Worried about symptoms

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pomita
pomita Member Posts: 33

Hello, I'm new to this forum. Asian, 41 years old. I'm posting because I'm worried about some symptoms I'm having lately, which the internet tells me are similar to IBC, though not matching exactly. From about 6 weeks back, I have a recurring (not constant) pain in my right breast and armpit, and a strange rash which looks like itchy reddish cracks in the skin. The pain comes and goes, but the rash seems to be spreading and getting worse during the last few days.

I showed my doctor about a month back, she did a physical exam and said there is no lump and it was probably hormonal (pms). On my asking she prescribed a mammo and US. The US came back clear (no abnormality, no lymph gland swelling), and the mammo said 'asymmetric heterogenously dense tissue'. My doctor said she was satisfied with the results, especially since my breast pain seems to be somewhat cyclic (went away in the 2 weeks between my periods). However the worsening of my rash has her confused too, when I visited her 3 days back; she has prescribed a cream, and said she'll refer me to a dermatologist if it doesn't get better. I actually asked her if it can be IBC, and she said probably not.

I would be glad of any help/advice regarding whether this actually sounds like IBC, and whether I should suggest a biopsy even if the doctor doesn't refer me for it? The internet is really worrying me, especially since dense breast tissue is supposed to have a higher risk of cancer. Thanks in advance!


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Comments

  • Moderators
    Moderators Member Posts: 25,912
    edited February 2018

    Dear pomita,

    We are sorry that you are having these breast changes that are causing you such worry. It sounds like your doctor is following through with all of the necessary steps to get to the bottom of the cause of the rash. It sounds like she has prescribed a cream and if such does not help to alleviate the rash she is prepared to send you to a dermatologist. That is usually what our members report as an initial course of action with skin rashes. IBC is relatively rare but searches on the internet tend to take you there. Perhaps you can discuss your concerns about IBC with your doctor for peace of mind. We can't really tell you the cause of your rash but you are doing all the right things to get to the bottom of it. Keep us posted. The Mods

  • edwards750
    edwards750 Member Posts: 3,761
    edited February 2018

    Pomita- the internet is info only. Don’t let it scare you. I made the mistake of doing that and made myself sick worrying about the same thing you are concerned about.

    I did have BC and I woke up one morning to a red rash all over my breast. It was overnight. I totally freaked and read all kinds of dire things it could be. One was IBC. Mine didn’t exactly fit the pictures either but I was still worried. My husband told me to go to the cancer clinic the next day but he also said it did look like bruising. I decided to see if it cleared up in a few days. It did.

    If it is IBC it doesn’t just go away. So try the cream and see what happens.

    Diane

  • KBeee
    KBeee Member Posts: 5,109
    edited February 2018

    If it does not clear up with the cream, go to the dermatologist and request a punch biopsy. That should tell definitively what it is so appropriate treatment can heal it; hoping it is a skin irritation or infection and not IBC

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited February 2018

    Thanks a lot for your advice and support. I've been using the cream from 4 days,no effect yet. The itchiness does subside with an antihistamine tablet, though. Will probably visit the dermatologist if there's no change by next weekend.

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited February 2018

    Update: The rash has somewhat subsided (brownish marks are still there, but no redness or itchiness). Unfortunately, my breast pain has worsened considerably in the last few days - throbbing pains in the affected (right) breast and armpit which make some arm movements difficult. The breast also looks a little larger and swollen, I think (not sure of this since it has always been bigger than the left breast anyway). And it's not even PMS time!

    So, I'm more scared than ever of IBC. I'm going to my doctor again tomorrow, though I'm confused as to what will happen next. Referring to the dermatologist seems rather pointless now, since currently pain is the main symptom. Can my family physician directly refer a biopsy? Should I ask for one? As far as I know, there are no breast specialists in the place I live.



  • LisaAlissa
    LisaAlissa Member Posts: 1,092
    edited February 2018

    As I understand it, IBC doesn't get better and the symptoms don't come and go. This is good news for you, since your symptoms have gotten better. So no reason you would want to push for a punch biopsy (what would they biopsy?).

    I'd focus on the pain, swelling, and movement restriction. Ask your doc to help you sort out why you're having these troubles. It might be something which isn't breast related. And you don't want to rule out things that haven't yet been considered by your PCP.

    Best wishes in sorting this out (and being pain-free) very soon!

    LisaAlissa


  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited February 2018

    Thanks for the reassurance. I'll update on what my doctor says tomorrow.

