Presidential debates on ABC right now-both parties

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  • sccruiser
    sccruiser Member Posts: 1,119
    edited April 2008

    Well, with Bill and the strategist Hillary fired, going off to work a trade deal with Columbia, that she's against--I just think we'll see more of that if she were to be elected president. he's not going to go quietly on the road again--he roars you know!! LOL



    I think she'll have her hands full trying to keep him in line. And if he has any special clearances at all, perhaps he should have a cabinet post so she can keep a real close eye on him! There's a lot of talk out here in the West about a twofer, and it's not very positive!



    We'll be electing or voting on our Obama delegates this Sunday. They are doing the caucus during the day, so hopefully there will be a good turnout. There isn't really any campaign office in our county, and most of the work is done grassroots, using online phone banks to make calls. Some people even bring their cell phones to the cite to do their calling. I can't afford to participate in that, as we had to go to pay as you go phones just so we could have a cell phone. Can't afford any of the monthly fees.



    Guess we all cut back where we can. Right now, I'm so angry about this oil business. I just paid over 50 bucks to fill my little old car. It costs $3.73 a gallon right now at the cheap stations--and the shell, union 76 and others are almost $4./gallon for unleaded (87) the cheapest gas. I see these hummers and beemers filling up on the highest octane and wonder for how long they will be able to afford it.

    It sucks to live in California when it comes to gas. We end up paying the most.



    Wonder if it will continue to rise up until the election. That might make some people not want to vote republican. Although I guess those with gas/oil stock and getting those great dividends are happy, they'll probably continue to vote republican.



    And so the rich get richer, and the poor get poorer. Seems the middle class is on the way out!

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    We could lower those oil prices whenever we want.  We have about 40 years worth here in the States from what I'm hearing.  What are we waiting for?  We could put Arabia out of business if we choose to.  We'd glut the market.  I say we keep it all for ourselves. 

  • sccruiser
    sccruiser Member Posts: 1,119
    edited April 2008

    Latest I heard on CNN (last Friday--I had a busy weekend w/family and granddaughter--love that baby!) when Bush assumed presidency, he had a trust set up for his assets that would be considered conflict of interest, that evidently includes oil being stored in the Gulf of Mexico. He has ordered a one day world supply of oil to be stored every day, and has been asked by Congress to stop doing this, as it continues to drive up the price of gas for Americans. i don't know if he stopped or not, but CNN said when he goes out of office, he will get a substantial amount of money put into his trust for the sale of the oil. I'm sure he had Cheney set this up for him--look at what he will gain when he leaves office and collects his interest in Halliburton that has been held in trust for him.



    I just don't trust any of these political leaders anymore. And I don't care how hard McCain tries to distance himself from Bush, he still smells like a Bush third term.



    Waiting for all the stupid stuff that isn't very important--like bitter remarks--and attacks on opponents--for the candidates to get to the issues we care about and help us decide who to vote for.

    The time of change has come--think we need to start from the bottom up--get rid of that old school politics and vote out the Senators and House of Rep members who are in bed with the lobbyists. It's time to "re-vision" our government and KEEP the middle class!

  • ijl
    ijl Member Posts: 897
    edited April 2008

    Grace,

    Forgive me but I find it hard to beleive that Bush and Cheney are trying to make more money while in White house, they could have done much  better job outside of it. For people like him it is about power. He always said that he wanted to have reserves in case of a crisis. Imagine for a second that something were to happen and we are cut off from our supplies as the result of terrorist acts or government overthrow in our supplier countries. We will not be able to have enough oil for any money then.

    When you budget for a family, you need to put money for the rainy day no matter how hard is it to sacrifice today. This is a prudent thing to do.

    One thing we can do about oil prices is to remove tax component from them and build more refineries. We haven't added any siginificant number of refineries in the past few decades. It will not help NOW, but it will help LATER.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited April 2008

    I believe most of the bickering is coming from Obama and Hillary.

    Shirley

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited April 2008
  • sccruiser
    sccruiser Member Posts: 1,119
    edited April 2008

    I don't find it hard to believe at all. Cheney's trust--which includes his shares in Halliburton--is making him a mint of money. It was all talked about on the news. I believe it's true. Bush is making more than enough money with this under the table deal--he isn't holding the oil for a rainy day in America. No siree--he's holding 1% of the oil that would be used by the world in one day. If he was a altruistic as you think he is, or want to believe he is, he would have worked harder on the environment, not let so many of our jobs go overseas, watched what is imported from other countries, like China, and made sure it meets American standards, gone greener with housing and found a way to fund transportation that doesn't require the huge glut of oil we are so used to having at a cheap price in this country. This president could have solved world hunger with the amount of money we have gone into hock for Bush's Folly of War.



    And when he gets out of office, it is likely that not only will he have made millions off of holding this oil in reserve, he will be making millions of dollars going and giving speeches that he probably will never write, and a book he will never write--it will require a ghost writer, and our taxes will pay for his nice salary for the rest of his life, plus all the perks--and for what--to be found the worst president this country has ever had.



