The Brand New Respectful Presidential Campaign Thread

I'm not sure why anneshirley changed her name but I understand that she's left the board.

nosey1, interesting that you would ask, since you just joined BC.org today and this is your first and only post.  Have you been following this thread anonymously?   Tell us more.... inquiring minds want to know.

Me three, Amy and Beesie.

That might work if the boss is the new one who comes in--the people under him may try to get along with him/her, but if they aren't well received by the boss--he's got the power. And I've seen cases where the boss easily built a case against the employee, and got them fired. It often happens when the new boss wants to bring in his own crew. So if management finds profit more important then working relationships, the little guy doesn't stand a chance.



We always have to look at where the power resides. The prez would have the power and the vp would just have to go along. Perhaps that's why Obama is so opposed to being the VP--he would be "under Hillary's thumb," and I'm sure kept quite quiet for 4 years.



grace

Obama would be insane to hitch his political career to the Clintons...............he is young and has a long career but to be assoicated with the Clintons would be political suicide....in mho.........Shokk

I am curious Grace, how is it that you know these vets are unable to access the care they need? And the V.A. does a good job of taking care of vets and their families when the vet follows through and stays with the program, I KNOW this for a fact. So I am curious how you know the vets in CA. (I am assuming that is where you live) are out of the loop. Do you know all these homeless vets personally?

Well, if the war isn't over oil, then why haven't we gone into some of the needy areas of Africa where there have been terrible civil wars and holocausts of whole populations of people? Tells me this current administration is more interest in oil.



and why is it so expensive? because people are willing to pay any price at the pump for gas and the ability to drive their large SUVs anytime they want. I see huge SUVs on the road everyday--large enough to hold a soccer team, being driven by one sole driver, and narry a passenger in sight.



Mmmm--sure the oil is over $110. a barrel, as the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The wealthy probably own many shares of stock in gas companies and are making buckos off of this ridiculous war. As long as the shareholders get their money, and the gas companies can still make billions in profit in ONE quarter, there will be some type of warring presence in the Middle East. It's in the best interests of the oil companies--protecting their fuel--and the wealthy shareholders.



Let's face it. Money talks.

Grace says:

"Living here on the Central Coast, we have many Vietnam Vets who are homeless and desperately needing medical care. They are unable to access vet care, because they are either not severely disabled enough, or have never been determined as to their disability. They continue to live on the fringe and are homeless and self-medicating with drugs and alcohol. After our brave young soldiers have served in Iraq and Afghanistan, I hope we honor their bravery and giving up of their bodies to the fodder of the war machiine, and provide for them all that they need to be healed as much as we can."

And I say WHAT!?  My father had no disability.  He got care at the VA hospitals.  We have friends who have no disability, but get care at the VA hospitals.  My dh has never signed up, but if he does he can get care.

The vets do not want care.  I'm sorry, but there are some who would rather remain homeless and drink and do drugs.  Yes, they need mental health care.  And they don't want to go into rehap to kick their habit.

I'm not saying that all vets are treated well.  I'm not saying the VA hospitals are perfect.  But there is help for them if they want it and there's also room for improvement of the system.

Shirley 

Inna,

I disagree with you. I still say it's all about the OIL! The only African nation we have attempted to help with troops is Liberia, a country where US citizens decided to return to and start their own country.



We have allowed millions of people in African nations be slaughtered and stood by and done nothing. Of course, you or anyone can say that what am I talking about. Maybe we didn't go into Africa, but we went into Bosnia, etc. Well, the proximity of Bosnia to the Middle East can be very telling. We are going to do everything we can to keep the glut of oil coming to this country. And the cost will continue to rise, as our consumption continues to rise. More and more countries are moving out of their "third world" designation. They are driving more cars, have more technology, and need oil to provide their power and fuel their power plants. As the use of oil increases around the world, the cost of oil will continue to rise.



The American car companies could have done a lot by now to reduce our reliance on oil. They have stalled and played the waiting game. The oil companies have reaped the largest profits ever in the history of this nation. And we are paying for it. At the pump and every time we go to the grocery store. The price of foods that need to be trucked from one side of the nation to the other is continuing to jump up in price. So, we, the large group in the middle, and the poor get poked all over. Most of us aren't getting revenues from stocks. Most of us aren't driving those gas-guzzling soccer team sized SUVs and writing them off on our taxes as a business expense, and most of us are not getting write-offs of taxes from the federal government. We pay our fair share of taxes. The wealthy and the businesses in this country don't.