  • Michelle_in_cornland
    Michelle_in_cornland Member Posts: 1,689
    edited February 2018

    Shingles, scabies, bed bugs, fungal infections can all involve the trunk of the body. A derm doc would be a great choice.

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited February 2018

    So my doctor (a different one, not the family doctor) checked me out today, and got another US done. He confirmed that there is a lot of swelling in and around my breast, and the whole area is very painful, and he also found a bit of nipple retraction; however, there is no redness, warmth or hardness, and the skin seems normal other than the earlier rash which has left some purplish scars. The US came back normal again. So for now he's put me on anti-inflammatory medicines for a week, and will refer me to an oncologist if there is no improvement.

    I'm hoping for the best.. thanks for the support here.


  • KBeee
    KBeee Member Posts: 5,109
    edited February 2018

    I would still try to see a derm

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited February 2018

    Well, there isn't really anything much for the derm doc to see now, since the rash has more or less faded apart from a few scars. The swelling and pain seems to be the main problem currently. I'll definitely ask for a derm referral if no other diagnosis happens soon.

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited February 2018

    Update: The oncologist checked me out today - did quite a thorough physical exam. He found some tender nodes in my armpits and general lumpiness in both breasts, but since the US and mammo are clear, he says it's nothing to worry about. According to him the pain and swelling is probably hormonal (perimenopausal), so he's prescribed Danazol for 6 weeks and will check again after that. He doesn't think it's IBC since there is no redness, hardness or warmth, just swelling. So he didn't recommend a biopsy.

    I'm not sure why the hormones would affect one breast so much more than the other. The doc was rather abrupt, though, and didn't seem to want any further questions (he said I'm thinking too much, which is possible).

    Right now I feel pretty sore from the exam, especially in the armpits, but feeling a little relieved. Thanks for the support here!




  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Hello.. I'm back to say that I'm getting worried again. I haven't started with the Danazol yet, since my family doctor suggested I should get a hormone profile done to check if I actually have hormone imbalance; I'll have the blood test on 11 March.

    But meanwhile, the pain and swelling in my right breast seems to have actually got a little worse, over the last 2 weeks - my armpit, especially, is very painful. And this is right past my period, so it can't be PMS (it has been continuing from 3 weeks, anyway).

    My worry is that I don't think any of the 3 doctors I've shown are really familiar with IBC. My family doctor hadn't even heard of it, the gyn hasn't seen a case though she knows about it, and the oncologist (who prescribed Danazol and was rather dismissive of my concerns) seemed to be familiar with it but his attitude made it hard for me to question him further.

    So I'm thinking - if my blood work does indicate a hormone imbalance, of course I'll be relieved and will start on Danazol. But if it's normal, then won't it mean that the cause is not hormonal? And in that case, should I try to go for another medical opinion, someone who might be more open to prescribing a punch biopsy, instead of biding my time with hormonal medicines?

    As of now, my symptoms are moderate/severe pain and swelling in the affected breast and armpit, some pain in the left armpit also, and a few scars (brownish marks) left over from my earlier rash - I don't know if it can be called bruising, but it does make my breast look a little different. Still no warmth or redness.. but not all IBC cases have those symptoms, right?

    I'll know the result of the hormone test by Monday.. feeling quite tense, meanwhile. Any advice/support would be appreciated!




  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    From 1-2 weeks, the swelling in the armpit is getting worse and now I can hardly move my arm. The breast seems to be bigger, too, and it's not pms time. I'm very scared again of possible IBC. Can hormones cause such severe pain, and affect the armpit so much? And why just on one side? Should I get a another opinion? My hormone test is due tomorrow.. maybe I should wait for the result, which should come in a few days?

    Please respond.. I'm feeling anxious. I've also started getting vague aches and pains all over my torso (back/shoulders/neck/abdomen, apart from the breast and armpit), especially when I wake up from sleep.


  • djmammo
    djmammo Member Posts: 2,939
    edited March 2018

    pomita

    Have any of your doctors suggested an MRI ? That will show whats going on inside the breasts and the nodes under your arms.

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Thanks for the reply. No one's suggested it yet. To be honest, I'm scared of an MRI since I'm severely claustrophobic. But if that's what it takes, I might bring it up at my next appointment.

    Just a question.. can an MRI detect IBC even when the mammo and US were clear ? Or is a punch biopsy the more reliable test?


