Bottle 'o Tamoxifen

Rah, the pelvic ultrasound is not the most pleasant experience, but it is doable-- and you can walk away and go about whatever you want to do afterwards. Hope you get your results promptly. The waiting for results, at least for me, is one of the most stressful parts of this journey we are on. Best wishes for tomorrow.

vampeyes, not at this point from missing a Tamoxifen pill but yes from missing a blood pressure pill! Interesting thought.

meowmmy65--I found Tamoxifen to be very dehydrating. I spent months battling nausea and dizziness. Once I started drinking lots of water, both issues went away. I did 5 years on Tamoxifen and am now about 6 months off. I find that I still get very nauseated if I don't drink enough water. I'm assuming that this will be my new normal.

I cannot overemphasize the importance of LOTS of liquids! After 3.5 months on Tamoxifen, I' m finally settling on 2.5 to 3 liters of fluids daily to avoid needing a Squatty Potty. Of course the gut slow down from abdominal surgery about a week before starting Tamoxifen complicated things a bit so it has taken somewhat longer to work it all out.

Runor - men naturally have more muscle mass (in shape or not) than women, which in turn has their bodies burning more calories to support the muscle, and hence why they lose weight faster and keep it off easier.

Just another perk to being born with testicles....and they complain about having to shave everyday?

))

Tamoxifen makes my stomach upset and I've been on it for 3 months. Interesting about the body builders ~my reaction, who would want to take this medication that didn't have to, UGH!

Runor - I'll echo Veeder & Shelabela's sentiments....who in the HELL would take tamox on purpose?!!?!!? Oh a ton of folks do! Over the years I've read a few articles like the excellent one you posted, and personally know three fellas in my gym that take tamoxifen. While the articles state that they're taking it alongside of other performance enhancing meds to offset estrogen surges (ergo bigger 'gainz') my experience has been different. Without really knowing A THING about the drug, they simply pop tamox because someone very ripped and bigger than them has said "Dude, if you want bigger pec gainz, take this pill" Very few know about the serious nature of tamox, or the domino effect that takes place, let alone knowing how or why it works to build chest muscles.

Same goes for steroid use, albeit most know about the 'shrinkage' and 'roid' rage' effect. Beyond that, a vast number are staggeringly ignorant of exactly what they're popping....all in the name of lookin' good...stylin' n' profilin'...oy vey! Can they not see that the shrunken pecker kinda sorta cancels out the huge biceps? I've had a few discussions with these gym regs (once they found out I was on it), and was even offered money for my 'stash'. That one floored me. "Sure, let me sell you my CANCER MEDICATION, the $5 profit I make is worth the risk!" Egads the pusher LOL!! Thankfully the fella that offered to buy my tamox seemed to listen to my diplomatic spiel on the 'evils' of tamox, and actually read the info I directed him towards....he's still taking it, but seriously reconsidering and dogging me with constant questions. Crossing fingers he ceases and desists, but I won't hold my breath, some of these guys (and girls) are seriously into their gainz.

I'm not knocking ALL bodybuilders, a large number of them are surprisingly knowledgeable about the 'cause & effect' and wisely avoid the quick fix method with any drug....and a few that I know could literally be pharmacists. The sad fact remains however, that most gyms have needle disposal boxes in the change rooms. They aren't there primarily for the diabetic member's convenience....they were installed in the hopes that the staff wouldn't have to risk picking up, or the members being stuck by the many empty syringes that are left in large daily numbers on the floor, stalls & showers by muscle enhancing drug users . Yeah, I know, puts ya in mind of Kermit the Frog in the Muppet Movie, riding a bike without holding the handlebars, shouting "Look Ma! No brains!"

PS - I keep sayin....squats and lunges = no leg & foot cramps. Permission granted to tell me to FO (not Florida Oranges) )

Meowommy65, no nausea here, but I too started with SEs very quickly. Like Becca, I had frequency and pelvic discomfort, plus a small amount of vag discharge. ... Felt like menstrual cramps or ovulation. I'm 67 and post menopausal! The pain got worse. Called the MO and he scheduled a pelvic and vaginal ultrasound next Tuesday. I had only been on tamoxifen for 5 days when the SEs started. I've been off it for 6 days now and still have some vague achy feeling in my lower pelvic area, a small bit of discharge, and when I have to pee, I really have to pee, no pitting it off.

There have been no meds that I've been able to tolerate. Maybe I'm too much of a wuss, but all the pain really cuts into quality of life.

Here is an update after my doctors appointment today. This is a new Gyne for me, my last one retired so I was a little apprehensive at first but I have to say she is pretty awesome. She listened to what I had been experiencing, and was very aggressive in her treatment plan based on my symptoms, ultrasound, and family history. The ultrasound showed a submucosal fibroid in the uterus, which she is concerned about based on my thickened lining of the uterus. At some point in time that will need to be removed. I also have two complex cysts which are still symptomatic, also still running a fever which baffled her. So here is the path of treatment that we will follow. First she ordered an Ovarian Malignancy Risk Test (ROMA) not the C-125 but a more comprehensive risk assessment for ovarian cancer. I have an appointment with an oncology gynecologist on 10/17. If the roma test comes back elevated then there is a higher likelihood of ovarian cancer. At that point both doctors will determine the official course of treatment, ovary removal, cyst removal, fibroid removal, or full hysterectomy. It seems like there is always something going on, I can't wait for the day when I am completely healthy! The healthy me seems like a distant memory now....