    So, he didn't do any of this, nor anything in the future because he cares about the american people. He and Cheney have both shown that they don't give a fig about what we think, believe, or how we expect our government officials to behave and listen to us. They are arrogant and elitist. There are a lot of people in this country who are bitter, and well they should be. We've had 8 years of a dictatorship, and a Congress that's afraid to act responsibly. We have had our own story in this country and the title is--dah dah--THE EMPEROR'S NEW CLOTHES

  • ijl
    ijl Member Posts: 897
    edited April 2008

    Grace,

    Perhaps Bush can also make even more money selling pardons like his predecessor :) Although he might not do as well with speeches as Clinton as he is not as eloquent :) The book should be OK , Clinton's ghost writer is probably available for hire.

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    Shirley,

    I think that gaffe will follow Obama all the way to November if he still gets that far.  We'll see next Tuesday if the people really care or not.  The Mayor of Scanton was talking on a TV show yesterday, and he called those words from Obama a real slap to the voters of Pennsylvania.  All eyes are on PA.

  • NoH8
    NoH8 Member Posts: 2,726
    edited April 2008

    I agree that most of the bickering is coming from the democratic side, Shirley,and it all starts with Hillary and the Clinton campaign Machine. If you look back on the individual punches, most of them have come from Clinton and her supporters - one of the main reasons I said from the beginning that she will never be president of the united states. She's too much of a divider and has been since her white house days when she coined the phrase "republican attack machine". There are so many times when Obama has risen above the conflict and ignored chances to take swipes at Hillary-- like going after her honesty about Bosnia and other misstatements/lies.

  • saluki
    saluki Member Posts: 2,287
    edited April 2008

    The Mayor of Scanton was talking on a TV show yesterday, and he called those words from Obama a real slap to the voters of Pennsylvania.  All eyes are on PA.

    Rosemary--The very next day The Scranton Times endorsed Obama--.

  • NoH8
    NoH8 Member Posts: 2,726
    edited April 2008
  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    And today, Hillary is leading 50% to 41% in PA, that's the news that counts.  Maybe mayor's have more pull with voters.

    http://www.rasmussenreports.com/

    Amy, that was absolutely perfect.  LOL.  One icon can say a thousand words. Very funny.

  • Beesie
    Beesie Member Posts: 12,240
    edited April 2008

    "I think that gaffe will follow Obama all the way to November if he still gets that far."  I agree.  The Republicans won't let it go, nor should they.  Over the years, the Republican machine has successfully attacked Democratic candidates with a lot less in terms of "real" ammunition.  They much be estatic.

    From today's New York Post:  http://www.nypost.com/seven/04152008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/bitter_blunder_106636.htm?page=0

    "....After the likes of Al Gore and John Kerry, Republicans had to be wondering, "Could Democrats possibly nominate yet another candidate easily portrayed as an out-of-touch elitist?" With Obama, Democrats appear to be responding with a resounding "Yes, we can!"

    Obama brings a special measure of arrogance to the standard liberal critique of Middle America. His candidacy has always been characterized by two paradoxes. How can he be so hopeful at the same time he and his wife, Michelle, portray America as a sink-pit of despair? And how can he claim to be a uniter when he's an orthodox liberal who has risked little or nothing for bipartisan outreach?

    Now, we know. Obama defines hopefulness as liberalism, specifically liberalism as embodied by himself. Only with Obama's election will America be redeemed from its harrowing false consciousness. We will be unified, not by Obama reaching out to conservatives to hammer out compromises, but by conservatives shedding their bitterness and becoming Obama liberals.

    This is the underside of hope: arrogance fading into a secular messianism based on the fallenness of everyone who disagrees with Barack Obama. And it's small-town voters who are deluded?"

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    Barack has a new ad out in PA, it is showing a man asking a question something like: is Hillary's attention to his eliteism remarks sound more like she's saying you are uppity?  Then Barack answers, no this is not about race. 

    This is the best to date.  If he's above injecting race issues into the campaign himself, why does he have an ad with this man asking that type of question?  He's polarizing us and I think it's sad.

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited April 2008

    What station are the debates on tonight?



  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited April 2008

    Oh, and I really do not believe Obama's gaffe will hurt him one bit. Obama lovers are Obama lovers. I don't care if it was proven that he robbed a band five years ago..they'd forgive him.

    Shirley

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    Shirley,

    I'm going to try CNN or Fox or MSNBC,  one of them should have it.  I don't know the time it will be on.  I'll start looking early. 

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    Shirley,

    It's funny that you say that.  My sister was at a luncheon yesterday and the talk got around to Obama, and she said, oh good your following his campaign, tell me about his health care program.   No reply.  His immigration policy?  Nothing.  She asked, you aren't voting on the issues?  She said she just went back to eating her lunch. It's a good chuckle, people can't tell you why they're voting for him, just some abstracts about change, or whatever.

  • saluki
    saluki Member Posts: 2,287
    edited April 2008

    Shirley and Rosemary and anyone else who is interested.