  • Arh0990
    Arh0990 Member Posts: 1
    edited March 2018

    I too thought only of IBC mostly because of the peau de orange. I’ve been a mess but started chemo today for invasive ductal carcinoma in situ her 2 positive. So some of the same symptoms caused by IBC can be caused by other cancers or even non cancerous things. The internet however will make your anxiety sky high.. and if I’ve learned much during this process it’s that worrying only makes it worse. Try to stay calm but definitely push for biopsies and testing because only you kno when something is truly wrong. I was told for three weeks by my obgyn that I had mastitis from being 30 weeks pregnant but I kno antibiotics if prescribed for the right thing should start showing some symptom relief within 3 days and mine didn’t so again they gave me stronger antibiotic and nothing happenedso I was sent to a breast surgeon. He too looked me in the eye telling eye tellinv me his doubts were so high that is could possibly be cancer but sent me to his partner and that’s when the third ultrasound was done and following was the biopsy and test results

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Arh0990 - Thanks for the information about your situation, and good luck for your chemo.

    You're right about the internet. I guess I've started worrying again now because my pain has worsened. The reason to doubt IBC is because I thought ductal carcinoma or other forms of malignancy show up in the mammo + US ? (Which it didn't in my case). Did your mammo + US initially miss it ?

    I'm not sure if I have peau de orange - there are a few patches of somewhat wrinkled skin apart from scars of the rash I had last month. but they don't look like the typical peau de orange you see in pictures. The main symptom is a lot of pain and swelling, particularly troublesome in the armpit - I can't even bring my arm close to my body.





  • djmammo
    djmammo Member Posts: 2,939
    edited March 2018

    pomita

    Punch biopsy is usually diagnostic but you have to have an abnormal area of skin to target. If this has been going on 6 weeks you should certainly have distinct areas of orange peel skin that are thick and hard if it were IBC. You should be able to find it with your eyes closed at this point.

    There is usually something on the mammogram to trigger the MRI in breast cancers of all types including IBC, usually a diffuse hazy appearance or an asymmetric area of density that is new from the prior study, or you can see the skin thickening sometimes when caught in tangent on the mammogram. Similarly the US will show areas that are poorly penetrated by the sound waves making everything look indistinct without a discrete mass.

    An MRI should show a cancer if one is present. My question is, will you be satisfied with a normal MRI report?

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    I meant that there are a few areas of abnormal-looking skin, but they don't look like peau d orange, at least to my inexperienced eyes - they just look wrinkled/stretched skin. They did come up in the last 2 months, though, and coincide with the swelling.

    My mammo said 'asymmetric heterogenously dense tissue shadow obscuring details of mammogram'. Again, I don't know if 'asymmetric' here means that the density is more in one breast than the other (maybe you can help me). Also, this was my first mammo, so nothing to compare it with.

    Yes, I would probably be satisfied if an MRI is clear. But correct me if I'm wrong - from some comments on this forum, it seemed to me that IBC may not show up at all in a mammo or US? Maybe it depends on the level of experience of the doctor reading it. I have my doubts regarding that here, since my family doctor hadn't even heard of IBC (I am in a small town in India).

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Today I got my hormone test report; everything is normal, and specifically, estradiol is on the lower side (24 pg/ml). So it doesn't seem like my symptoms are due to any hormone imbalance. On the other hand, the armpit pain and swelling is getting worse day by day, and the right breast size has increased further. I guess I need to get to another doctor soon, for further testing. I'm feeling more and more worried.

  • NancyHB
    NancyHB Member Posts: 1,512
    edited March 2018

    Fibrocystic breasts, including pain and swelling, are not related to an imbalance in hormones, but rather are affected by our hormones. It’s quite possible for one breast to be affected more than the other, as well as for one breast to generally be larger than the other. Have you tried using the danazol yet? If indeed your symptoms are fibrocystic-related it sounds like the danazol may help. If you try it and get no relief or symptoms worsen, you can then relay that information to to your doctors when you ask for more imaging or testing

  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Thanks for the reply! I haven't taken Danazol yet since I was concerned about some of the side-effects (hence the hormone test). And honestly, after the pain and swelling in my armpit has worsened over the last 2 weeks to the point of being debilitating, I'm finding it hard to believe that such an acute symptom can be due to hormones. And it has been steadily getting worse right past my period, which was a week back - whereas fibrocystic breast pain fluctuates pre- and post-period, right?

    Also, one breast being bigger than the other is not the problem (it always was) - the increase in size is what is worrying. I've had to go up a bra size, in the last 1 month, just because of the right breast.

    So I'll probably get another opinion, and will take Danazol if he/she also recommends the same.. will keep this forum updated, either way.