Jada

Random thoughts, you can all tell me if I'm bonkers. Follow along ... Tamox makes you pee, it makes you sweat (hot flashes) this results in dehydration which contributes to constipation, which contributes to gut pain. Dehydration is a contributing factor in leg cramps (or so I have been told). Perhaps Egads, being in the gym, sweating, has trained herself to drink more water than the rest of us. Or maybe Florida Orange juice?! So perhaps what she thinks is cramp relief through stretching, is actually cramp relief through better hydration (cause she has that gym bottle of water with her?).

And now to shoot a hole in my own theory, I drink coffee. LOTS of coffee. LOVE my coffee. Coffee is mostly water. I do not agree at all with the belief that only WATER that goes in as water can be utilized by our bodies. Our bodies are designed to wrestle out the water or nutrients from everything that goes in our mouth. That is the entire point of our bodies!! That and to look horrible in a bikini, but that's another story... So my body is fully capable of separating out the H2O that I consume, I should be well hydrated, and yet I get KILLER leg cramps that hurt like an SOB for days after and threaten, constantly, to go off again!

So is it water? Or is it exercise that helps leg cramps.

In conclusion, my theory is stupid. I am leaving now.

Runor - Don't ya be running anywhere lol. Your theory is very well thought out and intelligent....not stupid. I mean if we don't stop to question and poke issues with a stick, we'll never get anywhere. Maybe you have a point. Maybe it is the water/coffee/or the OJ (lol). Dehydration is a def cause of cramping. I gulp down approx. 2-3 8oz bottles of water in the gym.....any more and I get nauseous. Outside the gym I consume 2-3 more glasses...not always 8 oz. I'm a coffee lover too (cheers!) so that adds to the liquid intake.

Here is the thing (for me), when I take an occasional break from the gym (can be as long as 2 weeks) I up my water intake to compensate for what I drink at the gym......add to that the coffee and overall I'm consuming the same amount of water and not losing to gym sweat. The HORRIFIC, mind blowing, Linda Blair Exorcist, feet involuntarily twisting into pretzel shape cramps return within 2-3 days of my break....and happily continues to torture me until I return to the gym. So at least for me it would seem to be the squats and lunges (which are weight bearing exercise, not stretches)doing the trick.

So let us take this out for a test drive.....your theory is a good one and deserves attention, so for the common good I'll take down my post-workout intake to 1 8oz glass and limit coffee to a quarter of the usual staring next week. I'm really curious to see what comes of it. If it is the water the cramps will come roaring back with a vengeance by about Tuesday night - Wednesday morning. I won't do anything out of the norm in the gym barring the water.

If my theory is wrong then we all may have another method of combating the leg torture so many of endure. Win-win as far as I can see!

…..well except for the limited coffee intake....I better warn the hubs.....I'm no June Cleaver on limited coffee ))))))

Edited to add: Good point GoKale, magnesium can def help.....but in my case I didn't start taking it until last year and I had basically no problems long before starting on it. That said my NP reported that 50% of women see a reduction in leg cramps from the mag.....I can't say for me, but I did find that my sleep was MUCH improved though.

I've been taking magnesium for several months and I have to say, while I get bone pain and joint stiffness, I don't get cramps in my calves like I did. I use Solgar liquid calcium and magnesium citrate.

Along with that, I use MO Maggie magnesium lotion at night. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't for the achy knees and hips and pain behind my knees.

I wish there was something I could definitely say helps, but I take so many supplements and rubs and yoga and walking... hard to tell if nothing is working or if I didn't use it, would it be worse.

I, too, want my old body and health back! I just told my husband that I think between chemo and radiation, (I only had rad), I don't think your body ever fully recovers.

Today I am stopping Tamoxifen for awhile, I need to know if the pain in my torso and head is from it. Is Tamoxifen intensifying the arthritis they say I have? Is Tamoxifen causing the bruised feelings in certain areas of my torso? I massage an area (say head for headache) and then there is this painful bruised feeling in that spot. All I know is that today the pain feels like it's my spine and goes down my legs currently. I am hoping this will ease up as the day goes on.

I will, it will be good to know at least to eliminate the drug from the list of things it could be.

egads007 - thanks for the info on magnesium, and avoiding citrate. I just checked what I am taking and it is Magnesium (magnesium oxide, aspartate, citrate, taurinate, alpha-ketoglutarate)/ Potassium (as citrate, aspartate, alpha-ketoglutarate). My BMs have changed over the last 2 months or so, and I seem to be more gassy, maybe it is the supplement. I do not know what the previous (Magnesium only) was. Another person told me she found that if she took magnesium at night vs morning, it seemed to help with getting to sleep and not waking up in middle of night. Has any one else noticed AM/PM differences ?

2009 ER+ left breast. 52 yrs. Lumpectomy, Radiation 6 weeks, tamoxifen 5 years. Dense lumpy left breast, normal right. Acupuncture offered at facility as part of integrative medicine. It really helped with anxiety/stress during radiation treatment.

2016 ER+ left breast. Probably a new cancer, but unknown. 4 rounds TC Aug-Oct 2016, Bi-lateral (my choice) Nov 2016, no reconstruction. Anastrozole 1 mg starting May 2017. Joint issues noticed immediately. Stopped Anastrozole after 3-4 months do to joint stiffness in hands. Started tamoxifen March 2018.