    Debates are on ABC tonight 8:00PM

  • sccruiser
    sccruiser Member Posts: 1,119
    edited April 2008

    And on CNN The Cafferty file, there were emails posted from PA about Obama's bitter comment, and many said he was right on. That PA people are bitter and don't feel that they have been listened to; and that faith, guns are two ways they can feel secure and have something that comforts them.



    You can go to the blog on CNN and look at the emails. He posts a different question everyday.



    I saw the polls yesterday, and Hillary is only 5 points ahead of Barack in the polls. So, who knows. Doesn't look like she has gained a lot from her negative campaign shift. She might just shoot herself in the foot. LOL



    And McCain might want to stay out of it, except that he's not getting much press, so maybe he figures he'll get more this way.



    I don't believe his gaffe will make much difference in the PA primary, as I think many voters have already decided who they are voting for. And I certainly believe that there will be more important issues to discuss in this election campaign other than the definition of bitter and better. Hillary better be careful--I agree with Amy, she is going to turn people off with her divisiveness.

  • saluki
    saluki Member Posts: 2,287
    edited April 2008

    I don't know how often they are playing this commercial since I turned off the TV because frankly I have been sick of all the political commercials. I'll be very happy when the Pa Primary is over.



    I decided to put this up because I was wondering if anyone else besides me found something creepy about it?



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AO_TfQ6hiXk






    http://www.politicstv.com/blog/?p=3888
    One of the two links should work --maybe the bottom

    Don't know whats happening with bc.org website but I've had major problems connecting for the last two days--and no tool bars

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    Susie,I watched the ad, no it didn't creep me out.  When you talk about tool bars, what do you mean exactly?  I've never had tool bars here, Shirley said something about a spell check? 

  • saluki
    saluki Member Posts: 2,287
    edited April 2008

    I'm talking about the bar that controls bold and italics---Its missing.

    I found the ad very cult like.

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    I see the toolbar now.  I should wear glasses.  Watched the ad twice now, not a problem.

    Rosemary

    Change, Hope, Obama

  • saluki
    saluki Member Posts: 2,287
    edited April 2008

    I'm on political commercial overload--- Change Hope Obama --Let's go change the world?

  • Rosemary44
    Rosemary44 Member Posts: 2,660
    edited April 2008

    Y-E-S,  We should behave, He has a vision for this world, Change, Hope, Obama

  • djd
    djd Member Posts: 866
    edited April 2008

    I was undecided about Obama until the last few weeks.  And I don't think Hillary would be a bad president at all.   But now, I am an Obama supporter.

    He is educated, thoughtful, well-spoken, intelligent and likeable.  He wants to get us out of Iraq.  He addressed the Wright issue with courage and forth-right honesty.

    As for the bitter comment - I think the MSM believes this was a big gaffe because they are so friggin out of touch with middle class Americans.  We ARE bitter, and when I can't see any hope from our government, I do turn to God (not guns though).

    Obama may not be the best president ever, but I don't think he'll be as reckless, hard-headed, willfully ignorant and universally despised as Bush.

    edited to add:  Remember, the reason people elected Bush was because he was supposedly someone they would like to have a beer with!  Voting for Obama because he is intelligent and well-spoken sounds like a better reason, even if one thinks he's an empty suit.

  • sccruiser
    sccruiser Member Posts: 1,119
    edited April 2008

    Well said Donna.

    You are right. At least we can be sure Barack can pronounce all the words in his speech and know what they mean! After 8 years, it's time to have a president that can write and speak well.



    Gosh, there is a book out there somewhere with all the Bushisms in it I believe. Stood in the bookstore one day and just chuckled. It's amazing how many gaffes he committed in his 8 years. Certainly more than any of the candidates running in this election.



    Time to get to the issues, and forget the other nonsense.



    Even those of us not having to worry about finding a job or losing a job are bitter. This adminstration has been totally out of touch with the American people.



    We had 8 years of an empty suit--and he couldn't even talk well. I'm sure his advisors cringed every time he spoke without a prepared speech. No one knew exactly what he was going to say!

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Member Posts: 1,376
    edited April 2008

    Grace, you really do hate Bush, right?

    Susie, I felt the same way you felt about that commercial.  All the people rushing into the auditorium, etc.  Weird!

    Sometimes I wish that Obama would become prez just so we could see just how doggone bad he would be.  But that scares me too.  I find him to be dishonest.  He says he didn't hear the minister say the things he said.  Then in his speech he said yes he heard him.  Or was he aware of his words.  I'll have to read the speech.  And then I believe he said that he would have to leave the church if the minister was not retiring, but could not distance himself from him...like an uncle.  He'd leave the church, but not disavow the man who was his spiritual guide?  Spiritual guide?  That says a lot...but wouldn't let him be on the same "stage" when he announced his bid for the presidency because his minister was too controversial?

    I know this is old news.  But I still find it hard to believe that Obama was being truthful.  I don't trust him.

    Shirley

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