Is anyone else an atheist with BC besides me?

magiclight, the audience for my articles is people with breast cancer, either undergoing active treatment or post treatment. If anyone is familiar with the Facebook page "Beyond the Pink Moon" you'll understand my audience: https://www.facebook.com/groups/BeyondthePinkMoon/ There's lots of religious folk who will pray for other here. Christianity is quite a thing with this group. I just want to put the perspective on this topic from the point of view of atheists. The working title is: "Thanks for your offer of prayer, but I'm fine."

Traveltext

This might be handy.

AliceBastable,

Those trees are incredible. Thanks for posting the pictures. Right now my god of choice is gravity, that mysterious force that created matter and keeps it in motion. If I wasn't so attracted to gravity, it would be trees that I worship, those entities that provide us with the very air we breathe. Who needs gods when one has gravity and trees?

Traveltext,

Like Alice, I just faded from religious upbringing into non belief. The final gentle push came from reading the bible. I read it cover to cover and came away knowing I was an atheist. This seems to be a common experience among atheists.

Like Wren44 I have had experience studying Buddhism that lovely atheist philosophy but studied a tradition called Theravada. The meditation that Wren mentioned, called Metta in Theravada, is what helped me through diagnosis, treatment, and fear of recurrence. Metta is a meditation that wishes goodness to oneself, one's loved ones and slowly encompasses all of life. This type of meditation calms the mind.

I am not really atheist. I am an agnostic that leans towards atheism. I kind of have trouble with definitive(s). I kind of raise an eyebrow when someone says "god exists" or something like "there are no god(s)". I like the thought of a god, it is really an interesting concept. When you start looking a bit deeper there are some flaws in that logic. I was raised christian and I once had a pastor say "what is true for us (congregation) must be true for a single mother in Africa". I don't remember the context of the point that he was using that statement in, but it started my slow change towards disbelief.

I am a father and I love my kids tremendously. One of my worst fears in life is getting Alzheimer or dementia because of the burden I would be to them. This father god concept is troubling. If my daughters god-forbid got cancer I would do anything to make that cancer go away. I have a hard time wrapping my brain around a loving-omniscient-omnipotent father that allows such pain, unfairness, and misery...because of freewill.

Yet here we are with so many daughters on a forum such as this with so much pain and unfairness. I don't even know any of you, and if I could wave a magic wand and take away your pain and make you better I would do it, and I am 100% confident all of you would do the same for me or my loved ones.

That being said I have no issue with theists. Theism gives hope and if used correctly can show some of the best of humanity. There is nothing wrong with repackaging hope and labeling it faith. I am adamantly opposed to anyone that would use their beliefs or even non-belief to harm others. I don't even have an issue with proselytizing. It is good for people to have a variety of experiences and be exposed to cultures and different ways of thinking. The desert, mountains, and valleys can all be beautiful it is just that I choose not to live in a desert or on a mountain. People's faith can be just as beautiful and even inspiring. Who am I to try and take that away from them?

At the end of the day I hope the kind and loving theists are correct. I hope they find their god(s). I hope they get the full rewards of their faith. I came from silence and if I am returned to silence simply because I did not jump onto the faith boat then so be it. I am ok with the peace that finality brings. If I am doomed to some ridiculous eternal punishment then all I can say is that my god-given life prepared me for that eternal misery.

Meanwhile, in whatever time remains I can work towards leaving something behind. Maybe it is the love for my family, maybe it is just making this world the tiniest bit better. Whatever it something insignificant yet maybe important to someone will survive me.

I will call out militant atheists. I envy faith and I have no problem locking horns so to speak with militant atheists.

Let everyone have whatever peace that they can find and that which comforts them. Whether we believe or not we are all in this together.

I'm also interested in these stories we're sharing about how we arrived at our current position/belief/doubt about theism.

I grew up in an Episcopal church where the language (KJV Bible, 1928 or so prayers and liturgy) was poetic and mesmerizing. All the Biblical interpretations and lessons were interpreted metaphorically, which was quite attractive.

When I started to learn more science (astronomy, evolutionary biology, physics) and also philosophy, history, anthropology and sociology, my critical thinking just could not reconcile a belief in something so unprovable. I have a whole framework of morality and ethics without the extra helping of hypocrisy. Intellectual curiosity and Secular Humanism work very well for me.

I can’t be too militant. I work for a religious non profit

Traveltext,

Though I am an atheist, I am willing to let people pray for me if they want to… as most of my friends are non-believers, it's a rare event. My evangelical cousin (a family outlier) is one who can't help himself.... When I told him that got a pCR he went into a big prayer over the phone. It was completely sincere and full of thanks for my wellness, and while I had an eyeroll feeling, it did not bother me, because it felt genuine and sweet. That's his belief system, and he cares about me, and it's what he does with his worry or his thankfulness: talks to God. I find the prayer/God part completely silly but not the sentiment of love, or wanting to give thanks for the wellbeing of another person, which is kind/ meaningful. I basically consider the intent and don't get bent out of shape.

My resilience in the face of cancer comes from a few sources. First, I do not fear death. I'm pretty sure it's a lot like being in a deep, dreamless sleep— one of my favorite activities. My kids are grown (youngest is 21) and we have strong relationships and they are well launched. My loose threads are basically tied up and I don't have any big guilts or regrets. I am sure I would have a lot more fear if my kids were small. I lost a brother in childhood so there is a part of me that knows I got a long life compared to his, and so I feel lucky anyway.