  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    I consulted another surgeon (oncologist), who did a physical exam and said he doesn't think it's IBC since in that case 'the breast looks hard and red and inflamed'; mine is just swollen and increased in size, but soft on palpation. But he did observe definite swelling in my breast and armpit, and couldn't diagnose a reason for it. He even said it doesn't seem to be hormonal, since he would expect that to be bilateral and varying with cycle. So no Danazol. He's given me a week of antibiotics and Aceclofenac 'just in case', and said he'll refer me to an orthopedic if there's no improvement. (Why orthopedic, when the armpit pain and swelling is clearly related to the breast? Again, 'just in case').

    I'm feeling helpless, rather than reassured; because a) my armpit pain has worsened to the point of needing to take leave from work this week (Im typing with one hand); and b) doctors here seem clueless about IBC. This one said he's seen 2 cases in his 12 years, and didn't even entertain my suggestion that presentation can vary and redness/hardness isn't essential. He also (on my asking) ruled out any need for a biopsy.

    The fact is that my breast size has increased a lot in the last 3 weeks, I'm in severe pain, and I still have no idea what's going on, after 4 doctors. I need a solution! Maybe I should go to another general physician, and try to get a diagnosis, anyhow? I don't know who to trust, and I'm feeling worried and scared.



  • wrenn
    wrenn Member Posts: 2,707
    edited March 2018

    Are you likely to trust the 5th doctor if he/she tells you it is not IBC?

    Hoping the antibiotics help.


  • Sjacobs146
    Sjacobs146 Member Posts: 770
    edited March 2018

    pomita, give those antibiotics a chance to do their stuff, perhaps the rash that you had turned into an infection of some sort. I know that you've seen several docs, but are any of them breast specialists? That may be your next step if antibiotics don't clear things up.


  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    wrenn - Maybe not, if I feel they don't know much about it. Two of the four either hadn't heard of it or never saw a case.

    Sjacobs146 - the first oncologist (the one who prescribed Danazol) was a breast cancer specialist. Maybe he had more experience than the last one, but he wasn't even willing to talk.

    I'm hoping that the antibiotics work, too; but not so confident, since this whole thing has been a gradually worsening process over 1.5 - 2 months, and an infection would probably be sudden. Anyway.. 3 days and no effect, as of now.



  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Recently I noticed another weird symptom - my skin on the right side (breast, neck, shoulder, underarm, even upper arm) feels really dry and stretchy. It's like if I move my hand, I can feel the stretching right till my underarm, or if I look up, I can feel it right through the skin of my neck and chest. Does this sound familiar to anyone here?

    I'll mention it on my next visit to a doctor, though it doesn't seem like doctors here even pay attention to a narration of symptoms. :(


  • pomita
    pomita Member Posts: 33
    edited March 2018

    Update: absolutely no effect of the antibiotics. The breast/underarm pain and swelling is continuing as is (moderate/severe) - no significant change in the last 2 weeks. I visited my earlier doctor (gyn who I was consulting for breast pain in Jan/Feb), who did a physical exam after one month, and said that she can see the underarm swelling, but can't find any hard nodes, and the breast swelling/size change also doesn't seem suspicious since there are no specific skin changes or nipple retraction. So she went back to the theory of its being hormonal, and asked me to try Danazol if my symptoms are too bothersome. As of now, no further tests or doctor visits required, she feels.

    I would like to have an MRI just to be sure, because the pain and swelling definitely is troubling me; but it doesn't seem like anyone's going to refer me for one. I'm still on the fence about starting Danazol. It feels like back to square one, except with worse symptoms than a month back. And I'm tired of going to different doctors with no consistent diagnosis.

    I don't know if my posting here even makes sense now, given this impasse. But I've sometimes lurked on other 'not diagnosed but worried' threads with symptoms similar to mine, and I find it frustrating when people disappear without any information on what finally happened. So I'll keep updating here till I either get a diagnosis, or get better.



  • KBeee
    KBeee Member Posts: 5,109
    edited March 2018

    I'm glad your updating. It can be frustrating to not get answers. If it is an infection; it just may be one that does not respond to the particular type of antibiotic you're prescribed. Different antibiotics work on different types of infections. Could you have done something to cause a soft tissue injury? Workout, lifting, etc? That would affect one side. I'm just mentioning possibilities, because it does not seem typical at all of IBC. That being said, if it is bothersome, you should try to find a solution, but do so without worry of it being immediately threatening.

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