearning for Zion Ranch beginning April 3 after receiving an abuse report. State child welfare officials sought custody of all the children, alleging that the sect's practices of marrying underage girls to older men put them at risk.
Seeking donations
While children from the West Texas compound will continue to live in the large family groups they are used to, they will find a different environment in the Houston area from the near-desert where they grew up. Kidz Harbor is in a sprawling, single-level brick and concrete block building at the end of a series of winding Brazoria County roads about two miles from Liverpool.
The six-acre campus has big oak trees shading lush green lawns leading to Chocolate Bayou.
The building was constructed about 30 years ago as a drug rehabilitation hospital. Kidz Harbor was created five years ago by the late Rev. Jim Green, who died in 2004.
The center is now operated by a nonprofit group called Jim Green Kidz Harbor Inc., said administrator Angela Colbert, who is Green's daughter.
The children from the compound will live in two- to four-person rooms in one wing of the facility.
Rooms to Go, a furniture store chain, donated most of the beds the children will use, as well as bedding, Colbert said. The home still needs donations of chests of drawers, towels and other personal items.
The children will be sent to public schools in nearby Alvin. School district spokeswoman Shirley Brothers said the district is asking the Texas Education Agency for direction on any special needs of the children.
She said the district plans to test and assess the educational needs of each of the new arrivals and place them in the school programs they need.
The same process was used for about 150 students who arrived in the district after Hurricane Katrina, Brothers said.
"We're used to getting kids who come from all sorts of situations," said Ollie Russell, administrator of Kidz Harbor's short-term care program. "Many of them come from troubled backgrounds. The first thing we need to do is put them in a stable, loving environment."
He said a few children walk away, mainly from schools, "but not many."
Behind the Arrow Child and Family Ministries green iron gates near Porter in Montgomery County is a forested haven spread over 111 acres. A narrow road winds around to an open green area where the three main living quarters are located.
The buildings resemble log cabins, but inside are the amenities of a modern home - leather furniture, TVs, stainless steel kitchens and lots of bedrooms with single beds. The facility also has four small cabins hidden in the woods. They each have a living area, kitchenette and several bedrooms.
Private and charter schools
Employees have begun sprucing up the place. Mops, buckets, paper towels and other cleaning supplies were piled on the floor of one of the cabins.
The children will have a chance to ride paddle boats in the fishing pond or interact with the nine horses at the facility. There's also a swimming pool and sports pavilion.
The children will not attend public schools while living at the facility, founder Mark Tennant said. They will likely attend private or charter schools, he said.
Boys and Girls Country, near Hockley, about 35 miles northwest of Houston, can accommodate up to 88 children in 11 eight-person cottages, said director Shirley Wright. The children live with house-parents and attend public schools.
"We are a place for children to grow up when their families can't take care of them," she said.
"They live with us usually between two years to all the way through college," Wright said.
CPS has cited the facility a number of times, once for failing to promptly report sexual abuse.
The cost of housing the children isn't being released, Azar said, but it is being paid for with federal money the state receives. He said the state pays group homes from $38.59 to $227 a day for each child, depending upon their needs.
Since there are already 17,500 children in the state foster care program, he said, "this won't break the bank."
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I hadn't read that article. The state of TX really has gone too far now. By sending these children, especially the ones over the age of six, to a school outside their own system, either public or private, is wrong. They have been raised by generations of extreme modesty in dress and lifestyle. They will no doubt be behind their peers in education and awareness of the world around them. Their dress, speech (they have a particular speech pattern) will set them vastly apart. How do the authorities in TX expect to keep them anonymous in a school with other children? Children talk to their parents .... they will be subjected to more scrutiny.
So what if that facility has a swimming pool. These children don't wear swimming suits. They have been taught to stay covered from head to toe.
So, they're going to see a few trees now. Whoopee. The compound in TX has only been in existence since about 2004. All the children older than 3 or 4 have come from UT, where they do indeed have trees and streams, and even horses. Just no swimming pools.
Again ... Where are the men ... cowards, hiding behind their prophet and the women. And who suffers .... we know the answer.
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I think alledged inbreeding in the polygamist sect should NOT be compared to Ashkanazi Jews.
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Rocktobermom....I had a feeling that was your school pic! Too cute.
Again...it is so sad what these children have to be put through. The cowards (men) are the reason all of this is happening..and where are they?
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Marissa,
I agree with you. The differences are vast. The polygamists in UT and those that migrated from the two towns there to TX, are a very small population and the inter-marriage there is very convoluted within a select few families over last 140 years. The reasons are obvious ... very few men marrying many, many women from the same families, their son's marrying from the same pool of women's children. When it all shakes down, you'll find there are probably only about 3 last names for all of them, including the sister-wives, who aren't even legally married to their husbands.
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Does anybody ever watch the tv show "Numbers"? It had a program last year (or the year before, I watch reruns if I haven't seen them before) about a town like this. On the show they charted the families, the tree, and it showed all the inbreeding involved.
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After reading the book ESCAPE, this is from another who was directly involved...
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Now, my3girls, there is my daughter in the avatar. I wish I could post them side by side but I can't do that from this computer.
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Wow...you do look alike!! I have 3 daughters and not one of them look that much like me!
Lisa
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RM, you do look like her...or, uh, she looks like you! She's already purtty, but we know who she's gonna grow up and look like. You better not let her date until she's 20 or 30!
Shirley
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And, on top of it, she is just as lovely inside .... One of her friend's mom said, "I'm sure you see the wings she has when she takes a bath, we all just haven't seen 'em yet." She is kind, thoughtful and grateful for all we have ... she always tells God how thankful she is that "Mommy is better from chemo" ...
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That story by Naomi is powerful. If I lived near there, I'd want to help them ... is there any danger for the families that do take in these children? Would the fathers try to get them back by force?
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