Shirley,

The services your father and my father received at the Vet Hospital did not require a disability. After the Vietnam War, the Vet Hospitals were understaffed and had too many patients to serve. The Vet Hospitals (or Federal Govt if you want to be particular) were told to assign a number to each Vet who came to the hospital for service. In fact, the armed services ended up identifying who would receive service at their Vet hospital. The more disabled you were, the sooner you were seen. Your father may not have had to have a disability then, I don't know his case obviously. But I'm not talking about 1 man, I'm talking about a large group of men. I am not applying the case of one man to all men.



I don't know if you realize it, but all the time this war in Iraq has been going on, Bush wanted to reduce the amt of money for Vets Hospitals and suggested that they continue to serve less and less patients--only the most severely disabled were to get service.



Absolutely there is room for improvement in the system. We have treated our Vietnam Vets horribly. These men came back physically and emotionally damaged from that war, and then we didn't even give them the respect they should have gotten when they came home. They were treated not like heroes but like they were criminals. These men did what the government required them to do. They did not have a choice, they had to follow orders, unless they killed their commanding officer one night in the dark.



Americans have shunned them. and now we expect them to walk meekly into a hospital and ask for care? These homeless vets may use drugs and drink. They are doing exactly what others do who don't get help for their problems--self-medicating.



We see the Hollywood stars doing the same thing. Oh, but they have the money to pay privately for their rehab. Who's going to foot the bill for the Vets?



And there isn't room for them if they want it. We can't even adequately take care of the soldiers injured in Iraq now. The system is broke. It's time for a change.



And I do support the troops in Iraq, if you might question my politics. I have a bumper sticker on my car that says: Support Our Troops Bring Them Home Now

and it will stay on my car until all the troops are safely back on US soil.



grace

Wow pompous rhetoric--must have really hit a nerve. Perhaps I should simplify my support of our troops: that is not the only thing I do, and I don't have to justify what I do or don't do to anyone on this thread. I am not wrong about the VA. I have seen the papers, and read the awful conditions our soldiers were in. It was only because it was brought to light that our Iraq vets have since gotten the treatment they deserve.



You don't like what I write on the board, so instead of having an intellectual discussion you call me "pompous," and that I'm trying to tell you what to do. That is so wrong!



You don't have to attack me, you can express your own opinions on this site without personally attacking people because you disagree with them. This isn't about you or me, this is about our country which as I can see from this thread and the other presidential thread is in serious trouble. People are more concerned about making sure their point of view prevails by making attacks "below the belt."



I have never said I am right, or anyone else is wrong. If you could calm down and read my posts you would realize that I am just offering my own experiences to this board. I have not invalidated one other person's experience on this board. I just disagree to how the experiences are applied.



I am not here to change anyone, just offering a different point of view. I hope we can all be adults and stick to the issues, and drop the personal attacks. That's why this RESPECTFUL thread was established.



Sorry if I offend you, but I'm not going away.



Oh, and who are these cronies? Nice description--personal again! I don't even agree with my supposed cronies--and by the way--they have their own opinions--they haven't adopted mine! sorry to disappoint you, but there's no conspiracy here. LOL

Grace, you do not in any way shape or form offend me, I actually find you amusing! You do exactly what you accuse others of doing! You generalize. Also, I did not attack you, I called your rhetoric pompous, now if I had called you pompous, that might be attacking! Also, calling your supporters "cronies" could actually be a compliment. As I am sure you are aware, a crone is a "wise woman, elder", it's one of those words that can be used to denote a lot of things!

Your bumper sticker does not support the troops, it supports YOUR view of the war and what YOU think the troops need. Did you ever ask the troops if they want to come home? If not, being the supportive person you are, perhaps you should ask the troops if they want to come home before you use that bumper sticker. Otherwise you are generalizing again!

I asked you earlier if you knew these homeless vets you see all over the place personally. No answer! Don't you think YOU might be generalizing where this group is concerned? If you have not personally spoken to them, how can you possibly know their situation? Isn't that making assumptions about that group? I bet if you talked to them you might find out most of them receive benefits and that is how they pay for their drugs and alchohol, interesting hunh? 

And Grace, when you say this isn't about you and me, this is about our country, well guess what? You and me (I know it is supposed to be you and I) are our country as well as millions of others! So...nice try! 

I am not into conspiracy theories, nice touch though!