The one large grief I had was thinking of never getting to be a grandmother-- a role I feel I was born for! That really feels like the worst part of possibly dying early. One of my younger friends is currently a stay home mom to a three year old and a one year old. I had been helping out once a week with them for a few months when I got my diagnosis. All during chemo I continued to go over once per week and rock the baby, and play with the three year old… It was peaceful, not taxing but in fact joyful and replenishing... babies don't give a hoot if you are bald, and this is a beautiful chance to experience a facsimile of grandmotherhood right now, in case.

I have incredibly wonderful, devoted friends who have made my life rich and full. I have peace and contentment, and feel lucky to have had the life i've already had, whatever happens.

My closest friend is a devout Catholic. Whenever she tells me she will pray for me I always smile and say thank you. She comes from a place of sincerity, generosity and love. She isn't passing judgment. We have Lively discussion on religion. Yet we never become angry or frustrated with one another because both of us always come from a position of respect.

I can bite my tongue and ignore anyone who prays FOR me. But if someone started to pray AT me, I'd be pissed and let them know. That's taking advantage of a person's illness to selfishly shove your religion down their throats.

Does anyone here read Terry Pratchett? He was an atheist, but wrote brilliantly on the subject of personal religion - and big nasty religion - in his Discworld novels.

TravelText - I have no problem with death. And I am not afraid. If I simply disintegrate back to nature, or move into another world (parallel or in the clouds) or am reincarnated - all would be fine with me. (although I'd just as soon not come back as an ant)

My only fear is a lingering, painful transition. My Mother was basically a vegetable for 12 years, plugged into 3 different sockets. Since my Dad (at age 85) insisted on keeping her at home & being her major care giver, the toll on him and the rest of the family was devastating. She would have been horrified, so I'm grateful she didn't know. Needless to say my son saw all this as an adult and is aware that I don't want to be plugged in under any circumstances. Unfortunately I don't live in a state that might honor death with dignity.

Like Santabarbarian - My life has been good. I would have liked to have been a grandmother. My only son is 49 and they decided many years ago not to have any children. While I'd like to spend more time with them, we don't live in the same part of the country and only see each other a couple of times a year. I am satisfied that he's grown into a life he likes and is mostly happy with his choices.

Related to my cancer diagnoses - the first time I was in a hurry to "get it out" and get on with my life. It never occurred to me to think about death. With the recurrence two years later it was more of a slog, and particularly annoying since my MO recommended 'immediate' treatment due to HER2+ status. That meant I had to cancel two weeks in NYC with my BFF and four Broadway shows. Even more I had to cancel a cruise to Alaska with my son. Both were opportunities that can not be resurrected. Oh well. It was a long day-to-day slog with lots of yucky side effects - some permanent. I got through it, but will likely not choose to have chemo again should I have another recurrence. In spite of no pCR and other circumstances, I really didn't ponder death. Just quality of life.

This thread feels like such a good place to discuss these huge issues.

As for what we go through--MinusTwo, you nailed it. Everyone who's faced a serious DX and difficult TX has given up things, and the losses are huge. I also had to cancel longtime plans for very wonderful fun experiences I couldn't do because of TX. We survivors also now live with more fear of the unknown, depending on our DX. So, we've given up some peace of mind about our futures.

I do have a long list of things I still want to do in my life, so I will be rather irked if my time is up soon. Grrrr.

However, I don't have much fear about how my end of life will be. My husband has a long career as a hospice nurse, and now he's a manager of nurses and social workers and chaplains and aides, for a large hospice. I have good faith in our hospice system, which didn't exist in this form 30 years ago. Hospice can make the end of life be comfortable; this was the case for both of my parents' end of life. DH says that almost never does Death With Dignity even come up, although we do have it in Oregon. Instead, good care with hospice coming in soon enough can really make almost any end of life comfortable.

DH and I also saw Book of Mormon. Perfect! Barbara Kingsolver's novel, The Poisonwood Bible, points out how disrespectful it is to not just let people be. Let others do religion and culture THEIR way! For instance, American missionaries try to grow American vegetables in Africa, where the climate is very different; it's a not-so-subtle metaphor about imposing one's cultural values on other people. The imported vegetables fail, of course!

I had a recent PET scan as a follow-up to a nephrectomy last September. Clear, but then I had to look forward to a cardiovascular surgeon visit because the same lumpectomy pre-op scan last year that showed the kidney cancer also showed an aortic aneurysm. This was my first appointment for this issue, thanks to my dumbfuck PCP forgetting about it. So, I found out I'm still in the safe observation zone. First thing I told my husband was, "We can plan a vacation this year!" That's when I realized I'd kind of been holding my breath for the last year.

Alice - so glad to hear you are comfortable planning a vacation.

I intend to go to my step-niece's wedding in LA in September and to Hawaii in January with my BFF. Either or both or neither might include a stop to see my son in San Francisco. I'm pretending there won't be at least a set of blood labs & maybe a scan or two in between.

For a counter intuitive book recommendation, try "Gilead" by Marilynne Robinson. It's about a preacher... a beautiful and deeply moving book. If every preacher was like this one, religion would not be such a bummer!